Buying a used Marlin 1895 GG


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civilian75
November 12, 2009, 01:17 PM
I am about to buy a used guide gun online. Being totally unfamiliar with Marlins and lever action rifles, I need help assessing the risk.

Assuming seller is trying to ditch a lemon, what is the worst that it could be?

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Averageman
November 12, 2009, 01:36 PM
MarlinOwners.com and look at the websight. They have lots of answers for you.
From everything I have read Lemons are possible but very rare. These things are the Rifle equivilant of the 350 V8, they just hang in there for years.
I am currently reworking a 336SC and trying to make it into a GG configuration as the ultimate Truck Gun.

rcmodel
November 12, 2009, 02:01 PM
The only real risk is the previous owner lost the ejector when he had it apart.

Or used the gun for an emergency bumper jack handle or club.

Both should be fairly obvious defects.

rc

DMZ
November 12, 2009, 03:39 PM
I am thinking the seller could not take the recoil. I had an 1895SS in 45-70, that I found unpleasant to shoot.

civilian75
November 12, 2009, 04:58 PM
I am thinking the seller could not take the recoil. I had an 1895SS in 45-70, that I found unpleasant to shoot.

Which 1895SS in 45-70 you found pleasant to shoot? :p

I will be shooting cowboy/subsonic loads mostly mostly. Full loads only once in a while (i.e. LeveRevolutions 325gr) :D

Averageman
November 13, 2009, 12:19 AM
capability of turning cover in to concealment.
Look at the tests at Marlinowners

Daniel B
November 13, 2009, 02:13 PM
Late September I found a 1895G for sale on Marlinowners.com. The seller was in AL. He had the gun for a year and never shot it. Bought it off of Gunbroker from the original owner claiming never fired.

I got it delivered on a Friday. Exactly what the seller described. 1895G NIB(original box) never fired. Action was still a little stiff as it hasn't been cycled much.

I made it to the range for the first time since I purchased it. I took along two boxes of ammo. Loaded up three rounds to start. Cycled the lever all the way down. Tried to close it only to find the action was locked up tighter than you could imagine. Saving you the details of me cussing as I scratched the receiver putting it back together after a full tear down. I sent it back to Marlin with a letter stating the exact problem. They got the rifle on a Tuesday. 3 days later I called and asked on an update. Rifle fixed will be shipped out on Monday. Tuesday I got it back in my hands.

THey had to replace the loading spring(aka loading gate) as it was bent. No charge. I was out the 12 bucks to ship it to Marlin.

You will find some 1895G rifles have a loading problem. Don't hesitate to test out the Marlin warranty as it is top notch. I hope to devistate the hog population with this rifle after deer season is over this year.

The recoil isn't bad with certain rounds. Get some rounds that have some higher velocity and you will definately feel the rifle in your shoulder. If you are one sick individual go pick up some Buffalo Bore 500gr animals. Those will get your attention real quick.

After the first of the year I'll be throwing some ghost ring sights on mine as I hate buckhorn sights.

civilian75
November 16, 2009, 03:37 PM
Marlin 1895GG - RANGE REPORT

Couldn't hold back no more, and last Saturday I picked a SS guide gun. I love it! Serial number starts with a 93 (was it mfg in '93!?!?). Action worked fine. No signs of what Daniel B observed (thanks heavens!). First round into the magazine enters smoothly, the remaining three require a lot more force and wiggling. Probably need to refine my technique or something.

The night before I had purchased dies, shell holders, bullet puller collet, brass, 405gr boolits and primers, and before going to bed, I had already loaded my first twenty five .45-70 rounds with 11-15gr TB. And that was even before owning the firearm for the caliber (a personal first)!

Sunday, my son and I test fired both rifle and loads. I see why Daniel B hates the buckhorn sights. Took us a while to find the correct sight picture, plus, you can't adjust windage :cuss:. More on that later.

Being new to the rifle and just starting to work up a load (for now i want to remain subsonic), our accuracy was not that great. My gut tells me we can probably do 2-3" groups at 50yd before we get really good at it.

