CCI Stingers?

[emilianoksa]

I know that 22lr is not recommended for self-defence, but could you please tell me if it's true that this round was designed for use in handguns?

Does the slightly bigger case size mean it only works well in certain makes of pistol?

Can I expect it to function well with a CZ 75 Kadet?

[Gryffydd]

The increased case size is offset by the shorter than normal bullet. The overall length of the cartridge is about the same. I've had good luck with them in my Walther P22, so far as accuracy and reliability.
Since you mentioned defense, I should point out that the CCI Velocitor is probably a better defense round than the Stinger. It is slower but heavier than the Stinger. In fact, the Velocitor was specifically designed to be used on larger game than the Stinger.

[emilianoksa]

Thanks for the quick reply?

The Velocitor doesn't seem to be available here.

Shooters here have to put up with what they can get.

[Grumulkin]

I've used Stingers in several different rifles and handguns and they functioned well in all. In fact, I have a Ruger Match pistol in which I have shot several brands of match ammo and other types of ammo. Stingers gave the best accuracy of all.

[Yo Mama]

Put it this way. It's much better than regular .22 ammo. I'd rather Velocitor or stingers over a federal bulk pack for your situation. They were not designed per say for just handguns, as you can use them in some rifles not all though.

They are more reliable in a handgun as they pack that extra punch to cycle properly. As with any ammo try a box to make sure it works well in your gun.

[rcmodel]

please tell me if it's true that this round was designed for use in handguns?No it's not true.
They will work fine in most handguns, but they were not specifically designed for handguns.

Here is some ballistic gel tests with a handgun and various ammo.
Note the Velocitor did not have enough velocity to expand at all.

http://www.brassfetcher.com/WaltherP22test.html

I use 40 grain CCI Mini-Mags, or Winchester Super-X solids in my .22's if SD is a possibility.

I know they will give maximum penetration, and I know they will always go off.

rc

[Gryffydd]

Note the Velocitor did not have enough velocity to expand at all.
No, but the penetration wasn't too shabby!
Since it didn't expand wouldn't it penetrate more or less like a mini-mag, but with the advantage of a couple hundred fps?

[rcmodel]

I'm just say'n, don't expect some of the trick ammo to work as advertised at handgun velocity.

With a .22 handgun, I think penetration is all important, and I know I can get it with premium brands of 40 grain solids. I've been known to carry Stingers, Velocitors, Yellow Jackets, etc., too.

But right now, if I were to go look, I'd bet my S&W 317, and my P-22, and my S&W Kit Gun is loaded with Super-X solids though.

rc

[emilianoksa]

That's interesting.

Super X solids are what I've been using all the time in both my pistols and rifles.

They are one of the rounds you can always get here.:)

[Deltaboy]

They work great in all 22 firearms.

[LibShooter]

Stingers work well in my Walther P22 and Ruger 10/22. Thinking out loud here, but it seems the tiny fast bullet would be better for SD situations in the summer than winter. Heavy clothing would probably sap velocity quickly from the light projectile. I use CCI MiniMags when .22 reliabilty is a must.

BTW here's a good source for rimfire info:

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/

[DBR]

The Stinger case is a bit longer than the standard 22LR case. In most sport gun chambers it is OK. In a match type chamber the case may extend into the lead of the rifling pinching the bullet and cause excess pressure.

The CCI Velocitor is a 40gr Gold Dot bullet in a standard length case. It is my choice for use where over penetration is not an issue. It has been considerably more accurate in my guns than Stingers.

[pbearperry]

Believe it or not,the Stinger in my Ruger Single Six is close to the speed of 22 Mags. and at a cheaper price.

[Davek1977]

They work great in all 22 firearms.

Not true...Many .22 LR firearms have a bentz or match chamber, and users are specifically warned to stay away from Stingers, as they won't chamber/cycle properly because of the slightly longer case. In most firearms, it is not an issuie, but you said "all" making your statement inaccurate. Pretty much any 10/22 thats been rebarreled or any match grade rifle should NOT be used with Stinger ammo.

