Here she is for you "Non Believers" The Big Brown Toy Truck brought it last night. It is an Uberti 3rd Model Dragoon(civilian, not cut out for a shoulder stock). I am laid up because of minor surgery so the pictures are not great, sorry. I may have a chance to shoot it this weekend if I can put some get up in my get up and go and if SWMBO approves.
http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt204/messerist/sept09138.jpg
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Ratdog68
September 17, 2009, 11:00 AM
Oooooo..... Aaaaaaahhhhhh.... nice lookin' Dragoon ya gots there !! Now, ya know? Post-op therapy includes the smell of burn't powder and the exercise of a squeezed trigger while holding that puppy up on target. You "NEED" it. :D Heal up quickly !
NobleSniper
September 17, 2009, 11:16 AM
Nice one ;) The "Holy Black" has amazing healing properties :D
bigbadgun
September 17, 2009, 11:46 AM
yup now that is one purdy shootin iron.
Heel up fast and take your new toy out to play.
Das Jaeger
September 17, 2009, 11:48 AM
How's that trigger pull , I have the exact same Model , mine is Olympic class scarey light and crisp trigger , did you get lucky too ? :D
Beautiful gun , your CCH is pretty good too , bonus :D
Maybe my whining to them paid off finally ?
Cheers, get well soon .
Jaeger
messerist
September 17, 2009, 01:24 PM
I'm gonna sound like a complete ignoramus Herr Jaeger but I really can't tell how crisp the trigger is. The Dragoon is much lighter than my Pietta 1862 Police so "I" think it is pretty nice. Those of you who are better gunsmiths than I would know better. I really like the Dragoon. There are some minor flaws in the brass that can be spruced up. I don't know if I will re-finish the grip. My last Uberti(a 58 Remmy)had orange grips for Christ's sake! These are much nicer. Sorry for rambling but I am ambulatory until tomorrow and SWMBO has told me to stay put or I can't play on Saturday. She has no idea how much trouble I can get into on the computer.:evil: I've been saving for 6 months to get this puppy and when it showed up she gave me the FFLF(Female Fun Limitation Factor) look, I shopped for it "online" Mwaaahahahahahah!(evil laugh) What can I buy today? Some Treso Nipples maybe?
Das Jaeger
September 17, 2009, 07:00 PM
like a light trigger pull poundage wise and breaks like a glass rod snaps . :D
Definately Treso it up !
Jaeger
missuramoss
September 17, 2009, 08:45 PM
Niiice!!!....man...decissions decissons....one of those...or another Walker..!
mickdk2
September 17, 2009, 09:50 PM
Sweet! Love them Dragoon's. We'll be expecting a range report soon. Get healed up first though.
GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
September 17, 2009, 11:28 PM
What's wrong with the 1st Model? (!!)....
Das Jaeger
September 17, 2009, 11:30 PM
darn thing :D
Everyone should owne all four of the Models , and maybe two of each minimum . . And NO LESS than two Walkers .
Jaeger
GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
September 17, 2009, 11:58 PM
I'vd got one 1st Model (Uberti) Herr Jaeger. Hey, you know? I'vd got two Walkers (Uberti) and I'vd never even loaded one of them. I'vd had it for years. I looked at it today in fact and re-lubricated it and put it back in the nylon case and tucked it away. You may not believe this but I'vd got enough spare parts I'vd bought over the years to build 6 complete Walkers and have plenty of spare parts for them to. What gun I settled on I would alway's ease around and get 2 of them so I would have one for a backup. Then I would make sure I had plenty of spare parts for them, and THEN and only then would I start looking for another gun. I don't have many different types or models of guns but I worried and agonized and read and studied for sometimes weeks on end (actually lost sleep) considering every possibility I might run into between then and someday when I would die before actually settling on one. Yeah, for real Herr Jaeger. I only have one 1st Model because I bought it out of a sense of loyalty because of the Walker, not to ever have to depend on....
Smokin_Gun
September 18, 2009, 12:50 AM
Messerist congrads on the New Puff the Magic Dragoon :O)
She a beauty ... I think you just convinced me not to sell Colt Signature 1st Model Dragoon.
SHIPCHIEF
September 18, 2009, 01:52 AM
When I was a young engineering student living in Maryland, I knew there was no way I could keep a pistola, being from out of state and under 21.
A Second Model Dragoon quickly cured that problem. It was the first of many cap n' ball revolvers.
I've had it since 1974. It is accurate and powerful. I have converted many to the ways of the charcoal with this one.
