I am new to the forum but not new to firearms... I wanted to pose a HD shotgun question to the experts here. Even if you do not consider yourself an expert your advice is greatly appreciated.
Does anyone here keep a round chambered in their HD pump shotgun, and if not, why? Do you consider it safe? Unsafe? How do you store your HD shotgun if you keep it chambered? How do you store it, period?
I'm trying to devise a plan to keep my home safe, and wanted to know what others do. :o
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docnyt
September 22, 2009, 11:22 PM
I'm a newbie here too but I'm sure this question has been beaten to death and resurrected several times in many guises before...
Milkmaster
September 22, 2009, 11:32 PM
Yep sure has! The search feature is your friend.
For me...I have kids in the house although they are now teens. I choose to have a full magazine and fill the chamber when I determine it is time. That is MY choice and not necessarily the right or popular choice.
Others have it where one click of the safety is all that needs to be done before pulling the trigger.
Find what is comfortable for you and practice practice practice!
ARdefense
September 22, 2009, 11:35 PM
Im no expert but I never keep mine chambered. I do keep the saftey off though.
jojo200517
September 22, 2009, 11:42 PM
I don't consider myself an expert either. I do however have a 3 inch mag 15 pellet buckshot load in the chamber and a tube full of ammo, safety on. Anything mechanical can fail, even a pump shotgun. If I absolutely have to shoot something I would like to have as few things to have to take place between me making the decision to do it and the kaboom. Less chances of hearing the loudest sound ever heard in gun fight "click".
I wouldn't recommend it around kiddies tho unless they are completely taught on gun safety.
inthelineofire
September 22, 2009, 11:52 PM
Sorry if I am beating a dead horse. I searched for a bit but didn't find what I was looking for. Anyway, is there anything unsafe about keeping a round chambered if I am the only one with access to the gun?
Jeff82
September 22, 2009, 11:53 PM
Keep in mind that (generally) long gun safeties are not like handgun safeties. They are much easier to get to shoot by jarring the gun. Crossbolt safeties are especially troublesome while they do block rearward trigger motion, they don't lock the sear-hammer engagement. Which means a shock or a hard enough jar on the longgun will allow the sear to let go of the hammer. So AD's are much easier to achieve with a long gun than with a short one. Plan accordingly!
No one in our house but me and my wife. Rarely have visitors, and when we do it is more often than not my adult son and his girlfriend (both of whom I have personally trained in pistol and shotgun). Shotgun by the headboard has a full magazine and one in the chamber. Glock 29 on the night stand has 12 in the magazine and one in the chamber.
I am comfortable with it. You may not be.
Glamdring
September 23, 2009, 02:06 AM
NO!!!!
Shotguns are NOT drop safe!
If you prop gun against wall with round chambered and it falls or gets knocked over it can discharge. BAD.
Keep safety on or off as fits your needs but don't chamber until your ready to shoot IMO.
Dave Markowitz
September 23, 2009, 10:28 AM
I have two small children. They are at the point where I'd trust them to not touch a gun without permission. OTH, they have friends who come over and I can't trust them not to. So, I keep my Mossberg Mariner in a Mossberg Loc-Box. It locks around the action like so:
The gun actually hangs on a vinyl coated hook through the open ejection port. I am able to keep a shell on the lifter so all I need to do when I remove the gun is to close the action, and it's ready to go. (You can see where I put some electrical tape to cover the edge of the LB to protect the gun.)
(The wood into which the muzzle hook is screwed is secured to studs with 3" drywall screws, and is also Gorilla Glued to the sheetrock.)
Since I don't want to be fumbling around in the dark if someone breaks in, I unlock it before I go to bed.
Dee
September 23, 2009, 10:31 AM
On my shotgun I have a Knoxx stock with a power pack on it, it is basically a shell holder on the side. I keep 3, 00 buck shells and 2 rifled slugs in the shell holder. The chamber on the shotgun is open and I can pretty quickly load a shell directly into the chamber and then the rest in the mag tube. The gun is in a case tucked away in my closet but I do not keep it loaded because I do have a 3 year old around.
If I need to get to something quicker I do have a loaded .45 (no round chambered) kept out of reach as well.
