Charter Arms Bulldog Pug .44SPL

What's the skinny on this? They look like a beefy little unit in a solid caliber. Not bad on the price either... 320 for blued.

What are the prose and cons of these guys?

And what does it mean by not having a stud to hold the cylinder in place when open? Does that mean the cylinder can fall off id you turn the gun muzzle up with it open?

I've owned two, an old-production 4" Target Bulldog and a new-production Bulldog Pug (if that's the right model), both in .44 Special. I found both disappointing... hot loads would "lock them up" pretty easily. I found the S&W 696, Taurus M431 and Rossi M720 to be superior in smoothness of action and ability to use "hot" loads.

One of the Cons is that they're not as strong as others. For instance, check out Buffalo Bore's heavy .44 Special loads (http://www.buffalobore.com/ammunition/default.htm#44spl). 180 grains at 1150 feet per scond, and 255 grains at 1000 feet per second. Potent stuff, and I wish a load like the latter was available in .45 Colt.

Anyways, these loads, according to the website, are safe in ALL current .44 Special revolvers EXCEPT the Charter Arms. I would expect the same would hold true for Cor-Bon's .44 Special loads.

If you don't mind not being able to use the more potent self-defense loads, then it won't be an issue. Otherwise, check out the offerings from Taurus. There's also the S&W 296. While not currently in production, they're advertised all over the Shotgun News. 5-shot L-framed hammerless .44 Special snubby.

1) I had a nickeled one (a Charco, I think; this was nine years ago) that, in 300ish rounds of PMC 240gr loads, shot itself so loose that I got skeered to shoot it anymore. Plus all the nickel had flaked off the forcing cone, blast shield, and the underside of the topstrap. Plus the screw holding the cylinder latch on would back out every 15-20 rounds, causing the latch to fall off.

2) A guy came into the shop recently with a recent Charter 2000 Bulldog Pug. The barrel had broken at the front of the frame, leaving the threaded shank in the frame and sending the rest downrange with the projo. Ammo was Silvertips.

A great concept that can be flawed by iffy quality control... I'd recommend sticking w/200gr loads (Silvertips, CCI Blazer, or Federal LSWC-HP) for increased frame life.

That Charter 2000 sounds like the ultimate in barrel short. :D
Be fun to chrono some loads from it if it was still shootable.

Sam

The original Charter Arms guns were generally fine, but were not designed with hot ammo in mind.

At the time they came out, though, there really wasn't much in the way of hot ammo for the .44 Spl.

The later offerings by Charco, et al, have been less than inspiring.

All in all, though, it's still a great concept.

A small 5-shot in a large caliber.

I had one back in '80 (?) Anyway great concept as mentioned. I shoot what I carry, and some of the "non factory" loads I shot really thumped ;)
Didn't take long for mine to get "real smooth and broken in". So before it became a shake rattle and roll pc of metal and wood I traded it. New owner wanted a desk gun, fired 5 rounds, went "yep" and probably hasn't been out of his desk drawer since.

Others I knew that had them and didn't shoot the 'loads' I did but factory stuff experienced the same deal...I just sped up the process. I like the concept and the cartridge.

All is not lost, Ogre! Check out the offerings from Taurus.

http://www.taurususa.com/imagesMain/H_415SS2C.jpg

This is their model 415; a 5-shot stainless steel (ported) snubby in .41 Mag! (Super Snubby!) Also available in .45 Colt and .44 Special.

There are MANY more variations on the .44 Special models, though, including the blue finish you're looking for.

http://www.taurususa.com/imagesMain/H_445B2C.jpg

http://www.taurususa.com/imagesMain/H_445CHB2.jpg

i've got an early model SS that has held up

quite well.but i only shoot the 200gr. silvertips.

my only criteria for a pistol of this type is to go bang every time you

squeeze the trigger,which it does:D

i,had the hammer bobbed and the sight channel widened

and the top bead blasted.she still gets some trail time;)

I have the ultimate in the 5-shot .44 S&W Special revolvers - a lite weight Al/Ti 296 and the SS 696. That 3" 696 is an L-frame - a bit more massive than the others in it's class. Mine gets a lot of range time, with everything from .44 Russian Plinkers to .44 S&W Special defense loads. The 296 is limited to 200gr maximum and clad-only rounds. I use the 200gr GDjHP Blazers in .44 S&W Special exclusively in mine - it is almost 'made to order', as the Speer Gold Dot opens up well, according to Speer and others, at the 800 fps that those Blazers leave the 296. If I had a Charter 2000, I'd try the Blazers.

S&W axed the 296 two years ago - the 696 went last fall. The 696 evaporated quickly - the 296 seems to still be available new closeout @ ~$350 - well below it's ~$780 original list. The only .44 S&W Special chambering still available from the vintage 1907 cartridge's originator is the 396 Mountain Lite - and they are 'dear' (~$600 locally). It is a great personal protection round.

Stainz

Son of Sam! Son of Sam!

WildthemostfamouscharterarmseverAlaska

Oh yeah... there you go Nightcrawler... That one in the middle... the shiney blue one. Nice.


So if these Charters are weak and crapy, what are they doing saying that the design is so much stronger because it has the locking points and has a solid frame?


/Still looking into the the World Of Wheelguns.

...what are they doing saying that the design is so much stronger because it has the locking points and has a solid frame?

See, there's this thing called "advertising." They use it to make things called "ads," and in these "ads," things may be said that are li... er, well, not exactly "lies" per se, but let's call it "the truth presented in the most favorable light possible." ;) :p

Case in point a sleeved barrel is a "design feature" a pinned barrel is safer because it "cannot rotate in place" and a "positive safety lock" is safer for the children.

Why oh why do we see in these threads someone saying hey I know it's made from pan fried japanese steel, and its only a 44 special loaded up to cowboy spec but can I load up just shy of Corbon/hammerhead 454 magnum thumpers??


NO YOU CAN'T.

Ever.

And there is no Easter Bunny either.

I've never shot the Bulldog but my impression (and one shared by gun digest) was that it was a pretty good little shooter with modest loads (read within saami spec).

Yep, I'd go with Taurus...

I had one for a very short time.
A .44 spl pug.
It was fairly tight when I bought it.
I shot maybe 150 rounds through it.
In 150 rounds, I don't remember hitting any target anywhere vital at any distance.
It started to loosen up a little, I panicked and sold it immediately.
I think it scared me away from .44 specials from that day on...

i had a blued one that i sold to get the stainless one when it came out back in the 80's.

it "shot loose" the cylinder stop latch wore down enough that i could manually rotate the cylinder past it . if you look, it is a very thin piece of metal shaped like a small shark fin. not robust at all like a s/w or taurus...


anyway, it seems that you either get a descent one or a real p.o.s.
how many posters here still have theirs?

one so far.
not real good rep i'd say. i like the snubbie .44spl. the charters are junk, and unless i can shoot a 50 round box through one first, id let it go without a second thought.

tauri are nice, i have a ti taurus in .38 (850 cia) that id trade for the same version in .44spl....

smiths are nice, but quite a bit more money, if you have it fine, but if you have to work for a living, the taurus is more in your reach realistically unless you can wait a while to save up.

George, you have PM.