22LR Conversion in AR15


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loadedround
September 4, 2009, 09:36 AM
I am a reloader, but because of the high cost and shortages of components I am considering buying a 22 LR conversion kit for the two AR15 rifles I own and need comments from anyone using possibly the Ciener or other conversion kit in terms of accuracy.
My two AR's are a Colt H-Bar with a 1/7 twist and a DPMS 20" 1/9 match barrel. Hopefully some of you shooters could tell me what I could expect shooting 22LR's in my AR's. Thanks! :)

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Rack Grade
September 4, 2009, 09:51 AM
Why don't you consider buying a 5.45x39 upper and getting some of that supremely cheap ammo that's out there right now?

4v50 Gary
September 4, 2009, 10:25 AM
The bore diameters .223 (224) and 22LR (221) are dissimilar. If you use a Ciener, you're going to experience leading. That's why some folks go with a dedicated 22 upper.

7mmMurphy
September 4, 2009, 11:02 AM
I prefer the CMMG at Brownell's. It's extremely reliable and unlike other conversion kits it uses the same size magazine as the standard AR so you get the same look and feel which is important for easy handling when you have the real magazines.

I do NOT fire it in my Colt H-Bar target. The .22lr will foul the gas tube. I don't have any problem throwing it into my Rock River Arms and shooting 500 rounds. I run a boresnake through it several times before leaving the range and I've never had a problem. On several occasions I’ve fired 3-5 rounds of .223 after the .22lr to blow out the gas tube residue. I don’t know if this helps but I know it hasn’t hurt.

I normally shoot it at the 50 yard line and it’s accurate enough to say that if you miss a shot it’s the shooter and not the rifle. I've put the calipers on several brands of .22lr and they come in right at .224.

I would buy another CMMG with no hesitation.

krs
September 4, 2009, 11:25 AM
I usually don't go for gimmicky things like conversion kits but I bought a kit from Brownell's: http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=27008/Product/CMMG_AR_15_M16__22_LR_CONVERSION_KIT

It works in both of my carbines, a 1/8 and a 1/9 twist barrels, but it works better in one than in the other.

In the one it works best in, a Mod 1 upper with the 1/9 twist, it feeds reliably and fires 'bugholes' - putting shots down one on top the other like it thinks it's a benchrest rifle. If anything that rifle is more accurate with the .22 kit than it is firing .223 or 5.56 ammo. It really surprised me as I wasn't expecting more than 'plinking' accuracy from it. It's doing it with both Remington and Aguilla ammo from CMP - their 'black box' stuff that I've got tons of here. Some of the Remington needs two hits to fire but it's like that in most of my semi-auto .22 rifles, so I don't think the kit can be blamed necesarily. Maybe it needs a slightly stronger recoil spring.

It's fired over 1000 rounds now and seems to be getting even better with more rounds out of it and I haven't cleaned it or removed it from the carbine it's working so well in. I don't want to disturb it. :). I did need to crank the Aimpoint to a new zero but it wasn't all that far off and wasn't a big deal.

In the other rifle, a Fulton Armory build, the kit tended to fail to close. It worked most of the time but would need a push about five times a 26 round magful. That rifle is a tight good shooting piece of artwork and I don't think I'll subject it to the kit again - it spits it up anyway.


I do have another rifle with a Colt 1/7 20" barrel in a Colt upper but I haven't got around to trying the kit in that gun.

So that kit has become one of our favorite backyard shooters. My wife is coming around to liking the AR ergo finally too, so it's a great training aid - LOL!

I'd like to have a little stronger hammer spring to get the gun to hit harder, but other than that I think that kit is a good thing.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
September 4, 2009, 11:30 AM
Aguila SSS 60s shoot well in my 1 in 9" bbl; dunno about other ammo brands/types (that's all I shoot in them).

KW
September 4, 2009, 11:40 AM
My M261 conversion in a 16" 1/7 chrome lined barrel works quite well. I've only ever shot it out to 25 yards, but it's been accurate enough at that range for plinking or small game. 22lr is certainly dirtier then 5.56, but nothing a little CLP can't fix. All I've used so far is Remington bulk pack, and it's run perfectly with that. I suppose better ammo might improve the accuracy a bit. The only downside is that the 22lr doesn't shoot to the same point of aim as 5.56, but I've found that aiming between the 400 and 500 meter marks on my ACOGs BDC ladder and a little left gets me right on target. If you are using A2 irons, or some other click adjustable sight or scope you could probably work up your own correction for your rifle/conversion/ammo.