Snowdog
September 23, 2009, 12:13 PM
My HD shotgun has an exposed hammer, so I keep it on half cock with a shell in the chamber. I sleep well at night. When my daughter becomes old enough, of course I'll have to factor that in.
WJR
September 23, 2009, 12:35 PM
I do not keep one in the chamber for the same reasons as others have mentioned above. I also have small children in the house.
WJR
mljdeckard
September 23, 2009, 12:51 PM
Magazine full, shamber empty, slide locked. As they get older I will have to re-evaluate.
Gunfighter123
September 23, 2009, 01:44 PM
I am in the same camp as alot of others --- mag full , chamber EMPTY , and safety off.
It takes less then 1/2 second to rack the slide on a pump or cycle the bolt on a semi-auto ---- on the other hand , if the SG gets dropped/knocked /or trigger gets pulled with the safety off --- it COULD be you or a loved one who gets killed !!!!
Some will say " we don't want the BG to HEAR the SG being racked " ----- I SAY IT IS THE LAST THING THEY WILL HEAR BEFORE THE BOOM !!!
rcmodel
September 23, 2009, 01:59 PM
Chamber empty always!
1. You can't hardly pick up a short barreled shotgun from a "standing in the corner" position without covering yourself with the muzzle at some point.
2. Shotguns are not drop safe. Guns with exposed hammers even less so.
A sharp blow to the hammer can break the sear and fire the gun.
3. In the event of a house fire, a round in the chamber is going to cook off and shoot something!
Might be a fireman on the roof trying to put the fire out!
4. A loaded magazine with the slide unlocked or open is as fast into action as leaving it loaded.
IMO: Leaving a shotgun chamber loaded in the house is bordering on irresponsible gun safety.
rc
KBintheSLC
September 23, 2009, 02:15 PM
Does anyone here keep a round chambered in their HD pump shotgun, and if not, why?
No... never.
It is not safe to do that in my Remington 870 Express 12ga. All it has is a trigger bar safety... that is not reassuring in a single action gun with no external hammer. A round is chambered only when I am preparing to fire the gun.
tribbles
September 23, 2009, 02:17 PM
New 870, same status - chamber empty, mag tube full, safety on. The 870's safety is in exactly the same spot as the Charles Daly autoloader and 552 Speedmaster I grew up with, so no need to change 25 years of muscle memory as far as that's concerned. 90 pounds of Chesapeake Bay Retriever as an early warning system.
Spirit 1
September 23, 2009, 02:28 PM
It's all about the logistics and details of the particular situation.
Other possibilities: with NO CHILDREN: a rack on bed frame allowing shotgun to sit in a secure horizontal position, with barrel towards foot of bed, foot of bed faces door. Hooks suspending gun are deep enough it won't get knocked off by bumping it or stumbling. With a shell in chamber, safety on, it's about as secure as it can be and yet ready for instant deployment during the night. Works for me but nobody is allowed in that area of my house.
Also possible to load up your gun, safety off, and push the slide lock and start slide just past locked position. It's entirely safe, and you can lean it up in a corner or whatever that way. In a fast action event there's no fumbling for the little slide release button, allowing you to very quickly rack it and chamber a round. You can even pick up the gun by racking down first, then when lifting gun up swiftly by forestock the shell is shoved home in the chamber. You'd want to dry fire practice that of course.
With those two setups I have 2 guns ready to go in an instant, however I live alone!
rcmodel
September 23, 2009, 02:40 PM
Works for me but nobody is allowed in that area of my house.Even the fire department?
rc
oneounceload
September 23, 2009, 03:13 PM
Trigger tripped so the chamber is empty and ready to rack one in, safety off - no need for those things - none of my guns get a round in the chamber until ready to shoot
Girodin
September 23, 2009, 03:29 PM
I wouldn't recommend it around kiddies tho unless they are completely taught on gun safety
Even then, kids typically have friends. IME some of those friends will probably be idiots, even if there not they may not be gun savy. Loaded guns that other people have access to is bad news.
