Mods going overboard cleaning up threads.


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harmonic
April 17, 2009, 03:42 AM
So, you're deleting any divergent post?

How cozy.

The new High Road.

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bikerdoc
April 17, 2009, 07:11 AM
For your review and edifcation

Welcome to The High Road, an online discussion board dedicated to the discussion and advancement of responsible firearms ownership. It is the declared mission of this board to achieve and provide the highest quality of firearms discussion on the Internet, a standard set by the discussion board The Firing Line from 1998-2002.

Everyone is welcome to participate, regardless of political affiliation, gender, religion, nationality, or stance on gun ownership. We aim to respect every point of view, as long as it is presented in a polite and factual manner. You only need to provide a name and a valid email address to participate. We do not sell that information to anyone.

There are only a few house rules:

1.) All topics and posts must be related to firearms or civil liberties issues.
2.) Multiple user registrations are prohibited.
3.) As a family-friendly board, we ask that you keep your language clean. If you wouldn't say it in front of your dear old Grandma, you probably don't want to say it here.
4.) Spamming, trolling, flaming, and personal attacks are prohibited. You can disagree with other members, even vehemently, but it must be done in a well-mannered form. Attack the argument, not the arguer.
5.) We cannot provide a comprehensive list of "Things Not To Say".Posts that are contrary to the above policies, or to the mission of The High Road, may be edited or deleted at our sole discretion. Membership may be revoked if such a step is deemed necessary by us. We're a private venture enabled by an all-volunteer staff. Please treat this venue as a polite discussion in a friend's home and respect the wishes of the hosts.

We have learned from bitter experience that discussions of abortion, religion and sexual orientation often degenerate into less-than-polite arguments or claims that "my God is better than your God". For this reason, we do not discuss such subjects on THR, and any threads dealing primarily with these subjects will be closed or deleted immediately. Threads which deal with other subjects, but which mention abortion, religion or sexual orientation as a side issue, may be allowed to continue, but will be closely scrutinized, and closed or deleted if they "cross the line".

A note on FREE SPEECH:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

The First Amendment is greatly respected here on The High Road, as are all other Amendments that the Second Amendment defends. However, The High Road is private property and requests that members adhere to all forum policies. It is a contract agreed to by all who become members of The High Road. Those who break forum rules cannot invoke censorship or freedom of speech - a contract broken is a contract broken. If you do not like the rules of conduct or the acceptable topics, seek out a new venue to frequent or start your own board.

If you feel you can abide by these requests, we hope that you join us on The High Road. We invite you to share your expertise and enjoy the camaraderie. "Share what you know, learn what you don't."

Thank you,

The Staff

Sam1911
April 17, 2009, 08:22 AM
Look, read through about 90 of the last 100 posts in technical and see how many times this same question (or some minor variation of it) has been asked before.

The mods have explained their philosophy/strategy with EXCRUTIATING patience and politeness in every ... single ... one ... of those threads.

If you seriously still have a problem with it, there are lots of other gun boards out there that suck more and you might like one of them.

-Sam

rbernie
April 17, 2009, 10:29 AM
If you have a question about the cleanup in a specific thread, I suggest PMing the mods of that forum.

Posting a public complaint about how you don't like the moderation just makes it look like you want attention.

Art Eatman
April 17, 2009, 10:33 AM
Sometimes I want to post a response which reeks--Reeks!--of impatience...

On one occasions I "worked" the Legal forum in a strict-constructionist moderation per the rules. Several multi-page threads wound up as half-page "shorties".

All in all, I gotta say that it all seems pretty fair and reasonable.

I've only been here since THR started, though, so what do I know?

harmonic
April 17, 2009, 12:13 PM
Posting a public complaint about how you don't like the moderation just makes it look like you want attention.


That's the nature of a protest, isn't it?

I gotta say that it all seems pretty fair and reasonable.


I disagree.

harmonic
April 17, 2009, 12:23 PM
BTW, the posts to which I refer are not way out in left field. I'm talking about posts that are merely a couple of degrees off center.

BullfrogKen
April 17, 2009, 01:05 PM
That's the nature of a protest, isn't it?

Protesting?

So you're saying rather than trying to resolve the matter with a staff member first, you're taking to a public protest?