I have developed subsonic loads for a handful of 22 and 30cal rifles. Recoil is from non-existent to just barely noticeable. Not quite with the 405gr, still mild but very, very noticeable. :evil:

I also picked a couple of boxes of shoulder crushing 325gr LeveRevolutions. In short, I was a bit disappointed. Between the both of us we fired 8 rounds. All landed 3.5” +/- 0.2” right of POA!! All our 405gr work had been on a bench. But due to severe recoil, we held the rifle with our hands, using only the bench to support our elbows. Is this why some guide guns come from the factory with port holes to the right of the muzzle?!?! Since I am eventually threading and suppressing it, I don’t think porting will work for me. :fire:

But that was not all! Shots landed a full 8” below all 405gr shots initially, that is, until we started tweaking the rear sight for elevation. I am still scratching my head about the elevation thing and I sure hope someone explains it. And with no windage adjustment, if I decide to keep shooting the Hornady round, I will have to look at ghost sights, or something. How easy are the ghost sight to adjust for a rounds windage?

I’ve been giving some though to a possible scope solution. If I do the unthinkable, I am partial to something with turrets. Maybe a BSA Sweet 22? Why a S-22? Because their dial presets don’t work anyways and one has to re-label the dials to match the rifle/ammo. Anyway, any suggestions?

I also did the cleaning rod trick to estimate the bbl twist rate. I believe it is advertised as 1:20 but I measured more closely to 1:18. Any comments?

Daniel B
November 16, 2009, 03:43 PM
windage is adjustable by drifting the rear sight right or left. I had shots impacting 3" right at 30 yds. A little nudge on the rear sight and I was smacking the xring.

civilian75
November 16, 2009, 04:05 PM
A little nudge on the rear sight
I tried that but it would not move.:confused: I guess I will have to nudge it a little harder.

Daniel B
November 16, 2009, 04:19 PM
Take a brass or nylon hammer to the range with you. The sights need a little motivation. If they didn't you would loose your zero every time you dropped the hammer.

I just got in a set of XS Ghost rings for my 870 Police Magnum. After holding this sight setup and looking it over, I'll more than likely give some more time to researching the best sights for my GG. I still can't get over the XS set that requires the mounting of a 2x4 on the end of the barrel. I'll be leaning towards Skinner or some other brand. Although I guess I could order the XS in and take a look at them in my hands. I can always return for full refund if not mounted.

civilian75
November 16, 2009, 05:57 PM
I still can't get over the XS set that requires the mounting of a 2x4 Unsightly :barf:

A ghost rear sight that does not require a tool to adjust for windage would be nice.

Asherdan
November 16, 2009, 07:26 PM
I used a leather mallet and a brass drift to move my factory buckhorn around in the dovetail. Take some masking tape and put a square on the barrel at the front of the rear sight leaf and draw a line off the 'V' so you can tell how much you've moved it, it'll give you a reference point and quicken up the process.

The last two of the serial shows it to be of 2007 (100 - 93 = Year) manufacture.

I use Unique for subsonic loads but Trail Boss should work well from what I've heard.

About the only 'tool-less' adjustable peep I know of would be a Williams FP with target knobs. Click adjustable but kinda 'too much stuff hanging off' for a rifle that would be hunted with for me. I've used my pocket knife to adjust Williams FP and 5D sights without an issue.

Load velocity and bullet weight is going to play dickens with your elevation settings in the 1895G. The more time in the barrel for the bullet the more time for recoil to raise the muzzle. It is not unusual or surprising to see the difference described between a ~1100 FPS load and a ~1800 FPS load.

I'd recommend a peep of the flavour that fits your taste over the factory sight anytime.

X-Rap
November 16, 2009, 08:52 PM
I like the wide XS sight with the white line up the center. Put the target/elk on top of the line and center in the ring and its good.
The only problem with mine involves the way the barrel is screwed into the reciever and I didn't notice until I put the GR sights on because they are mounted to both the barrel and reciever.
I have to set my rear sight annoyingly to the right because the barrel is turned slightly off center of the reciever.
Other than that I am happy as can be with mine and have taken 3 elk with it.

civilian75
November 16, 2009, 09:22 PM
Pardon if I am being dense. But, you guys deal with varying loads/ammo muzzle velocities (mv) and sight settings once you do away with the factory rear sight? I like the Skinner sight but it does not look like something you can switch ammo with different mvs in the field with easily. Am I right? I'd like to be able to shoot slow 405gr or heavier and then switch to how ~300gr hot rounds. Am I asking too much of a guide gun? Even the Williams does not seem like a slam dunk.

1858
November 16, 2009, 09:30 PM
I’ve been giving some though to a possible scope solution. If I do the unthinkable, I am partial to something with turrets. Maybe a BSA Sweet 22? Why a S-22? Because their dial presets don’t work anyways and one has to re-label the dials to match the rifle/ammo. Anyway, any suggestions?

