Guns and Canadians


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Arctic Scout
September 5, 2009, 09:01 AM
Ok...so I had a really frustrating thing happen to me today.

I was standing in line at the PX and the fellow behind me (a Canadian Contractor) mentions the "Shotgun News" that they have in the magazine stand. He asks me (apropos nothing) if I'd ever heard of it. So I say that I have and he should check it out because they have some interesting things in there most of the time.
Then he shocks me.
He says "I'm not interested in that crap. Only in an American store could you buy a magazine that ships guns right to your house". I couldn't tell by his tone whether or not he was being derisive so I asked him if he was a shooter.
He gave me a scornful look and said that he hated guns and didn't understand why anyone needed them.
I reminded him that we are, in fact, in Afghanistan.
Then he brought up Canadian firearms laws and how we have so many more "gun crimes" than Canada and how guns OBVIOUSLY raise the crime rate.
Now...reasonably I know his information to be flawed and not true. However, I was so offended that I spent a few minutes insulting his country, parentage and masculinity instead until he left the line and just walked out. My question is, how could I have more reasonably disproven him. I'm not normally an apologist, so I'm not accustomed to fending off 'antis'.

AS

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KenWP
September 5, 2009, 09:11 AM
Listen to the news for Calgary Alberta and see how well our stupid gun laws work. There is a gang shooting once a month at least and I just bet they have their guns registered. The gun laws do nothing for crime as crooks don't register guns and of course they can buy auto loading firearms when honest people can't.
I would say ingnore the twit as you can't reason with unreasonable people. I have a good buddy over in the Sandbox right now and lost two others two years ago so personally I would have told him off to.
By the way I can no longer get some gun magizines by mail anymore due to stupid laws. Outdoor Life actually had to send me a refund and I had received it every month since 1974.

Starship1st
September 5, 2009, 09:30 AM
You could have told him that if he dislike shot gun news he should see all the other gun magazines out for sale. You could ask him does he expect a Mounty in front of every house in Canada for protection?

Here in the US the police can not be expected to be every where to prevent crimes. Armed citizens must protect our selves and family.

Finally, you could have ended with: This is why I live in America and why you choose to work here. :cool:

MisterMike
September 5, 2009, 09:42 AM
Just tell him that our country could be up his country with one of the Nuclear Triad tied behind our backs . . .

KenWP
September 5, 2009, 09:45 AM
With cut backs I lived most of my life in a high problem area and on the weekends they had one RCMP on duty and he was the rookie. I was a NC gaurd at the jail and this poor fellow never slept all weekend and he had no experience to fall back on to think things out.
They actually figured a cop would get called to a domestic dispute and be able to call in and ask if any guns were registered at that address and if they say no he could just walk safely in and handle the situation. Does the word DUH work for that situation.

Readyrod
September 5, 2009, 09:59 AM
Just ignore idiots like that. He was just trying to pi** you off. You just make his day by reacting. That's what he wants.

BTR
September 5, 2009, 10:08 AM
Good question. The USA certainly has a higher murder rate overall than Canada. Is it because of gun laws? Nope. How do we know? Because there are several states in the USA with both lax gun laws an murder rates equal to or lower than Canada's.

Look at the murder rates of the USA broken down by state for 2006. You see there are nine US states with equal to or lower murder rates than Canada's overall rate of 1.85 for that year:

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/85-002-x/85-002-x2007008-eng.pdf

Compare it to the overall Canadian 2006 murder rate of 1.85 per 100000:

http://www40.statcan.gc.ca/l01/cst01/legal04a-eng.htm

Many of the states with in murder rate equal to or lower than Canada's have relatively lax gun laws (ex Montana, North Dakota, Utah, Wyoming).

Murder rates are the product of the culture of a people living in an area and are unrelated to fireams laws. Example: Russia and Jamaica have severe firearms laws and extremely high murder rates.

Shung
September 5, 2009, 12:11 PM
I would have shot him.... and made his point ;)


just kidding.. ;)

Shear_stress
September 5, 2009, 12:29 PM
"Only in an American store could you buy a magazine that ships guns right to your house".

That's funny. In Canada it's perfectly legal for regular folks to order guns through the mail. This hasn't been allowed in the U.S. for over forty years.

Snow Dog
September 5, 2009, 01:23 PM
As ShearStress mentioned, it's perfectly legal to use the postal system to ship guns in Canada. I just sent a rifle to a fellow out in Alberta a few weeks ago and I received a pistol in the mail from a dealer a couple of months before that. A$$hats like that guy are products of years of brainwashing from the liberal media. There are actually more guns in Canada than there are people! Guys like that have already decided that they are right and everyone else that does not share their point of view is ignorant. Calling people like that names is only going to reinforce their mindset, unfortunately. They are also so convinced of their own superiority that they will not stoop to looking up or verifing facts and figures - whatever the media tells them is "the truth". The best way to deal with people like that is not to be adversarial but to question them about their "facts" and "stats". Ask them to show you these numbers so you can see them for yourself. Start to undermine their beliefs and start them doubting themselves.

spartywrx
September 5, 2009, 01:32 PM
By the way I can no longer get some gun magizines by mail anymore due to stupid laws. Outdoor Life actually had to send me a refund and I had received it every month since 1974.

