[move99]

I accidientaly bought Berry's 9 mm 115 gr FN plated bullets. I'm going to reload them with Winchester cases. Could someone tell me what the overall cartridge length should be? It seems that the reloaded cartridge will be shorter than the factory Winchester 9 mm Luger, and I'm wondering if they work okay with my Glock17. Thanks.

[Nate1778]

Gonna need more info, what does your manual call for in a FN lead or jacketed bullet?

[Walkalong]

I have been loading Magnus 115 Gr RN, Ranier 115 Gr RN, and Hornady 115 FMF-encapsulated bullets at 1.130 to 1.135 with good results. It probably is a tad long with the Magnus bullet.

That should be a good starting point at least with the Berrys 115 Gr RN bullet.

Welcome to THR

[editingfx]

Not Berry's, but Rainier plated 115gr RN, with 3.8 Clays powder, OAL of 1.120 gives me 1200fps from M&P Pro 9

[something vague]

I don't know why everyone's missing it but he's not concerned with RN bullets. The post is saying he bought FN bullets by accident. I don't have anything for data in front of me but all I can, and should tell you is that you'll be fine using those bullets in your Block...oops I mean Glock. Get yourself some manuals first off and if all else fails look up some online powder/bullet companies manuals. You can use a similar style bullet in the same weight for a starting point, and would also start a little lower than a FMJ. That's about all I can really tell you.

[Steve C]

First the OAL needs to be no greater than 1.169" the maximum recommended allowable by SAAMI, secondly it must fit in your pistols chamber and magazines. Rather than taking someones word its better to figure it out yourself since bullet shape can affect the required OAL and you don't want the round to engage the rifling before fully chambering.

1. Load a round to max OAL and just take out the belling with the crimp.
2. Pull the barrel from you Glock and drop in a factory round and see where the end of the case is in relation to the back of the barrel hood.
3. Drop in your loaded round, if it fits the same as a factory round and fits in the magazines then you are good to go. If not then proceed to shorten the round by making small turns inward of your seating dies stem, and rechecking after each adjustment. When it fits the you've found your maximum OAL, readjust the die to provide the crimp you want. If you have other 9's them check the round in those chambers too.

[Faitmaker]

Best I can do for you.... Take it for what it is.

Hornady Manual

115gr HP-XTP 1.075
115gr FMJ-RN ENC 1.100

Lee Manual is all over the place depending on which powder you use.

[freakshow10mm]

How about keep it simple? Load to the longest OAL that will feed from the magazine and properly chamber in your firearm. There. That simple.

[Walkalong]

I don't know why everyone's missing it but he's not concerned with RN bullets.must be the "FN" part. I know I missed it.

1.060 then for the Berrys 115 Gr TrFP's (http://www.berrysmfg.com/product.aspx?i=14472&c=11&pp=8&sb=0&p=0).......... :)

[move99]

Thanks everybody for your responses. That helps me. Being a newbie, I got a little nervous about FN bullets on OAL and the ramp shape in my Glock. I'll reload and try half a dozen of them first. Thanks again.

[mongoose33]

Thanks everybody for your responses. That helps me. Being a newbie, I got a little nervous about FN bullets on OAL and the ramp shape in my Glock. I'll reload and try half a dozen of them first. Thanks again.


I'm working up some loads for Precision bullets, also flat-nose. I worked up a few *dummy* rounds--no primer, no powder--and then dropped them into the barrel chamber to see if they'd fit.

In my particular case--yours will likely vary as my gun is an XD--a 1.130 OAL wouldn't chamber fully, 1.125 was borderline, 1.20 seemed to be fine.

Once that was the case, I loaded a couple of the DUMMY rounds--not loaded, obviously--into the magazine and checked to see if they'd chamber or not. I racked the slide to eject a round from the chamber and reload the next, to see if there were ramp problems or whatever.

So, right now I'm working up rounds at 1.120 OAL max length for me in this application. I'll shoot 'em through a chrono and see what I get.

[Deavis]

"I'll shoot 'em through a chrono and see what I get."

Probably a hole in that chrono. Perhaps shooting it over the skyscreens is a better idea ;)

[Dreaded]

I load berry's 115gr FN to a OAL of 1.08". That was the longest I could go before the bullet started touching the lands.

My suggestion is pull the barrel in your 9mm and make a dummy round up at 1.13" and do a chamber drop test. Then decrease your OAL by .010" until the back of the case sits flush with your chamber. So 1.12" then 1.11" and so on. Once you find the length that fits your barrel your set. Start with a low charge and work up carefully the 9mm can be a touchy cartridge.

[something vague]

Definitly better that it stays longer than too short, especially with 9mm. Getting them too short can start creating dangerous pressures in a hurry with this round due to the tiny case capacity.

Walkalong, I missed the RN/FN at first but reread it becuase the question just didn't make sense to me otherwise. Oh well.

