"buckled" reloads


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bensdad
July 25, 2009, 10:51 PM
Do I have to pull these and trash the brass? It did it to three out of 100 40 s&w rds. I thought there was plenty of bell, but I must have been wrong (unless something else causes this?). Anyway, do I have to pull them? They load in the bbl. o.k.

http://i888.photobucket.com/albums/ac87/daisybaby_photo/gunstuff074.jpg

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JimKirk
July 25, 2009, 11:16 PM
Looks like too much crimp to me. I may be wrong.
Jimmy K

Remo-99
July 25, 2009, 11:31 PM
Looks like too much crimp to me.

And/or seating and crimping in a single operation is causing issues, try seating then crimping in a seperate operation. It should only need a very slight taper crimp to remove the casemouth flare and to ease chambering, with most rimless selfloader ammo.

bensdad
July 26, 2009, 12:02 AM
Thanks, guys. I had a few 45acp do this to me when I first started reloading. Haven't seen it since. You're right - I do both at the same time. I'll split the duty (double the work:(). Seat first, then crimp.

Incidently, should the crimp on 40 s&w be ~.001 under factory case mouth width (SAAMI says .423) or ~.422?

243winxb
July 26, 2009, 08:08 AM
Lee Dies? The seater tapers then rolls. To much crimp. Ok to fire if they chamber.

fourdollarbill
July 26, 2009, 08:33 AM
I don't think there is anything wrong with seating and crimping in the same stroke. The crimp is too heavy and it needs backed off. Look at the crimp area, it looks as if you went past the taper crimp and it started sqeezing through. Take up your crimp a bit until the crimped case just touches the bullet and then maybe a fine hair. I have done this before when setting up my crimp and I wanted to see how far it would go.

Walkalong
July 26, 2009, 08:33 AM
You don't need to crimp separately, although it is a bit easier that way, but you do need to adjust your die for much less crimp. That is WAY too much crimp.

If they fit the barrel, it won't hurt to shoot them. Just scrap those brass afterwards.

This (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=78870&d=1211725549) is all the crimp you need.

The Bushmaster
July 26, 2009, 08:48 AM
You will note that in the photo that Walkalong posted that only the bell was removed and no farther crimping was done. If it looks like the case mouth is starting to turn in on any semi-auto (except maybe .357 sig) you have crimped too far.

Yes...If they chamber and do not go too far in to where the firing pin can't reach the primer they will be OK...

Forgot to mention...I seat and crimp (remove the bell) using the same die and one stroke.

JimKirk
July 26, 2009, 09:02 AM
Ben
I don't have a 40 S&W, so this is just an opinion. The 40 S&W headspaces off of the case mouth, you may have headspace problems with those crimped like the ones in the photo.
Here's my method of bullet seating and crimping at the same time:
Back the seat die out(up) so there is no crimp
Screw the bullet seating stem in(down) until bullet is seated to crimp groove
Back seating stem out(up) several turns
Screw Die in(down) until you have desired crimp- go slowly it only take small turns
Lock Die in place with ring
Screw seating stem in(down) until it touches top of bullet - lock stem with lock nut
you may have to play with stem adjustment to get it just right

Jimmy K.

Riss
July 26, 2009, 09:03 AM
Case diameter WITH bullet seated should barely measure a .001 decrease ONLY at the very tip of the case where the crimp is. As compared to the case around the outside of the bullet. I hate using a standard measurement ie .423 or .422 as some brass as bullets are clightly different in their diameter. When crimping you should just be able to see the shiny spot around the top of the brass where it is crimping. That should only extend less than 1/8" down the case from the rim.

bensdad
July 26, 2009, 10:10 PM
Thanks for all the help guys. I guess I will continue to do both at the same time. I'll just back off the seat some.

Funny thing is, I was cruising along just fine (well into my 3rd shipment of 500 bullets for the 40) until some advice from another, more experienced, reloader got me rethinking my crimp. It was he that told me to crimp below the SAAMI spec.

Walkalong
July 27, 2009, 07:18 AM
I am sure they meant well, but you see the results.

Remo-99
July 27, 2009, 09:30 AM
Funny thing is, I was cruising along just fine (well into my 3rd shipment of 500 bullets for the 40) until some advice from another, more experienced, reloader got me rethinking my crimp.

If it ain't broke don't fix it, and if they were working fine the way you were doing it before, then you proberbly had it right the first time around.
Seating and crimping in a seperate operation is a just a work around, if you can do both in the same go then it's a time saver and a normal part of the reloading process.

tydephan
July 27, 2009, 09:47 AM
I had the exact issue you are having when I started loading .40S&W. Just like the guys are saying, I had wayyyy to much crimp in my cases. In addition, I was also belling out the case mouth way too much as well. I actually had to adjust both.

I seat and crimp in the same stage and have no problems now the dies are set up correctly. Cranked out 300 on Saturday. :D

jmorris
July 27, 2009, 09:55 AM
It was he that told me to crimp below the SAAMI spec.

I crimp to fit a cases gauge and pass a "press test" any more and you are just working the brass more than you have to, same goes for sizing and belling.

Historian
July 27, 2009, 04:40 PM
Yup, those look like the first .40s I loaded when I was experimenting with my RCBS seating die. I backed the die off, and kept resetting the seating depth until I was getting a round with good OAL and straight case with no crease.

As an afterthought, watch your belling. You only need enough to set the bullet on top of the case without it falling off. Good luck and good shooting.

Historian

"Democracy requires wisdom."

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