As an aside people should not presume that everyone has the same situation as them. Some may have different models of shotguns. Some may not keep it leaned up against the wall, or may not do so with the muzzle up. Some may have kids, or roommates or frequent visitors. People need to think through what is best for their equipment and their situation. Doing what someone else does just because they do it is silly.
For what its worth I do not leave my particular HD shotgun chambered. The design of my gun is not conducive to it. I also don't think it is sound to leave guns just lying around. If I'm not there I like them in the safe.
inthelineofire
September 23, 2009, 04:26 PM
Interesting you mention about keeping it muzzle up/down, against the bed, etc. What is the best way? I've always done muzzle up, chamber empty, slide already released so I don't have to fumble for the switch in the night. I doubt I'd fumble, since I'm familiar with the gun, but one less thing to do is OK with me.
Virginian
September 23, 2009, 04:49 PM
Locked and loaded is the only way to go. I can't believe anyone would practice anything else for true home defense. The sound of you racking the slide isn't going to panic a bad guy looking for drug money packing the same gun, it's just going to pinpoint your location. And I bet he's loaded and not locked ! The chamber is always empty when I am cleaning it, though.
mljdeckard
September 23, 2009, 06:16 PM
Just because we keep the chamber empty doesn't mean we plan on scaring the bad guy by racking the slide.
Snarlingiron
September 23, 2009, 06:28 PM
Even the fire department?
A good point. I have had a house fire. My wife kept trying to go back into the house to retrieve a kitty cat. The Fire Captain finally took her by the arm, crossed the street told her to sit on the curb and if she got up from the curb he would arrest her for interfering with the firefighters.
Once those guys arrive, it isn't your house anymore until they clear it and leave.
Girodin
September 23, 2009, 06:30 PM
Locked and loaded is the only way to go. I can't believe anyone would practice anything else for true home defense.
:rolleyes:See my comments above about projecting your situation onto everyone else.
It is hard for me to imagine a situation in which I would be able to put my shotgun into use but not have time to drop the bolt on it (it take about the same time as disengaging the safety would). Unless you keep the thing in bed with you or are carrying it around slung there is already a delay in the deployment. This is part of why the same people that would never consider having a CCW empty chamber don't have an issue with the HD longun having a loaded mag but an empty chamber.
For someone to get into my bedroom they have to get past the locked doors and windows, which are alarmed as well. If the alarm for whatever reason did not wake me, I have a large dog that sleeps downstairs. I have a second locking door into my bedroom. Somewhere in the time I get woken and the time that individual could get to my room I think I would have time to drop the bolt on my gun. Beyond that I always have a handgun at arms length. During the day it is holstered and on my person. At night it is within arms reach. If someone kicks the door in during the middle of the day the chambered shotgun in the other room might be of no use anyhow.
If one has locked doors, an alarm, a dog (a rather large one), and a second locking steel door I don't think that the empty chamber will be a huge problem.
The sound of you racking the slide isn't going to panic a bad guy looking for drug money packing the same gun, it's just going to pinpoint your location.
As Yogi Berrra once said predictions are very hard to make, especially about the future. It might or it might not. No one can say, which is why you cannot not rely on it. Wanting to rack is probably not a good reason to keep it chamber empty (you could rack a loaded gun too). Did anyone who said they keep an empty chamber suggest that was the reason why they did so? There might be some other valid reasons however. Re-read the thread. My SG is not even a pump gun for what its worth.
TomADC
September 23, 2009, 06:50 PM
I keep my 870 cocked and locked on a empty chamber with the safety on. I figure if I get up in the middle of the night, I have to be alert enough to either hit the slide release and jack a round in the chamber or safety off pull trigger on empty chamber, cycle slide to get it in battery.
Snarlingiron
September 23, 2009, 10:20 PM
Somewhere in the time I get woken and the time that individual could get to my room I think I would have time to drop the bolt on my gun.
So, you see we all have different situations. My wife is an extremely sound sleeper, and over the last couple of years my hearing has become quite diminished. It is very likely that someone could be in my face by the time I'm aware that there is a problem.
Understand that I am not trying to suggest that anyone do anything. I am just relating what I do. Your situation is probably different, and your comfort zone most likely is too.