[rcmodel]

I thought we were talking about .22 handguns for SD use?

Nobody ask about Bentz chambers or Match rifles.

rc

[.45Guy]

Well, the only experience I have with stingers is shooting groundhogs, coyotes, and possibly an ungulate, and some large birds.... Don't ask... They certainly work when killing is the task at hand though....

[Davek1977]

I thought we were talking about .22 handguns for SD use?

Nobody ask about Bentz chambers or Match rifles.

Fair enough, but nonetheless, the staement was made that Stingers work in ALL .22 caliber firearms, which, no matter how you cut it, simply isn't true.

[cleetus03]

Well according to Wikipedia;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_Long_Rifle


"The Stinger uses a longer case, a stronger charge and copper plating on a lighter bullet. The case is longer than that of the normal Long Rifle cartridge (approx. .68 inch versus .59 inch for the Long Rifle), yet Stingers will fit in most Long Rifle chambered firearms."



"The powder is designed to burn more slowly and thus make the most use of the length of a rifle barrel. The extra case length is compensated by a shorter bullet, which is only available as a plated hollow point."



"The thin copper layer on the bullet functions as a lubricant and reduces the friction between the high velocity bullet and the barrel, thus reducing barrel wear. It also has an oxidation-preventing effect on the lead bullet."



"Lead tends to oxidize if stored over long periods of time; as a result of this, the bullet's diameter increases to a level that might both prevent the insertion of the cartridge in the chamber and might cause the pressure in the barrel to rise to a dangerously high level."



"The increase in pressure may lead to the case rupturing and potential danger to the shooter. Standard and subsonic cartridges tend to use a type of wax for the same purpose."

[woad_yurt]

A while back, I was curious as to how the above 3 rounds penetrated when shot from a short barrel. So, I took 3 H&R 922s (2.5", 4" & 6" barrels) and did some semi-scientific testing. All 3 guns were made from 1950-1953, had roughly equal barrel-cylinder gaps and had great bores.

From exactly 12" range (muzzle to wood,) I shot into some new, uniform-in-density-and-grain 2X4s with all 3 types of ammo and all 3 guns.

Using all three guns, the Aguila Supermaximums penetrated the most, followed closely by Velocitors. The Stingers were a distant third. The shorter the barrel, the more the Aguilas pulled ahead of the Velocitors. They were almost even with the 6" barrel but the Aguila still penetrated 1/16" more than the Velocitors.

All in all, I used 9 rounds per gun (one cylinder-full) of each brand. I was going to do more but the results were so consistent that I decided I'd rather plink with the remainder.

I did the same with rifle barrels from longer distances and the Velocitors mopped the floor with the Aguilas and Stingers.

My findings: Supermaximums in a handgun, Velocitors in a rifle.

[cleetus03]

Here's a pic comparing the length of a 22lr stinger;

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/434/22lr.jpg
.22 Long Rifle – Subsonic Hollowpoint (left). Standard Velocity (center), Hyper-Velocity "Stinger" Hollowpoint (right).

[Daizee]

I've posted this before - here it is again.
Note, NO stingers were tested, but the velocitor info is interesting.
My SP101 loves stingers, but they're SO lightweight.

The velocitors give about 10% more velocity for MORE bullet than the 36gr Federal bulk in a 4" barrel. In a 20" rifle they're awesome, and in fact they're slower in a 24" barrel.




5-shot Avg. Vel.
4" SP101 22"? Win 9422 20.5" CZ 452 Lux
--------- -------------- ----------------
Federal Auto Match
Bulk pack $10/325rds 1009 1179 N/A
40gr solid

RWS Rifle Target
40gr lube solid N/A N/A 1060
$50/500

Federal Value Bulk
$10/550rds 1037 1227 1258
36gr copper-washed HP

CCI Velocitor
40gr copper-washed HP 1106 1344 1415
$7-$8/50rds


-Daizee

[351 WINCHESTER]

I have been shooting stingers since they first came out around 1975 or so. From a rifle they were deadly on small game. I used to toss quarters in the air and shoot them with my nylon 66. If the bullet hit squarely it would easily punch a hole in them. The problem was finding them.

