Military CLP


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Deckard
June 30, 2009, 11:51 PM
I found some in my cleaning stuff (little black bottle). Army "S-758...cleaner, lubricant, and preservative" and I'm wondering if the stuff is any good. Any G.I.s, former or active, use the stuff? Results? Better/worse than Hoppes 9?

Thanks.

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TheFallGuy
June 30, 2009, 11:59 PM
We had a few of those bottles in basic, but they were filled from a bulk supply of commercial CLP. Not sure if commercial CLP and military is the same, I think it is though, but I like it and still use it today. There are better oils out there but I don't have a reason to switch. I prefer it to Hoppes.

Badger Arms
July 1, 2009, 12:04 AM
They sell the CLP stuff in 1 quart bottles at the local issue store. You can buy anything there with a Military ID but 1005 stuff (Magazines, gun parts, etc.) require a letter from your resource advisor. The problem I have with the commercial stuff is it's all got a strong oil smell that Break Free CLP does not have. Next time I'm splurging on the real thing. Break Free or DIE!

Chindo18Z
July 1, 2009, 10:20 AM
The U.S. Army likes to field test equipment and materials by having students at the Ranger Course wring out proposed items.

Usually, the unlucky students will be handed something and told to use it until course completion or complete failure of the item (whichever comes first).

In 1978, my Ft. Benning class was told to completely clean our weapons (dry solvent pressure cleaners and boiling water in 55 gallon drums), and then apply a new mystery lubricant/protector to all weapons (M16A1s, M60s, & M14s). We were given very specific instruction on exactly how much to apply and to what parts. We were then given tiny little bottles to carry to the field and instructions to NOT CLEAN OUR WEAPONS AGAIN UNTIL COURSE COMPLETION. The only thing allowed in a patrol base was for us to shotgun and field strip the ARs, hit 'em with shaving brushes to remove sand or dirt, and drip more of the fluid onto the parts and components. Run a patch down the bore (liberally soaked with new lubricant), reassemble,...and call it good.

We were not even allowed to disassemble the bolt carriers.

We dragged our weapons thru the next 8 weeks of rain, dirt, blank-fire carbon buildup, mud, swamps, sand, and saltwater.

Weapons worked, rust was not a problem. The product was BreakFree (CLP)...and the entire military began using it the next year. That experience made a CLP believer out of me.

I haven't bothered using anything else since. It is not a great solvent for cleaning but gets the job done with a modicum of elbow grease. For stubborn carbon buildup, I still use something like Hoppes.

The RIs hated our entire class and thought we were "gettin' over" due to the weapons cleaning prohibition. They figured out other forms of unpleasantness to occupy the time we were normally supposed to apply to weapons maintenance.

When I was raised up to guns (before the Army), lubricant was gun oil and cleaner was solvent. CLP does a good job of both (plus rust protection) and was expressly designed to hold up thru high rates of fire by automatic weapons. Great stuff...

P.S. - The stuff in your bottle is simply military labeled BreakFree [called CLP (Cleaner, Lubricant, Protectant) by the military]. Perfectly safe and effective to use on any firearm and readily available in any gunshop.

stubbicatt
July 1, 2009, 10:45 AM
WARNING: Thread veer...

Has any of you noticed that the CLP that comes in the aerosol has a different odor and texture than the stuff in the squeeze bottle? It also seems to be a little more effective too.

Jim Watson
July 1, 2009, 10:50 AM
Is there a white sediment of Teflon in the bottom of the bottle until you shake it up?
If so, then it is Breakfree.
If not, it is a later contract from a different supplier who met the spec without Teflon.

My gunsmith uses the recent stuff on guns and machine tools and thinks it is great.
One of the gunfighting academy coaches has said that it is inferior to his pet commercial lube or to Breakfree.

I follow the old custom of clean with solvent, lube with lubricant and do not try to make one product do it all. Now if I were burdened down with a lot of other equipment in the field as for military deployment or a long hunt, it would be very handy.

Horsemany
July 1, 2009, 11:00 AM
Has any of you noticed that the CLP that comes in the aerosol has a different odor and texture than the stuff in the squeeze bottle? It also seems to be a little more effective too.

