Wolf LP primers hard to seat


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floydster
September 21, 2009, 01:12 PM
Started using Wolf Large Pistol primers loading for 45 ACP, man thses things are difficult to seat and really screws up the rythem of the LNL press hanging up the shell plate if the primer is not fully seated. You really have to ram that primer home, I don't like it.:(
I don't have problems with the Wolf small pistol, just the large.
Anyone else? Thanks.
Smokeyloads

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Otto
September 21, 2009, 01:43 PM
Does the subplate wobble on ram?
Are the primers seating flush or 5 thousandths below?
Have you tried a hand priming tool?

floydster
September 21, 2009, 02:06 PM
Otto,
The subplate is tight, the Wolf primers are larger in dia. then Rem, CCI or
Win, about +.001.
Heck, if I used my Lee hand primer it would break the handle big time!
It just takes a lot of pressure to seat them, hench it will be my last Wolf LP primers I will buy. I'm priming cases that have been loaded at least 10 times prior to this experience.
Smokeyloads

Randy1911
September 21, 2009, 02:40 PM
I tried loading Wolf LP primers on my LnL and had the exact same problem with the LP. Like you, no problems with the SP. I gave up and sold them and went back to Winchester. I sure did like the price though.

floydster
September 21, 2009, 04:14 PM
Hi Randy,
Ya, I wish I would have known about this before I ordered. I did research on Wolf primers before I ordered but nothing like this came up.
Now I have 4,000 of these dang things to deal with, live and learn.:mad:

Walkalong
September 21, 2009, 04:17 PM
RCBS priming tool (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=329291). You never go back to priming on the press. ;)

Uncle Chan
September 21, 2009, 04:29 PM
Walkalong, I'll see your RCBS priming tool and raise you a RCBS Automatic Bench Priming Tool : http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=457599.

I have this one and I won't use anything else. Great device. Fast. Slick. :)

Walkalong
September 21, 2009, 04:33 PM
Well, you win, I can't beat that. :D

floydster
September 21, 2009, 04:39 PM
Walkalong,
I can't imagine a hand priming tool having enough leverage to seat these friken primers. I have to grab the back of the LNL to get enough force to seat,then sometimes they don't bottom out and hang up the shell plate.
I suppose I could drive them in with a hammer:D
I guess I'll have to prime them on my Classic Cast single stage.

Walkalong
September 21, 2009, 04:45 PM
They may not be lined up just perfect, and it has to be perfect. Hand priming and skipping that step on the LNL sure does make things go more smoothly. That tool has a lot of leverage. I wish I had a few extra Wolf LP primers handy to try, but all I have is a box of 5K that I don't want to break into. It's part of my "rainy day" stash.

fprefect
September 21, 2009, 04:52 PM
Primers from different manufacturers will sometimes vary slightly in diameter just as different brands of brass will sometimes vary in their primer pocket diameter. I don't know what tool you are using to prime, but if it doesn't take more than approx. twice the force used to seat your regular primers, it shouldn't be a problem.

In fact, it's the loose fitting primers that would be of more concern to me.

F. Prefect

floydster
September 21, 2009, 07:20 PM
It's just the Wolf primers I am having problems with.
CCI, Rem, Win all work great no matter what priming method I use, wether it be on my LNL, Classic turret, Classic cast or hand priming.
So it's the primers.

Uncle Chan
September 21, 2009, 07:25 PM
My Wolf SR Magnums seat tough too, but they do seat. I'm very happy with Wolf.

Iron Sight
September 22, 2009, 01:10 AM
An interesting poll would be how many of the progressive reloader people prime with separate units outside there progressive machines.

I do.

Historian
September 22, 2009, 01:14 PM
Just finished seating 300 Wolf SP primers in S&W .40 cases. I read up on them and the only rap I could find is that they a little oversized. I used an RCBS Universal hand priming tool and had no difficulty at all. True, on a few I had to squeeze harder than usual but they all seated to correct depth. Now, will the go off?

Historian

mgkdrgn
September 22, 2009, 05:29 PM
Well, I have a block of 5K of these suckers I'll shortly be into, and nothing to use but a Lee hand priming tool. But, in 4 months they were the ONLY LP's I was able to find for sale. I still can't find any SP's.

floydster
September 22, 2009, 05:49 PM
mgkdrgn,
Let us know how you make out using the Lee hand primer.
I am anxious to find out, I didn't try mine yet on the PL Wolf's.
All my 45 ACP brass is primed so I guess I will have to wait till I do some
shooting again this week.
Smokeyloads

mgkdrgn
September 23, 2009, 11:16 AM
I did 10 45 Colts last night with the Lee hand loader and the Wolf primers, and they are harder to seat. My hand strength isn't what is use to be, but I was able to get them seated. Probably wear gloves to make it a little easier on my hands.