I also used to give an 1851 Navy to the occasional young male that turned 18 and showed signs of 'growin' up. Sort of a 'rite of passage' thing.
I'm pleased that you picked such a fine specimen, and I hope SWMBO is wise enough to recognize true therapy. :rolleyes:
GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
September 18, 2009, 01:58 AM
Messerist, Oh, I forgot. I'm a dumb ass as usual. Congratulations on the new piece. I hope it serves you well over the years to come sir....
Oyeboten
September 18, 2009, 05:12 AM
Congrats masserist!
Very nice looking 3rd Dragoon there..!
Range Report soon?
messerist
September 18, 2009, 06:21 AM
Thanks to all for the sentiments. Your concern is touching and your enthusiasm for "our" way of life truly rock solid! I consider you all my friends even though we have only met in the ether of the Internet and this ain't the Vicodin talking here cuz it ain't doing a dang thing to help with my owie. You might find this shallow but I bought the 3rd Model because it had the shortest waiting period to receive it. The other two models had longer waiting periods due to the dreaded "Backorder". What are your guy's preferred Models? And why? I wanted a Dragoon and have been saving for a long time and couldn't wait no more! You must now chastise me for being greedy! I learn so much from you all you should charge tuition!!! Sorry, it's early and I'm babbling.
missuramoss
September 18, 2009, 07:46 AM
(I learn so much from you all you should charge tuition!!!
I hear that messerist...I'm learnin li'll tips and tricks on this forum that beats the hell outa surfin the tech pages and such. These guys are really insane....(jokin..you know I am)...but they definatlly know thier weapons, as every owner should. You asked what our prefered models are...I guess for me its a toss up between my WALKER and my .44 Navy. That Dragoon is excellent...take care of it, and take care of yerself!!
madcratebuilder
September 18, 2009, 10:50 AM
Good looking Dragoon messerist, have fun breaking it in.
I think you just convinced me not to sell Colt Signature 1st Model Dragoon.
That's good to hear SG.
mickdk2
September 18, 2009, 08:45 PM
My prefered is the 2nd because I wanted the squared trigger guard and the rectangular notches. I've never had a revolver with a squared trigger guard until now. I like the way it looks. My next Dragoon will likely be a Whitneyville because of the grip. If I had the money I'd buy every damn one of them.
brotherlloyd
September 19, 2009, 12:01 AM
messerist,
nice #3 just picked up a #2 and planing on owning as many bp pistols and rifles as possible. really like the uberti line. Just orderd a 58 cal big bore barrel from tc for my renegade
SHIPCHIEF
September 19, 2009, 02:13 AM
Second model for me, same as above, I like the square back trigger guard. Also I like the improved lever latch.
The Third Model is my next Dragoon, if the right one passes under my nose.
I guess I'll get a Walker some day, but I think all the Dragoons are improved.
I like the square back trigger guard so much I look for it on the later models, you know, Navy's etc. there are so many variants.
Don't worry too much about how you decided to select your Dragoon. You have it and that's what matters. To those without: :neener:
I hope you are better soon.
Oyeboten
September 19, 2009, 05:38 AM
Hi messerist,
What make of Dragoon is this?
Das Jaeger
September 19, 2009, 08:00 AM
Look at the original post he made , it's right there for ya :D
Jaeger
madcratebuilder
September 19, 2009, 09:05 AM
Look at the original post he made , it's right there for ya
No, not until post #6 does messerist imply that his new Dragoon is made by Uberti.:rolleyes:
Das Jaeger
September 19, 2009, 12:30 PM
SINCE IT WAS THE ONLY REPRO IN THE 3RD MODEL EVER MADE FIGURED THAT WAS A NO BRAINER . :D
Jaeger
And don't try to tell me COLT BLACK POWDERS was a repro . :banghead:
Ratdog68
September 19, 2009, 01:07 PM
No, not until post #6 does messerist imply that his new Dragoon is made by Uberti.:rolleyes:
However... he did ID it as a 3rd model Dragoon first in this post on the 16th. :D
you Cremudgeon :neener: :D
Some poeple just got to be right no matter what , me on the other hand could realy give a Ratdodgs butt , and at least admit when I am wrong , or think I am wrong , which is seldome :D . But I am wrong at times nonetheless . You win today MCB , yeeehaaa , your King for the day , whooo hoo hoo , browny buttons all around .
Jeager
madcratebuilder
September 19, 2009, 02:07 PM
The question was.
What make of Dragoon is this?
Not what model.:)
SINCE IT WAS THE ONLY REPRO IN THE 3RD MODEL EVER MADE FIGURED THAT WAS A NO BRAINER .