Good luck with that. This is a private board, not public property. Protesters who just don't like how the place is run aren't going to get much of an audience here. But hey, you do your best to stage a protest march and let us all know how that works out for you.

rbernie
April 17, 2009, 01:13 PM
A protest about how somebody else manages their private property? What an interesting sense of entitlement....

Constructive comments in private (aka 'the suggestion box') are always welcomed. But a protest?

Dang.

harmonic
April 17, 2009, 01:44 PM
Protesters who just don't like how the place is run aren't going to get much of an audience here.

Well, sometimes just being able to state one's mind does wonders for the spirit.

And, in case you weren't aware, an individual protesting a thing is not necessarily the same thing as staging a protest.

My wife tells me I have to entertain her uncle's visit. I tell her I don't like it, but I do it. I've protested. Doesn't mean I staged a protest.

Mal H
April 17, 2009, 01:45 PM
Let's get down to brass tacks, harmonic.

Are you complaining about a specific post of yours being deleted? Would it be a post in which you called another member a "chump" and offered to sell him some magic beans? Is that the action you're complaining about? If not, please be specific and let us know at least the thread that spurred your complaint instead of a blanket "the mods are deleting divergent posts. How cozy.".

As for your "The new High Road" jab, I would suggest that we are actually trying to get back to the old High Road in which posts like the one of yours I quoted above aren't even posted so that we wouldn't have to delete them.

BullfrogKen
April 17, 2009, 01:53 PM
Fair enough, harmonic.

But we really don't care what's on your mind when it comes to criticizing THR's policies. Protesting those won't be very effective.


To continue with your analogy, you didn't just tell your wife you didn't like entertaining her uncle, you announced it at the family reunion, with her uncle and everyone else in earshot.


If you had a problem with a comment of yours going away, the polite way to handle it is contacting a staff member about it. You've been here long enough to have figured that out. Sarcastically suggesting the staff arbitrarily erases any posts simply on the basis that they express a diverse opinion is scurrilous. And you know it.

Yo Mama
April 17, 2009, 02:07 PM
I belonged to other forums that were much stricter even. This forum is the best by far, and I find that they only edit or delete when it's in THR and your best interest.

harmonic
April 17, 2009, 02:14 PM
Would it be a post in which you called another member a "chump" and offered to sell him some magic beans?

No, I see why that post was deleted.

I was actually thinking about some posts deleted in a thread re California where a poster posted some things like,


You can have 10+ mags in CA, they are not illegal.

No mag disconnect needed on hand guns already the approved list or ones private party.

you can buy as many hand guns as you like, you can only buy one NEW hand gun in 30 days. you can buy as many as you want private party.

its not 10 days, its 10, 24 hour increments.

CCW are actually very common in most countys in CA.

I would hazard to guess that we have more CCW in CA then you do in your state.


I rebutted his assertions, then discovered his entire post had been deleted. The explanation was,

Those posts that did not advance the discussion or that were blatently off topic were removed.


But his post was on topic. It just needed clarifying.

Then I began to notice a lot of such posts deleted.

Yeah, yeah, I know it's a private forum and all, and I also know other forums are worse. But the standards for deleting such posts seems inconsistent. I think "subjective" is the word.

Hungry Seagull
April 17, 2009, 02:16 PM
I have opened my mouth a time or two and got deleted.

No problem. You dont see me protesting. I take my medicine and move on. Once in a while a topic gets me going and it will take a moderator to hold me down as it were.

No problem.

hso
April 17, 2009, 02:34 PM
Maybe it was because of the same reason you rebutted his assertions? Sometimes mods remove wrong info because we don't want someone just stopping on the "you can do X" post and following it's advice when it can get them in a bunch of trouble.

harmonic
April 17, 2009, 03:27 PM
we don't want someone just stopping on the "you can do X" post

IMO, you're not giving the participants very much credit. This isn't the first grade.

bikerdoc
April 17, 2009, 03:42 PM
This isn't the first grade.

No it is an adult forum with rules and high standards. I like it here, made a lot of friends. Also have a small ignore list. I hope you not offended if I tell to please take this to PM with the mod involved cause frankly im tired of listening to you.

rbernie
April 17, 2009, 04:21 PM
And again I have to ask why the need for the drama - excuse me, protest - when a PM to the mod that did the cleanup in this specific example would likely have explained it?

