Accurate .223 Loads?


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doubs43
April 16, 2009, 11:57 PM
I've just purchased a CZ-527 in .223 Remington and I'd like to hear about your favorite 55 grain loads, especially with WW-748 and 4198 powders. I know that the 52/53 grain bullets made for bench rest matches are more accurate but I plan on using the Hornady and Sierra softpoint bullets designed for small game. I used to use the Hornady SX bullets in my .222 and they were very accurate.

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doubs43
April 17, 2009, 02:41 PM
Anyone? Surely SOMEONE here loads for the .223 and has an accurate combination.

bfoosh006
April 17, 2009, 02:47 PM
Try here....http://www.radomski.us/njhp/cart_tech.htm

and , http://www.ar15.com/forums/forum.html?b=6&f=42, you should be able to find all sorts of info there.

rcmodel
April 17, 2009, 02:53 PM
Do not overlook the Hornady V-Max or Nosler Ballistic-Tip bullets.

Both are extremely accurate in most rifles, and devastating on varmints.

I have found nothing more accurate, short of match HP bullets, and even then sometimes the plastic-tips beat them.

My CZ-527 really likes the 50 grain V-Max and 27.5 grains WW-748.

Also, 55 grain Nosler B-T and 26.0 grains WW-748 shoots really good.

rc

flashhole
April 17, 2009, 03:04 PM
Having tried them, I don't care for your choice of bullets or powders but I will tell you what works really well in my 223.

BLC-2 powder with 40 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips or Sierra 40 grain Blitzkings.

Varget with Sierra 63 gran Semi Point bullets.

Both use Rem 7 1/2 or CCi BR-4 primers.

rcmodel
April 17, 2009, 03:21 PM
Having tried them, I don't care for your choice of bullets or powdersWell, see, thats what makes asking for the most accurate .223 load using WW-748 powder will do for you.

Before this thread runs it's course, somebody will suggest homemade black powder and pulled .22RF bullets as the best & most accurate .223 load! :neener:

rc

Mags
April 17, 2009, 05:02 PM
55 gr winchester FMJ BT with federal primers and 23 grains of ramshot tac, 2.26 col recommended but i go down to 2.25 might be a little hotter so be careful.

rcmodel
April 17, 2009, 05:18 PM
55 grain Winchester FMJ-BT in the white.
55 grain Nosler B-T in the black.
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/KTOG/EoTecGroup.jpg

rc

flashhole
April 17, 2009, 06:06 PM
rc - my comments weren't directed to you, they were for doubs.

I didn't have any luck with the components he's suggesting.

rcmodel
April 17, 2009, 06:13 PM
Oh! I see clearly now what you meant! :o

Yea, IMR-4198 is too fast for the .223.
It was real good in the smaller .222 though, when there wasn't anything else.

I don't buy SP or FMJ bullets anymore either, except for AR15 blasting ammo.

As I said though, I have had very good accuracy with WW-748 & plastic-tip bullets from Hornady or Nosler.
Can't tell any difference actually.

rc

Shimitup
April 17, 2009, 09:06 PM
25gr of W748 under Hornady 55gr BTSP is sub MOA on my stainless Ranch Rifle. May not hit paper in some one else's gun.

jcwit
April 17, 2009, 09:22 PM
Just looked up your rifle on the CZ site. It states it has a 1 in 12" twist.

For that twist I would suggest the 52 or 53 grain Sierra Match King bullet. I have a Rem. 700 VLS with this twist barrel. I use 22 1/2 grs of 2230 Accurate and get excellent accuracy, however each rifle is different.

If your barrel had the 1 in 9 inch twist the heavier 60 gr. and up bullets would be better. ie; the faster twist stabilizes the heavier bullet better.

slicers63
April 17, 2009, 09:26 PM
I have been working up some loads for my Colt Tactical Elite and Rem 700. So far I have had good luck with 25.0 gr Win 748 behind a 69gr Sierra HP Bt. It has been windy this spring in Phoenix therefore I won't quote group size until I have more practice and experience with the loads.

I am still developing a load for 55gr FMJ Bt but 27.5gr of 748 looks promising. The 55gr FMJ are bulk bullets therefore I do not expect great accurcy but maybe 1.5-2 MOA. Just started on developing loads for the Speers 52gr match.

mudslinger
April 17, 2009, 09:44 PM
I have been loading 21 1/2 grains of imr4198 with 55 grain win soft point bulk bullets for years. The load is 1 inch group at 200 yards from a ruger vt77 mk 2, my choice for prairie dogs at 300 yards with the 26 inch bbl.

doubs43
April 18, 2009, 11:38 AM
Thanks to everyone who has taken the time to reply. Everyone's suggestions will be considered and I appreciate the information and ideas.

It looks like I need to buy some new powders to test and new bullets too. :)

dagger dog
April 18, 2009, 03:40 PM
Here's a load in 4198 with Midways Dogtown 55 gr (Hornady SP) but you can see why I didn't persue. It was shot from a Savage 1in9" twist 26" bbl @ 100 yds., I think the bullet is run of the mill, between it and the 4198 , 1in9 twist it just didn't perform. Varget worked a lot better!:D

flashhole
April 18, 2009, 05:59 PM
This is typical for my 223 shooting Varget loads with the 63 grain Sierra Semi Point bullet.

