So what's the type to Mexico?


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pictoblu
July 1, 2009, 10:54 AM
Have read many threads and news items about law abiding Americans being harrassed for "having guns like the ones the Mexican gangsters use."

Did a search, but was not able to find out what types of guns these are, specifically.

So, friends, what specific guns put law abiding Americans on the list of suppliers of guns to Mexico?

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DAVIDSDIVAD
July 1, 2009, 03:04 PM
It's all BS, man.

They have proven that Russian gangs from Moscow are supplying guns to the cartels in Mexico.

I'm not saying that's where all of them are coming from, but if you have a supply of all kinds of weapons coming in from powerful sources, why bother with American semi-autos?

c919
July 1, 2009, 04:24 PM
GATS, definitely GATS. I think they are the kind with the 9mm clips in em'.

Although, I here they be gettin foaties soon too.

Mohawk
July 1, 2009, 04:53 PM
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but 45Cal. semi autos are illegal in Mexico except for law enforcement. Most desireable pistol in Mexico is the 1911 action chambered for the 38super round. Other than that I can't think of anything we got that they can't get elsewhere cheaper and quicker.

damien
July 1, 2009, 05:02 PM
FN FiveSevens are specifically mentioned and .38 supers. The former because the gangs think they can defeat body armor (only with special ammo) and the latter because the ammo is fairly available in Mexico.

nalioth
July 1, 2009, 07:28 PM
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but 45Cal. semi autos are illegal in Mexico except for law enforcement
As with many countries, firearms in military calibers are illegal in Mexico for civilians to own.

TheFallGuy
July 1, 2009, 09:46 PM
I never understood Mexico's prohibition on military calibers... I mean don't most of the common hunting calibers come from military cartridges? 5.56 is a military caliber but appears to be legal.

Bwana John
July 2, 2009, 01:53 AM
Most desireable pistol in Mexico is the 1911 action chambered for the 38super round
Chrome plated with ivory or mother of pearl grips, tucked into the waistband:neener:.
5.56 is a military caliber but appears to be legal.
not for private ownership in Mexico.

The most desirable rifle cartridge seems to be the .270 Win.
Another cartridge that I see all the time down there is the .30-30, I wonder if that was ever a Mexican military round:confused:

Birdmang
July 2, 2009, 01:56 AM
Why would drug lords/gangsters abide by the Mexican laws on legal gun calibers?

pkoch62
July 2, 2009, 02:26 AM
Lesser penalties if caught, maybe?

Deus Machina
July 2, 2009, 06:43 AM
They don't care about the law--they'll be going away for life for everything else, anyway. If they get caught by a cop and a judge they can't buy off or kill.

It's because it's a lot cheaper and easier than smuggling, if they can actually buy the ammunition there.

Onmilo
July 2, 2009, 10:13 PM
A small selection of the narco weapons of choice.
http://www.fototime.com/4FE2EB10BB38050/standard.jpg

Zoogster
July 3, 2009, 01:58 AM
The type is whatever the Mexican government has. That includes many weapons from the US, since a large number of the government's firearms come from the US.

Here is a story on a battle last month:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D98MRJM01&show_article=1&catnum=2

ACAPULCO, Mexico (AP) - Gunmen launched grenades and opened fire in near simultaneous attacks on two police stations in Acapulco Monday, killing three officers in violence that broke out less than 48 hours after a spectacular gunbattle in the resort left 17 dead.
The bold, pre-dawn attacks Monday also wounded one police officer in this Pacific resort city, which has long been plagued by drug violence.


Gunmen fatally shot two officers sitting in a patrol car parked outside one police station. A few minutes later, assailants attacked a second station, about two miles (three kilometers) away, wounding two officers, according to the Guerrero state police department. One of the officers later died.

Soldiers set up roadblocks in search of the suspects, who shot up at least eight patrol cars.

A state police official, who was not authorized to give his name, said investigators are looking at whether the attacks were in retaliation for late Saturday's gunbattle.

The weekend shootout between soldiers and alleged drug traffickers killed 13 suspected hit men, two soldiers, and two innocent bystanders, Velasco said. One bystander was wounded. The Defense Department in initial reports mistakenly said 18 people had died.

A hit man named "Commander Magana" with the Beltran Leyva cartel was among the dead, Daniel Velasco, a military commander in Acapulco, told reporters Monday.