[Lj1941]

I load my 115 FP's to 1.055 for my M&P. I have no trouble with them feeding in my S&W. Your mileage may vary. I really like that 115 with 5 grains of W/W 231.I load the round noses to 1.125. The factory length is only a guide with the same style bullet. I don't know about Glocks. I hope this helps.

Lou
100% American Made Weapons

[rfwobbly]

In my CZ SP-01, which probably has the shortest freebore of any common 9mm gun around, I load Berry 115gr FP to 1.045" with 4.2gr of Win231. These shoot really well, so much so I used them in IPSC competition. (I believe this load and length is listed in Hornady's 4th or 5th.)

If you are worried about case volume, then it's a simple thing to measure the Winchester round, then measure the naked Winchester bullet length. With some 3rd grade math you can then calculate the "height" of the bullet's base at that OAL. Then, using the Berry's FP bullet length, you can easily arrive at a OAL than will result in the Berry FP sitting at the same depth in the 9x19 case. If nothing else, you may not wish to go any deeper (lower) on your OAL than this number.

However, that is not the full story by a long shot. The FP's shoot great, but due to the feed ramp angle, every gun has an optimal OAL for these to feed well too. So like most shooters, you probably want the bullet to shoot well AND feed well. If you load 10 of each (1.045, 1.055, 1.065, etc), you'll find a sweet spot. Just be careful NOT to run the bullet into the rifling, or out of the case mouth.

Hope this helps!

[threefeathers]

I load the same bullet with 4.7 grains of P B woth OAL of 1.100

[move99]

As a sequel of my first posting, I loaded the bullets with OAL being 1.065" and 3.5 grains of CLAY. 50 rounds fired without any problem from Glock17. It felt mild rounds compared to factory Winchester 115 gr ammo. I'm on the way to increase powder to 3.9 gr max, which Hodgdon manual says. I appreciate great tips from everybody.

[JCisHe]

Move,

Why would you want to load max? It's rarely ever the most accurate load. Also, just for kicks... you may want to call Berry's and ask them for a load. They have a nice guy over there that has reloaded their stuff for years and he will give you a good recommendation or tell you to look at the speer manual (because they have plated bullets/at least that's what he tells me).

Anyway, since your new, I would advise you to stay away from "max" loads and go with target loads for awhile. Then, work up some SD loads later.

Regards,
Beau

[Walkalong]

Ditto. I would not jump from 3.5 to 3.9 Grs, especially with a very fast powder (especially in 9MM) like Clays. 3.9 may very well be safe and accurate, but I would suggest you sneak up on it. Try 3.7 first. :)

[ants]

"I'll shoot 'em through a chrono and see what I get."

Probably a hole in that chrono. Perhaps shooting it over the skyscreens is a better idea

If the skyscreens are the white plastic diffusers that go above the chronograph, you probably won't get a reading when you shoot OVER the sky screens.

If the sensors are the electric eyes in the box, maybe you should shoot over the sensors and below the sky screens.

[move99]

I'm hot in IDPA events now, so, I thought powder at max would be good to knock off a steel plate with a single shot (I'm switching from 45 ACP to 9 mm). However, shooting accuracy would be still more important than bullet energy. I refined adjustments of my loading equipment, and powder is now set at 3.6 gr. I'll see how I do in the next event with 9 mm. Again, many thanks for your tips.

[JCisHe]

Move, best thing to do would be to load 10 ea. (3.4,3.5, 3.6, 3.7) all the way up to max and then shoot them at targets and see which group the best. Just mark the primer with a colored permanent marker (3.4 black, 3.5 blue, etc...). That's typical procedure for working up the best load for your weapon.

After you have figured out which ones shoot best/most accurate then load a batch and take them to the match.

Best of luck...

[Sunray]

"...FN lead or jacketed bullet?..." Plated bullets aren't jacketed. Use cast data.

[RustyFN]

I have had the same experience as rfwobbly, I have to load them at 1.035 for my CZ but can load them at 1.12 for my Glock 17.

Rusty

[rfwobbly]

Mr Move -
You definitely won't need anything near max load for steel, and Berry suggests that you NOT load their bullets to max. I'd start by going back and reading the Berry FAQ on their web site.

[JCisHe]

Yeah actually Berry's says NOT OVER 1200 FPS... Better obey... jacket separation is possible if not.

[Walkalong]

OMG, the world is gonna stop rotating on its axis if we load plated bullets over 1200 FPS or exceed lead data with them. :eek: :D :) ;) :cool:

[JCisHe]

Are you promoting that?

[oneounceload]

I load their 124 gr's for my 17 and do not go to max loads - no need, my accuracy is just fine for what I do with it

[Walkalong]

Are you promoting that?
I shoot Ranier 115 Gr RN bullets at up to a little over 1400 FPS with no problems. Lead data is unnecessarily holding plated bullets back. Not just me talking...........:)

I have never been able to make the plating (not jacket) on a Ranier, Berrys, or X-Treme plated bullet "shed" or "separate". I have been able to make them tumble at a paltry 1100 FPS in one revolver, while others shoot then fine at the same velocities and more.