Wait. They don't allow gun magazines :what: !!?? What kind of fascist crap is that? Please tell me its some kind of technicality with shipping.




I'm sure glad we have no prior restraint here.

KenWP
September 5, 2009, 03:43 PM
Can.t mail them. The stores can sell them but they have weird ways of distrubuting them. For awhile they shipped the magazines to Canada and then mailed them out that way but then had to stop doing that too.
I get guns in the mail all the time also. I also own more guns then most normal people. Normal is a button on the dishwasher by the way.

Prince Yamato
September 5, 2009, 03:44 PM
He was probably just cranky because he has been deprived of Tim Horton's while staying in the US.

mustang_steve
September 5, 2009, 04:52 PM
I would have just jokingly told him I had an Abrams tank being FedEx'd to my house this weekend.

There's really no point in arguing to such a misinformed and opinionated person, they'll just disregard the info until they are forced to recognize they were wrong...and honestly, that's not our place to force anyone to realize anything. To advise, of course...but to advise when it won't be taken is a fool's errand.

If it makes you feel better, point out Washington D.C. If handguns are illegal in city limits...why are there so many shootings that involve handguns? They came from outside? So why are liberals banning various guns if we already know they will come in from outside? Can we say exercise in futility? Then research some canada gun crime statistics and present it back to him. The flavor the media has there is less gore-obsessed than ours....so they get a significantly different picture of a similar environment, while ours tries to be the next grossest thing (I honestly wished the media knockced this off, it's not helping things nor increasing knowledge by any level...this coming from someone that does like movies like the saw series).

Really, it doesn't matter where he's from....some people are violent, and they'll do violent things. If he wants to look at gun violence...he'll see a matching trend in that there will be other forms of violent crime to go with it....assaults, robberies, rapes, etc. This is not because a gun is some evil tool that urges it's owners to kill (this isn't the movies, fella), this is because they simply have a mass of violent people in an area. Perhaps they should work on that instead.

Shadow 7D
September 5, 2009, 08:04 PM
Uh no, this was in Afghanistan AND they have a couple of Tim Hourtons there, at least one each at Bagram and Kandahar. Stupid canuk, guns are for battle ships.

goofy grape
September 6, 2009, 01:42 AM
If Canada is so friggin' great, why are many of them coming down here? It's nota guns out there that are killing people and causing crime, it's the low life scum, the "poor oppressed minorities" that are doing it. Obamanation wants to outlaw guns and have a National No Carry law. Alcohol and vehicles kill more people ever day, so why doesn't he get hot on banning cars instead of bailing out the manufacturers?

Ohio Gun Guy
September 6, 2009, 02:01 AM
Canadians are actually "Americans" who where to chicken to join the revolution..... (AKA Loyalists) :evil:

Its genetic...


The first shots of the Revolutionary war were over the British coming to take the guns of the militia. Just remind them, that if they really want our guns, they can come and try to get them.........again :evil: (Didn't work out so well last time, eeehh)


But then afterward, thank them for their current status of one of the few countries helping us. Seems we spent much of our time, money, lives defending Europe from 1945-1990's from the very real Russian threat, and when we need the help, everyone isn't willing to pay us back........We should be keeping a list of asshats not to bail out again.

MD_Willington
September 6, 2009, 03:52 AM
Ship guns to your house.. tell @sshat that in CANADA you can have guns shipped to your house...

I was in Oyster River BC Canada last week... Liberal BC... there were approx 1/2 dozen firearms magazines at the local store and there was a myself and 4 others reading them...

Not every Canuck is gun hating wuss bag...

Actually with the horse crap that goes on in BC, I'm surprised no one has camped out at the Legistlature in Victoria and took out Campbell on the opening day, he sure got boo at when he showed his smug liberal face for the cameras.

Sunray
September 6, 2009, 05:15 AM
Arctic Scout, please accept my apologies for my countryman's rudeness. Unfortunately, most of our people know nothing about firearms or our stupid laws. Most, like most of our Southern cousins, have never seen a real firearm of any kind and only hear about firearm usage in a negative context.
"...how could I have more reasonably disproven him..." No point arguing with people, from either side of the border, who won't listen.
"...Canadians are actually "Americans" who where to(SIC) chicken to join the revolution..." Those are fighting words. The 'Loyalists' took a stand just like the 1776 rebels did. They knew the difference between to, too and two, as well.
"...why are many of them coming down here?..." You need our educated people. Canadian engineers put NASA on the moon. Alex Bell invented the telephone in Canada. The M1 Rifle was designed by a Canadian born engineer. So was the basic design of the M4 Sherman tank. Basketball was invented by a Canadian. Every SOP for a military operation, currently used by every army in the world, was invented by a Canadian Militia general in W. W. I. Shall I go on?

