1903 Springfield A1 bolt problems.
orc
October 25, 2009, 12:16 AM
I have a 1903 A1 Springfield that was working wonderfully until I took it apart to refinish the stock. Now the bolt sticks when I try to open it. The bolt will turn about half way and then stick. I can get it to open completely with a good smack with the palm of my hand (the action was previously quite smooth). Once the firing pin is locked to the rear, the action works perfectly i.e. I can open and close the bolt without any problems. However once the firing pin is forward, the problem returns. Any suggestions?
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First Big Foot
October 25, 2009, 12:27 AM
Sounds like something on the "bottom" of the bolt is conflicting with a proper range of motion with the trigger prong that allows the firing pin to go forward. Could you have put the spring loaded prong piece in backwards?
Could the end of the spring have gotten caught in the "track" of the firing pin's movement and is constricting during cocking?
Could the prong piece on the firing pin just be protruding too far out of the bolt, causing binding on the bolts channel in the receiver? (Look for scratch marks on the inside of the receiver where the re-assembled parts could be protruding to. I mean, since you have already forced it, it likely made some sort of mark.)
Rub a bit of lipstick on the parts of the bolt that seem to be sticking out too far, then function them back in and through and see where it transfers.
Good luck. Please let me know what you find.
rcmodel
October 25, 2009, 12:04 PM
There are very few to no ways you can put an 03 together wrong and get it to work at all, period.
Perhaps you got a blob of stock finish inside the inletting that is causing the trigger to rub inside the stock? Or holding the bolt handle from closing all the way?
Start out by taking the barreled action out of the stock and see if it works out of the stock.
If it does, you have something out of place and rubbing on the trigger sear or trigger.
Perhaps the receiver did not seat all the way down on the magazine box or something?
If it doesn't work, dissemble the bolt and check for free movement in the receiver without the striker in the bolt. If that works, then replace the striker and try it again.
Regardless, you will be better able to see what might or might not be taking place with the stock off.
BTW: Putting a dab of grease on the cocking cam in the bolt will make it cock much easier.
rc
orc
October 25, 2009, 02:20 PM
The bolt works fine without the firing / striking mechanism in it. So at least we've narrowed it down to somewhere within the striker mechanism.
It also happens both with the sock on or off so at least I didn't screw anything up by refinishing it.
I can't see any obvious new scratches or marks from forcing the bolt open but then again it's a bit dinged up from 90 years of use. Somewhere I have a tube of lipstick for aligning door striker plates with the bolt, so I'll see if I can dig that up.
Both the barrel and receiver stamps / serial numbers indicate it was made in 1920. At some point in it's life it was sporterized. The trigger mechanism was replaced with a Timney Sportsmen S03-AS assembly, it has a very nice micrometer Lyman peep sight and it looks like someone tried to float the barrel at some point.
I'm a bit reluctant to start poking around with the trigger mechanism as I am pretty novice with bolt action rifles, so any additional advice would be greatly appreciated.
rcmodel
October 25, 2009, 03:37 PM
Use a black magic marker.
It's not nearly as big a mess as lipstick.
Couple more things to check.
Make sure you have the striker assembly screwed all the way into the bolt. I think it might be possible to put it together one full turn from all the way? but can't recall for sure?
With the bolt assembled, pull back on the cocking piece and see if you can feel any binding inside the bolt body when the striker moves in and out.
Take the Timmeny trigger assembly off as a unit and see if the bolt assembly operates normally without a trigger.
Cocking will be the same as with the trigger in place, except it won't stay cocked.
But at least you can rule the trigger out.
Also, check for a too long screw from the peep sight mounting projecting into the inside of the bolt raceway and interfering with bolt movement.
rc
fguffey
October 26, 2009, 10:40 AM
I do not have a clue, the M1917 safety is not part of the bolt, I compress the spring pin by placing a washer between the cocking piece and bolt sleeve, the Mauser will bolt will not 'fit' unless the safety is engaged before the bolt can be installed, the Japanese built a rifle that they thought could not be assembled incorrectly, we showed them.