Big44mag
September 4, 2009, 03:00 PM
I do have one but with their customer service and reputation I would definitely go with another manufacturer. The Spikes kit looks and work great, at least in the ARs I have used them in and their customer service is highly praised.

I ran about 500 rounds through the Ceiner kit then all of a sudden it failed to extract. I sent it to Ceiner and it was delivered on February 24th to be covered within their 1 year warranty. The warranty statement in the manual says that if I wanted to find out anything I had to mail them a check for $10. The warranty page is no longer available on their site but used to list the same information. I figured I'd just cut my losses and forget about it.

To my amazement, I got it back on Tuesday Sept 2nd. No phone call, email, shipping notification, it was just sitting on my doorstep when I got home.

Now that I have my kit back after it took over 6 months to "change the extractor", I'm almost out of my warranty. I'm actually scared to shoot it because if something breaks I'll be SOL shortly.

Also, when they were backordered you had to get on the waiting list or you could pay an extra $50 and that would bump you up to the top of the list. Love the business ethics there.

Midway has had them in stock for quite some time, so they seemed to have been more worried about selling more than taking care of old customers.

If you want to know who you're dealing with, go ahead and give Ceiner a call, 321-868-2200. Don't worry they won't answer the phone. His answering machine will just refer you back to the website because "Everything's There"

He can fall off the face of the earth for all I care.

Sorry for the rant.

As for accuracy, I use the kit in an 11.5" Colt with a 1 in 12" twist and a 7" RRA with a 1 in 9" twist. Both produce descent accuracy at 50', between the size of a golfball and baseball depending on the ammunition. They all seem to group a little low right though.

Zach S
September 4, 2009, 04:08 PM
My 1:9 upper did pretty good, my 1:7 sucked in comparison, but did alright for cans and such. Never compared the two because I had to sell the 1:9 long before I got the 1:7. Ammo used was federal bulk and CCI minimags.

I now have a dedicated 1:16 carbine. It does the best.

ArmedBear
September 4, 2009, 04:50 PM
Dedicated upper here, also. 1:16"

Shoots great, feeds great, lots of fun. Shot out to 200 yards with it so far.

Not the CHEAPEST toy in the world, but if you shoot the AR a lot, the savings in ammo (cost and/or reloading time and effort) will pay for it quickly.

jpwilly
September 4, 2009, 11:04 PM
CMMG Kit from Brownells here...shoots great. Fed Bulk ammo funtions very well I've only had a couple of duds and one Jam so far. Just under 2 boxes shot through my DPMS 1-9" upper. It puts them right where I aim and no leading issues so far.

Jasper86
September 4, 2009, 11:21 PM
another dedicated upper here.

Compass Lake, basically a carbon copy of my service rifle.

with CCI standard velocity, its SCARY accurate.

(5shot groups while dialing in windage)

http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q132/JasperSTi/DSC_2504.jpg

benzy2
September 5, 2009, 12:33 AM
I had one that was a pain from the start. It would not for the life of the bolt go fully into battery. I tried all the mods and it just never would load all the way. This lead to a lot of fail to fires. Once I would get it into battery it would shoot fine. The accuracy was decent. Nothing spectacular but certainly good enough that if I missed a bowling pin it was my fault. I would be willing to try a different one again but it wouldnt be through Ceiner. He is a prick and will never get another dime of mine. Spikes and CMMG both look to be the same design but better follow through. My JAC kit was rough around the edges.

IndianaBoy
September 5, 2009, 02:04 AM
I have a CMMG conversion.


I have put more than 4k Federal bulk rounds through it.

Good accuracy, good reliability, excellent value.

You do NOT need a dedicated upper unless you like spending money. I run my conversion in the same gun that I use for plinking, home defense, and 3-gun. Nary a problem.

bglz42
September 5, 2009, 07:20 AM
I love my Ciener kit! As far as fouling, inaccuracy, etc... bunk. Mone runs great and shoots great.

Rollis R. Karvellis
September 5, 2009, 09:46 AM
It seem's to me that for the price just go with the Colt or S&W, they are right around the $500.00 mark.

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