ThrottleJockey72
September 6, 2009, 05:50 AM
"...why are many of them coming down here?..." You need our educated people. Canadian engineers put NASA on the moon. Alex Bell invented the telephone in Canada. The M1 Rifle was designed by a Canadian born engineer. So was the basic design of the M4 Sherman tank. Basketball was invented by a Canadian. Every SOP for a military operation, currently used by every army in the world, was invented by a Canadian Militia general in W. W. I. Shall I go on?

Oh yah? Well you still don't know how to play football! lol j/k

cottonmouth
September 6, 2009, 06:02 AM
I am near Kandahar and yesterday I was shooting a bow that a friend had shipped over and a Canadian walked by and mentioned that he had recently moved into a new house but he couldn't shoot his bow in his own yard because there it was considered a firearm. Crazy talk I tell ya! Shadow 7D, ole Tim has some pretty good coffee at the shop on KAF, doughnuts aint bad eigther!

J.B.

IndispensableDestiny
September 6, 2009, 09:12 AM
Can.t mail them. The stores can sell them but they have weird ways of distrubuting them. For awhile they shipped the magazines to Canada and then mailed them out that way but then had to stop doing that too.

Wow.

Fortunately, our first amendment protects that. At least for now.

Ohio Gun Guy
September 6, 2009, 09:38 AM
Sunray....

Love it, went strait to the spelling error. :evil:


Most of my post was in jest. I dont have a problem with the Canadians. I do wish they / you would get a little more tough with your government and your rights. It is always easier when "Everybody" is doing it.

JohnL2
September 6, 2009, 12:59 PM
(Shaking head slowly)
Reminds of a day not too long ago. I was filling up my car and couldn't help but overhear a man spouting off about the new personal TASERS that will be on the market.
As I was standing there holding the gas nozzle in my hand, I glanced down at the NRA decal prominently displayed in my back window and then looked at him again.
I just rolled my eyes and finished my business.

I bet anything the guy was from the Eastern provinces.

kdstrick
September 6, 2009, 01:12 PM
Now...reasonably I know his information to be flawed and not true. However, I was so offended that I spent a few minutes insulting his country, parentage and masculinity instead until he left the line and just walked out. My question is, how could I have more reasonably disproven him. I'm not normally an apologist, so I'm not accustomed to fending off 'antis'.

It sounds like you handled the situation perfectly! :D Nice work...

Shadow 7D
September 6, 2009, 03:22 PM
Cotton mouth, Tell me about it, I got stuck with two tours in Iraq, at least the second tour we had a burgerking on the mail run. I was with the scouts so in my platoon the routing was planned by stomach vote, the PL and PS have majority vote. The had an awesome breakfast at Ste. Mare outside of Falluja.

Funny thing is that I ran into a guy who helped set the one in Kandahar, corporate sent over what they thought was a 3 month supply, they sold out in less than 2 weeks. He said that every Canadian in the sector came by.

But then your talking to a guy who was 5 minutes late rolling into Iraq for the invasion because he was getting subs for the truck, I guess its a good thing that I was on 1SG truck.

hso
September 6, 2009, 04:47 PM
Only in an American store could you buy a magazine that ships guns right to your house

"Welllll, you can ship guns "right to your house", but we can't so I wonder what else you're wrong about? How 'bout the crime rate and guns? Considering that there are many states in the US that have looser gun laws than Canada, but have a lower per capita gun crime rate, it would seem that guns aren't the source of the problem."

JCMAG
September 6, 2009, 04:52 PM
A violent crime comparison between the United States and Canada, with Britain thrown in for good measure. Data courtesy of a recent report by the European Union and United Nations, as reported by The Daily Mail (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1196941/The-violent-country-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html).

United Kingdom: 2,034/100k
Canada: 935/100k
U.S.A.:466/100k

Next time you see that fellow, tell him to mind his own business.

KenWP
September 6, 2009, 08:48 PM
My family were all from the US. Dad's family were Loyalist and they went back after the war for a long time and then left again. Just think I could have got to carry a handgun if they had of stayed. Course I am old enough to have ended up in a rice paddy also.
Friend is a gun smith up here and he gave up as the stupid laws made if hard to make a living. I can take a gun in to get it fixed no guestions asked but to pick it back up I have to show my firearms permit. Go figure that stupid one out.
As to crime we have to be the only country that give child molesters a 2 year sentance with time served.

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