[Wolfebyte]

Ok guys, more of your knowledge is needed..

I've been through Google, maybe I'm not phrasing the question correctly..

I was given a few sections of lead pipe. This pipe has a couple of brass couplers on it, which I'll cut the pipe and slide them off. The biggest issue seems to be the corrosion and sediment inside the pipe.

Iffen I'm going to smelt this, will this burn out? do I need to use some muriatic acid to clean them first? Other options?

Never messed with any lead this dirty before..

[Das Jaeger]

but I am doubting its gonna be soft enough for anything but modern bullets ?
I could be wrong , it happened once , I think :D

Jaeger

[badpenny]

just melt them down all of the crap including the couplers will float to the top.once you have the crap cleaned off flux it real good,and cast your ingots.

[messerist]

Herr Jaeger is right. Some "pipe lead" has alloying metals in it like tin etc. Some one here should be able to inform you how to test the softness of lead for it's compatibility with Blackpowder firearms. I work for a company that uses lead in roofing and the sheet lead we get is very soft almost 99% pure which makes it great for BP guns. Good Luck Pardner!:)

[JamesKelly]

I believe the "plumbers' lead" I've been using for some time, including ingots rescued by a friend from a job site, contain some amount of antimony.

One way to tell is to watch a reasonably large, say 1/2 pound or more, ingot poured into a hot iron mould, or pot, while it cools. The last stuff to freeze solit is the stuff in the middle, of course. If you see what looks like little square corners pop up, those are the antimony crystals.

A sensible guy would use this lead for his trade gun, where a little extra hardness matters not.

Until I get out my wallet & buy some commercial purity lead, I use the stuff for rifled guns as well. Not a good idea, but it is the lead I have.

Antimony & lead melt together just fine, but when that melt freezes some high antimony crystals get kicked out. Technically those crystals are made of one atom of antimony & four atoms of lead. Fascinating, huh? I do not know how much antimony is in my lead, cable sheathing has about 1% antimony, most commonly found lead (I suppose wheel weights excepted) has less than 6% antimony.

[Wolfebyte]

Thanks!

I know this came from an old house, the pipe is probably 1 1/5 OD, and though it's stout, I can crease it with my thumbnail.. Not deep, but it does mark it.

each section is about 2 foot long and weighs close to 5 lbs as is.

I know it's not as soft as the roofing lead that I've come across before, or the flanges on the old sewer pipes.. but lead it is.

guess when I burn it down, I'll add some tin solder to it and see what I've got.

I'm disposing of my Traditions Inline, SWMBO has given in and allowed me to spend up to 500.00 on a new rifle. I'm thumbing through books and online sources now..

I'm leaning toward the Lyman GPR for 445.00

[Das Jaeger]

find someone with a hardness tester after you melt and ingot .
Am sure somene here knows what it should be , and then compaire .
Cograts on your new Rifle you have yet to pick out . I would go with PEdersoli on sale, much more bang for your buck on sale .
And what is ( stupid question ) SWMBO ?
I am Pollish , most everything obvious gets around me , ok :D

Jeager

[Wolfebyte]

SWMBO ...

She
Who
Must
Be
Obeyed..

You ain't married, so you don't have one yet brother.. I on the other hand have been through 3.. ain't letting this last one go.. got a good un this time.

She shakes her head when she comes into the office and finds me flipping through my "gun porn" ..


So what would you recommend in a rifle?

I want the following:

Right hand
Caplock
.50 caliber (don't want to start with another mould and supplies)
It will be a shooter, not just a wall hanger.

[TomADC]

I think you are going to find that a little hard, Used some years ago, was okay for modern bullets right up there with linotype I must have a few hundren pounds cast into 9mm, .357. .451 & .429 coffee cans full, but don't think I could recast them as round or mini balls for my muzzleloaders.

[arcticap]

So what would you recommend in a rifle?

I want the following:

Right hand
Caplock
.50 caliber (don't want to start with another mould and supplies)
It will be a shooter, not just a wall hanger.


