The idea of a 'club-gun'


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10-Ring
July 5, 2009, 06:38 PM
I've met up w/ a good bunch of shooters. We get together at least a couple times a month to talk guns usually, eat & drink too much and just be able to hang out.
The other day during our bbq, the idea of a 'club gun' came up. Maybe well all pitch in and buy something none of use could afford on our own that the club could enjoy -- or maybe a common firearm we all own. Something w/ could have engraved w/ a club logo.
My question -- what do you guys think I could nominate for club gun (make, model, caliber) at the next bbq?

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BHP FAN
July 5, 2009, 06:56 PM
A good idea is a rifle everyone could afford to buy and shoot. Sometimes it's nice to have the same kind of equipment.Then you know who's really shooting the best, not just who owns the most expensive rifle.A nice ten pack of Moisen Nagants,maybe? The larger dealers usually give a break for more than three,and a bigger break for ten or more.

falmike
July 5, 2009, 07:00 PM
Best bet would be to form an LLC, takes care of liability issues if something happens...God forbid.

Deus Machina
July 5, 2009, 07:06 PM
I'd vote for a box of Nagants, too, but they just vary so much it would leave plenty of argument over shooter/gun problems.

Maybe something like a Marlin 60, or one of the other cheap .22's. Anyone could still afford to shoot it, and the Marlins are nice guns on their own.

THE DARK KNIGHT
July 5, 2009, 07:12 PM
Agreed, get everyone a Mosin Nagant and have a blast.

OR pitch in money from everyone and get a .50 BMG!

4v50 Gary
July 5, 2009, 07:13 PM
Barrett Fifty.

Mohawk
July 5, 2009, 07:18 PM
Ruger Blackhawk. Not a gun you'd buy for CC or HD but a hell of a lot of fun to shoot.

rugbyer81
July 5, 2009, 07:21 PM
I also would suggest everyone get the same type of milsurp rifle, possibly a Mosin or possibly not. That way you could not only all be shooting the same rifle/ammo, and see who really was shooting the best, but you could also have a variety of production years and factories to compare, as well as have fun speculating who's rifle was where during history. The rifles don't even have to be nice, sometimes its even more fun to shoot older, well-worn firearms that exhibit lots of charecter, especially if all your buddies are shooting the same kind of thing.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
July 5, 2009, 07:33 PM
Get an LLC, corporation, or partnership agreement IN WRITING, or there's gonna be trouble later. Make it crystal clear who gets possession when, exactly! Probably just a short partnership agreement will work well. Just put down the terms of who's paying what, who gets to keep & shoot when, what to do when someone dies or moves away, who's going to insure it and who bears the risk of theft or other loss (just the possessor or all share and share alike?), and have all parties sign the writing.

And yeah, this sounds like a job for a .50 BMG, .416 Barrett, .408 CT, or .338 Lapua.

10-Ring
July 5, 2009, 07:35 PM
Remember we are in CA -- i cannot be trusted to stay safe w/ a 50 cal :(

Flash!
July 5, 2009, 07:42 PM
I suggest forget buying a gun for the club..... buy some land and build your own private range....

HuntAndFish
July 5, 2009, 08:07 PM
** deleted ** Was thinking NFA restricted item...

jimmyraythomason
July 5, 2009, 08:14 PM
So how would you answer the questions on form 4473? ONE of you would have to fill it out. Could you answer the question "Are you the actual buyer?" without commiting pergury? Just asking.

gbran
July 5, 2009, 08:20 PM
http://www.bbqgun.com/images/postcard2.jpg

jackdanson
July 5, 2009, 08:22 PM
So how would you answer the questions on form 4473? ONE of you would have to fill it out. Could you answer the question "Are you the actual buyer?" without commiting pergury? Just asking.

Was wondering that myself....

A class 3 would be awesome if it could be done in a legal manner.

Mohawk
July 5, 2009, 08:28 PM
I take back the Ruger Blackhawk post. After reading suggestions I say make it a FA HK MP5. It should work for Cali firing ranges being 9mm. Only problem is you guys will eventualyy fight to the death to see who gets to keep it. ;)

Rembrandt
July 5, 2009, 08:39 PM
Club Gun?.....bad idea. Comparable to the problems I could see in having a "Club Corvette".....

Only go into business with a partner as a last resort.....always try to do it on your own first, fewer problems.

jim in Anchorage
July 5, 2009, 08:42 PM
Did you say BBQ Gun?
That is the most unbelievable combination of clothing I have ever seen in my life. Honest.

jnyork
July 5, 2009, 08:50 PM
Old adage applicable here: "Never do business with friends or relatives, or soon you will have no friends, no relatives and no business". If you want to do something like that, just get everyone to pitch in and draw cards for sole ownership! :D

Mohawk
July 5, 2009, 08:56 PM
That is the most unbelievable combination of clothing I have ever seen in my life. Honest.
Definately proves the old adage, "Never Dress Drunk"

Rembrandt
July 5, 2009, 09:00 PM
That is the most unbelievable combination of clothing I have ever seen in my life. Honest.

