C&R question...


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hobgob
July 7, 2009, 01:45 AM
Does a C&R license permit one to buy C&R guns from stores out of state. For instance... If a license holder were on vacation and saw a milsurp worth buying?

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Quiet
July 7, 2009, 02:11 AM
Yes.
Even allows you to purchase them online and have them shipped to your door.

Just remember to log all your transactions in your bound book.

Shadow 7D
July 7, 2009, 02:16 AM
yes, you have to have your license then make sure that the seller will accept it, then you sign a copy and jump though whatever hoops the seller wants and you can purchase you new gun. BTW never sign the original.

hobgob
July 7, 2009, 02:39 AM
Thanks, I am still kind of new to the C&R game. just got my giant white book of regulations from the ATF. I already bought a nice leather "Bound Book" made specifically for C&R license holders. I was just curious.

SaxonPig
July 7, 2009, 08:05 AM
It allows you to buy just like an FFL dealer except you are buying for collecting purposes rather than as a business. And you still can't send or receive handguns via the US Mail.

Be aware that not everyone will sell to a C&R holder.

TimRB
July 7, 2009, 01:54 PM
The C&R license ONLY allows you to buy C&R guns interstate. Within your state you have to comply with your state's gun laws, whatever they are.

Tim

GRIZ22
July 7, 2009, 06:23 PM
A few states restrict any sales to an out of state resident. For example I know a 01 FFL who bought some guns at Sarco in NJ. They were happy to sell them but only if they shipped them to his FFL address out of state.

stickhauler
July 8, 2009, 12:02 AM
The C&R license ONLY allows you to buy C&R guns interstate. Within your state you have to comply with your state's gun laws, whatever they are.


That isn't my understanding of the law, I live in Ohio and have a few C & R dealers fairly local that allow me to buy firearms with my C & R license.

TimRB
July 8, 2009, 11:17 AM
"That isn't my understanding of the law..."

Your C&R license is a *Federal* document. It has nothing to do with intrastate shipments, only interstate ones. It may be that your local laws (or dealers) make some allowance for C&R holders, but the purpose of a C&R license is to allow people out of state to be able to legally ship you "old" guns without the bother of going through a dealer.

Tim

SaxonPig
July 8, 2009, 12:19 PM
That doesn't sound right, Tim.

Yes, state law always applies but your situation in CA is not the same as most of the rest of the country. CA restricts the use of C&R (as in all handguns must still go through an 01 FFL) but federal law doesn't restrict C&R holders from in-state purchasing. With a C&R I can buy from any source within my state and log it as a purchase made via the license. It's not just for out of state purchases. An FFL holder (01 dealer type) can certainly buy guns inside his home state under federal law and it's the same with a C&R (for C&R qualified guns, of course).

Shadow 7D
July 8, 2009, 01:51 PM
Let me jump in here and state that

These are the opinions of the posters and in no way should be construed as legal advice.

When you are in doubt, please contact your local ATF office and talk to the nice people who are paid to answer your legal questions

A cravat, make sure that they know the law, read some old posts and you will find some funny stuff that the ATF has put out.

Finally, welcome and hope you enjoy your guns, might want to start with a cz-82 from J&G sales in AZ, Century arms has some nice polish Tokarevs, and Samco has M-38 mosin nagants.

TimRB
July 8, 2009, 02:13 PM
Here are the words attached on the bottom half of the paper which is my C&R license:

"Dear Licensee:

Enclosed you will find your Federal Firearms License. This license entitles you as a collector of firearms, classified as curios and relics, to acquire curios and relics in interstate commerce..."

At the bottom it says:

"A Federal Firearms License does not permit you to recieve, sell, or transfer firearms or ammunition without first obtaining the proper State and/or local license, if any. Please check your local authorities."

If we take Shadow's advice and check the C&R FAQ page on the ATF site (http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#g1) we find this:

"(G1) Is there a specific license which permits a collector to acquire firearms in interstate commerce? [Back]

Yes. A person may obtain a collector's license. However, this license applies only to transactions in curio or relic firearms.

[18 U.S.C. 923(b), 27 CFR 478.41(c), (d), 478.50(b) and 478.93]

(G2) Does a collector's license afford any privileges to the licensee with respect to acquiring or disposing of firearms other than curios or relics in interstate or foreign commerce? [Back]

No. A licensed collector has the same status under the GCA as a non-licensee except for transactions in curio or relic firearms.

[27 CFR 478.93]"

So as I said, you must comply with your state and local laws, whatever they are. Your state may grant some privileges to you if you have some sort of FFL, but it may not. If you are an FFL-holder, your state may saddle you with additional restrictions, or even prohibit you from exercising your Federal privileges. For example, as a California C&R holder I may NOT have C&R handguns shipped directly to me; they must go through an 01 FFL dealer. This is a state requirement; the Feds could care less.

Tim

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