WST


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moe1942
September 10, 2009, 01:43 PM
I have almost five pounds of WST and would like to use it for .38 Spl load in .357 cases using 158 gr SWC. I have load data for .38 cases but it would simplify things if I just used .357 for all loads. I have a large supply of nickel .357 cases.

Anyone tried this and any guidance on bullet depth etc??

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Deavis
September 10, 2009, 02:41 PM
No loads for WST are listed in the manufacturer's data, check your reloading manuals.

http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

Walkalong
September 10, 2009, 03:01 PM
Increase the .38 data by .1 to .2 Grs in .357 cases to get the same velocities you would from .38 cases. The .357 cases and the guns can take a bit more of course.

Seat to cannelure if it has one. Seat to the same depth in the case as you would in .38 cases.

Walkalong
September 10, 2009, 03:02 PM
Agh. I missed where you do not have .38 load data for .WSF. I'll have to look around.

Mark whiz
September 10, 2009, 06:45 PM
I went back to my records and load books and find nothing for WST in .357Mag. However I have tried it, I just don't remember were I got the data.

For 158gr LSWCs I used 5.2gr of WST (OAL 1.570" to 1.590", basically crimped at the bullets 1st groove from the tip) and got groups of about 3 inches at 15 yds out of a 4" Ruger Security Six. Not my best LSWC load by far, but passable for center of mass shooting.

If you want to try it with jacketed bullets, I used 6.3 to 6.6gr with XTPs and 5.8gr with Gold Dots (OAL of 1.60") and got groups in the 1.25" to 1.75" range at 15yds.

BTW - I saw no signs of excess pressure or any other trouble with those loads.

Walkalong
September 10, 2009, 06:58 PM
From Winchester online data. (http://www.wwpowder.com/data/handgun/38spec/) Old link that does not work. They use to have all calibers. I printed many before the pages were disabled or whatever.

.38 Spl - 7.7" test barrel

148 Gr Lead 2.5 Grs - do not reduce - 680 FPS @ 13,000 CUP

158 Gr Lead 3.3 Grs - do not reduce - 705 FPS @ 12.800 CUP

You should be able to use .1 or .2 more Grs to get these same velocities in .357 Mag brass, but could go over it some since it is a .357 Mag after all.

moe1942
September 11, 2009, 03:13 PM
Thanks for the replies. I'm not new to reloading but this is my first at pistol reloading.

My concern is after I threw a 3.7 gr load of WST it looked awful small to get proper ignition in a .357 case. It looked sparse for a .38 load. I got the data from Winchester for .38 special. 3.7 gr WST and LSWC with CCI 500 primer.

Also I have the Lee FCD for .38. If seating the bullet to .38 OAL and the bullet is below the last groove will this crimp suffice?

Hope I'm not confusing anyone...

moe1942
September 11, 2009, 03:32 PM
Mark, 5.2 grs sounds a tad better. Was this a published tested load or one you worked up? Did you see any bad signs or did you feel it could be upped a tad? I will be using a S&W Mod 65.

I know WST is at the top of the fast powder heap so I'm aware of over charging hazards. This is why I'm looking for personal load experience.

Walkalong
September 11, 2009, 03:45 PM
a 3.7 gr load of WST it looked awful small to get proper ignition in a .357 case. It looked sparse for a .38 loadI shoot 4.0 Grs Clays and 3.3 Grs Clays with 125 & 158 Gr plated bullets in .357 cases. It does not take up a lot of space either, just like most light loads in .38 & .357 cases.

Walkalong
September 11, 2009, 03:47 PM
If seating the bullet to .38 OAL and the bullet is below the last groove will this crimp suffice?
Why seat it that deep? Seat it like normal. Re-adjust (back out) the crimp die to crimp at the case mouth of the longer .357 cases, but yes, the crimp will work with a deep seated bullet.

Your O.A.L. for that bullet in .357 cases should end up right at .125 more than in .38 cases.