TomADC
September 23, 2009, 11:36 PM
Snarlingiron you need to have two mini dachshunds sleep in your bedroom, they only bark when something requires attention:D
Girodin
September 24, 2009, 12:10 AM
Snarlington, I with you. You do what works for your situation. I just wish the person who posted chambered was "the only way to go"
would realize that.
It is very likely that someone could be in my face by the time I'm aware that there is a problem.
I too think about this possibility, and it is why I have a handgun within reach. I figure it would be easier to deploy in such a situation than the long gun anyhow.
gearchecker
September 24, 2009, 12:19 AM
If you truly want it set up for HD, it needs to be cocked and locked.
Racking a round in the presence of another person in some states be considered an act of attempted murder.
There have been cases intruders leaving the home they brkoe into after hearing a round getting racked, and then calling the LEO's to report that the homeowner racked a round from outside of the home at them. Even though it never happened that way. The LEO's show up and the homeowner has a shotgun with a round chambered and gets hauled away and charged with attempted murder. If you don't rack the round into shotgun who knows you even had the intent to use it. They never heard you.
Girodin
September 24, 2009, 01:02 AM
Racking a round in the presence of another person in some states be considered an act of attempted murder.
If this were true (cases?), there sure would need to be some other dispositive facts. Other wise there would be a whole lot of bird hunters in jail. The racking alone would not be enough. Thus if it is a situation where you could shoot or point your loaded gun at them racking is unlikely to be a problem one would think. If you want to cite some applicable case law I would be interested in reading it.
Under your hypothetical if I kept it chambered and the BG saw me/it and ran away and called the cops making the same claim, I would still be in hot water since I have a chambered shotgun, no? Is it unimaginable they guy might fabricate such a tale?
If the person truly broke in there is likely going to be signs of forced entry. This will not bode well for the BG and his fabricated version of events.
There is another point however. If someone breaks in (or any other situation where you need to wield a gun) you need to call the cops ASAP. I would dial 911 before I went looking for the BG (I'm not going to go look for him). I'd congregate the family, barricade and call 911.
In short the buglar will have a hard case if he really broke in. Lets think it through Usually these people have past records the last chap who broke into my house was a 2 time felon and on parole he is happily back in prison now. That might not come up in burglary trial but it would certainly be something the cops and a DA would look at. It is more menaingful when juxtaposed against my standing in society. How did he get in the house, are there signs of forced entry. This makes the idea I racked my shotgun at him outside a harder sell. One, its not what the cops are worried about two there is clear evidence to support my version of events that he was indeed in my home. I'll be on the horn with 911 before he will in all likely hood, that counts for something. Further I don't live in NY, Chi, CA, or any other place where DAs judges and juries have crazy ideas about HD and guns.
I'd love to see the case law. There is going to have to be some other facts in there. That or simply a DA and court very hostile to guns.
mljdeckard
September 24, 2009, 01:03 AM
I'm ringing the bull bell on that one. Which states?
76shuvlinoff
September 24, 2009, 07:52 AM
you shouldn't be muzzling yourself if you store it muzzle down
Spirit 1
September 24, 2009, 01:11 PM
"Even the fire department?"
No, not even the fire department. My circumstances are unusual, not the norm, so quick assumptions may not apply. In this case there is no chance of fire fighters as such being either in a situation of danger or even fighting a fire inside the structure. Can't happen.
My second option given may be better for some people, or neither one as the case may be. Just descriptions of my personal choices.
Girodin
September 24, 2009, 03:34 PM
I have to admit that my curiosity is piqued. I am having a hard time imagining a place where there is zero chance a fireman would ever need/be able to go yet there is danger enough of someone or something getting in there that might require use of a shotgun. The best I can come up with is a very rural residence. I would classify that as there being extremely low odds of a firefighter being there not an utter impossibility. Not that it really matters. Like I said it just made me curious.
mcdonl
September 24, 2009, 03:40 PM
This is a different "locked and loaded thread...." I am of the mind set that an unloaded gun is a paper weight. So, my SD handgun has one in the chamber in my night stand. It is a DAO pistol.
