Had my guns taken away in nj


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.308
July 23, 2009, 10:38 PM
The cops took my guns from me yesterday because my mother went out and got a restraining order on my father who lives in the same house as me. The ro is on my father and not me. When the cops showed up i offered to take them out of the house but that wasnt good enough for them. Then to top it all off they called and took my firearms purchaser card today. I'm being treated like some kind of criminal but i didn't do anything! Now i have to jump through hoops to try and get them back. If anyone has advice on how to get them back please let me know. Thanks

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General Geoff
July 23, 2009, 10:41 PM
Hire a lawyer, if you ever want to see your firearms again. Just a heads-up, it may end up costing more than your guns are worth, just to get them back

41magsnub
July 23, 2009, 10:41 PM
a lawyer, call one. Internet legal advice is worth less than it cost you.

Deltaboy
July 23, 2009, 10:44 PM
Call and get a Lawyer ASAP.

2nd 41
July 23, 2009, 10:45 PM
Sorry to hear this. Hope your Mom will be OK.

Sheepdog1968
July 23, 2009, 10:46 PM
I am very sorry to hear this. My first approach would be to call the local NRA (I'm assuming you are a member). I'd follow that first. In the absence of that, I'd get a hair cut, shave, dress nicely and go to the police station and politely explain the situation and politely ask what you can do to get them back. If they aren't sure, then politely ask them who you should talk to. I would not under any circumstances get upset. Be calm as possible. If you don't feel as if you are making any progress or getting helpful information, you will need to get a laywer and local NRA can help you. I would guess it will take a while before you get your guns back. Let us know how it works out.

John Wayne
July 23, 2009, 11:01 PM
Hire a lawyer.
Call the NRA legal defense fund.
Call the local ACLU (yes, really).
Hell, even call the media.

First, go ahead and mail a letter via registered mail to the police, and call them, and notify them in as many ways possible that you have a safe alternate location to store your firearms. Then, notify all of the above that you are a responsible, law-abiding citizen and have had your property stolen from you by the police.

Also collect all the info on your guns including serial numbers, make, caliber, etc. and hopefully pictures and original receipts as well.

DeepSouth
July 24, 2009, 10:01 AM
And people say your crazy if you hide guns in the wall behind the paneling.:scrutiny:

Sorry man, I hope you get them back.

Keep us up to date on what happens.

j-easy
July 24, 2009, 10:04 AM
wow that's horrible, good luck OP. anyone know if Florida has asinine policies like this?

Old Fuff
July 24, 2009, 10:12 AM
There are a lot of questions here that left unanswered make a conclusion next to impossible. For example:

Who owns the residence? Father or son? Or maybe both? Or someone else?

How old is .308 - under or over 21?

Usually after an emergency injunction/restraining order is issued a hearing must be scheduled to be held in the near future. Has the father been informed as to when and where this hearing will be held? Does he plan to be present or be represented by an attorney, or both? Does the son plan to pe present or be represented? It would seem that this would be the time to bring up the firearms issue.

If the firearms were returned, how would they be stored? In a safe or otherwise. A safe that the Father didn't have access to might make a big difference in how the court viewed the issue.

Last but not least, .308 should speak to an attorney, but he needs to get his ducks lined up first.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
July 24, 2009, 10:19 AM
I wish you the best of luck in getting them returned. The last step in the to-do list after that is obviously: LEAVE that god-forsaken state and never look back.

hwp
July 24, 2009, 10:47 AM
What I find humorous is the fine upstanding politician that pioneered this law was elected by the fine people of NJ.

Frank Lautenberg is the man responsible for this law and the fine people of NJ keep electing him to office over and over and over.

lloveless
July 24, 2009, 10:53 AM
Did the police give you an inventory/receipt for the guns removed?
ll

eye5600
July 24, 2009, 12:05 PM
File suit against your father.

Oro
July 24, 2009, 02:10 PM
File suit against your father.

Now that's mature (sarcasm).