Yes...but more effective at cleaning. The aerosol seems to be thinner and clean much better than the liquid squeeze bottles I've used. So I prefer the liquid squeeze bottles because I clean with other solvents like Hoppes or Ed's Red. I use BF CLP as a lube and corrosion protectant. It is one of the most effective corrosion protectants available.

aka108
July 1, 2009, 11:03 AM
I was given a gallon of the military stuff about 15 years ago. Came straight from Camp Pendleton in a milk bottle. Still halve about half of it. I use some of it sparingly on several semi auto. I was weaned onto Hoppes 9 and some form of Rem Oil in the late 1940's. Those two products are all that some of my old arms have ever seen ad they are still in extremely good condition so my preference remains with them. Breakfree/CLP does not impress me as a really good material for removing copper or lead from the barrel. Might just be me but that's my feeling.

SlamFire1
July 1, 2009, 11:46 AM
Breakfree/CLP does not impress me as a really good material for removing copper or lead from the barrel

CLP is not a copper solvent. It is primarily a lubricant. Secondarily it provides a low level of rust resistance. There must be some powder solvent in the stuff, but then because powder residue is organic, and oil is organic, and "like dissolves like", there may not be.

Since the spec MIL-PRF-63460E (to be found on DoDiss) is a performance spec, the seller only has to make something that "performs" the functions in the spec. That means the chemistry of CLP is not controlled and each batch from any maker can look, smell, be, really different.

Breakfree, the commerical stuff sold over the counter, only has to meet whatever requirements the manufacturer wants it to meet. The manufacturer is free to change, delete, whatever, whenever they want to.

All you know as a consumer, is that it comes in a black and gold bottle.
3.4 Environmental requirements.

3.4.1 Humidity resistance. CLP, applied to three test panels, shall provide humidity resistance so that not more than three corrosion dots, none exceeding one millimeter in length, width, or diameter, shall be evident on test panels after 900 hours exposure in a humidity cabinet. The total of such corrosion dots on all three test panels shall not exceed three.

3.4.2 Salt-spray resistance. CLP, applied to three test panels, shall provide salt-spray resistance so that not more than three corrosion dots, none exceeding one millimeter (length, width, or diameter), shall be evident on test panels after 100 hours exposure to a spray of 5 % salt solution. The total of such corrosion dots on all three test panels shall not exceed nine.

3.4.3 Corrosion-protection from propellant reaction products. CLP, applied to three test panels, shall provide corrosion protection from propellant reaction so that no rust spots involving visible pitting or etching of the metal, size two millimeters or larger (length, width or diameter), shall be evident on any of three test panels after exposure to the ignition of WC 844 propellant, (see 6.6) and 96 hours conditioning at 49 2 C (120 4 F) and 100 % Relative Humidity.

3.4.4 Water displacement and water stability. CLP, applied to three test panels, shall displace water so that there is no evidence of rust, mottling, or other abnormal surface stains on the test panels after storage in the static humidity chamber for one hour.

3.5 Operating requirements.

3.5.1 Firing residue removal. CLP shall provide cleaning capability to remove a minimum average of 80 % of the residue generated from the ignition of WC 844 propellant.

3.5.2 Weapon performance. CLP shall provide cleaning, lubricating and preservative characteristics to support operating requirements of the MACHINE GUN: 5.56MM, M249, hereafter referred to as M249 (see 6.9.1 through 6.9.3) when exposed to the following conditions.

3.5.2.1 Cold temperature. CLP applied to a machine gun that is then exposed to severe cold conditions shall prevent any Class II or III stoppages, shall allow no more than two Class I stoppages in 200 rounds, and shall sustain a rate of fire of at least 650 rounds per minute.

3.5.2.2 Sand/dust environments. CLP applied to a machine gun that is then exposed to very fine blowing dust shall prevent any Class II or III stoppages, shall allow no more than five Class I stoppages in 500 rounds, and shall sustain a rate of fire of at least 650 rounds per minute.

3.5.2.3 Salt water immersion. CLP applied to a machine gun that is then immersed in salt water for one minute and stored in high humidity conditions for ten days between firing cyclesshall prevent any Class II or III stoppages, shall allow no more than five Class I stoppages in 1000 rounds, and shall sustain a rate of fire of at least 650 rounds per minute.

briansmithwins
July 1, 2009, 01:29 PM
Breakfree/CLP does not impress me as a really good material for removing copper or lead from the barrel.