[Dr.Rob]

Long ago, I want to say early 80's Gun Digest did a nunch of tests with Stingers and other 22's from a rifle and handgun and against soap and clay targets, The Stinger was a good penetrator in a pistol, but in a rifle against clay they exploded, leaving an impressive 3 inch cavity. While that's great in a VARMINT round, not what you want in an SD round.

Just my 2 cents.

[cleetus03]

Caliber: .22LR

Load: CCI Stinger

Bullet: 32gr. LHP

MV (fps) 1262

ME (ft. lbs.): 113

Penetration (10% gel.): 9.8"

One Shot Stop %: 34%

Test Brl. 6" Colt

http://www.chuckhawks.com/handgun_power_chart.htm

[mrt949]

Work fine in my beretta 21a.and walther p22.:)

[Tiomoid]

I prefer the CCI Mini-Mag's, always seem to function with accuracy, and complete reliability. Besides, they cycle great in my P22.

[makarovnik]

Stingers are about the best performing ammo I've used in an auto pistol.

[The_Shootist]

That was a damn interesting post - I have always favoured the Aquila Supermax over Stingers in either my Cheetah or my 617 (especially my Cheetah they work well - no jams or any problems). It was mainly a gut feeling the Supermax were more effective.

Seeing the results of your test reinforce that feeling. Just too bad that the Supermax (like all other ammo) is a bit hard to comeby now. Not so long ago you could buy a couple of bricks and have them in hand in a couple of days.

[woad_yurt]

Believe it or not, that same day, Mag-Tech's .32 S&W (shorts) from a 3" barrelled Iver Johnson sailed right through a good, dense 2X4 and further into the second than did the Supermaximums. Gave me a little respect for the old round.

[Grey Morel]

Personally, I would go with Velocitors. The Stingers have a hair more energy at the muzzle, but that light bullet sheds energy so fast that at just a few yards the Velocitor will have surpassed it.


Caliber: .22LR

Load: CCI Stinger

Bullet: 32gr. LHP

MV (fps) 1262

ME (ft. lbs.): 113

Penetration (10% gel.): 9.8"

One Shot Stop %: 34%

Test Brl. 6" Colt

http://www.chuckhawks.com/handgun_power_chart.htm


Sorry cleetus, but while Chuck Hawks may have a lot of good ideas, he is not an independent researcher and is far from unbiased. The brass fetcher test found HERE (http://www.brassfetcher.com/WaltherP22test.html), and previously posted by rcmodel on page 1 shows velocitors penetrating 15.8" inches of ballistic gel from a 3.5" barrel. In fact, EVERY type of ammunition tested from this shorter barrel yielded much more penetration that was found by Chucks test. That leads me to suspect the accuracy of his results. Additionally, the fact that he is trying to emulate Marshall and Sanow by calculating a bogus "one shot stop %" blows what little credibility his test would have had left. :(

Shot-placement, shot-placement, shot-placement.

[76shuvlinoff]

I run them in my Kimber .22 conversion on my 1911 without a problem.

My 39A and Marlin 60 both love em but the varmint population votes nooooooooo.

[Gryffydd]

Chuck Hawks may have a lot of good ideas
I'm still looking for them...His writings on the .45 Colt crack me up.

[dagger dog]

While shooting at a refrigerator at the local dump, using a Beretta 21A and CCI stingers, I have had the bullet bounce off and not penetrate the door, at 10 feet.

The barrel on the 21a is just slightly longer than a loaded Stinger this is not including the chamber.

A 40 grain solid standard velocity Remington Golden Bullet would peirce the door at the same distance.

I think a sonic velocity 40 gr. solid would be the best for any 22 handgun caliber with a barrel under
4"s. Any barrels under 4" the hyper velocity is just wasted.