Now, I am also not a fan of the warning shot people, but I do feel as though the cycling of a pump action shotgun is an effective deterrent and is one of the reasons that I keep the tube full, but chamber empty.
RSVP2RIP
September 24, 2009, 03:56 PM
New to the thread but RCMODEL brings up an important item. Cookoff in a fire. Can he honestly say that he keeps all his firearms in condition 2? It may be his choice but my father's house burnt down a few years ago and he was lucky enough that the guns only suffered smoke and water damage, not heat. Finish gone, good to shoot, too bad for the 20 ga Superposed :( I keep the shotgun cond. 2 because the saftey is only good on the trigger and the Glock/Kahr/High Power cond. 1. High Power I feel is safe enough because it has a half cock notch, which will catch a broken sear nose forced from full cock and hold it.
M1911
September 24, 2009, 04:12 PM
Magazine full, chamber empty, safety off, slide unlocked. Drop safe, but rack it and go.
I am of the mind set that an unloaded gun is a paper weight. So, my SD handgun has one in the chamber in my night stand. It is a DAO pistol.
Your DAO pistol is drop safe. A pump shotgun is not.
mcdonl
September 24, 2009, 04:28 PM
I agree M1911... thats why I keep it with an empty chamber... the mossy 500 that is...
Gunfighter123
September 24, 2009, 05:47 PM
Locked and loaded is the only way to go. I can't believe anyone would practice anything else for true home defense. The sound of you racking the slide isn't going to panic a bad guy looking for drug money packing the same gun, it's just going to pinpoint your location. And I bet he's loaded and not locked !
As I already posted ---- IF AND WHEN you SEE a nutcase in your home -- it takes less then 1/4--1/2 of a second to rack the slide and pull the trigger !!! If you already have the SG cocked -- you have 1/2 a second less time to really ID if it is a true life threat or a drunk entering the wrong house thinking it is theirs etc.
bratch
September 24, 2009, 06:02 PM
There have been cases intruders leaving the home they brkoe into after hearing a round getting racked, and then calling the LEO's to report that the homeowner racked a round from outside of the home at them. Even though it never happened that way. The LEO's show up and the homeowner has a shotgun with a round chambered and gets hauled away and charged with attempted murder. If you don't rack the round into shotgun who knows you even had the intent to use it. They never heard you.
Do you have links to any of these cases? I'd would like to read them
xjmox14x
September 24, 2009, 06:04 PM
"Even the fire department?"
No, not even the fire department. My circumstances are unusual, not the norm, so quick assumptions may not apply. In this case there is no chance of fire fighters as such being either in a situation of danger or even fighting a fire inside the structure. Can't happen.
My second option given may be better for some people, or neither one as the case may be. Just descriptions of my personal choices.
Actually, the fire department can, and will, gain access. And if you interfere, you will be taken away in handcuffs.
Assuming of course this area is pertainable to the situation (it is inside your house or attached). If not, you're good to go.
I am a fire fighter in NY and we've gotten automatic alarms where the home owner said it was a mistake and they wouldn't let us in. Guess what. She was placed in the back of a police car until we were finished.
Why? What happens if "that place that no one but you can enter" is smoldering or has some form of fire or ignition in it? The FD comes and checks the place out, and doesn't check that room, and then leaves. 2 hours later your house is fully involved and guess who's at fault?
In an emergency situation, we have every right to search where needed, and we will, whether you like it or not.
Moving on, my pump shotgun has the mag tube loaded and chamber empty, safety off.
rcmodel
September 24, 2009, 06:10 PM
No, not even the fire department. My circumstances are unusual, not the norm
I'm thinking this guy owns Oussama Ben Laden's cave.
:D
rc
inSight-NEO
September 24, 2009, 08:02 PM
For the shotgun, I never keep a round in the chamber. Rather, I keep the action "unlocked," dummy round in the chamber, mag tube loaded and more often than not, the safety engaged. Essentially, I guess you could call this "cruiser ready" or a modification thereof.
Now, for handguns, sometimes I may keep a round in the chamber. But, only with certain guns at specific times.