Seriously, I went through something very similar in NY years back. Don't panic. Follow Old Fuff's advice (fyi for those that don't know - following what Old Fuff says is almost ALWAYS the right move).

Eight time out of ten, TRO's are what cheap divorce lawyers tell their female clients to do to rack up fees - the clients are generally vulnerable, trusting, and ignorant of the law and personal ethics. Judges know this and dismiss that kind of junk out of hand. I don't know if that is what prevails in this case, but the odds say yes. I do not mean to disparage your mother or father and a serious issue may be at hand, but for others, keep this in mind.

Spending a thou on a legal beagle is not necessarily your first or best move. Follow Old Fuff's advice.

LostinJersey
July 24, 2009, 02:47 PM
.308 the best gun law lawyer in NJ is Evan Nappen, he is the one who won against Jersey City when they passed one handgun a month law awhile back.

Here is his web site with contact information http://www.evannappen.com/

Good Luck on getting your guns and FID back.

franconialocal
July 24, 2009, 03:52 PM
deleted

dullh
July 24, 2009, 10:51 PM
1) Hire a lawyer. A good lawyer.

2) Get your guns back.

3) Move OUT of New Jersey and move into the United States.

Pennsylvania, for instance, is right across the river. Move there, then you can look back across the river at that communist s***hole you just fled - from the FREE side.

Uncle Mike
July 24, 2009, 11:10 PM
You may be able to have them put into the possession of a friend at a different address.
As long as the protective order is in effect on your dad, and he resides at 'that' address, there will not be any firearms, unless court approved, at 'that' address.

It aint just NJ... this is nationwide!

.308
July 24, 2009, 11:24 PM
I called up a few lawyers, including evan nappen. I heard very different stories from all of them. All I know is that the ro needs to be dropped before I can do anything, but that is supposed to happen soon. I'm 25 years old and the house is in my parents names for those who asked. I've been planning on moving out of this state for a while and this incident is pushing me to hurry up.

Phydeaux642
July 24, 2009, 11:24 PM
As usual, Old Fuff offers sage advice. Take heed.

.308
July 24, 2009, 11:39 PM
Also, the police wouldn't give me a receipt at the time and at the station they told me "they dont give receipts". Good thing I ripped off my $700 leupold scope when i heard they were coming.

Autolycus
July 25, 2009, 08:32 PM
Do you have a copy of the police report or any paperwork indicating that they took your firearms? Because it might be hard to prove that the police inventoried them.

HOME DEPOT GEORGE
July 25, 2009, 09:04 PM
Do yourself a favor and get out while you can, I'm in the process of getting a restraining order thrown out for something that I was accused of 12 yaers ago,my record was expunged all arrests were wiped clean and NJ will not drop a f***ing 12 year old order protecting a person that if still in NJ lives 1100 miles away from me and if I was sitting next to her I wouldn't even know it. link http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=420202 as others have said GET OUT OF THAT GOD FOR SAKEN CORRUPT @###$$$%%%^^^^&&%%$$# TOILET OF A STATE AND JOIN THE REST OF FREE AMERICA.

Truthseeker
July 25, 2009, 11:54 PM
Get a good lawyer. Go to the police with the lawyer. Tell them they took your property even though you were not accused of any crime. Ask for a receipt for your property. Document everything, especially if they refuse. You need documentation of what they took. Without it, said property may very well disappear.

Good Luck,

Gene

IANAL, read my first four words.

Texshooter
July 26, 2009, 12:25 AM
This can not be in America.

PaladinX13
July 26, 2009, 12:55 AM
Until your residency changes sufficient to satisfy an address change for a NJ drivers license or your FID card, you're unlikely to get your firearms back. From an enforcement perspective, your guns are effectively "registered" to your father's home address. Given the RO on him, it would be a PR nightmare for the state if a man with a restraining order and guns "registered" to his home, if not his person, went and victimized using those guns just because of the technicality of the guns belonging to a housemate.