I'll use them until I can find something else ...then hold them in "ready reserve" I guess.

putteral
September 23, 2009, 04:10 PM
I have only been buying Wolf large pistol primers for the last couple of years(mainly because of price) and I use the Lee hand primer tool. They are a little tighter than their small pistol primers but not to the point that I cannot seat them. Never broke a handle yet. Although I do have a few spares just in case.

Uncle Chan
September 23, 2009, 11:52 PM
An interesting poll would be how many of the progressive reloader people prime with separate units outside there progressive machines.

I do.
I do.

Deavis
September 24, 2009, 07:27 PM
They suck, just like CCI primers do in LP. Hard to push home but manageable. Good thing is that they go bang everytime and they are hard as hell to seat too depp.

evan price
September 25, 2009, 12:44 AM
I think I mentioned this issue first about a year ago... They are a smidge larger but that's better especially on well-used brass. I have no problem on my Pro-1000 with Wolf primers. You just have to push a little harder.

metalax
March 12, 2010, 07:17 PM
(Yes. I know this is a old thread but as best I can see no true solution has been found.)

I give up on Wolf LP primers as of today. I did not so much have a force required to install problem as much as a cycle problem. My major complaint was the (392218 PRIMER SLIDE LARGE) hangs in the fully extended position causing all kinds of problems. I spent my whole loading time last night trying to find a solution to this situation with the Wolf problematic primers. I went so far as to lap-in the slide and adjacent components on the L-n -L. It seams to me being forced to hand or single stage load primers in the de-primed case is an unexceptionable solution. When you get in a rhythm and finished product is adding up fast the last thing I want to be forced to do is remove an crucial integrated procedure in the process. Then go in reverse to an antiquated procedure. I have hand primer tools but the fix I will use is not to buy Wolf products. IMHO way buy a new loading system only to go back to the way you did it before.
maxx

helg
March 12, 2010, 07:23 PM
OK, to continue the old thread.

I had no problems seating Wolf SP primers in my Loadmaster.

bds
March 12, 2010, 07:31 PM
FWIW, I deprime/resize separately and I hand prime Wolf LP using Lee Auto Prime with just a bit more pressure (2 thumbs instead of 1) than Winchester.

Since then, I have never had to contend with primer issues and I now waste "zero" primers due to upside down, sideways crushed, crescent mooned, etc.

No more wasted time and final 2 stations on progressive (flare case/powder charge and bullet seat/taper crimp) really makes it easy to reload (2-3 fingers pressure is all it's needed).

YMMV

Hey_Allen
March 12, 2010, 08:21 PM
I was working on a faulty ignition problem (which eventually turned out to be a headspace issue) and tried a number of primers, both in my LnL AP and a Lee hand priming tool.

The Wolf SP primers were stiffer to seat, but would seat none the less.

JimKirk
March 12, 2010, 08:22 PM
Anybody know if Wolf small rifle primers are larger than other SRP, anybody taken measurements lately?

Jimmy K

helg
March 12, 2010, 08:32 PM
Wolf SP and LP have been found to be the same size as other brands. See here (http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=510268).

Wolf primer manufacturer claims that their SR primers have the same diameter as the SP.

http://www.flame.murom.ru/en/Htmls/primers.htm

Marlin 45 carbine
March 12, 2010, 08:44 PM
all I can add is that I use the Lee hand prime and the Wolf (sp and lp) primers I've loaded do seem a little snug compared to CCI and Win. Fed's seem snug compared to those also. I'd rather that than loose.
all shooting of them has been fine.

cmgred
March 12, 2010, 10:12 PM
I've just bought 4000 and a least the first 600 have seated fine, about the same as Winchester on Dillon 550.

I's seen posts on another forum (may have been Brian Enos, but I could be wrong), folks we're having issues with Wolf spp. One of them contacted Wolf and after checking out the lot #, Wolf made good on them.

Anyways, it may be worth a phone call, poster said their customer service was great.

Good luck, I had a bad batch of another manufactures primers and they refused to stand behind their product, even when they admitted the primers were out of spec. I don't buy any primers with 3 letter names after that.

broham
March 12, 2010, 10:22 PM
I haven't had a problem yet on my Lee turret. They are cheap, go bang every time and in stock 99.9% of the time.

Exposure
March 12, 2010, 10:29 PM
I just came up from my loading bench and did 300 45 ACP with Wolf LP and had no seating trouble at all.

I have been VERY happy with Wolf primers. I think they are great.

ole farmerbuck
March 12, 2010, 10:47 PM
Anybody know if Wolf small rifle primers are larger than other SRP, anybody taken measurements lately?

