7mm-08 vs .25-06 Questions


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BlayGlock
July 7, 2009, 09:33 AM
Ive always hunted with an old winchester .30-30, or a 7mm rem mag for long range work. Ive decided to buy a rifle that my wife my actually like to shoot as well, and one that she could take deer hunting with me. What are your opinions on these two rounds as far as recoil,trajectory, ect?

I handload so ammunition is not an issue.

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Uncle Mike
July 7, 2009, 10:10 AM
The two are nearly identical in the energy department with the nod going to the 7mm-08.

I mean, if you move a 120gr bullet at 3000fps, it does not matter to which cartridge it came... 120 grains at 3k is just that. The trajectories are also too close to debate over.

The 7mm-08 will have a wider variety of loading ability offered to the reloader, shorter, lighter rifle, can be loaded 'up' with heavier bullets, shorter bolt throw... I favor the 7mm-08.

:D

SeekHer
July 7, 2009, 10:40 AM
Two of my daughter have the 7mm-08, two have .257 Roberts, one daughter a .257 Weatherby, my wife has a 6.5x55 Swede, another daughter a 7x57 Mauser and me with a .280 Ack Imp and a .284 Win and a .264 Win and a .260 Rem and...

I much prefer a shorter action and the family of the .308 Win and especially the 7mm bullet size which has a much broader shoulder then the .25 and bullet selection is much better in commercial ammo and reloading components...

They all kill deer dead but I'd rather shoot the 6.5mm (.264) and 7mm (.284) size bullets and can at least use the 7mm for elk in a pinch...I don't have any 6.8mm (.270) chamberings although a SPC is in the offerings...

kludge
July 7, 2009, 10:46 AM
Ditto. 7mm-08 is as versatile if not more so than the 30-06, even at long ranges, flat shooting, and there is a plethora of good bullet choices for the handloader.

Also look at .243 and .257 Roberts if all you need is a lower recoil deer rifle. Your .30-30 might be fine for your wife too.

H4985 (off the top of my head, don't quote me on that, check for yourself) is good for reduced loads in several calibers, which are nice for youth or those who are recoil sensitive.

HarleyFixer
July 7, 2009, 10:50 AM
I would really consider the 6.5x55. Recoil is very light, accuracy is outstanding and it hits VERY hard. It is one of THE hunting calibers in Europe and is often used to take game up to moose. Plus some of the guns made for it are just sweet.

peyton
July 7, 2009, 10:51 AM
I second the .243 if all you are going to hunt is deer. I have shot a 7mm-08, it shoots pretty well and both ammo's can be found. I think the .243 is more available.

lefteyedom
July 7, 2009, 03:44 PM
Get a 7X57 mauser. Old school is still the best school.

Water-Man
July 7, 2009, 04:03 PM
+1 on the 6.5x55 Swede. One of the best calibers ever. I have one in the TIKKA T3 Hunter. VERY accurate and dependable. Made by Sako.

Paradiddle
July 7, 2009, 04:05 PM
I've read the Swede has about the same recoil as the 7mm-08. Do you guys find that to be true (in comparable rifles obviously).

Mr_Pale_Horse
July 7, 2009, 04:09 PM
I have a 7x57, albeit in a long action Mauser, and I think the 7mm-08 in the lighter/shorter short action is the bees knees.

BlayGlock
July 7, 2009, 07:22 PM
Thanks for the good info, seems the vote goes to 7mm-08. I did see a run of limited Ruger rifles in the 6.5X55. Are the components readily available for handloading?

Paradiddle
July 7, 2009, 08:01 PM
Thanks for the good info, seems the vote goes to 7mm-08. I did see a run of limited Ruger rifles in the 6.5X55. Are the components readily available for handloading?

Yes - you can get 6.5 reloading gear from anywhere. Lupa or Norma brass is the most highly recommended as it's sized correctly from the factory and there are several good loads out there.

Jeff

ECVMatt
July 7, 2009, 08:14 PM
I am pretty new to this cartridge, but I really like it so far. I love short actions and this cartridge fits perfectly in them.

I am not sure about the 6.5. I am sure is it a good round, but there is just more choices for the 7mm diameter. 7-08 seems easier to find as well.

Matt

loneviking
July 7, 2009, 08:20 PM
Why would the 7mm-08 be more versatile than the 30-06? I'm not knocking the caliber, but I can load Speer 100 gr. 'Plinkers' or 110 gr. 'Varmints' flying at about 3500 fps out of my Springfield. Light recoil and devastating results out at 500/600 yards. I can load up the 'o6 with 220 grs. that will put down a big bear.....so tell me again why I would want to go with a cartridge that can be hard to get components for and the ballistic results that I've seen aren't all that superior? I'm not looking for an argument, I really am curious as to this claim.

AKElroy
July 7, 2009, 08:30 PM
The .25-06 shoots exceptionally flat for a non-magnum load; the 7mm-08 hits as hard but is not as flat shooting. If you are looking for a good dear harvester that shoots flat like the 25-06, but can fit in a tidy short action like the 7mm 08, split the difference & get a .243. The .243 has a proportionally longer bullet profile for any given weight & bucks the wind really well, so it would probably be my choice. It's why the 6mm PPC rounds are so popular in longe range competition. Recoil in the .243 is next to nill as well, which may be important to a new female shooter. The only other factor you may want to consider is that the .25-06 is significantly overbore & really needs a 26" barrel to reach it's potential.