TRO/ROs have always had dramatic effects and under constant pressure to reform in either direction.

Until then, document everything and have a lawyer provide letters of intent to the police outlining the awareness of your legal rights and your intent to- legally and procedurally- reclaim your property.

razorback2003
July 26, 2009, 03:22 AM
How can this be if the restraining order is against your father and not you and you are a grown 24 year old man? I could see this happening to you (well not really in a normal state) IF the restraining order was slapped on you. If these firearms are yours, you should have been given the chance to somehow lawfully retain possession of them, even if that meant taking them to a buddy's house.

That would make me so angry to have to hire a lawyer to get my own guns back over someone else's restraining order! I hate to pass judgement on New Jersey, because i've never been there, but it sounds so messed up the more I hear and read about it. That sounds like something that would happen in a foreign country, police confiscating lawful property without a warrant and you not doing anything wrong and no restraining order against you.....not hear in the USA....and not in Tennessee where I live.

Old Fuff
July 26, 2009, 11:17 AM
This can not be in America.

It's not, it's New Jersey... :banghead:

But you need a more practical observation.

The main problem here is that your Father owns the residence where you live.

When a hearing on the restraining order is held (if it hasn't been held already) you - or better yet an attorney representing you - can bring up the issue of your guns. You, or he/she may have to present evidence that the guns do belong to you, and a statement signed by your Father (and Mother if possible) to that effect may be enough. Any official documents such as registrations, bills-of-sale, etc. are better yet. As I suggested before a possible option would be a safe that your Father had no access to, and another as has been pointed out is to store the guns at an alternative site.

Another possibility would be to have an attorney file a motion with the court requesting (or maybe demanding) that the guns be returned under condition that they would be where your Father couldn't obtain them. The court would have to hold a hearing on the motion, and the State's Attorney would have to convince the court that your proposals would not meet the law's requirements. If the solution(s) proposed in the motion were acceptable the state might not even bother to challange it.

If possible and practical, moving to a new address at this time could only help your case. It would be very difficult for the state to justify holding guns that belong to you if you weren't living under the same roof as your Father.

geim druth
July 26, 2009, 04:24 PM
Be careful, I believe there is a residency restriction on your Firearms Purchaser ID Card. If you move to another town, you may need to apply for a new card. I would imagine that could hold up getting your guns back also.

Colonel
July 26, 2009, 04:42 PM
not hear in the USA....and not in Tennessee where I live.

Wrong. The law under discussion is a federal law and applies in all 50 states.

2RCO
July 26, 2009, 04:55 PM
RO= Nightmare for gun owners.

Fetus
July 26, 2009, 05:03 PM
Yep, thats NJ . -- how long in advance did you know they where coming ??

I would have taken at least 1 handgun wrapped it in a sheet and thrown it in the backyard or something .

hope everything works out for you . but knowing NJ this will be a big problem for you ( unfortunately )

Maelstrom
July 26, 2009, 05:15 PM
This sounds like a pretty good case for Alan Gura. Give him a call and see if he'd be interested in another pro bono 2A case.

Something as weak as a mere accusation against one party and someone else entirely loses his property? I think the Supreme Court should hear it.

ljnowell
July 26, 2009, 06:24 PM
In illinois stuff like this happens too. When I was going through a divorce my soon to be ex filed a order of protection out of spite. The revoked my FOID card, which prevented me from legally possesing a firearm or purchasing any ammo for one. Took me over a year to get it back. The entire time I was technically a felon for owning my legally purchased gun to use for home protection. An uncle recently went through a nasty breakup that required the cops to be called. They catalogued and confiscated over ten firearms from him that night and gave then back 48hrs later, when he provided proof he would not be going back to that house.

Before anyone calls BS on these stories, let me say, I dont care. They happened, they are fact, and I witnessed it. The cop in story two even showed us in his little book of laws where his justification was to do that.