Thousands of shots and 50 grenade explosions marked the battle, which erupted after soldiers received a tip that a group of armed men were gathered at a gated house less than 100 yards (meters) from the Los Flamingos Hotel that was once a private club for Hollywood stars including John Wayne and "Tarzan" star Johnny Weissmuller.

Several gunmen tried to flee but crashed their car into a military Hummer that was blocking the gate. At one point, more armed men with grenades arrived to reinforce the men in the house, but they died in the shooting, said an army colonel, who led the operation and spoke on condition of anonymity for security reasons.

Inside, soldiers found four men bound and shirtless who claimed they were Guerrero state police officers being held hostage. The alleged officers and one other person inside the house were detained, the Defense Department said in a statement.

Soldiers did not know the hostages were inside when the shootout began, and the colonel said the four men's claims to be police would be investigated.

The soldiers confiscated 47 guns, grenades and ammunition, as well as several cars, including a Mercedes Benz.

Guerrero state, where Acapulco is located, has long suffered from drug violence from cartels fighting for turf.

The Beltran Leyva cartel, in particular, has a strong presence in the state. Last month, soldiers arrested a suspected cartel lieutenant as he stepped off a private plane in the northern city of Monterrey on his way back from Acapulco, where he said he'd met with cartel leader Arturo Beltran Leyva at a baptism party.

President Felipe Calderon has sent at least 3,000 soldiers to Guerrero state as part of his nationwide crackdown on organized crime launched in 2006. Since then, more than 10,800 people have been killed by drug violence nationwide.


The military was called in after the police were attacked.
A lot of grenades were used in the battle with the military. They are so bold that when engaged by the military they call for backup and more people arrive to assist them! The result of the fighting may or may not be accurate. Details are often altered to favor the government forces to deter future criminals in these types of events. So the actual wounded or dead on the military side could be different than reported.



So when you see crates of hand grenades, rifled grenades, rocket propelled grenades, and grenades in general you have found the type.
The source is likely the grenade booth at your local gun show. :rolleyes:

Most of the US private weaponry that is smuggled to Mexico is not the type used in the actual warfare. They are private less capable firearms than available to organized crime. Even those that do go to drug cartels are more often fancy handguns for private collections, not "business" type weapons used in shootouts. There is better sources in Mexico for combat weaponry.
There is private citizens without the sources of the organized crime or government who may purchase smuggled arms.
The only difference between us and them though is it is generaly illegal for them to keep and bear arms. We wouldn't want to see the gun ban for private citizens trying to cope with almost civil war in thier nation fail. We must support Mexico's gun ban and crack down on any sources that may result in a weapon bought by a Mexican private citizen. After all, only the police, corrupt and non-corrupt, should be armed with any moderately capable weaponry. :rolleyes:

PTK
July 3, 2009, 04:04 AM
.......there's an M79 in that pile. These gangs are SERIOUSLY outgunning police both here in the USA and in Mexico, aren't they. :(

Kind of Blued
July 3, 2009, 06:50 AM
If I had a dollar for every M79 I walked by at a gun show... :rolleyes:

geronimo509
July 3, 2009, 07:29 AM
How about this...http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090703/ap_on_re_us/us_drug_trafficking

This got me thinking, I might be a cold hearted bastard, but here are my thoughts. Even if the US is supplying guns for the cartels can kill themselves, SO WHAT, let the animals wipe each other out. Mexico has been supplying drugs that have been killing many US citizens who happen to have a drug problem. Some drug users got sucked into the world of drugs because they are weak. The drug cartels chose that line of work for the money and if they die, good for them.

BTW, the "animal" comment is not racist, I know more than a few Mexican Americans who are hard workers and great guys. I was referring to mexican cartels as animals. I would say the same thing if US gang members were killing each other in a turf war.