Dustin4185
September 25, 2009, 12:52 PM
I use the same setup as my patrol truck (game warden). I bought a tuffloc shotgun rack and installed it with lag bolts in the closet. You can get a transformer at radio shack to convert 110v to 12 vdc. Just wire it in like the manufacturer says (the unlock button is hidden in night stand). In our trucks we leave the chamber empty, slide back, and lock on the upper part of the barrel/magazine tube. This allows you to load what you need directly into the chamber. The rack also has a trigger guard that we adjust to cover the ejection port to keep large foreign objects out of the chamber.
bigalexe
September 25, 2009, 03:02 PM
A comment on Racking a Pump gun.
It was once stated to me and I completely agree that racking a pump doesn't necessarily scare a bad guy but it does clear things up a little bit. Most people in a right frame of mind have some idea what the sound of a shotgun racking is and will recognize it if they hear it. Thus if a burglar is in your house and they hear that slide their are going to be an infinite number of possible reactions, however the one that matters is that if the guy is still in your house burglarizing you after clearly hearing that sound then it can probably be safely assumed that the criminal is either a violent criminal intent on harming you, or that the criminal is in a non-stable state of mind and therefore should be handled as such.
Positrack
September 25, 2009, 04:43 PM
I keep the sporting gun I use for HD (12ga. 870) chamber empty, mag full, safety on (I don't at the moment have a dedicated HD weapon). I've given some thought to keeping a round chambered, but I'm just not comfortable with it for a few reasons, particularly on a shotgun. That's just me, and I wouldn't presume to tell anybody else what to do, but that's the way I've always done it, and that's what what my muscles expect to find when I pick up one of my guns. I've also thought about leaving the chamber empty and dropping the hammer so the slide stays unlocked, but I really don't want to get into the habit of pulling the trigger every time I store the gun, plus I like having the slide locked for easy everyday handling. I'm used to the gun to the point that I can have it unlocked, racked, shouldered, off safe, and on target pretty darn fast. As far as the noise of working the slide goes, I really don't worry about it. My house is small enough, anybody with ill intent is going to figure out where I am quick enough anyway. If they round the corner to my bedroom, it won't much matter one way or the other...
RSVP2RIP
September 25, 2009, 05:42 PM
+1 Positrack...good info on using whats natural. I would highly suggest that the first $150 of availible cash you get you dump it on an 18" or 20" barrel, sights or bead doesn't matter, but I choose the bead because it's what I'm comfortable with.
Spirit 1
September 25, 2009, 09:48 PM
Please bear in mind that what I suggested was just that, suggestions, not to be followed by everyone. Each circumstance is of course different. I prefer having the chamber unloaded and slide unlocked as described.
My circumstance is extremely remote location, accessible only by 4WD up the side of a mountain, no visitors likely, and none in the 'house'. Fire fighting is 90% personal responsibility and the rest is possible grass fire. The fire protection system and fire fighting tools here should have anything structural dead out without any other complications, and will certainly keeps things 100% manageable if not. The responders here would use airplanes & helos.
Also I don't recall saying that I would leave the house in event of fire with a loaded shotgun inside in that conditition? Not a chance!
I might get crispy grabbing a few things on the way out if it came to that which is a very, very remote possibility, because I'd more likely end up soaking wet from head to toe.
gearchecker
September 25, 2009, 10:33 PM
Gearchecker here,
I stand corrected. I was asked to find an article supporting my statement and I can find none inside the USA. I was pretty sure they were in IL & NY states but I can't find anything.
I did find 2 articles on the web involving people being charged with attempted murder and in the article it discusses the assailent "racking his shotgun". The states involved are both in England and Australia.
Well I was about 1/2 correct. I've now spent hours looking and can find no cases here in the USA that fit that bill. My error and I apologize for my mistake. At least there has been no harm done at this point.
Laws do change, and what I knew in the past may very well be different at this time considering the status of the Castle Docterine and the number of states that have adopted it's guidlines.
With that said, at this point in time my statement is more than likely to be inaccurate within the United States, with the prevailing laws.
I still keep my Mossy loaded beside the bed. And still they won't hear me rack that round either. Even if it won't get me in trouble.
Thanks for bringing the statement into question. We do need to keep each other correctly informed.