Wildyams
July 26, 2009, 06:25 PM
One thing i didn't see anyone say yet (i didn't read ALL the posts though) was, talk to your mother. It may seem simple, but sometimes simple can be the right way. Prove to your mother that you have a safe place to store the guns besides the house with your father, then have her request that your guns be released.

If you and your mother are on good terms, it may be an easy and CHEAP way to try and solve this whole thing.

oneounceload
July 26, 2009, 06:42 PM
Maybe have your mom store them at her house?

.308
July 26, 2009, 07:54 PM
My mother is on my side and is willing to say whatever it takes to get my rights back. She never intended for this to happen to me. The charges are also supposed to be dropped tomorrow.

hardluk1
July 26, 2009, 08:19 PM
Don't forget to get your own place.. Then it would not have happened.

rscalzo
July 26, 2009, 09:58 PM
Go to the police with the lawyer

Worthless advice. The lawyer will not get them back any quicker.

First a listing is available of what is removed. It is the Property and Evidence Report. However under state law anything involving a DV cannot be released regardless of the OPRA laws as it is privileged.

Second, the firearms are not retained by the agency who removed them, nor can they return them. Only the county Prosecutor's office can approve that and that will not be done until the DV restraining order is dropped by the court. At that point the agency will recover them from the Prosecutor's Office and process the return. You can spend money for a lawyer but it will only be wasted.

As far as their removal, that was done under the order of the judge authorizing the Restraining Order. That is the only way the property can be removed. I don't have a facsimile of the Restraining Order form by the judge authorizes certain areas one of which is usually the removal of any weapons.

When the case is heard in Family court the judge MAY allow you to move them to a secure location. But don't bet on it. As far as who is the owner of the firearms, it doesn't matter. Their location is the deciding factor which is the home you both share.

Moving out of state won't change a thing. Every state has the exact same procedures with the exception of who stores the firearms. Up here in NH the same procedure is followed. In fact they are even stricter up here as they ban firearms in the home for certain parole instances.

dschflier
July 26, 2009, 11:35 PM
Wow Move down here in VA we are still free last I checked.

Tacbandit
July 27, 2009, 12:07 AM
.308, I hope it works out for you. Sorry you had to get caught up in that...Hope it works out for all of you...

rscalzo
July 27, 2009, 12:16 AM
Wow Move down here in VA we are still free last I checked.

You had better review the VA law. http://www.dcjs.virginia.gov/blueprints/dvguns.pdf This was valid in 2006.

larry_minn
July 27, 2009, 03:16 AM
Just a thought to other folks out there. When I moved back home I alwasy had my mail "Larry_Minn 12345 South Mockingbird lane. Smalltown, MN 55255 APT B" My room had a lock on the door.
My (thinking) is that it would not be the same residence on paper. Just as if you rented a room. Because the guy on the third floor apt has a RO against him does not mean the folks on 6th floor can't own a firearm.
I would guess that NJ has registration?

Sigman314
July 27, 2009, 12:06 PM
If I knew they were coming, I would have done more than just remove my scope, I would have moved my arms to an agreable and trusted friends home. I'm sure that there are more than a few old guys on this forum in the area that would have been more than happy to help you out as well. Just for future refrence anyhow. Make sure you have arrangements ahead of time with pro-gun friends in case of unreasonable law enforcement encroachment.

Carl N. Brown
July 27, 2009, 12:47 PM
Well, since the father and son live under the same roof and the father with the restraining order would have access, I suppose the guns had to be removed from the house. I have heard that people awaiting a hearing or trial have been told by the judge to remove all guns from the house until the legal matter was resolved. For the police to take the son's guns and the son's firearms id card seems excessive, but we are dealing with New Jersey. The son should have been given the opportunity to have the guns stored safely where the father would not have access until the TRO was resolved; there are jurisdictions that would handle it that way. Sometimes a TRO is needed, sometimes it is unnecessary, and in some jurisdictions it is routine.

rscalzo
July 27, 2009, 03:56 PM
In light of the events over the last two days, the judge is not going to be sympathetic. Additionally, the law that comes into play is FEDERAL, not state.

