Some poor victim buying a fake Swede carbine


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Float Pilot
September 2, 2009, 06:08 PM
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=138411115

This seller has been notified that he was selling a cut down (bubba-ed) m/96 rifle as a collectable m/94 carbine. In fact we ran a tread on it here a month or so ago.

Supposedly some folks from the Swede Military Rifles collector site even contacted Gun Brokers to tell them this guy was selling a fake. And it would seem no action was taken...

Now some poor person has been fooled into buying the darn thing, which is really worth about $75 in parts.

This sure is a lesson on where and who to buy from....

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Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
September 2, 2009, 06:53 PM
I'd say that if the buyer KNOWS this, and still thinks that the 94 look alike is worth it, then no problems. If the buyer is unaware, then shame on gunbroker for not taking action, and double shame on the seller. The seller was contacted - did anyone contact the high bidder before the auction was over - it's just a matter of being registered and clicking on the bidder's username, correct?

Besides, it doesn't look like there's any bid on it at all except for the 1st bid, which is a "fake bid" that is nothing more than the seller placing his de facto reserve on it.

Float Pilot
September 2, 2009, 06:55 PM
I tried, it does not seem to work on Gun Broker

Ratshooter
September 2, 2009, 09:11 PM
You cannot get someones name and e-mail unless you doing a transaction with them.

But you know. its his money and his choice. Getting good info on a gun like that is easy with the net and places like this. It ain't my problem.

cchris
September 2, 2009, 10:09 PM
^agreed there 100%. If someone buys a gun without taking the time to do the research on it...their loss. Conversely, this can happen to the seller as well - in the situation of my Gewehr 98 that the seller stated was an "unknown company" by the name of "Amberg" (obviously, he wasn't familiar with Mausers).

lionking
September 2, 2009, 11:10 PM
The bolt was the true give away.The stock refinish also looked suspicious.Upon looking more closely the rear sight was also proof of a cut down.

It might be worth $75 in parts but no one other than a personal sale would sell even a bubba that cheap either on line or at a show.

Well I hope it turns out to be a good shooter for the buyer anyway.

Float Pilot
September 3, 2009, 01:42 AM
It had several obvious flaws that told the true story of it being a cut-down m/96.

1. The fake stock sling slot did not have the cut-out for the sling buckle.

2. The finger grooves in the fore-stock are twice as long as they should be.

3. It has a m/96 long rear sight and not a carbine sight.

4. There is a barrel step visible outside the stock. A real m/94 barrel has the step under the wood. But a m/96 barrel has one right there...

5. The bolt is a sporter bolt and not military.

6. There is a sling swivel on the bottom of the butt stock. M/94s did not have that since they had a side mounted sling. More proof that it is a m/96 cut stock.

7. The stock disc is in the wrong location for a m/94.

I would not mind as much if it had not been for the seller being notified that he was selling a fake.

nwilliams
September 3, 2009, 02:40 AM
Why should I care if someone is selling under false pretenses on Gunbroker? People do it all the time on sites like Gunbroker and Ebay.

It's buyer beware on online auction sites, if you don't know what your buying then don't bid! Scams are everywhere and those who get scammed are usually people who didn't do proper research ahead of time.

It's not my job to warn people that what they are bidding is fake, it's their money they can spend it however they want.

lefteyedom
September 3, 2009, 04:53 AM
Why should I care if someone is selling under false pretenses on Gunbroker? People do it all the time on sites like Gunbroker and Ebay.

We should care. How did you learn about firearms? Did you learn everything by yourself without any help?

Should we keep our knowledge to ourselves and allow the tenderfoot to be feed to the wolves?

When members of the shooting sports community allow these kind of shady dealings to go unchallenged it sullies all of us.

nwilliams
September 3, 2009, 06:30 AM
We should care. How did you learn about firearms? Did you learn everything by yourself without any help?

Should we keep our knowledge to ourselves and allow the tenderfoot to be feed to the wolves?

When members of the shooting sports community allow these kind of shady dealings to go unchallenged it sullies all of us.

Sorry but there are plenty of ways for people to research before they buy, if someone rushes into something without doing the proper research first then it's their own fault. The seller put enough pictures up to allow anyone who has done proper research to realize that it is not what the seller says it is, anyone who gets fooled by it should have searched google before searching gunbroker.

If people want to play gunbroker police then they by all means can, personally I've got better things to do with my time.

Horsemany
September 3, 2009, 08:25 AM
Sorry but there are plenty of ways for people to research before they buy, if someone rushes into something without doing the proper research first then it's their own fault. The seller put enough pictures up to allow anyone who has done proper research to realize that it is not what the seller says it is, anyone who gets fooled by it should have searched google before searching gunbroker.

If people want to play gunbroker police then they by all means can, personally I've got better things to do with my time.