Spirit 1
September 26, 2009, 01:07 AM
I should just leave it be, GearChecker, but...
SOMEWHERE [!!??!!?] I recently saw a thread on the net started by a guy that was one who was wrongfully charged, and it was in the last month to 6 weeks. Probably on Cal Guns forum, seems to me. Can't remember details, of course, but it was a somewhat similar scenario.
Something like him getting busted for brandishing or whatever, and losing one or all of his guns. He supposedly hadn't done what he was charged with but LEO's weren't sympathetic. Sorry, can't remember the exact facts but maybe that's what you're remembering.
I'll look for it.
Positrack
September 26, 2009, 02:50 AM
+1 Positrack...good info on using whats natural. I would highly suggest that the first $150 of availible cash you get you dump it on an 18" or 20" barrel, sights or bead doesn't matter, but I choose the bead because it's what I'm comfortable with.
I thought about just getting a second barrel (20" bead or RS would be great), but I'd really just as soon get a second complete 870. I made the "mistake" of getting an especially clean and pretty Wingmaster, and now I find myself fussing over scratches/dings like an over-protective mother. :rolleyes: It's like driving a real shiny vehicle; it sounds great, but my rusty 33 year old pickup keeps my stress level lower. I figure for probably twice what it would cost for a new barrel, I can get a complete albeit "well broken-in" police trade-in that I can set up specifically for HD and use for carrying up the corn crib ladder to dispatch coons, take camping, or throw in the truck without fussing over. Plus, I'd like to get a HD gun with a shorter stock in case my fiancee ever needed to use it. She's 5'3" and it's a real sight watching her shoulder my Wingmaster. Believe it or not, she's still not too bad with it though (I wouldn't want her shooting at me anyhow... :uhoh:).
Sorry all for the digression.
TomADC
September 26, 2009, 11:29 AM
I was thinking if you keep a shotgun stashed in a closet (I do) it wouldn't hurt to take it out once and a while to make sure something hasn't made a nest in the barrel like a spider..
NCSUPackman
September 26, 2009, 04:07 PM
A comment on Racking a Pump gun.
It was once stated to me and I completely agree that racking a pump doesn't necessarily scare a bad guy but it does clear things up a little bit. Most people in a right frame of mind have some idea what the sound of a shotgun racking is and will recognize it if they hear it. Thus if a burglar is in your house and they hear that slide their are going to be an infinite number of possible reactions, however the one that matters is that if the guy is still in your house burglarizing you after clearly hearing that sound then it can probably be safely assumed that the criminal is either a violent criminal intent on harming you, or that the criminal is in a non-stable state of mind and therefore should be handled as such.
Exactly how it was explained to me. There are three types of people who will break into your house: The greedy, the desperate, and the crazy. The greedy and desperate will generally flee if they hear the sound of a slide being racked because they're not going to risk their life for money; they'll find an easier target. If the crazy hears a shotgun being racked and doesn't leave, it's a good bet he doesn't care about his own life and therefore not care about yours so he will more than likely try to do you harm.
wrs840
September 26, 2009, 08:55 PM
I think maybe a HD pump that can't be kept with a round chambered may not be being properly stored. I sure wouldn't keep one "leaning against a wall", or "under the bed/mattress", or "hidden", or anywhere like that with a round chambered, but assuming it's stored in a proper, close-by, (and stealthy/non-obvious) quick-access lock-up (I unlock it every night before sleeping), I can't think of a reason not to store a HD pump chambered. The one time I woke to a noise that had me concerned enough to deploy a shotgun, I recall very clearly not wanting to make any slide-racket.
Les
oneounceload
September 26, 2009, 09:19 PM
I was thinking if you keep a shotgun stashed in a closet (I do) it wouldn't hurt to take it out once and a while to make sure something hasn't made a nest in the barrel like a spider..
and so what IF a spider made a nest? You really think a load of shot is going to be stopped or hindered?
It's a simple scenario - IF you're uncomfortable with leaving a round in the chamber....(I am as well), then leave the chamber empty, have the trigger tripped so you can readily rack the next round, safety off - good to go
Girodin
September 26, 2009, 10:19 PM
and so what IF a spider made a nest? You really think a load of shot is going to be stopped or hindered?