That the hearing for the TRO, the victim can request that the TRO be dropped. At that point the judge can address the issue of the return. That will depend on past history. I'm guessing this is the first TRO issued at the resident? If not, the judge can set conditions.

What I find odd is that the TRO was issued at the request of your mother. did you think that someone wouldn't show up to execute it? As it is standard practice and statutory law to remove any weapons, why did you think yours would remain. They pose the same hazard regardless of the ownership. The removal certainly isn't a secret and has been the norm in almost every state. You would be wise to learn the restrictions and laws of firearm's ownership in the state. If you review the TRO forms, you will see the area covering stating the removal of firearms as per the issuing judge's order.

The only think I do find a bit off was the taking of your FID card.

Just as if you rented a room
A lot more is involved beyond the simple changing of the address. This is a very involved subject that cannot be simplified to a few sentences.

bondmid003
July 27, 2009, 08:10 PM
There are plenty of stories just like this over at calguns.net, good luck .308. It's a sad world we live in where people throw around restraining orders merely to spite the other person in a divorce. I'm not saying that's the case here but i've heard plenty of stories with the exact same scenario

crazy-mp
July 27, 2009, 10:03 PM
even call the media

Why? The anchor would start out with

"In other news police disrupt a father son murder scheme today when the police served a restraining order on a man who was living in a arms bunker with his son..."

I guess you could have just said the police officer that took your guns was racist and make sure someone video tapes it, then you can kick back with Obama, drink a few cold ones and hash this whole thing out. :D

hwp
July 28, 2009, 10:36 AM
The ignorance of the law is abundant on this thread.

No laws have been violated and the officers did what they are required to do. BTW, to all you move away people, this is federal law and would go the same exact way in all 50 states.

Contrary to what some people think everything is NOT a conspiracy.

As for all the "hire a good lawyer" advice, there is no such thing. If you never want your guns back be sure to show up at the PD with a smart azz lawyer.

You are just going to have to wait this one out.

kanook
July 28, 2009, 11:21 AM
perhaps some of the people saying "move" are refering to get into a different house that his dad doesn't live in. That would enable him to retrieve his firearms regardless of his fathers situation. :neener:

Deanimator
July 28, 2009, 11:49 AM
As for all the "hire a good lawyer" advice, there is no such thing. If you never want your guns back be sure to show up at the PD with a smart azz lawyer.
Whenever somebody tells somebody else NOT to seek competent legal counsel for a substantive legal matter, I always suspect an ulterior motive.

The law is the law. If the legal process REQUIRES the police to return lawfully owned property, it doesn't matter if he shows up with a lawyer or a troupe of mimes. I could swear you just endorsed a "wrongful taking" by police...

hardluk1
July 28, 2009, 01:04 PM
We had a retired marshall that had his house raided by mistake took his guns from years of collecting and most ended up stolen from the police lock up. Go figure. Some recovered in other states some found in the hands of the police chief. . Illegal crap happens all the time in and out of the enforce departments . Get a record of your guns and do what you can to get them back . To darm many crooks on bought sides of the badge. aclu sounds like a good place to start talk'n just to see what advise comes from them. THE LAW IS THE LAW. Yes it is , to be used is they see fit sometimes to there version of the law. I grew up in collier county fl and watched a heck of a lot of crocked ass leo's do'n business as they wanted to when dealing with drug enforcement back during the 70's and 80's.

zxcvbob
July 28, 2009, 01:39 PM
the police wouldn't give me a receipt at the time and at the station they told me "they dont give receipts". There's a reason for that. I don't know what that reason is, but here's what I suspect: they never intend to give the guns back and they don't want you to have a paper trail if you take them to court. (they will probably divide up the "good" guns amongst themselves based on seniority or rank, and the cheap guns will end up at the bottom of the Hudson or Delaware river.) I hope I'm wrong.