Jimmy K
Oh yea, i was suppose to do that! Umm.......well.....i forgot.

Randy1911
March 13, 2010, 12:43 AM
I have no more use for Wolf LP primers. My shoulders hurt after loading just 100 of them. I had no problems with the SP primers. I will never buy another LP though. I have noticed that my dealer no longer sells the large primers. He does still sell the small primers. He said he had too many complaints about the large.

Rmeju
March 13, 2010, 01:40 AM
I had a problem with my LP primers in Wolf, with the exact same issue on my Hornady LnL. BUT, I was able to get on the phone with the guys at Hornady, and they showed me how to dial in my shellplate to dead center. My problems have largely gone away now. I still get the odd one that doesn't quite seat all the way, but none so bad that they hang the press up.

If anyone wants to know, what they told me to do, PM me.

RmeJu

JimKirk
March 13, 2010, 02:01 AM
Reason I asked about the Wolf SR is I got a bucket full of .223 FC that the pockets are loose in, not real bad loose, but bad enough that I don't load any like that any more. If the Wolf SR was larger, they would have given me a few more loads out of those cases. I think I'll just carry them to the scrap yard. I don't want blown primers in my AR.
Thank for the info guys, Wolf are not to be found around here, but I have found other brands lately.

Jimmy K

dagger dog
March 13, 2010, 07:22 AM
I too found the LP Wolf hard to seat loading .45 Colt nickel plated Remington brass, using the Lee hand (thumb) primer tool, but this eased up the second time around. I thought it was the plating causing the "problem".

ole farmerbuck
March 14, 2010, 11:30 PM
Here is my primer measurements. Did the best i could.

CCI BR4 .174.5
Wolf SRM .174.5
CCI SR .174
Fed LR Match .210.5
Win LP .210.5
CCIBR2 LR .211
win LR .210
Win LRM .210
CCI#41 .174
Wolf SR .174.5
CCI SP .174
Wolf SP .174
CCI SPM .174
Fed SPM .174
Wolf LR .210
Wolf LP I think the only primer i dont have!
Wolf SR .223....back to wolf manufacturing!

bds
March 15, 2010, 12:22 AM
Wolf LP I think the only primer i don't have!

Wolf LP 0.215" - I got 0.210" for Winchester LP

PMC SP - 0.175" - I also got 0.175" for Winchester SP

ole farmerbuck
March 15, 2010, 12:29 AM
Thanks bds. I have some rem and mag tech over at the neighbors but i was too lazy to walk 100 yards.

bds
March 15, 2010, 12:36 AM
ole farmerbuck, saved you a walk for Magtech SP: 0.175"

You know, for some reason Magtech primer just "feels" smaller than Winchester SP.


Wait a minute ... OMG!!!

I just took a close look at the different primers I have and guess what?

The Wolf/PMC primers have sharp cup edges and Winchester/Magtech primers have rounded cup edges.

Maybe this might also explain why many people have trouble seating Wolf primers?

ole farmerbuck
March 15, 2010, 12:46 AM
Yep. You just might have a point there.

ole farmerbuck
March 15, 2010, 12:48 AM
I did notice when i picked them up with my calipers, some didnt seem flat on the sides. If you know what i mean. it was prob that sharp edge you're talking about.

JimKirk
March 15, 2010, 12:52 AM
Thanks for measuring !!

Looks like there is basically no difference. I'm using CCI BR SR now, all they had at the LGS. I had enough LP, LPM, SP, SPM, LR and LRM bought before the great salesman came to power, but I had zero SR and have looked far and wide before I finally broke down and bought the BR SR.
Looks as if the supply is slowly coming back, gotta get some soon.

Jimmy K

helg
March 15, 2010, 01:13 AM
The picture shows, left to right: Wolf SP, Rem 1 1/2, Win SP and CCI 550(magnum) primers.

1. I do see that the Wolf has thicker cup than Rem and Win. The cup is still thinner than CCI magnum.

2. I do not see that edges on the Wolf are any sharper than on others. Close look reveals even opposite: surface on the Wolfs is even smoother than on the others.

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc272/helgp/primers-wolf-rem-win-cci.jpg

bds
March 15, 2010, 01:17 AM
I do not see that edges on the Wolf are any sharper than on others. Close look reveals even opposite: surface on the Wolfs is even smoother than on the others.

FYI, my comparisons were made on Wolf LP/PMC SP (sharp edge) vs Winchester (brass cup) SP/LP and Magtech SP (rounded edge).

helg
March 15, 2010, 01:58 AM
Wolf LP 0.215" - I got 0.210" for Winchester LPSum ting wong.
You can not seat the primer that is oversized by .005". Is it .2105" instead of .215"?

bds
March 15, 2010, 02:02 AM
Is it .2105" instead of .215"?

