[WLE]

have purchased The folowing.

1. 2,000 230 gr. LRN 45 cal Oregon Trail Laser-Cast.

2. About 2,000 230 Magtech FMC 45 cal

3. 1000 200 gr LSW 45

I am loading for a S&W 5" 1911 that I just purchased new. I have the Lyman 49th addition and the Hornady Manuals and I am finding conflicting coal for the same grain bullets. I understand that the cartride headspaces on the case mouth. I have a machining and tool and die back ground so I a understanding how tolerances can effect function. Do I have to shot a few and see how they work. Will .065 in length plus or minus make a differance in how they chamber through. Does anybody reload for a S&W. I just loaded 50 rounds. Laser cast 230 gr. 4.5 700x coal 1.260. Any feed back would be greatly appreciated on sources of information and feed back on best powder. I was thinking leaded bullets because I did not want to wear out the barrel, but then again, maybe I have a thinking problem. Anybody have loads that have been successful in the S&W would be appreciated. What bullets would you suggest for target shooting. Should I be look at adifferent bullet? I am asking alot and any feed back valued.

[atblis]

Don't worry about wearing a barrel out. If you can afford the ammunition to do it, you can definitely afford to have it replaced.

Will .065 in length plus or minus make a differance in how they chamber through.
Depends on the bullet and the gun. As long as the bullet does not touch the rifling, it will not affect chambering. I kinda doubt you'll be able to load a round that'll fit in the magazine, and put the bullet into the rifling.

EDIT: OAL can definitely impact accuracy though.

[WLE]

Some bullets oal are 1.275 and some 1.160 will the bullet be more accurate if it is seated closer to the rifling?

[atblis]

You could probably make the argument that closer to the rifling is better. Most people just tinker. With rifles though, people do actually measure how far off the rifling they are.

EDIT: The other thing to remember is that is isn't just how far off the rifling you are, how the pistol will feed, and will it fit in the magazine. Pressure is another concern. A reduction in OAL, can raise pressure. I don't think 45 ACP is to touchy about that, but some other cartridges are. 40 SW comes to mind. Higher pressures, and less room in the case.

[WLE]

Should I just load and shot and work though any problems from there?

[atblis]

1.26" with a 230 gr bullet should be fine.

[WLE]

If I keep the load light will the pressure cause a problem if the bullet is seated deeper or more. Does a .070 variation or so really make a big differance in pressure.

[atblis]

1.26" with a 230 gr bullet should be fine.

[MikeS.]

WLE, .070 in a .45acp shouldn't be a problem. It would be an issue with 9mm and .40s&w. The .45 is a low pressure round where the other 2 are high pressure.

Like atblis said 2x above 1.26 with a 230gr is fine according to my manuals.

I've never been a big fan of the 1911 but I love my XD in .45acp. I shoot about 300 rounds a week with it.

[jfh]

It sounds to me like you may have a press / die setup problem. While an LOA variation--for example, from 1.170 to 1.240 overall--will not generally cause pressure spikes, it certainly can at the upper / max end of a recipe. Proper die setup can minimize the LOA variations, but other variables include bullet QC, case LOAs, and bullet type.

The .45ACP is pretty forgiving, however.

Tell us more about your press and die setup--type, what brand, what die brand, etc., etc.

Jim H.

[Walkalong]

I agree with jfh's assessment. Something is out of whack. That is too much variance.

[WLE]

I use a Lee classic 4 hole turret with carbide dies which are also Lee. I have no problem with consistancy. The Hornady manual says the col should be 1.230 for a FMJ when I go to the Lyman manual the specs show 1.275 for the col. Why is there a difference in the col for the same grain and type of bullet. I have found some information that the col should be 1.200, that would be a .075 variation I do not understand why, if someone can explain I will be able to sleep tonight.

[atblis]

I thought he was asking about the different OALs listed for different bullets, not variance in his loads.

What are you asking about?

EDIT: To answer your question, for the 45 ACP it doesn't matter. All those listed recipies are probably fine. If we were talking about a rifle, or a handgun loaded to the max (high pressure and no room in the case left), then it would be an issue.

[WLE]

Sorry for the unclarity of the question. Why does one manual specify a col different from another for the same grain and type of bullet?

[jfh]

OK, I get the question now--

There's several answers to your question, WLE. First, all (for example) 200-gr LSWCs are not alike: On some bullets, more of the bullet will be seated in the case than on other designs, once the case-bullet combo has been sorted out for good magazine feed and chambering. For manufacturer's data, they may well have assembled a cartrige to meet typical criteria for a given bullet--e.g., how much shoulder is revealed above the case mouth--and then simply done their pressure testing in a pressure barrel, with no regard for the actual dynamics of .45ACP function in a 1911.

However, this kind of variation may also have to do with the personal preferences of the (manual / bullet / powder) manufacturer. If they test at a short LOA, the pressures they record will be higher, and since most people will not build to that short an LOA, there's an additional safety margin in their data.