If you knew they were coming (to take off the scope) you should have gathered them all up and got them out of the house -- maybe locked in the trunk of your car parked at a friend's house for a few days. I guess hindsight is 20/20, and you're not old enough to be cynical and jaded ;)

Joe Cool
July 28, 2009, 06:19 PM
You may have something to go on.

One firearms owner I know here in NJ has everything documented and one copy stored in another location in case of fire, etc...

Yes NJ is a pain the butt.
But it's also worth fighting the good fight where and how you can... at least for a few of us still here in NJ...

Maelstrom
July 29, 2009, 09:39 AM
Thanks, Bob, for that "good" little piece of fiction.

I'm "probably" putting you in for a Pulitzer. Of course your story may end up at the bottom of the Hudson or Delaware river.

The only thing missing was either a mob connection tot he police or the use of his guns as "throwdown" guns so the police can shoot people at will. Hey, if you're going to make stuff up, why not go all the way?

There's a reason for that. I don't know what that reason is, but here's what I suspect: they never intend to give the guns back and they don't want you to have a paper trail if you take them to court. (they will probably divide up the "good" guns amongst themselves based on seniority or rank, and the cheap guns will end up at the bottom of the Hudson or Delaware river.) I hope I'm wrong.

zxcvbob
July 29, 2009, 10:38 AM
use of his guns as "throwdown" guns so the police can shoot peoplePolice used to do that in Houston. (they got caught... I believe it was about 10 years ago)

The only reason for not giving receipts is to make it harder (or impossible) to get the guns back.

GRIZ22
July 29, 2009, 01:47 PM
There's a reason for that. I don't know what that reason is, but here's what I suspect: they never intend to give the guns back and they don't want you to have a paper trail if you take them to court. (they will probably divide up the "good" guns amongst themselves based on seniority or rank, and the cheap guns will end up at the bottom of the Hudson or Delaware river.) I hope I'm wrong.


My insight to this is a few years old but from what I know in NJ seized property is listed on the investigation report. Seized firearms are required to be turned over to the Prosecutor's office within something like 24-48 hours so they are stored centrally.

Cosmoline
July 29, 2009, 01:50 PM
I doubt the NJ cops will ever give him his iron back. If he asks they're liable to arrest him as a terrorist. It's not a free state, not even close. The authorities are little more than a bunch of mobsters in uniform. Just write them off and get the heck out of there forever. At the very least get clear of these people with their relationship problems. There's ample reason to do that even without the other issues involved.

DVRO's are nasty everywhere, but there is no federal law requiring ownership cards, nor is there a federal law giving cops authority to seize third party property. In fact there's a federal constitutional amendment that is supposed to prevent that absent due process and compensation for the taking. Of course in NJ that and five dollars might get you a cup of coffee. Maybe.

.308
July 29, 2009, 06:45 PM
The ro was dropped today, so i went to the police station with the dismissal paper and they directed me to the prosecutors office weapons return unit. He says i need to talk to them and possibly send a letter, then they will allow them to release the guns. I'm calling first thing tomorrow since it was too late today. I hope they're right on this.

bondmid003
July 30, 2009, 04:13 AM
Good luck .308, I think things are looking up for you

hwp
July 30, 2009, 07:53 PM
Deanimator,

Your tinfoil hat fell off.

Show up with a lawyer at any PD I have ever seen they will laugh in your face and tell you to take it to court. Lawyers don't have direct dealing with PD's.

jaholder1971
July 30, 2009, 08:05 PM
I'd be making demand of that woman to pony up for all the hassle you went through.

I don't care if she is your mother. Her actions (or that of her lawyer) violated your civil rights as well as seriously inconvenienced your life. If there's drama between her and your father she obviously and deliberately dragged you into it. Parents may get away with using the kids as a weapon when they're 12 but you've got a few years on now.

Deanimator
July 30, 2009, 08:08 PM
Lawyers don't have direct dealing with PD's.
If you're going to make something up, try making up something at least a little less foolish.