When there are guys at the range we will hold competitions for bragging rights. The target on the left was a winning beer bet competition. The idea is to put a shot in the center of the 2" target then ring it with as many additional shots as you can. If two shots touch, you loose. If a shot goes outside the target, you loose. If you don't get one inside the 10 ring, you loose. As the shooter you declare when you are finished. The shooter with the most non-touching shots in the target is the winner. The target on the right was a looser because I had two shots touching.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/GuideGun/223Kimber_VargetLoad.jpg

something vague
April 18, 2009, 08:10 PM
That sounds like a great game to play flashhole. I might have to suggest that one to my shooting buddies, think it might be a hit. Also, nice shooting.

docsleepy
April 18, 2009, 10:45 PM
I would suggest that you do the "ladder test" to find out where you are most accurate and least sensitive to loading errors.

This will allow you to find the most accurate load for YOUR exact rifle.

When I did it, using fairly large jumps of 0.5 grains between groups of 2 rounds, I found that the groups broke into three distinct groups.

Below 22 grains Varget behind a 69SMK HPBT, groups were similar.

Between 23 and 24.5, the groups moved up and down, but ALL groups and ALL shots were within a 1 MOA group. At 24.0 Varget, two bullets went in one hole (100 yards). 24.0 was the highest point in the bunch.

Then at 25 grains and above, a new group formed an inch higher.

Therefore, if I loaded to 24 grains Varget, and was slightly off, the shot would move down for either HIGH or LOW loadings -- halving the error likely at any other point. And even a grain high or low would be within a fraction of a MOA. In other words, the shot placement was fairy INsensitive to loading around 24 grains -- in MY rifle.


If you perform the same test in YOUR rifle, you'll likely find a series of loadings where the point of impact is little affected by the change in loading -- those are optimum loadings unless you are a perfect loader.


There may be more to it than that, but that is what I was instructed to do, and it seemed to work.

BTW, from my analysis, Rem Premier Match was much hotter than any of my loads. Took me an hour to make up all the ammo and a hour to shoot it on individual targets, one minute between shots, 2-3 minutes between groups, but the results were astonishing when all plotted on a common x-y axes.

gordon

flashhole
April 18, 2009, 11:06 PM
docsleepy is correct about the ladder test. That's how I got to my 223 loads but it should also be mentioned that the longer the distance the better. I do mine at 200 yards, your target is less crowded and the sweet spots are easier to determine. I usually end up 1-2 grains less than max for best accuracy.

doubs43
April 19, 2009, 12:28 AM
Here are the results of my CZ-527 .223 Remington tests today, all 5 shot groups at 100 METERS. I used 40 once fired LC 75 5.56mm cases that were all trimmed to one length and full length resized. The primer crimps were removed to permit seating new primers.

I used 5 shots to adjust a newly mounted scope (Weaver V-24) and then fired 7 groups. Powder was either WW-748 or IMR-4198. Primers were WW standard small rifle primers. Six groups were shot with 55 grain Hornady SX bullets and one group with 50 grain Nosler HP bullets.

Two figures will be listed: The first is the measurement at 100 meters and the second the 100 yard equivalent figured at 91.43% of the 100 meter measurement. I measured extreme outside distances and subtracted .219" for a C-C figure. Only one group failed to achieve less than one MOA accuracy.

WW-748 25.0 Grains + 55 Gr SX .810" .741"
WW-748 25.5 Grains + 55 gr SX .827" .756"
WW-748 26.0 Grains + 55 Gr SX .938" .858"
WW-748 27.5 Grains + 50 Gr Nosler .949" .868"

IMR-4198 19.5 Grains + 55 SX 1.276" 1.167"
IMR-4198 20.0 Grains +55 SX .764" .699"
IMR-4198 20.5 Grains +55 SX .811" .741"

My next step is to try a couple of different powders and bullets but for a good hunting round, a couple of those above would do just fine. The 55 grain Hornady SX bullet is quite good on varmints up to coyote size.

docsleepy
April 19, 2009, 03:01 AM
doubs43: you also want to look at the centerpoint of each group. You are looking for two different loads that have very little difference in their average shot placement, and also have acceptable group size.

If their average shot placement is similar, then a load at or in the middle will be much less affected by small variations in powder load, or perhaps by temperature or other factors.

The data you show are for group size only; if you could give x,y data for the center of the groups, one could discern where your sensitivity to powder load was minimized.

great work, keep it coming!

GotCoffee
April 19, 2009, 04:15 AM
Ive got one friend who likes 52 gr bullets with 21 gr of IMR4198,
and another who likes 55 gr bullets with 20.6 gr of IMR4198. They both swear by these for coyote killing.

doubs43
April 19, 2009, 02:27 PM
Here are the actual targets that I shot yesterday. There was a 5-10 mph wind most of the time and sometimes it was stronger. All groups began from a cold barrel. Ambient temperature was around 70-72 degrees.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i99/doubs43/CZ-527/CZ-527TargetIMR-41984-18-2009.jpg

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i99/doubs43/CZ-527/CZ-527TargetWW-7484-18-2009.jpg

lgjhn
April 20, 2009, 12:57 AM
I shoot a worked over, break-action, T/C single-shot Encore w/bull barrel and have found that 22 gr. of IMR-4198 underneath a 52 gr. Sierra MatchKing works really well in that gun. The bullet is seated just off the lands. It's a load I worked up to over time and seems to be extremely accurate for that particular rifle. I have several coyotes to my credit shot between the eyes and dead in their tracks at 150+ yards as testimony.

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