Sav .250
April 17, 2009, 04:54 PM
If you don`t have some sort of guide-lines, this forum would end up looking like some western border town with no sheriff.
Great if your a trouble maker but hell on the good folks who live there.
Wyatt, your needed at the front desk.

harmonic
April 17, 2009, 05:55 PM
And again I have to ask why the need for the drama - excuse me, protest - when a PM to the mod that did the cleanup in this specific example would likely have explained it?


Which retort is also melodramatic. But in answer to your question, such "moderating" is so prevalent it is not confined to a just one moderator. Therefore the moderators must have some standard set down by the owner of the site.

With the exception of a couple of moderators (is 1911 Tuner still here?), you're micromanaging this site.

I do appreciate, however, this continued dialogue. I honestly expected it to be locked by now.

rcmodel
April 17, 2009, 06:43 PM
This isn't the first grade.Maybe not.
But it sure seems like it sometimes.

rc

jim in Anchorage
April 17, 2009, 09:19 PM
OK you want the other extreme? I just looked at the Remington society website and it is overrun with-guess- Russian pornography.

Geno
April 17, 2009, 10:07 PM
There is a reason why I participate only in The High Road. There are other forums to be certain. However, I find that there exists a great extent of tolerance right here. I have no complaints. I do have lots of praise. If I ever have a concern or question, I'll just PM a moderator.

Geno

memphisjim
April 17, 2009, 10:11 PM
i think this is the most moderator comments ive seen in a single post especially one this short

hso
April 18, 2009, 12:46 AM
This isn't the first grade.

But we do have folks in the equivalent of the first grade of "gun skool" here (and high skool and college and grad school and post doc). Just because you and many others aren't at that level doesn't mean we don't have tons of new folks with no experience that come here to learn.

When someone posts something that is just flat wrong AND can get someone in trouble with the law if they follow it (or blowed up), performing "cleanup" by removing that post is the same as moving a board with nails out of the walkway. Sure most folks will see it and recognize it for what it is and walk around it, but someone might not and they'll pay a heavy price for not seeing it for what you and others did.

As members we ask that you hit the red triangle when you see stuff that is egregiously wrong. Call it out to everyone around in the thread so it's seen for what it is, but when we see some of these things that can truly get folks in serious trouble our position is to trim it out.

harmonic
April 18, 2009, 11:51 AM
performing "cleanup" by removing that post is the same as moving a board with nails out of the walkway

This dialogue can go on endlessly and frankly, it's not worth it. The micromanaging of this site is not to merely delete dangerous posts or illegal suggestions. Such posts are by far in the minority.

The micromanaging is a purely subjective response of a mod to a post that just doesn't "set well" with him, and you can try to rationalize it any way you want.

As I said before, not all mods are guilty of this.

We'll just have to be content to disagree on this.

redneck2
April 18, 2009, 03:09 PM
See, here's the thing I don't get. There have to be forty seven thousand gazillion web sites. If this one torques you up so much, why not spend time elsewhere?

To use your analogy, if I had some relatives that I strongly dislike (well, actually I do) I simply spend my time elsewhere.

Since THR is providing the sandbox and toys, I try to play well with the other kids. If I act up, they send me home. It's their roof, their rules.
This isn't the first grade
Hang around a while (assuming you can follow the rules) and you will most likely change your mind

3pairs12
April 18, 2009, 03:33 PM
I thought that complain about the mods day was the 3rd Thursday of each month. So harmonic you were a few days off. I tend to disagree with you I think the mods here do a great job and let some posts slide that probably shouldn't. There are several people that I would have removed everything they "contribute" to some threads. Unfortunately I can't, so I deal with it. I am a member of several other boards but this is the only one worth speding any amount of time on.

Rodentman
April 18, 2009, 11:42 PM
I am new here, and I enjoy the forum! I have been on many others (firearm and others) and seen them ruined by too little moderation, not too much.

I prefer to stay on topic. I ask a question, I get many good answers. If I think I know an answer or can add to a discussion I do so.

I have no complaints about how the forum is run.

IMHO....

krs
April 19, 2009, 12:19 PM
I just looked at the Remington society website and it is overrun with-guess- Russian pornography

Really? Got a link?? :D

Mal H
April 19, 2009, 02:11 PM
Okay!!

... and with that, it's probably time to go ahead and close this one.

If you enjoyed reading about "Mods going overboard cleaning up threads." here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!