Stop yelling.
Armi San Marco and Uberti both make/made the 3rd model Dragoon. That's not counting the eleven or so versions of the 2nd gen Colt and three versions of the 3rd gen Colt,
This is a unusal ASM.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d37/madcratebuilder/asmdragoon02.jpg
Ratdog68
September 19, 2009, 02:41 PM
Yum !!! That's a sweet lookin' one !!! Izzat yers? Kinda has that LRE aroma about it, don't it? :D
Smokin_Gun
September 19, 2009, 03:43 PM
Now that's a Big Colt to my Likin'... ASM made real good Dragoons and Walkers. I have worked on a couple and would buy one in a minute ifin I had the Gold pieces for one...I want that one MCB... :O)
messerist
September 19, 2009, 04:27 PM
Niiiiiiiice. Ditto on the LRE. Took the Dragoon to the range today. Thank God I could shoot sitting down. Leg is still tender. Of course like usual I forgot half the stuff I was gonna need to shoot with including my son's .22LR. I told him to grab his rifle in the hard-side case, which the little guy diligently did. Totally forgetting that I had switched guns in the cases and my SXS coach gun was in his .22LR case. Ok, Dad is a dummy. I think he had more fun shooting the "Dragon" as he calls it, than his .22. Besides he was able to shoot his cousin's 10/22. I also forgot the camera but did have my cell phone so there is a picture of the target. First two cylinders out of the box. Lower group is at 25 yds 40gr. FFFg with a .454 ball. Upper group was with same charge and a .457 ball. Aimpoint was center of mass. Gun shot great! Very crisp trigger and after 10 cylinders fouling was very manageable. I was able to knock down steel pig silhouettes at ranges from 20 to 75 yds! Since my Brother and I brought our kids we had all sorts of target help! Here is a pic of the target. I plan to get out again when I can move better. Thanks for looking and thanks for keeping me company the past couple of days.:)
http://i612.photobucket.com/albums/tt204/messerist/01253386089860000000503102_0-1.jpg
madcratebuilder
September 19, 2009, 04:38 PM
That's a sweet lookin' one !!! Izzat yers?
Hopefully it well be in about an hour.
messerist, That looks like a good day at the range, good shooting.
mickdk2
September 19, 2009, 04:40 PM
Good shooting messerist! No problems getting tight groups with that one.
Das Jaeger
September 19, 2009, 06:09 PM
ASM only made a second model , they just did what everyone else did to the
2nd model , put a third model trigger guard on a second model frame and cylinder . Very few specimens of 3rd Model have the real last edition of the
3rd model Loading lever catch either . You'll notice VTi and Numnutts gunparrts list the ASM parts list for 2nd model only .
This is a true 3rd Mdoel Repro , Uberti . Not a second model with round trigger guard , and wrong catch .
gun there Messerist , and shooter of course . Wait till you dial that bad boy in , ought to be outstanding . Am guessing your greatfull to have a good trigger pull huh :D
Jaeger , The Dragoon , what a Horse Pistol it is . :D
mickdk2
September 19, 2009, 06:22 PM
Look's like a 51 Navy on steroids eh Jaeger?
madcratebuilder
September 19, 2009, 08:43 PM
ASM only made a second model , they just did what everyone else did to the
2nd model , put a third model trigger guard on a second model frame and cylinder . Very few specimens of 3rd Model have the real last edition of the
3rd model Loading lever catch either
Check your black powder Blue Book. ASM, 3rd Model Dragoon. Three versions, #1 Western model has a silver plated back strap, Military model has a steel back strap and Texas model has a brass back strap, discontinued in 2000.
I just acquired a ASM 3rd Model Colt Dragoon military model. That's a mouth full.
The 3rd model has the round trigger guard and a longer trigger vs. 2nd model, everything else is the same. I know of no documentation on a new and improved loading lever latch on the 3rd model.:confused::confused: As far as I can see 1st, 2nd and 3rd had the same style latch release.
These did not have the name 1st model, 2nd model etc when Colt made them. The model numbers is something modern collectors has put on them. What we regard as model changes were just improvements as production went along.
This is a true 3rd Mdoel Repro , Uberti . Not a second model with round trigger guard , and wrong catch .
Same latch as a 1st or 2nd model. You sure that photo is not a 3rd gen Colt Dragoon, it's not a Uberti.