Carl N. Brown
July 31, 2009, 09:24 AM
Unfortunately restraining orders (ROs) have become part of the boilerplate paperwork in a lot of domestic breakups that don't necessarily involve overt domestic violence (DV) but are sometimes thrown in just-in-case to cover-all-bases. That is what makes the Lautenberg Amendment rather insidious. I would rather see true domestic violence -- if it was done to a total stranger it would obviously be assault and battery -- treated legally as the felonious act it is, than the current system of denying a constitutional right based on a misdemeanor accusation. Before the Lautenberg Amendment, you forfeited the right to keep and bear arms on a felony conviction. The Lautenberg Amendment greases the slippery slope of denying the rights of a free man (as listed in Dread Scott and Cruickshank as right to vote, right to bear arms, etc.) based on misdemeanor accusations.

Deanimator
July 31, 2009, 10:03 AM
Unfortunately restraining orders (ROs) have become part of the boilerplate paperwork in a lot of domestic breakups that don't necessarily involve overt domestic violence (DV) but are sometimes thrown in just-in-case to cover-all-bases.
The greatest irony is of course that a restraining order isn't worth the paper its printed on insofar as "protecting" a victim of domestic violence in the first place.

Where a woman has the right to effectively defend herself with a firearm, it's HER responsibility to defend herself, since the police will almost certainly not be present to "protect" her as an individual when she really needs it. In a place where she has NO right to effectively defend herself with a firearm, the police will almost certainly not protect her as an individual, while quite possibly working HARDER to make sure she can't defend HERSELF. I've heard of cities having special units to enforce gun bans. I've never heard of a city having one to enforce orders of protection.

A restraining order is nothing more than a legal justification for using physical force against the person who violates it, whether it be the victim herself or the police.

30mag
July 31, 2009, 10:09 AM
File a lawsuit.

hwp
July 31, 2009, 10:11 AM
Hey Dean I can assure you I am familar with what I speak. You need to join the real world because you clearly are talking from a position of ignorance. Lawyers DO NOT have sit downs with cops. If a lawyer wanted to have a sit down with a cop he would get a subpoena and a hearing scheduled.

No offense because I'm sure you think you are right but you are not. Its nothing new. The tinfoil hat crowd is strong in numbers on THR. It is why I don't visit here much.

I prefer to live in the real world NOT the gun show/internet commando world.

Deanimator
July 31, 2009, 10:22 AM
Hey Dean I can assure you I am familar with what I speak. You need to join the real world because you clearly are talking from a position of ignorance. Lawyers DO NOT have sit downs with cops.
Yeah, clearly when my lawyer does it in connection with a variety of cases, it takes place in an alternate universe.

Thanks for playing.

Cosmoline
July 31, 2009, 01:27 PM
Different states have very different rules when it comes to whom lawyers customarily talk to. For example here I routinely call up MD's and cops in various cases. In other states this is simply never done without setting up a depo. Our own Supreme Court has repeatedly told us to stop bothering the court system and do as much informal discovery as possible. So that's what we do. In other states it is very different.

larry_minn
July 31, 2009, 02:13 PM
It is true many people get fixated on what goes on "in thier little pond" and assumes that is the way things work elsewhere.
This is true with about everything. My former BIL let my sister off in small town. Then drove around next block (right/left/left/left then park) so he could park on other side of street. The local Police followed him all the way around. He was worried (as a hispanic in MN in 80s) when Officer pulls along side. "Son you can just make a U turn, you don't need to go all the way around" and drove off. (BTW Officer was @ 65yrs old) Most everyone was "son" I drove that (and the next) squad car a number of times. I even had a key to the squad. I could go on with lots of stuff that would NEVER happen in a larger city. (true I had been offered a job there but because of car accident was not able to accept it) Many would call me a liar because it could NEVER happen (back where I come from)

Deanimator
July 31, 2009, 08:35 PM
If you never want your guns back be sure to show up at the PD with a smart azz lawyer.
Now that I think of it, that's EXACTLY what I did one day.

