these were supposed to suck


July 10, 2009, 06:49 PM
ok i made it to a range that serviced more than just pistols for the first time in a couple years

i tried out two things that i bought new that according to online review were supposed to be horrid

first was 5 eagle brand 30rnd mags for a ruger 10/22
the christmas before last i bought 5 of the see through orange ones for 8 bucks a piece
online review had me expecting failure
all 5 of them performed flawlessly

second ive had a saiga 12 for several months nib but hadnt fired it
again after reading online reviews i expected it to have hiccups until i fired a few hundred shells through it
i used 2 of the 12/(13) round magazines and it fired a mixture or buck and slug 2 3/4 and 3inch shells flawlessly
i shot about 50 of these
then turned the gas plug to 2 and loaded up with federal multi-purpose shot
(less than 25 bucks for 100shells at wal-mart)
the gun shot 50 of these flawlessly
my shoulder said call it a day (the stock butt on a saiga leaves a lil to be desired)
i didnt even do an initial clean literally from the box to firing

this experience startled me i was expecting malfuntions from both products due to internet reviews

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July 10, 2009, 09:13 PM
On the mags you tested, now that you are sure they all function well, put all but one "on the shelf" and just shoot with one to provide a durability test...see how long it lasts until you have a malfunction.

On the Saiga, continue to shoot it with a variety of ammo and maintain it carefully...some individual guns may not "like" a particular type of ammo. If you ever experience a problem, carefully check to determine what caused it.

Some individual guns do require a break in period and will function just fine from then on.

Guy de Loimbard
July 10, 2009, 09:20 PM
My dad has Eagle 30rd. mags for his 10/22. We've never had a problem with those.

A friend of mine has Ram-line mags for his. Don't get me started complaining about those, I'd never stop.

B yond
July 10, 2009, 09:33 PM
I've seen the eagle mags jam up in a 10/22. It was obviously caused by their terribly dirty condition. Those particular mags worked just fine until they got really, really, really, really, really (see where I'm going with this?), really, really dirty.

July 10, 2009, 09:49 PM
FYI, sticking 12rd mags in a new in box, unaltered Saiga firearm is a violation of Federal Law 922r punishable by prison time.

US Code 18 Section 922 "Unlawfull Acts", paragraph (r) affects the building of an imported assault weapon....
"(r) It shall be unlawful for any person to assemble from imported
parts any semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun which is identical to
any rifle or shotgun prohibited from importation under section
925(d)(3) of this chapter"

925(d)(3) states

"is of a type that does not fall within the definition of a
firearm as defined in section 5845(a) of the Internal Revenue
Code of 1986 and is generally recognized as particularly suitable
for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes, excluding surplus
military firearms, except in any case where the Attorney General
has not authorized the importation of the firearm pursuant to
this paragraph, it shall be unlawful to import any frame,
receiver, or barrel of such firearm which would be prohibited if
assembled; or"

Now we get to the definition of the assault weapon and the 20 forbidden parts. The way it works is if the weapon is composed of 10 or less of these parts that are foreign made then the weapon in question is not foreign made. In other words if you have 11 or more of these on the weapon it is foreign made and you have broken the law. The following is referred to as the 1989 Import Ban.
18 USC Chapter 44 as amended by Public Law 101-647 (enacted 11-29-90) and 27 CFR part 178 as amended 06-25-93.
178.39 Assembly of semiautomatic rifles or shotguns.
(a) No person shall assemble a semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun using more than 10 of the imported parts listed in paragraph (c) of this section if the assembled firearm is prohibited from importation under section 925(d)(3) as not being particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.

925(d)(3) includes FN FAL (L1A1) style semiautomatic rifle with folding stock, military style stock with separate pistol grip, threaded muzzle, flash hider, grenade launcher, bayonet lug, or night sights. Note: FN FAL (L1A1) style semiautomatic rifles having a thumbhole style stock without the above features were approved for importation from 1989 to 1994. In 1994 BATFE changed their interpretation to eliminate the exemption for firearms with thumbhole stocks.