MCB Good luck on your acquisition quest. I really lucked out on this revolver. I wonder if Uberti has changed their nipple supplier because these take #11s like the Treso Nipples I have on my Walker. The nipples I replaced on the Walker were terrible some 2 took #11s and 4 took #10s! I switched to Treso nipples on the Walker because of advice received here and they work great. I don;t need to replace those on the Dragoon they are just fine.
Das Jaeger
September 19, 2009, 10:24 PM
Uberti Replicas.com , you decide .
Also, notice it has the modern front catch , not the drop catch of the 1st and 2nd models .
Jaeger
See , you don't know everything , even you can learn sometin .
messerist
September 19, 2009, 11:40 PM
Herr Jaeger, My Dragoon has a different loading rod catch than the Dragoon in the photo you posted. Have you any idea why?
Das Jaeger
September 19, 2009, 11:48 PM
it is the prior design like MCB stated in the evolution of the Dragoons designs , the first and second model designs . The one in my photo from UbertiReplicas.com is the very last design , and the best , the last 3rd Model .
I was just razzin the Ole boy anywayz :D , But its obvious he don't know everything , he sure missed that one . :neener:
Jeager one , MCB 1,000 , you still King my man :D Hee hee hee
Cheerios , Das Jaeger
madcratebuilder
September 19, 2009, 11:51 PM
MCB Good luck on your acquisition quest. I really lucked out on this revolver. I wonder if Uberti has changed their nipple supplier because these take #11s like the Treso Nipples I have on my Walker. The nipples I replaced on the Walker were terrible some 2 took #11s and 4 took #10s! I switched to Treso nipples on the Walker because of advice received here and they work great. I don;t need to replace those on the Dragoon they are just fine.
Well I have it on the way, hurry up brown truck!
Nipples seem to be the biggest pita for everyone that shoots c&b. Treso/Ampco are the best, but I can't afford to convert all my revolvers. I do need to buy two new sets for two Remingtons. I have had some sets that #10 is to tight and did not seat and #11 is loose. I would chuck them up and use a file to reshape so a #10 would slide all the way on. My 2nd and 3rd gen Colts are good about nipple fit, the Walkers and Dragoons use #11 and the 51,60,61 and .36 pocket guns use #10's. Pietta's seem to be the most inconstant in size.
Pic came off
Uberti Replicas.com , you decide .
When did Uberti start putting "Colts Patent" on the left side of the frame, not, look at the photo. From the color of the bluing and the stamped name I would say 3rd gen Colt.
Go look at some 1st and 2nd model Dragoons, all have the same latch, replicas or originals. Maybe your thinking about the Walker latch, I guess you could call it a drop catch, single spring that catches the lever just in front of the pivot point. The 'latch' was one of the big improvements on the Dragoons, from the Whitneyville on. Or are you talking about the holster frame style of latch on some newer repro's? Look at the originals all had the same latch.
Be observant grasshopper and you well learn.:cool:
Das Jaeger
September 19, 2009, 11:57 PM
and Grasshopper can teach you too MCB . :D
Go to the Website , then if you still think I am wrong , then all I can say is Bite me and your hard headed . :neener::D
YOUR WRONG , and I am RIGHT , sorry your having a hard time accepting your not perfect . On the other hand I know your not perfect and your worng on this one , I can accept it just fine . :D
Sometimes you just can't teach someone that is so BOOK smart they can't accept reality of Street Smart . Still love ya man , and congrats on your new Rifle/revolver :D
Das Jaeger
madcratebuilder
September 20, 2009, 12:24 AM
The horizontal "Navy-type" loading lever latches (most Dragoons have a vertical latch) is this what got you in a uproar? Sure, some original 3rd models had them. 2nd and 3rd gens do not, Uberti can go either way depending on when made. Can't tell you about the ASM, don't have it my hands yet. I here I thought you were screaming about the Walker style latch or something. I concede they are different, YOU WIN!:neener:
Oyeboten
September 20, 2009, 01:21 AM
Should I be embarassed if my supposedly "3rd" Dragoon has a 'wrong' Latch?
I hate faux-pas, especially when I do not know I or my Revolver have made one...
'San Marcos'...older...hardly used...but said to be a good reliable Shooter...and...waiting-for-the-Brown-Truck-myself...
messerist
September 20, 2009, 02:39 AM
From your picture Oyeboten and mine our latches look different from the one in the photo Herr Jaeger posted...just curious as to why? before I received my Dragoon this week I had never handled much less seen one so I am truly ignorant as to the changes in the three models Colt made. Not to mention the variations in the replicas
Oyeboten
September 20, 2009, 03:02 AM
Hi messerist, Das Jaeger, madcratebuilder, and anyone else interested,
Well...'School' is in session!