My mistake. It's 0.2105" - Still larger than Winchester 0.2100"

ArchAngelCD
March 15, 2010, 03:40 AM
FWIW, I have both the LEE and RCBS hand primers and the RCBS is a much heavier tool. It will easily seat a tight primer if you need to. I guess that's why the RCBS is twice the price of the Lee product. (but both have their place and I use both)

bds
March 15, 2010, 11:10 AM
FWIW, I have both the LEE and RCBS hand primers and the RCBS is a much heavier tool. It will easily seat a tight primer if you need to. I guess that's why the RCBS is twice the price of the Lee product. (but both have their place and I use both)

Come on now, the OP was why Wolf LP primer was hard to seat, not comparing the Lee vs RCBS. The Wolf LP is harder to seat because it is slightly oversized (0.2105" vs 0.21"). I have no problem seating the larger Wolf LP in my Lee hand primer, just takes more pressure (2 thumbs instead of 1). The need for extra pressure is not because it is Lee. :D

Besides, I don't see RCBS hand primer for $26 ... $36 and $49 at MidwayUSA - http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/BrowseProducts.aspx?pageNum=1&tabId=1&categoryId=19941&categoryString=9315***731***706***&

FWIW, I deprime/resize separately and I hand prime Wolf LP using Lee Auto Prime with just a bit more pressure (2 thumbs instead of 1) than Winchester.

ArchAngelCD
March 16, 2010, 06:32 AM
I was reporting on the 2 hand primers because the OP said he thought he would break his Lee primer trying to seat Wolf LP primers. I was letting him know if he had an RCBS it would seat the Wolf LP primers without breaking and the RCBS hand primer also offers more leverage than the Lee does.. (not that I personally think the Lee hand primer would break)

emb
March 16, 2010, 09:09 AM
I bought Wolf primers simply becasue I could find no others. I use a Dillon 550. I had no issues with SP. I loaded a couple hundred .45 with LPs. No perceived problem with seating the primers. I went to range and every 3rd or 4th round misfired. They fired on the second hit. I was shooting a Glock 36. Some of the primers were too high. I seated them fully with a RCBS hand primer. No further issues.

I have no issues with Wolf and they are not really difficult to use in the Dillon. I will just be more aware that I have to "seat" these primers, and I will be more diligent in inspecting the final product. If I had been more observant in inspecting the final rounds, I would have noticed the high primers and seated them properly.

bds
March 16, 2010, 10:52 AM
ArchAngelCD, the OP was having problem with LNL progressive press priming the cases. He had not tried hand priming because he thought he would break the handle.


Heck, if I used my Lee hand primer it would break the handle big time!

I can't imagine a hand priming tool having enough leverage to seat these friken primers. I have to grab the back of the LNL to get enough force to seat,then sometimes they don't bottom out and hang up the shell plate.

CCI, Rem, Win all work great no matter what priming method I use, wether it be on my LNL, Classic turret, Classic cast or hand priming.

Let us know how you make out using the Lee hand primer.
I am anxious to find out, I didn't try mine yet on the LP Wolf's.

This is the problem with product comparisons posted on various threads. I would agree that RCBS hand priming tool is better built, but would disagree that Lee hand priming is inadequate in doing the priming job. Even though OP has a Lee hand priming tool, it was not used, perhaps because of preconceived notion that the handle would break (now, where did that notion come from?). This is THR - I think all products deserve fair representation (Ruger P95, S&W Sigma, Keltecs vs Glocks, HKs, etc.). Not every gun/reloading solutions involve simply buying a higher priced item.

Glad other members commented on the successful use of the Lee hand primer. If OP tried using the hand priming tool, could post his results back here.

BTW ArchAngelCD, I do like/enjoy your posts.

floydster
March 16, 2010, 03:11 PM
Wow, this thread is still going???
I am the OP.
I am still using the Wolf LP primers, I bought 5,000 at the time.
I quit priming on my LNL EZ ject, just too much of a hassle, not only with the Wolf primers but other brands as well.
I now use my Lee hand primer or my Lee cast turret for priming the Wolf LP and it is going fine, and I think priming on the LNL is just a Royal pain in the U now what, trying to do a run of 100 rounds without a hangup of some kind is
impossible in my opinion. I have tryed all the fix's from Hornady in the last four month's to no avail, I have a private line to Hornady:eek:

At any rate I am happy with the way I am doing it now, much more relaxing then trying to run a full progressive press.

Take care,
Floyd a.k.a. Smokeyloads

ArchAngelCD
March 18, 2010, 04:06 AM
I'm glad you are able to use the Wolf primers you bought, that's good news. Maybe things will loosen up a bit and you will be able to buy the primers you like sometime soon... Thanks for the update.

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