I am just saying we are unnecessarily limiting plated bullets by sticking with lead data, or 1200 FPS for all applications. There is a good bit of plated data out there. No need to limit ourselves.

Link to some plated data (http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=5399850&postcount=8)

[ants]

Sometimes I have some copper separate from a plated bullet shot from a Beretta 92FS at about 1050 to 1100, which makes the muzzle blast behind the bullet take on a really cooool vortex shape. At IPSC shoots where we hit the paper target on the run (maybe 4 to 6 feet away) it leaves these really cool swirls of burnt powder surrounding the hole. Everyone gathers around to admire the cool pattern left by Anthony's bullets. It's a sight to behold!

But I still hit Alphas on the field courses, so it can't be all bad.

Also, we sometimes shoot plated rifle bullets at around 1600 fps and they don't bust apart. Remington has a series of hollow point 50-grain plated .223 bullets that we shoot over 2000.

Also, Speer Gold Dot is a plated bullet, and no one is afraid to shoot them at full power.

[JCisHe]

Unless you guys have all of the means to test the loads I would go with Berry's recommendations. They are conservative I'm sure but they keep people safe.

You can play fast and loose all you want. All I have to say is, "I'm glad you didn't train me."

I like being safe and in the process protecting others from harm. Move, if I were you, I wouldn't play with load data until you have many years experience and the necessary tools to test the parameters. Being a "cowboy" doesn't do anyone any good when things go bad because of it.

Bullets are designed for specific purposes and GD's are designed differently than Berry's plated. Speer doesn't warn you, "don't shoot above 1200 fps" Berry's does and it should be just that simple.

[D. Manley]

I shoot Ranier 115 Gr RN bullets at up to a little over 1400 FPS with no problems. Lead data is unnecessarily holding plated bullets back.

I don't normally push mine that hard (prefer more subtle loads) but I don't doubt it either. One of the tightest 10 shot groups I ever got was with a batch of 115 Rainier at well over 1300. I think the bullet company's caveat is in large part due to the extreme spread of calibers & bullet weights available...they needed to offer a blanket baseline and chose to err on the cautious side.

[move99]

I loaded cartridges with 3.5, 3.7 and 3.9 grains of powder (40 rounds for each weight, good for one IDPA match). 3.5 grain catridges did everything okay and were most confortable. So, I'll stick to 3.5 grain for a while. Also, I realized that my small electronics powder scale is temparamental and has a great deal of variation. 3.5 grain on one day can be 3.8 grain on other day. No wonder why veteran reloaders have a scale/dispensor costing $300 plus. Anyway, I'm enjoying shooting and reloading this summer.

Regards.

[rfwobbly]

Also, I realized that my small electronics powder scale is temperamental and has a great deal of variation. 3.5 grain on one day can be 3.8 grain on other day.

As they say on TV.... "Danger, Will Robinson !!"

9mm can't take that kind of variation, and you're gun's not going to be as accurate as it could be. You need to find a good used powder dispenser, like an old RCBS "Uni-Flow". If you want to load of (say) 3.9gr, then you weigh 10 powder drops and dial in 39.0gr. That's much more accurate than one drop at 3.9gr.

Then the dispenser will drop exactly 3.9gr until you run out of powder. Your loads will be more highly consistent across an entire "lot", and they will all shoot more nearly the same.


And read up on your model scale. Some of them are affected by weird things like air conditioning vents, florescent lighting, low voltage, etc.

[move99]

9 mm reloading is inherently temperamental, I realized. It's hard to distinguish from 38 cal caeses to begine with, rims can brake and cases stuck in the sizing die, better be careful in powder amount, etc. I didn't start reloading 9 mm if there were not the recent panic ammunition market. 45 ACP reloading is way easier. Cases are big and tough. With 185 grain SWC bullets and if I stay away from max powder level, things are mostly okay. An irony is that some guys ridicule me in practical shooting matches that I break targets with half an inch holes and hard to patch. Sorry, I'm more accurate than being fast. Well, thinking to go for 40 cal now.

Regards.

[Jim Watson]

I have not had any of those problems loading 9mm P.
As somebody already said, load as long as magazine and chamber will accept, then tweak if necessary for feeding. I recently had to change my OAL when I got a new brand of magazine and that has been about it.
I chronograph and adjust the powder charge for about power factor 131, similar to cheapmart econoball. But the only plated bullets I have shot in several years were out of a box given as a match drawing prize.

[JCisHe]

Hey Move,

You're close to me. I wouldn't mind coming over and loading some rounds with you. Let me know if you're interested.

It's really not a terrible thing and I have a great recipe I use for loading the exact some bullets.

Regards,
Beau

[rfwobbly]

Move, Beau. Beau, Move.

Problem solved!

[move99]

I much appreciate your help, Beau. But, being a newbie and silly, I'm comfortable to remain anonymous in the public domain. I've learned a lot in this forum in a quick time frame and would like to bring a closure to my original thread. Thank you and everybody.