Answers to questions you never thought to ask, Steel cased ammo in an "improved" gun


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R.W.Dale
August 31, 2009, 02:43 AM
I thought this little kernel of knowledge I learned from today's range trip was worth sharing. I know you've just been dying to know what happens if you fire steel cased ammunition in a gun with a "improved" chamber in this case 7.62x39mm Monarch (barnual) in a 60 degree improved chamber (30PPC largo) as found on my Stevens 200 bench gun. Well as it turns out nothing special happens at all, the case taper and shoulder blows forward just as it's supposed to with brass casings and out of the 25rounds fired on the target below there NO split necks or cracking to be found at all.

On a side note I'm also quite frankly astounded by how well this ammo grouped. A 1" average over the course of five 5 shot groups. Whoever says steel cased ammo is inaccurate crap should stop buying WOLF;)

Now to figure out how to reload the stuff:D

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y96/krochus/Stevens%20200/dd8b974c.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y96/krochus/Stevens%20200/18bc6c3d.jpg

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OrangePwrx9
August 31, 2009, 09:41 AM
The Wolf .223 steel cases are Boxer primed and are reloadable. I've only reloaded 20 so far and, out of that group, I had one split neck when the reloads were fired. Accuracy was no better than Wolf factory loads, but it was just a start.

One thing that's sure to harm accuracy is the way the steel shaves copper off the shank of the bullet. Might take some careful matching of components or a slightly oversize expander ball to cure that. Lubing the bullets didn't seem to help.

Interesting to see what happened in your improved chamber. Don't know if I'd have had the guts to try that.
Bob

Acera
August 31, 2009, 11:39 AM
The Wolf .223 steel cases are Boxer primed and are reloadable. I've only reloaded 20 so far and

I have got to know where you found Boxer primers! Haven't seen those on the market in a long time.

You got a link??

DMK
August 31, 2009, 12:46 PM
with a "improved" chamber in this case 7.62x39mm Monarch (barnual) in a 60 degree improved chamber (30PPC largo) as found on my Stevens 200 bench gun.Would you please explain what you mean by "improved chamber"?

You were shooting factory made Monarch ammo?

briansmithwins
August 31, 2009, 01:30 PM
What the heck is the 7.62x39 headspacing off of?

It looks like the shoulder is blow completely forward.

BSW

R.W.Dale
August 31, 2009, 01:46 PM
It headspaces on a crush fit at the neck shoulder juncture. Just as the old Ackley improved line of cartridges.

DMK
August 31, 2009, 02:16 PM
So basically you were shooting 7.62x39 in a gun chambered for a wildcat?

R.W.Dale
August 31, 2009, 02:49 PM
So basically you were shooting 7.62x39 in a gun chambered for a wildcat?

Pretty much, although I would like to add that I cut this chamber specifically to allow fireforming the new cartridge from 7.62x39 brass

http://www.wildem.de/Improvs.htm

here's a good article explaining the process although they do omit mention of the benefits of more positive headspace and greater brass stability (lonjevity)

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y96/krochus/Stevens%20200/HPIM2367.jpg

DMK
August 31, 2009, 06:42 PM
Thanks for the link and explanation. I had heard of Ackley Improved, but wasn't aware of the concept. Pretty cool.

OrangePwrx9
August 31, 2009, 08:12 PM
Acera: Try wideners.com. They've got Wolf primers. I've been using primers I bought years ago, but I got a few thousand fresh Wolf primers in from wideners today. Kinda wish I'd bought more.
Bob

SlamFire1
August 31, 2009, 09:12 PM
I only conducted a limited test of steel cased ammo, but the results were good.

I removed the bullet from 308 Win chinese ball. I used a Dremel grinder bit to bevel the case mouth and inserted 168 SMK bullets. After dumping the chinese powder and using IMR 4895. (I think)

So I have a chinese steel case, chinese primer, Match bullet and decent powder.

The stuff shot very well at 100 yards.

I recall measuring the run out of the steel cases, and neck run out was .001". It would be interesting to find if match bullets in steel cases shoot better than match bullets in brass cases.

Acera
August 31, 2009, 10:34 PM
OrangePwrx9


I misread your posting, and thought you said berdan primed, not boxed. That got me excited. I think that there is some sort of import ban on them. I can find all the regular primers I need around here.

I have a some fired berdan primed cases, and I am not going to buy the special tool to remove them until I find a solid source for the primers.

Thanks,

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