(c) For purposes of this section, the term "imported parts" are:"

1. Frame-Receiver
2. Barrel
3. Barrel Extension
4. Mounting Block/Trunnion
5. Muzzle Attchment
6. Bolt
7. Bolt Carrier
8. Operating Rod (charging handle)
9. Gas Piston
10. Trigger Housing
11. Trigger
12. Hammer
13. Sear
14. Disconnector
15. Buttstock
16. Pistol Grip
17. Forearm/Handguard
18. Magazine Body
19. Magazine Follower
20. Magazine Floor Plate

fireman 9731
July 10, 2009, 09:59 PM
I had a couple of Eagle 10/22 mags. I put about 500 rounds through each of them with only a few jams here and there... for 10 bucks I sure couldn't complain. I'll pick a steel lipped Butler Creek any day but I wasn't disappointed in the Eagle mags.

July 11, 2009, 12:34 AM
the dark knight you do not have a proper understanding of the law
there is more to it than you posted
a criteria of what is illegal since there is no pistol grip under the action in its sporter form it isnt illegal

July 11, 2009, 12:50 AM
A friend of mine has Ram-line mags for his. Don't get me started complaining about those, I'd never stop.

I'll second that. Those Ram-Lines are a bigger waste of money than investing with Bernie Madoff.

July 11, 2009, 01:05 AM
Well I once bought a mini-14 despite all the warning on the internets and you know what?

I should have listened! It sucked big time! :cuss:

Claude Clay
July 11, 2009, 01:30 AM
when choosing to believe statements made on the internet one needs to be selective

and knowing which to select as true is--well, its a lot like voting for change

July 11, 2009, 02:40 AM
the dark knight you do not have a proper understanding of the law
there is more to it than you posted
a criteria of what is illegal since there is no pistol grip under the action in its sporter form it isnt illegal

No, he is right.

A Saiga 12 is sucessfully imported because it slides under the sporting clause. Sporting=no pistol grip, and under 10 rounds. If you put a 12 round mag in the gun, it is now an illegally imported non-sporting gun since it has more than 10 imported parts on it even with the 3 US made parts of the 12 round mag. But if you "convert" the Saiga 12 properly with US parts such as the trigger group (3), pistol grip (1), gas plug (1), stock (1) , and mag parts (3), then it will have less than 10 imported parts and be considered a US made gun.

So yes, sticking a 12 round or 20 round mag into an unmodified Saiga is illegal.

July 11, 2009, 11:29 AM
So, according to the Internet, our Memphisjim will have 10 billion angry federal agents chasing his butt down the street for prosecution.

Run, Jim, Run!

July 11, 2009, 05:08 PM
LOL You and I know fully well that doesn't happen however according to the letter of the law, what he is doing is not in compliance with what he should be doing.

July 11, 2009, 05:23 PM
I know I shouldn't be expecting this law to make sense, but if I'm reading what I think I'm reading, it means that you could have a converted 922-compliant Saiga and have legal 12-round mags for it, and you could also have an unconverted Saiga and have 10-round mags for it, but if you put the wrong mag in the wrong gun, you're a felon.

That really begs for a court challenge.

July 11, 2009, 06:39 PM
What would you use a 12 round clip for anyways.

July 11, 2009, 06:53 PM
Fun. :D

And anything that can come up. :scrutiny:

The Doc is out now. :cool:

July 11, 2009, 07:10 PM
I have two Saiga-12s, one of which I've had for several years and I've left in stock spec as opposed to converting to the properly-AK form.

I'd never heard anything about them being anything less than great shotguns. I've never had the slightest hint of a problem with mine, despite some abuse - including the following.

Shortly after getting the gun, I decided to test it out with many diferent ammunition types - a mix of 2 3/4" and 3" shells, and the standard, light-loaded, and magnum variety. As my cousin, a few freinds and myself were putting the gun through its paces, we had a small mishap.

When switching from a standard buckshot load to a heavy one - a serious 3" max magnum loading in 000 buck marketed by Winchester for taking black bear - I forgot to rotate the gas system regulator back to the magnum position.

We were rewarded with an extremely loud and odd-sounding BOOM, coupled with the magazine (stock 5 rounders at this time, some years ago) flying straight out the bottom of the gun to the ground.

Years and many rounds later, the Saiga - and even the same magazine - continue to provide admirable service.

Shadow 7D
July 11, 2009, 08:24 PM
Get a polychoke, or a choke converter and your covered as long as the mag isn't imported, or better yet, to MD mags and buy the four port gas plug and your covered. or convert it back to the original config and improve the trigger.

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