A whacked out cop from another town got busted for keeping an alligator, got fired, and had to give up his guns, at which time he tried to claim his deceased uncle's stock of highly collectible firearms to sell. His aunt retained my best friend. I gave him technical assistance on which guns were which, and which were missing (including a Thompson SMG). He did in fact interact DIRECTLY with the police to get the woman's property back, at which time I helped him inventory every piece.

I guess that makes him not just a "smart azz", but considerably smarter than you.

rc109a
July 31, 2009, 09:25 PM
As much as I have disagreed with Deanimator in the past, he is right about lawyers dealing directly with PD's(or SO's). I know because I have had sitdowns with several regarding property and othe things outside of court. If w can work out details before trial it makes it a lot easier.

.308
August 10, 2009, 12:31 PM
I just came across this http://www.divorcenet.com/states/new_jersey/domestic_violence_weapons
In the article it says the prosecutors office has 45 days to either charge me with something or give my guns back. There isn't a thing they can charge me with so i should get them back if this is true. Does anybody know if it actually works this way? Are they going to call me or do i need to call them? Calling there i've come to realize is nothing but a waste of time because nobody ever answers the phone or returns messages.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
August 10, 2009, 12:53 PM
Here's the first lesson of dealing with ANYTHING in the legal realm: If it wasn't a (1) Letter, (2) Sent certified mail, (3) With return receipt requested, then the communication didn't happen, for any serious intents and purposes.

If you won't or can't get a lawyer to deal with them on your behalf, for whatever reason, then at least learn, know, and utilize that lesson 100%.

RiverCity.45
August 10, 2009, 01:04 PM
Good luck. :uhoh:

mustang_steve
August 10, 2009, 07:51 PM
I hope you get your guns back.

I'm a bit dismayed at all the off comments though....this guy needs solid advice, not assumptions that could jeopardize his odds of success.

.308
October 12, 2009, 12:38 AM
I ended up getting my guns back. They were all badly rusted from the poor storage conditions. The finish on my 870 was trash and the barrel had heavy rust inside and out. My 700 finish only had a few small spots of rust on the finish, and heavy rust in the barrel and chamber. My 1911 was rusty all around except for the barrel which is stainless, and the frame started pitting in a few spots. I had my 870 cleaned up and reblued by a smith for $250. I cleaned up the few rust spots on the 700 and brushed out the bore and chamber, so that looks perfect again. Now my 1911 I took alot of rust off but there's pitting and the finish will definately need to be redone if I keep it. The whole ordeal was such bs:cuss:

Horny Toad
October 12, 2009, 12:41 AM
What the hell did they do, store 'em in a bucket of water? Glad you got them back, but damn. :mad:

zxcvbob
October 12, 2009, 12:50 AM
I'm guessing they peed on them before locking 'em up. Or maybe this happens enough that they keep a windex bottle of saltwater handy in the evidence room.

Pitting on stainless steel is a pretty good indication of salt (chloride) damage.

.308
October 12, 2009, 12:52 AM
The pitting is on the frame, the barrel is fine

Prince Yamato
October 12, 2009, 04:50 AM
I ended up getting my guns back. They were all badly rusted from the poor storage conditions.

I would have totally filed a lawsuit against the police. Then bought some better guns with the money. :evil:

Mp7
October 12, 2009, 05:50 AM
Living in the land of lawsuits .. iŽd definitely make them pay for rebluing ...

paintballdude902
October 12, 2009, 06:56 AM
i would have taken pictures of them while still int he police station

then filed papers to take them to court and have them pay to ahve them refinished

cassandrasdaddy
October 12, 2009, 08:29 AM
what did you have to do to get em back?

Maelstrom
October 12, 2009, 09:08 AM
Maybe you should consider having your mother or father cover the cost, since they're the reason the whole thing went down.

It may sound cold but you were a third party.

Art Eatman
October 12, 2009, 11:22 AM
Enough. .308 can start a thread in General if he wishes, about his success.

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