Mark whiz
September 11, 2009, 04:08 PM
Moe - I really can't say where I got that 5.2gr load from. It's not in any of my load books as I checked them before I posted. I went back into my archive of targets (yes, I have kept my targets from all my load workups as a reference) and found those targets where I tried WST. This load could be upped some since the 6.6gr for jacketed bullets worked pretty well too...........I'd say 5.5gr would be as far as I would push Lead bullets though.

I am too safety-oriented to just make up a load, so I am assuming I found that from a site on the internet................I just ain't found it again - yet.

And none of those loads showed any signs of over-pressure or any other issue.

I really like WST for target loads in .38Spcl and .45ACP.................light recoil and a "sweet" smell when it burns.

moe1942
September 11, 2009, 05:18 PM
Thanks much Mark.

I have so much WST left because I stopped shooting sporting clay..a little more than half in a 8lb can.

I plan to load .45 as well so I can use it in that round also. If you have any tested loads in .45 that would be a leg up too..

Thanks again.

sniper1259
September 11, 2009, 05:26 PM
to MOE14942

actual load data can be found for WST powder at http://data.hodgdon.com

as a mater of fact i just checked for the .38 spcl and it is there, also for the .357

this site has the online data for Winchester and IMR Dupont powders as Hodgdon bought them out and are still manufacturing them.

they include the overall length info as well for almost all loads on the site.

to all; try this site, its a good one

the snipe

sniper1259
September 11, 2009, 05:33 PM
ps to MOE 1942;

better check the site data BEFORE you load. some of the loads from some of the other posters would be considered a "+P+" round. NOT a good idea when the manufacturer suggests a max for the .45 acp with a 155g slug at 5.4g of WST
and a max for the .38 with a 158g slug at 3.7g of WST

but DONT belive me.... CHECK THE ACTUAL DATA at http://data.hodgdon.com
its always better to be sure than to have to decap a bunch of hot loads
the snipe

rg1
September 11, 2009, 05:54 PM
From Winchester's 1999 Reloaders Manual:
38 Spec. +P--158 grain LSWC--WST powder--3.9 grains--800fps--17300psi
38 Spec------158 SWC-WST-3.3 grains-705fps--12800psi
38 Spec------158 SWC-WST-3.7 grains-770fps--15700psi
none of my manuals list WST in .357 Magnum

Mark whiz
September 11, 2009, 11:11 PM
Moe----

While WST didn't make my top 3 list with 230gr bullets in .45ACP, I have done well with 200gr and 185gr bullets with it. Here's my best:

185gr Ranier Plated Flat-nose, 5.3gr WST OAL of 1.245" sub-2" groups
200gr Ranier Plated SWC, 4.7gr WST OAL of 1.258" 1.5" groups
200gr Speer Gold Dot, 4.8gr WST OAL of 1.245" .623" group 527fps

This is with my Springer 1911-A1 G.I. model

moe1942
September 13, 2009, 03:59 PM
Good info. Thanks to all.

PADutchman
September 14, 2009, 11:49 AM
I too had WST left over from my sporting clay days. I use it in 38 special, 9mm Luger, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP. I like it better than Bullseye & Unique, and it costs less at least in my neck of the woods.

moe1942
September 14, 2009, 11:55 AM
PAD do you have any favorite .38 and .45 loads. I have plenty of factory load in jacketed ammo, I want to load some 158 gr SWC for target shooting..

Mark whiz
September 14, 2009, 07:05 PM
Moe, since you asked for .38Spcl loads now too - for 158gr LSWCs I've found that 3.5gr of WST works extremely well out of my 2" and 4" barreled revolvers.

Rugg_Ed
September 14, 2009, 08:14 PM
moe
I have tried WST in the 357 but was not satisfied with it. Try 4.0 to 5.2 grns see what you come up with.
I used a LSWCs cast at 152 grns and sized/lubed to .358, crimped at the cannelure. Had a wide spread in deviation 8.2 with ave vel at 1109.
Was fun playing around but caution be sure no double charges.
WST works fine in the 45ACP, 9MM and other straight wall cases.

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