Must be one of those "California Cowboys".....wouldn't see someone from Texas dressed like that at a BBQ.

TheFallGuy
July 5, 2009, 09:28 PM
Well if it wasn't in the PRK (People's Republic of **********), I would say an NFA toy, maybe something full auto but I can only imagine that you are not trusted by your state to possess such things. Perhaps something antique like an old Buffalo gun in .45-70 or a lever action shotgun.

Legally I think you should start an LLC though to avoid legal issues. Get a tax number, take dues (to maintain/feed the weapon). It could take your club to a new level!

rs999
July 5, 2009, 09:49 PM
In addition to the liability protection you might want to see if it is possible for the LLC to own the gun instead of any one individual. That way all individuals in the club can further distance themselves from liability since the gun is an asset of the club.

fireman 9731
July 5, 2009, 11:08 PM
I agree with Flash, buy some land for your own personal range!

sub.sonic
July 5, 2009, 11:47 PM
Form your club, become a LLC, then register with CMP and purchase some M1 Carbines or M1 Garands. Great shooters and very reasonable through CMP

BHP FAN
July 5, 2009, 11:57 PM
Since he was looking for a gun for his club,I assumed he already had one?

XTerminator
July 6, 2009, 12:45 AM
A Mosin-Nagant would be a perfect "club-gun".

When you have ammo it's a gun...............and when you don't it's a pretty darn good club.

:evil::neener:

Steve

Cannonball888
July 6, 2009, 02:32 AM
http://www.wrtcleather.com/1-ckd/1-gallery/cr19-006.jpg

BullfrogKen
July 6, 2009, 02:56 AM
I've met up w/ a good bunch of shooters. We get together at least a couple times a month to talk guns usually, eat & drink too much and just be able to hang out.
The other day during our bbq, the idea of a 'club gun' came up. Maybe well all pitch in and buy something none of use could afford on our own that the club could enjoy -- or maybe a common firearm we all own. Something w/ could have engraved w/ a club logo.
My question -- what do you guys think I could nominate for club gun (make, model, caliber) at the next bbq?

I'm not sure I catch your drift.


Are you saying all you fellas are currently members of a gun club now, and you'd like to buy a gun for the club's use?


Or are you just a collection of friends, and you want to buy a gun that you guys will share among yourselves?

rfurtkamp
July 6, 2009, 04:47 AM
So how would you answer the questions on form 4473? ONE of you would have to fill it out. Could you answer the question "Are you the actual buyer?" without commiting pergury? Just asking.


Read the instructions for corporate/trust purchases on the 4473. You affix a letter stating it's being purchased for X, and fill it out normally.

You are in fact the actual buyer, on behalf of the entity.

If you don't have a formal entity for this purpose, you can make one.

chuckusaret
July 6, 2009, 09:10 AM
Form your club, become a LLC, then register with CMP and purchase some M1 Carbines or M1 Garands. Great shooters and very reasonable through CMP

In addition to the liability protection you might want to see if it is possible for the LLC to own the gun instead of any one individual. That way all individuals in the club can further distance themselves from liability since the gun is an asset of the club.

A group of us also looked into a club/LLC to allow us to purchase guns and large amounts of ammo at a reduced rate and also to possibly reduce shipping costs. There are many hurdles to jump and they all take one thing, lots of cash and time. We are still attempting to start a private gun club and range even though the odds are against it. Remember this is the land of the free as long as you get the governments approval first.

Pack
July 6, 2009, 04:53 PM
If it's for the purpose of owning just a few guns, it's relatively easy to set up a firearms trust to hold the weapon. People do this with NFA items, so I'm sure it can be done with the ownership of less-restricted guns, too. It's nice to have, because any member/officer of the trust can have the NFA paperwork and possess the gun legally at any time. It just gets around the need for the one person who's on the paperwork to always be wherever the gun is.

This also creates a strong fiduciary relationship between the members, which means they have greater duties to each other than in an LLC, etc. - it also means that the law in the area, should a dispute ever arise, is generally more well-settled and clear. It would even be possible, in some jurisdictions, to take care of any potential disputes quickly and easily in a less formal procedure before the probate court of the county in question, as opposed to the only recourse being a suit in normal civil court.

***The laws of each jurisdiction vary greatly, and I'm not dispensing legal advice, nor in any way do I intend for you to rely upon it. I am not yet a memebr of the Bar of any state***

I just wanted to make you aware of the fact that people do effectively use "NFA trusts" to hold their MGs, etc. and the BATFE is OK with it.

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