WOW. We're all in this together. Some of us were raised to look out for our own. Obviously some of us weren't raised that way. This is the reason retailers have to put limits on primer sales.

Baba Louie
September 3, 2009, 09:37 AM
Whilst the weapon in question is no doubt NOT a 94, and while Caveat Emptor should hold true, it is still a nice looking little carbine and someone did get it, so its value holds true (for that buyer).

wheelgunslinger
September 3, 2009, 09:55 AM
WOW. We're all in this together. Some of us were raised to look out for our own. Obviously some of us weren't raised that way. This is the reason retailers have to put limits on primer sales.

I think I see what you're getting at here. I disagree.

I'm not anyone's mother. I'm not anyone's sensei. If you want to buy guns over the internet sight unseen, then you pays your money and you takes your chances.

My local gunstore lets me hold stuff and will even hold stuff in the back for me so I can do my research if it's something beyond their realm of expertise. No sweat.

As for buying primers, it's capitalism. You don't mind it when you get something cheap.

Horsemany
September 3, 2009, 11:22 AM
As for buying primers, it's capitalism. You don't mind it when you get something cheap.
Today 07:37 AM

Nothing against capitalism. I'm a small business owner myself. IMO selling something you know is not "as advertised" is not a good example of capitalism or ethics.

The hoarding of primers and general disregard for fellow shooters came to mind after reading some earlier posts. Perhaps it's my own neivity but I don't like seeing anyone getting taken advantage gun related or not.

Tully M. Pick
September 3, 2009, 01:15 PM
It seems that ohiopal is a very unethical Gunbroker seller. Thanks for the heads up.

HorseSoldier
September 3, 2009, 02:01 PM
+1. I'm a little puzzled by the "it's cool this guy is trying to commit fraud and rip someone off" attitude.

Float Pilot
September 3, 2009, 05:01 PM
I too am somewhat puzzled by the attitude of some that intentional fraud is just fine.
That same logic would dictate that someone knowingly selling contaminated food to your kids at a cafe should also be ok , since it was really your (or really the kid's job by that logic) job to investigate the food's safety prior to the purchase.
No wonder the country is circling the drain.

Clipper
September 3, 2009, 05:29 PM
What a hoot! How many of you 'Off with his head' 'ers would, if you bought a gun advertized as a reworked '96 for $100.00, return it upon opening the package and discovering a genuine '94...

And no, I don't believe you would, considering the posts I've read on this site about how someone bought the little-old-lady-selling-her-deceased-husband's-Purdy for $100.00 got what she asked for it, and so I shouldn't feel like I ripped her off...

jimmyraythomason
September 3, 2009, 05:49 PM
You OBVIOUSLY haven't bought any Mauser parts! If the seller had listed this chop job(done very well apparently) he could have reasonably gotten $250-$350 for it without lying about what it was.

Cosmoline
September 3, 2009, 06:00 PM
This falls into caveat emptor. But if the guy wanted his money back based on the erroneous description he should be able to get it.

dirtyjim
September 3, 2009, 08:07 PM
i wouldn't have dropped $479 on it but i would have had no problem dropping $250-300 just because of the large mineral streak running down the stock.

nwilliams
September 3, 2009, 10:31 PM
I too am somewhat puzzled by the attitude of some that intentional fraud is just fine. That same logic would dictate that someone knowingly selling contaminated food to your kids at a cafe should also be ok , since it was really your (or really the kid's job by that logic) job to investigate the food's safety prior to the purchase. No wonder the country is circling the drain.

NOBODY is saying that fraud is fine! Jeez! Where do some of you come up with this stuff!:rolleyes:

To use your own analogy. If someone is selling contaminated food at a cafe then you call the health department and report them. You don't stand outside the cafe and tell every patron that enters not to eat there.

Also there is nothing in that auction that says the seller is intentionally trying to fraud anyone. His description may be faulty but that could mean that he just doesn't know what hes talking about, or he was mistaken in his own research. There's plenty of pictures of the gun in question and it doesn't look to me like those pictures digitally manipulated in any way.

Also this seller has 673 positive feedbacks and one negative. It doesn't sound to me like he is the master of deception and out to scam everyone he sells to. For all we know he made a simple mistake in his description of the item, whether he did that intentionally or not I don't know and I'm not about to go pointing fingers at people unless I know for a fact what he did was intentional. If he did do it intentionally then that's sad but I'm not the internet police.

jimmyraythomason
September 3, 2009, 10:46 PM
There is a 3 day inspection period and a return policy on this auction.

lefteyedom
September 4, 2009, 12:44 AM
Some people's moral compass only points toward their own self interest.

lefteyedom
September 4, 2009, 01:16 AM
NEVER MIND>>>><<<<
IF it has to be explained.....

jakk280rem
September 4, 2009, 02:42 AM
not to threadjack, but here is another example of gunbroker mislabeling. i am in the process of asking the seller whats up.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=138577220

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