The only thing I would worry about are innocent civilians.

chuckusaret
July 3, 2009, 09:54 AM
What a shame to have a president that would intentionally lie to the people of America. The president stated that 90% of all weapons sized in Mexico were by illegal US gun sales to the Mexican drug gangs.. True, but twisted fact. The Mexican government stated that 90% of all weapons captured, that had a serial number, were from America. These serial numbered weapons also included weapons that were stolen from the Mexican Army and police that were given to them by the US. Rumor is that several thousand Mexican military personnel desert yearly with their US supplied assigned weapons. Of all the thousands of weapons captured by the Mexican authorities they stated less than a hundred had a serial number. If the 100 weapons with serial numbers that was captured and ten were made in other countries and 90 were made in the US then the statement by the president is true...........But, his statement failed to mention that of the thousands of weapons captured only weapons with serial numbers were used by the Mexican government in their report and did not report the total number of weapons, both with serial numbers and without serial numbers. We have a president that contridicts his stated "carved in stone" policy on a daily basis. We will cut un empoyment. we will reduce taxes, we will not tax health benifits we will not...........America is in shambles because of Obama.

NC-Mike
July 3, 2009, 12:53 PM
America is in shambles because of Obama.

Obama is just the tip of the spear.

Zoogster
July 3, 2009, 03:22 PM
there's an M79 in that pile. These gangs are SERIOUSLY outgunning

Oh that is nothing:
They have seized anti-aircraft guns:
http://borderviolenceanalysis.typepad.com/mexicos_drug_war/2009/04/mexico-police-seize-antiaircraft-weapon-near-us-border.html
http://borderviolenceanalysis.typepad.com/.a/6a011279457f1228a40115701d411d970b-320wi


Anti-tank rocket launchers such as the M-72 LAW and AT-4 are also regularly seized.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7a/Merida_initiative_weapons_seized.jpg

Belt fed machineguns
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/04/14/article-1170064-047231DB000005DC-330_634x389.jpg

Body armor and uniforms:
http://www.nraila.org/images/cartelfirearms.jpg
http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/09O24wi59LfmP/610x.jpg

Hand grenades: http://www.nraila.org/images/cartelgrenades.jpg


Other items clearly from your local gun store:
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/3672/610x789989ek4.jpg



Ever wonder why when you go down to your local gunshop they are always out of anti-tank rockets? Are you unable to feed your M-72 LAW, AT-4 or RPG-7 during your trips to the local firing range? Cartels must be buying them up so fast our FFL's cannot keep them stocked. :rolleyes:

Poprivit
July 3, 2009, 05:06 PM
Well, I just have to take my collection of M-79s and ammo down to Nogales and make some serious pesos.

Let's see, with the five M-79s I picked up at my local gun show for $20 apiece, and my stash of M-203s and a LAW or two, I should be able ...

Come on US government! Get the facts right. Just about everything shown in these photos is totally unavailable to civilians (And yes, i know about DDs and Pre-1986 Class III. I'm not going to take my $16,000 M1919A4 down to Ol' Mexico anytime soon.)

Husaberg Man
July 3, 2009, 06:28 PM
They have proven that Russian gangs from Moscow are supplying guns to the cartels in Mexico.

I'm not saying that's where all of them are coming from, but if you have a supply of all kinds of weapons coming in from powerful sources, why bother with American semi-autos?

David's David....

Who is "they," and do you have a link to the proof? I'm not saying you're wrong, but I haven't heard this before and I'm curious about the source of the stated fact.

DAVIDSDIVAD
July 3, 2009, 07:01 PM
I can't find the exact article, but this one states it as well.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/elections/2009/04/02/myth-percent-guns-mexico-fraction-number-claimed/


Podolskaya in particular has been mixed up with S. American coke and stuff for a while

chuckusaret
July 4, 2009, 10:27 AM
I use to live in El Paso, I don't remember any gun store that sold RPG'S, LAW's, and full auto weapons as shown in the picture. The big gun dealer, the US Federal Government, must have given the Mexicans the heavy stuff, but Obama is going to blame it on "straw" deals at gun shows and the Mom and Pop gun stores. I had a father that told me to always tell the truth, Obama missed that part of his up bringing, he did not have a father image in house while growing up.

NC-Mike
July 4, 2009, 12:06 PM
I can't find the exact article, but this one states it as well.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/elec...umber-claimed/


Podolskaya in particular has been mixed up with S. American coke and stuff for a while

Well common sense will tell you the only guns a drug cartel would desire from the US would be high-end pistols and sniper-type rifles including the 50 cal BMG's.

The FA rifles are coming in from somewhere else. Everyone in Mexico has full auto rifles because rifles are already banned, so if you're gonna break the law, may as well have a full auto.

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