Mud or even snow can cause a shotgun barrel to banana peel, it is not beyond imagination that a spider nest could cause an obstruction like unto snow. I have never seen a barrel blown buy a spider nest but it doesn't seem unreasonable to me.
Jeff82
September 26, 2009, 10:21 PM
Keep this in mind: long gun (nonmilitary) safeties are not like nor as trustworthy as pistol safeties. Civilian long gun safeties may block trigger movement (typical crossbolt safety) but may not lock up sear-hammer engagement. What does this mean? It means that long gun that you keep chambered, with safety "ON", may well fire a chambered round simply by being dropped, struck, hit, banged around or similar. Modern pistols on the other hand can be flung anywhere and you're ok.
TomADC
September 26, 2009, 10:26 PM
It's a simple scenario - IF you're uncomfortable with leaving a round in the chamber....(I am as well), then leave the chamber empty, have the trigger tripped so you can readily rack the next round, safety off - good to go
I don't keep a round in the chamber never have, I do keep it cocked on a empty chamber with the safety on.
My point is forgetting the spider if that makes you happy is my shotgun just sits there months at a time, I don't take it out and play with it, have 12 so I can play with them, but ever so often wouldn't hurt to check if you have on stashed away. I run a Tico tool down the barrel just incase of rust wipe it down and put it back. That Remington 870 has been in that closet for better then 20 years, I have zero doubt if needed it would perform as required.
If I lived in a hot and humis area I'd have a schedule to do that.
wrs840
September 26, 2009, 10:30 PM
Keep this in mind: long gun (nonmilitary) safeties are not like nor as trustworthy as pistol safeties. Civilian long gun safeties may block trigger movement (typical crossbolt safety) but may not lock up sear-hammer engagement...
Your point is appreciated and well taken. Does this apply to Mossburg 500/590 safeties?
Thanks,
Les
Jeff82
September 26, 2009, 10:48 PM
Your point is appreciated and well taken. Does this apply to Mossburg 500/590 safeties?
Thanks,
Les
I don't have one to take apart but the exploded view looks like the safety simply blocks the upward movement of the trigger (via the connector?). The sear is up front with the hammer and may be able to move independently of the trigger.
EvanWilliams
September 27, 2009, 12:36 AM
Mossberg 500 loaded with 00 buck and slugs ( Live in a house), empty chamber, I never use a safety on a shotgun. Ever. Don't ever want to get the idea that I could trust it. I can trust an empty chamber.
wrs840
September 27, 2009, 12:57 AM
I never use a safety on a shotgun. Ever. Don't ever want to get the idea that I could trust it. I can trust an empty chamber.
i don't get it yet... Why trust "empty chamber" and not a safety? And don't tell me because I "might drop my shotgun"... I don't "drop" my weapons. Who is planning their strategy predicated on the possibility that OOPS duh... I might DROP my shotgun? Someone help me with this line of reasoning, please...
No offense, but really...
Les
Jeff82
September 27, 2009, 01:14 AM
Nobody plans on dropping their weapon. It just happens. You ever trip? Does it ever get icy where you live? You don't have to drop it either. It could fall over after you prop it against something. There are myriad possibilities.
wrs840
September 27, 2009, 01:52 AM
I store chambered. Storing chambered is the topic. My HD shotgun doesn't trip or slip on ice when stored. ...and I don't "prop" my HD shotgun. It's stored properly, at ready, chambered. You're telling me in a HD situation you're not going to chamber a round until you're sure you're immobilized so you don't "trip" on something, or you're not going to chamber until you check to see there's no ICE in your path?
In skeptical but genuine respect,
Les
inSight-NEO
September 27, 2009, 08:59 PM
To me, during a break-in, assuming that the weapon is close, it would take no time to (once its in my hands) eject the dummy round and chamber a live one. All the while, my thumb is on the safety button (mossberg). Hence, I see no reason to keep a live round in the chamber.
Besides, chances are, if I do not even have enough time to perform this task (taking all of 1 or 2 seconds), then Im out of time anyway...particularly if Im dealing with someone who is armed.
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