Most of us who load for .45ACP get a bullet and case assembly sorted out that works well, and with high reliability, in our particular firearms. Then we sort out a charge weight for our primary criteria--e.g., a power factor, or accuracy, or whatever. My 1911 likes 200-gr. LSWCs loaded to about 1.240, for example. Obviously, your 700-x charge weight will be safe in my 1911, and now I have room to do some load development for my goals.

As for some of your other questions:

1. "Good" .45ACP powders include Bullseye, 231, WSF, and AA#5. Personally, I think 231 and the 200-gr LSWC loads go together like Apple Pie and Ice Cream at the low-medium recipe range. AA#5 I like for the higher-end loads. (Bullseye I don't use.)

2. lead bullets are fine, period. I don't care for plated bullets, myself--more expensive, and don't work any better. But, any barrel wear will not likely be from bullet type / jacketing material, unless you plan on shooting 1K rounds a week for the next few years.

3. For target shooting--(not necessarily Bullseye target shooting)--I don't think you can do better than a 200-gr. LSWC from the H&G 68 mold, loaded over about 5.0 gr. of 231. You may need to install a different recoil spring, however, for reliable function at that level of charge.

Jim H.

[Mark whiz]

For what it is worth, I load the 230gr MagTechs to an OAL of 1.255" for the best results out of my Springer 1911-A1.

and again for what it is worth - I load all of my loads which include XTPs, Gold Dots, Ranier SWCs, MagTech, etc in the 1.245" to 1.258" OAL range.
In that range, feeding is my ultimate test - a round has to be 100% reliable.

And to test that - you don't even need to load rounds................just install the bullets in the cases to the OAL you want to try, crimp like normal, (no need for powder or even primers) put in the magazine and just cycle the slide quickly thru the rounds....................if they don't like to feed, you'll know it in a hurry. This isn't a final test by no means..................but it'll get you in the ballpark quickly enough.

[DBR]

I load hard cast lead:
230gr WW231 5.5-5.6 gr 1.260 OAL
200gr #68 mold wad cutters WW231 5.6-6.0gr (OAL N/A) .015-.030 of shoulder above case mouth.

Taper crimp to .470-.472

Light loads with ball powders like 231 don't burn clean and in my tests the velocity gets more erratic if loaded to much less than max pressure. (SD increases) - doesn't mean they won't shoot well just not optimum use of the powder.

For light loads a better choice of powder would be VV310, VV320 or Hodgden Clays.

The 1.275 OAL quoted in some manuals is the max magazine length for the 45ACP. I take it to mean they did their load development in a test barrel, not an actual gun barrel.

The 45ACP is fairly forgiving of bullet setting depth partly because it can tolerate pressures higher than standard spec ammo. 45 Super runs at about 27,000psi and uses standard barrels. It does use modified recoil components.

[WLE]

You may need to install a different recoil spring, however, for reliable function at that level of charge.

Jim H.
QUOTE]


On lighter loads do you more spring tension because the recoil is not as great. And around how many pounds of spring pressure.

Where can I purchase 200gr #68 mold

[DBR]

For light loads in a 5" 1911 you can try a spring in the 12#-14# range. You might also have to go to an 18# hammer spring. The hammer spring weight controls initial unlocking more than the recoil spring does.

For a mold go here: http://www.grafs.com/casting/457

Look on page 3 for Saeco #068.

The original #68 mold has not been around for quite a while. This one looks close.

[Randy1911]

The original mold was a H&G #68. There are many copies of that mould now. The best OAL for a #68 bullet is 1.250". I have been using that in my S&W 5" for several years and never had a problem. If you don't know what mould the bullet came from, just load it so that about .030 of the shoulder sticks up above the case mouth and you should be fine.

[WLE]

Does the magazine make a difference in the way the bullet chambers, I just puchased a wilson combat magazine havent tried it yet

[DBR]

Yes, the magazine does make a difference. I use and recommend CMC Powermags and for the best performance I modify them with the Tripp follower and spring kit.

Here: http://www.trippresearch.com/CVS/products/1911/1911.html

Look at: "upgrade kits"

You want the "Super 7rd" kit

This combo is cheaper than Wilson and I believe considerably better.

[jfh]

WLE:

About the recoil spring: I think I am currently running a 14-lb recoil spring in mine--and it may well have an alternate hammer spring. My trigger job was done some 18 years ago--2 & 3/4 lb, reliably with a glass break--and that is NOT recommended for a multipurpose / SD 1911.

About the H&G 68 bullet: You don't need to buy the mold unless you want to get going in casting right now. Look around the various cast bullet sights--for example, see what Missouri Bullet does. I bought so many 200-gr LSWCs a long time ago that I haven't had to buy them recently. Consequently, I can't recommend a specific buyer.

The other recipes given here are good ones--just a bit more power, really. I set up my preferred load--5.1 gr. of 231--when the Major PF was 160, and I really just shot in club competition. With that particular recipe, my fps is about 820, and my SD is below 10.

ADDED ON EDIT: There are many, many good magazines. My .45ACP ones are typically Wilson--but they were bought nearly twenty years ago, too. I also have CMC 10mm ones, and like those in my Kimber 10mm.

FWIW--don't get too far afield--get your reloading under way, and get familiar with your 1911 before you launch into other shooter / gunny enthusiasms.

Jim H.