Arkel23
July 7, 2009, 08:40 PM
I second the .243 if all you are going to hunt is deer. I have shot a 7mm-08, it shoots pretty well and both ammo's can be found. I think the .243 is more available. I hope she can shoot.

AKElroy
July 7, 2009, 09:24 PM
I hope she can shoot.

I assume because the 7mm-08 hits so hard a poorly placed shot will get the job done & the .243 won't? Poor logic IMO. They share the same case & have nearly the same capacity. Many argue the longer bullet profile for a given weight of the .243 aids penetration. In my experience neither will work with improper placement, and both work well with it. A miss is a miss; a hit is a hit. Both will cleanly take any deer sized game if the hunter does his part, neither will if he doesn't.

NCsmitty
July 7, 2009, 10:53 PM
Why would the 7mm-08 be more versatile than the 30-06?
loneviking, I like the '06 but here is the reason the 7mm-08 is popular. It is a very efficient round.
These are comparable bullets and they are very close in performance. The BC of the 7mm does give it an edge.
The numbers are from muzzle to 500yds. Remington ballistic chart.

30'06 Premier® AccuTip™--150gr AT BT
VELOCITY --2910--2686--2473--2270-2070--1893

7-08 Premier® AccuTip™ 140gr AT BT
VELOCITY --2860--2670-- 2489--2314--2146--1986


Premier® AccuTip™ 150gr AT BT
ENERGY--2820--2403--2037--1716--1436--1193

Premier® AccuTip™ 140gr AT BT
ENERGY--2542--2216--1925--1664--1432--1225

BlayGlock, do you think that your wife can handle the recoil of the 7mm-08?


NCsmitty

Uncle Mike
July 7, 2009, 11:34 PM
BlayGlock, do you think that your wife can handle the recoil of the 7mm-08?

Well, my daughter has used a Remington Model 7 in 7mm-08 since she was 10 years old with no problem.... She loves putting rounds down range with that little thing.:rolleyes:

:D

dullh
July 8, 2009, 12:07 AM
"I assume because the 7mm-08 hits so hard a poorly placed shot will get the job done & the .243 won't?"

The 7mm-08 and the .243 are NOT the same. Not even close. The 7mm-08 carries more energy to the target than does a .243. The fact that they're on the same case means nothing. A reasonably well placed shot with a 7mm-08 will drop that deer where he stands. Same shot or worse with a .243 you'll probably be looking for the thing after it runs off. It's about energy, and where energy is concerned the 7mm-08 wins.

rangerruck
July 8, 2009, 12:33 AM
If your wife does not favor recoil, then the 25. will blast them out there, long and fast, with a long skinny bullet, in the 110 to 120 grainer class; very manageable.

BlayGlock
July 8, 2009, 09:34 AM
I am going to stay away from the .243 for her, it is a little less forgiving. I think that she would be able to handle the recoil on either the .25-06 or 7mm-08 with no problems. The recoil on my AK does not bother her. After some reading, Im really interested in the 6.5X55 Swede. I lloked around on buds and found a CZ and a Tikka. Anyone have experience with these rifles?

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
July 8, 2009, 10:19 AM
Either is good, but I'd run with 7mm-08 in that situation or better yet, .260 rem if it's available in the rifle you want.

oneounceload
July 8, 2009, 10:38 AM
I own both a 6.5 x 55 and a 7-08. That being said, my 6.5 was made in 1907, while my model 7 is about 80 years younger. Ballistically, along with the 260 and 7x57, they are a toss up - any will do the job on a typical white tail. I would favor them over the 25-06, just due to bullet selection. The 260/6.5 will easily use a 160 and the 7's a 175 grain for those times when you might be going for something bigger. My 6.5 prefers a Sierra 120 gr for accuracy, while the 7-08 prefers a 140 Nosler BT.

To me, my 7-08 thumps me more than my 7 mag; however, I think that is a stock issue

NCsmitty
July 8, 2009, 01:07 PM
BlayGlock, if you are considering a 6.5x55, I can second the choice.

I have a '41 Husqvarna Swede Mauser 38 and because of it, I built a heavy barrel M98 in 6.5x55 that I love shooting.
The efficient 6.5x55 case actually holds 2gr more powder than the 7mm-08, and when loaded to it's potential, in modern rifles, can garner some impressive ballistics.
It's easy on the recoil, but hard hitting with deep penetration on game.
Ask anyone who owns one.


NCsmitty

AKElroy
July 9, 2009, 12:12 AM
The 7mm-08 and the .243 are NOT the same. Not even close. The 7mm-08 carries more energy to the target than does a .243. The fact that they're on the same case means nothing. A reasonably well placed shot with a 7mm-08 will drop that deer where he stands. Same shot or worse with a .243 you'll probably be looking for the thing after it runs off. It's about energy, and where energy is concerned the 7mm-08 wins.