You've probably seen most of the factory production guns already.
The Traditions Mountain Rifle is essentially a twin of the former
Austin & Halleck Mountain Rifle except it has a matte barrel
finish that's similar to being parkerized.
You'd need to check with Traditions but I think that it has a
32 inch barrel and not a 28". Also verify the weight of this model
which is listed as being noticiably less than the Lyman Great
Plains rifle.
The A&H rifles were very well liked before they went out of
business and it appears that Ardesa completed production
and assembled these. It has some really nice features even
if it's a little overpriced.
Most folks would rather buy one of the Lyman rifles but then
they're not for everyone either. :)

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/traditions-percussion-mountain-rifle.aspx?a=457380#

http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/eshop/10Expand.asp?ProductCode=R910060

http://www.traditionsfirearms.com/eshop/products/MOUNTAIN%20RIFLE_L.jpg

[Das Jaeger]

mostly based on looks and what feels good in your hands Wolfebyte .
Hard ot recomend one for ya since I dont know what you like .
I would recomend working on her upping the pot some and getting a better quality rifle though , $500 is very minimal . Tell her I said it would be ok :D
You rright , I am not married , thank GOD ! Never have been and no kids to further diminish my firearms fund , yuk . :banghead:
I like my Pedersoli Tyron , allot . The Jeager is cool too , but have yet to shoot it :banghead: It is on sale still for $695 , normally $995 , good deal too its well made. I liekthe looks of that Moutnain Rifle Articap just posted too , kinda Plains Hawken style , but I highly doubt what you'll get will have that fine peice of wood on it . Just sayin . :D Advertazing man .
You could buy used and get one heck of a good deal that way , so at least consider it . If you could up the pot to $1,000 your world is your oyster on quality guns , and you won't be disappointed either .
That all being said , the Lyman would make a fine rifle too :D

Jaeger

[Wolfebyte]

http://texasguntrader.com/index.php?a=2&b=31746


I'm a looking.. just hate going for one that the company is out of business...

[Das Jaeger]

I would be getting a piciture of that bad boy, and look at all the accessories !
I wouldn;t concern myself with parts too much, you can get whatever you need to keep that gun functioning if anything breaks and I highly doubt it will ever break .

Jaeger

[arcticap]

I agree!
The Traditions parts should fit and there's not usually very much that can go wrong with a percussion rifle.
The A&H barrels have a much nicer finish too!

[mykeal]

And what is ( stupid question ) SWMBO ?
As wolfbyte correctly answered, She Who Must Be Obeyed.

From the British series of novels and the BBC television series about Rumpole of the Bailey by John Mortimer, a thoroughly delightful experience either read in the original or watched on TV. Well worth the time.

[Wolfebyte]

Ok Gentlemen, since I jumped off the pipe and onto the pole..

I've visited with the gentleman that has the Austin & Halleck Hunter. It may be the shorter barrel ... 28" still good?

[Das Jaeger]

Woods gun, the Deer won't care how they die , you aint a sharpshooter anyways are ya , 100yards or less the 28 will do fine well pas that anyways, especially from Halleck barrel .:D

Jaeger

[messerist]

That's a great deal on the rifle. There is nothing on the AH that can't be found at Track of the Wolf or other fine muzzleloading house in case of breakage. And Never forget there is aways THR!!

[Wolfebyte]

Ok.. Gentleman's agreement made.. it should be in my hands tomorrow afternoon..

I'll get a picture of it and start a new thread.. thanks for all your help!

[Das Jaeger]

you made a fine purchase of a VERy high quality gun , good deal !
I have dreamt of owning Halleck for years, now you go an beat me to it :neener:

Jaeger

[Ratdog68]

Zestay !!! New toy ! New Toy !!! Congrats on it !

[arcticap]

That rifle comes with a lot of accessories too.



FS/Trade...Curly maple stock, percussion cap. double set triggers. total of 6 round fired from this hi end muzzleloader. Comes with all accessaries; bullets ,powder, tools, powder flask, quick charge tubes, 2 cans of powder, fancy leather possibles bag.

$350 or trade in DFW area.

[Mk VII]

At the risk of thread hijack, She Who Must Be Obeyed was the praise-name of the central character in H. Rider Haggard's novel She (1886). John Mortimer's Rumpole uses it to refer (mentally) to his wife.

[GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL]

BadPenny is right. (Haven't read all the other posts here. Decided to reaffirm him) (or her)
The 'trash', properly called 'dross' will rise to the top and should leave you with some pretty clean lead after you skim off the dross. Only tried it once many years ago and performed the procedure with tire weights. Didn't use any of it myself (I use inlines) but a friend of mine used all of it. He said it worked just fine. I remember I skimmed off a right smart and the reason I remember so well is that I almost burned myself....

[Wolfebyte]

Ok gents..

today was a slow day, my wife is out of town.. so I decided to cook..

or get the lead out..

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j125/TxLobo/FireArms/IMG_0099.jpg

breaking out the Coleman cook stove and a cheap cast iron pot that I found at a flea market, I started with some .36 caliber balls and some tire weights.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j125/TxLobo/FireArms/IMG_0100.jpg


I melted them down, fished out the metal clips, stirred in a bit of wax to burn the debris and then skimed it down.

Using an old muffin tin I got some good ingots. have not weighed them yet.. but they look good and I can still scratch them with my thumb nail..

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j125/TxLobo/FireArms/IMG_0102.jpg



crazy thing is.. when I dug out the .36 caliber balls, I found a plastic "tin" .. have no idea where this came from.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j125/TxLobo/FireArms/IMG_0105.jpg

It says:

Hopkins & Allen Monsey N Y

in the center it says H&A tm 100 percussion caps made in ITALY

strange.. guess that's where the .36 balls came from . It's full of caps..

[Ratdog68]

'Dem are some nice lookin' ingots you got cooked up thar. Ain't it strange to see bits and bobbles of steel floating in the molten lead ? :D

[Wolfebyte]

aye..

'tis amazing how steel "floats" on lead..


I was confused though, some of the weights evidently were NOT lead.. they didn't melt.. I scooped them out when I realized they were not going to melt at the average melting point. I have no idea what their composition is/was..

[Ratdog68]

Or? M'be they're a lead alloy with a higher melting point than what you were cookin' at ?

[TomADC]

Maybe some of the weights were kirksite? Looks like lead but has a higher melting temp if I remember right.

[Acorn Mush]

Wolfebyte, why are you mixing wheelweight metal in with your softer lead? For ease of loading and better accuracy, soft lead is superior to hard in a muzzleloader.

Just curious.

[wittzo]

I found a bunch of iron (marked Fe) and Zinc (marked Zn?) in a batch of ribbon and clip-on weights I got last year. Next time, I'll pull them out of the bucket with pliers, if they get bitten by the pliers, they're lead, so I don't have to sit down and read them. :)

From what I read, the clip on weights are about 95% lead, so they're good for modern bullets. The ribbon weights are only 98% lead, they're "okay" for balls for revolvers. If you're shooting at paper, a smoothbore won't care, so I cast the clip-on's into balls for my smoothbore and the softer ribbon weights for my revolver.

[Wolfebyte]

Wolfebyte, why are you mixing wheelweight metal in with your softer lead? For ease of loading and better accuracy, soft lead is superior to hard in a muzzleloader.

Just curious.

there was a mixture of parts that I had..

Lead pipe
Wheel Weights (clip on)
Wheel Weights (ribbon)
Old Cast swagged round balls and mini's that didn't pass quality check before..
boxes of old beeman .22 lead pellets


neighbor estimated that my batch is about 95 - 97% using a hardness tester..


I just melted what he gave me.. I've got them out of the buckets and into ingots now.. When I get a ladle or pouring cup, I'll remelt them and probably add some of the pure roofing lead sheets that I have.

[Acorn Mush]

When I get a ladle or pouring cup, I'll remelt them and probably add some of the pure roofing lead sheets that I have.

That's a good idea. The softer you can make the lead, the better.

May I offer an observation? Some wheelweights are made of zinc, which melts at about 787 degrees F and can ruin a batch of lead. Somewhere I think I read that the stick-on weights are most likely zinc. Hope you didn't have any in your mix.

[Wolfebyte]

Acorn, I don't believe so..

I kept my heat pretty level on the stove around 650 by the electronic thermometer that I used to use on the kiln., if the weight didn't start melting within 15 seconds of hitting the molton lead, I pulled it out..