The 03 has a safety on the bolt (sorta like a Mauser) when assembling a Springfield 03 bolt I pull the cocking piece back and set the safety then install the bolt in the rifle, the safety should hold the cocking piece off the trigger, the bolt should have slack back and forth without a gage and or case in the chamber, less movement with a gage and or cartridge, with a cartridge in the chamber the back and forth movement is limited to head space, the movement of the bolt indicates head space and can be measured in .000 thousands with a feeler gage, or a guesstimate can be made with $$$$ gages but not in .000 thousands.
If you assemble the bolt and set the safety there should not be anything holding the bolt off, meaning when the safety is set is the same as installing the bolt without the firing pin assembly, it is about clocking the bolt, cocking piece and receiver. the 03 cocks on open (similar to the Mauser), the Mauser must be installed with the safety holding the firing pin assembly in the cocked position until the trigger sear is in position to support it.
F. Guffey
SlamFire1
October 26, 2009, 09:12 PM
Now the bolt sticks when I try to open it. The bolt will turn about half way and then stick. I can get it to open completely with a good smack with the palm of my hand (the action was previously quite smooth). Once the firing pin is locked to the rear, the action works perfectly i.e. I can open and close the bolt without any problems. However once the firing pin is forward, the problem returns.
I believe it is your aftermarket trigger mechanism.
I suspect that your trigger is resetting before you open the bolt. You are then having to force an override to get that sloped cocking cam over the sear mechanism.
Take the trigger mechanism out and see if the bolt is easy to lift. If it is, its your trigger mechanism.
If it is, increase the trigger overtravel.
orc
October 27, 2009, 10:24 PM
I've removed the trigger mechanism and it doesn't seem to have made any difference.
With the magic marker it looked like the front of the bolt was rubbing slightly against the Lyman peep sight. I removed the sight entirely and still have the same catching, so we've eliminated either the back face of the sight or any part of the screws sticking out.
RCmodel - the striker assembly appears to be an 'all or none' format. If the little spring loaded locking mechanism is clicked into place you can't screw it in any further (even with the button depressed). If it is one turn out, the locking mechanism doesn't catch. So I think we're ok there.
There appears to be a bit of fresh wear (again with the marker) on the bolt sleeve just above the locking pin (if the bolt was in the rifle in an upright position). There appears to be a corresponding mark on the receiver. As far as I can tell, this appears to be the best candidate for the problem.
Overall, the bolt is slowly becoming easier to open as I'm most likely wearing down whatever is sticking. Hopefully this is not a bad thing....
any further suggestions?
fguffey
October 28, 2009, 09:31 AM
Again, I do not have a clue but when I install the firing pin assembly into a bolt, Mauser, Enfield M1917 or Springfield I compress the spring and hold it back with the safety or a large 'C' ring, you said the bolt worked when stripped, did you remove the extractor, if the barrel is not indexed? (extractor cut aligned on right side) the extractor could hit the barrel.
You said the bolt worked when stripped?
Something about installing the bolt in the fired position or cocked position, you have not said.
F, Guffey
SlamFire1
October 28, 2009, 09:37 AM
any further suggestions?
It's fourth down and I am punting.
fguffey
October 28, 2009, 10:59 AM
The 03 Springfield has a cocking knob, after the bolt is assembled pull the knob back, set the safety then install the bolt in the cocked position with the safety engaged, you do not want the cocking piece making contact with the trigger before the safety is taken off of the safety position.
F. Guffey
rcmodel
October 28, 2009, 02:27 PM
Speaking of safetys.
Does it still have the stock three position wing safety?
Or has someone replaced it with a low scope safety?
If they have, that right there is most likely the problem.
Inproper fitting of the low safety is interfering with the striker.
rc
fguffey
October 28, 2009, 03:49 PM
I do not have a clue, I would use the 'AwMe' safety, if that safety worked I would then install the replacement safety, he did say he was using Lyman peep sights and he removed them with no improvement.
F. Guffey
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