I never said they were comparable with regard to energy, only that they are both effective on whitetail. My experience is based on South Central Texas game, where a 90lb buck is a good sized deer. The .243 drops them like a stone with decent placement. When my daughter is ready to start hunting, she will be starting with a .243. .223's, .220 swifts, .22-250's are all popular deer season chamberings around here, and the .243 is over-gunning it in that company. Recoil is critical to good shot placement for a new shooter, particularly a female. If I am buying a short action for me, then I would have to toss a coin between the 7mm-08 or the .308. The OP was buying for his wife, and that changes my recommendation to the .243. Back to effectiveness, on everything short of the largest boars, there is no South Texas game I can't take as cleanly with a .243 as you can with a 7mm-08.

hotlead
July 9, 2009, 01:04 AM
What is the big difference between long and short actions?:confused:
Dont mean to sound crass, just curious what the experts had too say.;)

ECVMatt
July 9, 2009, 01:27 AM
hotlead,

Rifle actions come in different lengths to fit various size cartridges. .223, .22-250, .243, .260, 7-08, .308 and other similar sized cartridges fit into small actions. Each mfg. has their own specs for what they call a short action. Generally the .30-06 family of cartridges fits into a long action. Some mfgs. also have a magnum action for the really large stuff like the Rigby.

Kimber models are labeled by action size. You might give them a look for more info.

Hope this helps,

Matt

I guess I read your post wrong. The biggest difference is how the rounds feed into the chamber. Some mfg. use a magazine spacer to fit short action cartridges into long action rifles as they are too short to "Jump" from the mag to the chamber. Others feel that a short action is "stiffer" and thus more accurate. I am sure others will have more info for you.

AKElroy
July 9, 2009, 01:32 AM
Traditional "short actions" are based on the .308; the .243, .260 rem and 7mm-08. Shorter bolt throws are desirable for faster followups, and shorter receivers mean a rifle with less weight & more compact overall length. The short action quest has become a bit of a craze with numerous "Short Magnums" promissing long range ballistics in a short action. Most people refer to standard actions as belonging to those cartriges typified by the .30-06 family; .270 win, .280 rem, .25-06, .35 Whelen.

hotlead
July 9, 2009, 01:47 AM
Thank you Clamper Matt & AKElroy!

Another question. Does a extra/less 1/4" of bolt throw really effect anything?
Again, I am not trying to be a smart/dumb butt, just curious.

ants
July 9, 2009, 01:54 AM
BlayGlock, as a reloader you can make any of those cartridges work for deer. They are all very flexible and very effective.

But as an experienced reloader, go look up the available bullet sizes, types, weights, manufacturers and cost in 284 (7mm) compared to either 25 cal or 6.5mm (or even 243/6mm for that matter).

I suspect that you will appreciate the wider range of 7mm bullets available, and the fact that you already use them for your 7mm Mag.

AKElroy
July 9, 2009, 01:58 AM
Does a extra/less 1/4" of bolt throw really effect anything?

Not for me. The only reason I would consider one is the really handy way the shorter actions carry & shoulder. I have two bolt action hunting rifles, and they are standard length actions (.270 & 7 mag). I fill my tag every year, and do not feel the least bit disadvantaged to a shorter action.

BlayGlock
July 9, 2009, 10:38 AM
Thanks Ants, now that’s some good advice,

The other conundrum I run into is this: I am really interested in the 6.5 Swede, but it is not as readily available in a rifle as the 7mm-08. I have seen a CZ and some Tikka rifles; I can get the 7mm-08 in almost anything. And I really like Savage, I’ve had good results with them.

TexasPatriot.308
July 9, 2009, 09:22 PM
I am new here but I will spout off, the 7-08 is just a tad below the .308, less recoil and a favorite with sillouette shooters so that tells you something. the 6.5 Swede is now my favorite after years of larger calibers (I am 55) the Swede will take anything here in Texas. ammo availability is a minus but Hornady makes some good factory loads. the .25-06, flat shooting, low recoil (less than a .308). so many choices, so little time.

BlayGlock
July 9, 2009, 09:54 PM
word on the street is thet the 6.5 is one of Europe's most popular calibers and that they use it on large game (bigger than a mule deer).

High Planes Drifter
July 9, 2009, 11:26 PM
Does a extra/less 1/4" of bolt throw really effect anything?
Again, I am not trying to be a smart/dumb butt, just curious.


Not a thing. However, if you hung around internet gun forums, you'd think it meant the difference between life and death.

proplinker
July 10, 2009, 01:29 AM
7-08 will out shoot the 25-06, if the guns are the same.

Mr_Pale_Horse
July 10, 2009, 04:38 PM
For the record:

Magnum Action - >69mm cartridges (375H&H and similar)
Long action - ~63mm cartridges (30-06 and all of its spawn)
Intermediate action - ~57mm cartridges (7x57 and its spawn)
short action - ~51mm cartridges (7.62x51 and all of its spawn)
mini action - <=45mm and below bolt action centerfire (.222, 5.56x45, 7.62x39)

That makes a short action 12mm, or roughly 1/2" shorter, not 1/4" shorter than a long action.

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