That's good because part of the spec it has to meet is that it doesn't remove copper. CLP gets on ammo and having something that etched bullets would be a bad thing.

BSW

Horsemany
July 1, 2009, 02:41 PM
Secondarily it provides a low level of rust resistance.

I politely disagree. My corrosion tests have provided the same results as the well know online tests. The results are Breakfree CLP is one of the best rust protection available today. Bare steel can withstand DAYS of saltwater spray before showing any rust. In the early 70's the product was originally invented by a plating company to prevent flashrusting of their prepared parts before getting in the bath.

Average Joe
July 1, 2009, 08:55 PM
Can I use CLP in my car ? Just had to ask, because so many here want to use motor oil in their guns....

SlamFire1
July 1, 2009, 09:48 PM
Can I use CLP in my car ? Just had to ask, because so many here want to use motor oil in their guns....

Absolutely not. SAE standards are very specific about engine lubrication. I just did a Google search, and can't find an example.

However, I have looked at an old version. The SAE oil spec covers a lot more than just viscosity.

I would not risk ruining a $1000, $2000 engine using Break Free.

You see, the lubricant requirements of a gun are less stressing than the lubricant requirements for a spark/compression ignition engine. That's why you can use motor oils as a lubricant for a rifle and not get into trouble.

Just don't expect motor oil to be a powder solvent or a rust preventative. It is a lubricant.

C-grunt
July 2, 2009, 03:12 AM
Mt only problem with the military CLP was it gummed up quickly when exposed to dust so I used Rem Oil. Im starting to use Breakfree again on my personal weapons because it seems the Rem Oil either evaporates or runs off of the parts when the weapon sits for a while.

mp5a3
July 2, 2009, 10:19 AM
So another thread veer, do you guys have an opinion on M-Pro 7 ? What about Slip 2000 ?

briansmithwins
July 2, 2009, 10:55 AM
So another thread veer, do you guys have an opinion on M-Pro 7 ?

I've used Mpro7 as a cleaner. It works really well when used with a brush or as an ultrasonic cleaning fluid. Being water based it's great for cleaning after shooting corrosive primered ammunition. Mpro7 strips off grease and oil so you have to relubricate after using it.

Recently I've switched to Simple Green Extreme Aircraft cleaner. It's like SG but w/o the nasty odor and coloring. It's also safe for aluminium since it's designed to be used for cleaning aircraft.

I switched because SGE is cheaper than Mpro7, not because it cleans any better. BSW

Jim Watson
July 2, 2009, 01:06 PM
I like MPro 7 cleaner. Detergent based, it doesn't stink up the house like oily solvents but still cleans well. I lube with whatever is handy. As the top IPSC competitor said, when asked what he lubed his gun with said: Whatever the free sample in the last match goodie bag was. I am amused by the people who think that "gun oil" on the label means it is necessarily better than motor oil or some sort of industrial lube. The gun lubricating experts package, sell, and use everything from water thin oil to light grease. Can they all be right?

Lazuris
July 2, 2009, 05:41 PM
I found that Kroil cleans and protects better than CLP. However it does not provide proper lubracation. I use Tetra gun grease for all bolt guns, Gun Butter for all simi auto pistols, And slip for Ar's.

Average Joe
July 2, 2009, 08:42 PM
Salmfire, you didn't read my whole post, I was just being sarcastic...It was a joke....

lipadj46
July 2, 2009, 11:54 PM
There must be some powder solvent in the stuff, but then because powder residue is organic, and oil is organic, and "like dissolves like", there may not be.

Solvents are polar or non-polar , does not matter if they are organic or inorganic. Multipurpose cleaners general have a non polar main solvent for the polar organic compounds and then have some slightly polar solvent (like an alcohol) that can dissolve the salts.

stevelyn
July 3, 2009, 01:11 AM
MPro-7 cleaner is awesome. I don't care for their version of CLP though and stick with good old Break-Free.

Uncle Mike
July 3, 2009, 01:30 PM
Royco 463... Made by Royal Lubricants
Mil Spec. MIL-L-6346OD-AMD3

Military CLP- the old stuff.

:D

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