From the image...my 'San Marcos' made example appears to have a Latch which is of a 'Vertical' way, verses, a 'Horizontal' way of the one shown in Das Jaeger's "Uberti" example in his image-posting.
This 'latch' issue is entirely new to me.
Now...what is up with this then?
Did "3rd Dragoons" have more than one Latch type in their day?
Or, does this represent liberties taken by modern makers?
"Colt" made 3rd Dragoon, 2nd Generation, having a 'Vertical' looking Latch ( about as my 'San Marcos' one does) -
My middle 70's vintage ASM 2nd model Dragoon has the horizontal latch.
It's a tight old cannon, with a good trigger too.
But when I touch her off with 'full house' loads, she sometimes unlatches the lever! :scrutiny: Maybe it needs a new spring? Where do I get one?
madcratebuilder
September 20, 2009, 07:49 AM
Did "3rd Dragoons" have more than one Latch type in their day?
Yes. Thumb latch or Navy latch.
I did find a few photos online of originals that had the Navy latch, but most have the thumb latch. As far as replicas most use the thumb latch. Either would be correct because the original 3rd models had both. Here is one description I found that mentions the Navy latch.
There were more variations of this model than earlier types. Features incorporated on some Third Model Dragoons include frame cuts for detachable shoulder stocks, horizontal "Navy-type" loading lever latches (most Dragoons have a vertical latch), and folding leaf sights. The key external identifying feature of the Third Model is the round trigger guard, instead of the square-back trigger guard of earlier types.
Das Jaeger, I have to apologize, your description of "new and improved latch" threw me and I was thinking you were saying something else. Some 3rd model Dragoons have a "new and improved" (Navy) latch, most have the thumb latch.
Das Jaeger
September 20, 2009, 10:13 AM
I had a Colt Black Powder 3rd Model Civillain about halfway through there production . Previously I had bought another 3rd Model Civillian at the beggining of thier production right when they came out , still have that one , serial number 085 :D . that's this one :
Odd part about this is the second one I bought I traded to my buddy that just had to have one , after shooting mine , and he sure as heck wasn't getting my 085 seriel number . So I traded him the second one I bought for his Grandads Boxlock shotgun ( kicking myself now , traded that too for other guns :banghead: ) , but the second Colt Black Powder had the Navy lever latch , but really high seriel numbers ? Now I am uncertain , but at some point I think Uberti started selling Colt Black Powder more parts than were on the first productions comming out of New York ? So I know they did make two styles for sure , the early verticle latch and the Navy Horizontle latch on Colt Balck Powder versions . I have also seen Uberti have the Navy latch too at a gun show years ago , but I don't owne one of them , wish I did , then I could have proved my case easier . My 3rd Model Civillian Uberti has the older style second and first model latch , and as admitted now and then by me , early examples of the 3rd model too :D .
I personally like the Navy style much better , sleaker , stronger design too . Although I will say my Colt Signature Series 3rd Model Civillain Dragoon has never dropped its lever ? And you darn well know the history of this gun MCB and that Pops fed it a steady diet of 60 grains of 2FF for years , and only 60 grains . So I think if some peoples latches are falling down , they may want to hone the slot sharper or latch sharper , should solve the problem . I never had a problem with the Navy style latch though on the second one I bought and neither has my buddy . I really do think it is a better design .
Both work fine though . I sure wish Colt Black Powder was still in bussiness , with different Owners ! :D ....ME !
Regardless , I am just glad Uberti is makin um now , they do a very nice job on them . But, they are not a good gun for little people with little hands and weak muscles , you got to pretty manly or womanly to handle one :D Same with the Walker, thier both beasts of a revolver , but what fun !
Damn, those look nice, you must buy powder in five pound kegs.
Das Jaeger
September 20, 2009, 12:31 PM
50 grains times six , each time you set off a session in each , it eats the stuff by the pound is right :D at 300 grain increments :D
Like a Dodge Charger, somethings are more important than gasoline , Black Powder fire and smoke is more important than money too for happiness .
jaeger
arcticap
September 20, 2009, 05:11 PM
My middle 70's vintage ASM 2nd model Dragoon has the horizontal latch.
It's a tight old cannon, with a good trigger too.
But when I touch her off with 'full house' loads, she sometimes unlatches the lever! Maybe it needs a new spring? Where do I get one?
You might try Deer Creek for ASM parts at 865-525-6181.
Here's a thread discussing latch fixes but doesn't reveal whether the stronger humbucker guitar pickup spring fix will work with the horizontal latch or not.
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