I'd suggest something like a 1-4x or 1.5-5x with a reticle that helps with holdover. I have 1.5-5x Mark 4s on both of my '95s and the special purpose reticle can be used for holdovers rather than dialing in elevation and windage. I started load development for my two Marlins a few months ago but I soon discovered that recoil trumps charge differences. You may be surprised by the accuracy of the Guide Gun. It's a lot better than I was expecting and once I can control the recoil I think sub MOA at 100 yards is very possible.

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/marlin/1895/guide_gun/guide_gun_01.jpg

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/marlin/1895/xlr/xlr_03.jpg

:)

civilian75
November 16, 2009, 10:01 PM
I like Leupold scope a great deal. I own a Mark II 6-14x42. Mark 4 are great but is way out of budget. I was thinking along the lines of a Bushnell Trophy 3-9x40 with mildots for holdovers.

But I remembered about the peep tang sights. Anyone can chime in about the Marble's Tang Peep Sigh? Seems easy to adjust for windage and elevation.

1858
November 16, 2009, 10:07 PM
I like Leupold scope a great deal. I own a Mark II 6-14x42. Mark 4 are great but is way out of budget. I was thinking along the lines of a Bushnell Trophy 3-9x40 with mildots for holdovers.

I wouldn't want something that big on my Marlins but I would suggest some form of reticle to use with holdovers so a mildot would work well. Have you considered a VX-3 2.5-8x36mm with a B&C Big Game reticle?

:)

civilian75
November 17, 2009, 03:47 AM
I wouldn't want something that big on my Marlins Neither do I. I am having a hard time finding a compact scope with a hold-over friendly reticle.

The Leupold is a fine scope. but it is big at 11" long, just like the Bushnell.

Rob96
November 17, 2009, 04:32 AM
I also picked a couple of boxes of shoulder crushing 325gr LeveRevolutions. In short, I was a bit disappointed. Between the both of us we fired 8 rounds. All landed 3.5” +/- 0.2” right of POA!! All our 405gr work had been on a bench. But due to severe recoil, we held the rifle with our hands, using only the bench to support our elbows. Is this why some guide guns come from the factory with port holes to the right of the muzzle?!?! Since I am eventually threading and suppressing it, I don’t think porting will work for me.


You think the Hornady ammo recoils, you should try a 405gr JSP doing around 1750-1800fps. Now that is a shoulder thumper. Marlin did away with the porting becasue of the complaints of how LOUD the gun was. I mean, it is loud without the porting. I have fired one with porting and didn't like it at all. My 1895GG is topped with a Bushnell Banner 2-7x shotgun scope which has been working out great. Excellent accuracy. I sighted in using Hornady LE for deer this season. All rounds touching dead center, an inch high at 100yds.

rogertc1
November 17, 2009, 05:17 AM
45 70 punch bullets- 400gr belt mountain.

CZguy
November 17, 2009, 06:00 AM
Marlin did away with the porting becasue of the complaints of how LOUD the gun was. I mean, it is loud without the porting. I have fired one with porting and didn't like it at all.

I have and older one that's ported and prefer it. The porting works.................but then again so does my ear protection.

Asherdan
November 17, 2009, 01:50 PM
I like the Skinner sight but it does not look like something you can switch ammo with different mvs in the field with easily. Am I right? I'd like to be able to shoot slow 405gr or heavier and then switch to how ~300gr hot rounds. Am I asking too much of a guide gun? Even the Williams does not seem like a slam dunk.

I have a plinker 350g cast load at 1125 fps and a hunting load at 1725 fps with the same bullet. When I had the Williams 5D on I scribed dots into the frame and the windage and elevation slides. Match up the dots for the load and I'd be pretty dang close to dead on after a change. The Williams FP does a 1/4 MOA click adjustment, I now have a Weaver 1-3x20mm on and I would use that the same way as the scope, remember, or mark down, your click adjustments and dial it in.

Phone Guy
November 17, 2009, 02:47 PM
Can I ask how much these GG's are going for?
There is one in the paper for sale right now. I have a desire to own a 45/70.

rogertc1
November 17, 2009, 05:09 PM
Buds Guns has them for $500 on up.

civilian75
November 17, 2009, 08:25 PM
Can I ask how much these GG's are going for?

Marlin 1895 Guide Gun, 18.5" bbl, 4+1 magazine:
D1ck's:
- blue: $580
- ss: $680

If you live in the Portland area, Keith's has the blue for $509.

civilian75
November 17, 2009, 08:34 PM
Asherdan said:
I have a plinker 350g cast load at 1125 fps and a hunting load at 1725 fps with the same bullet. When I had the Williams 5D on I scribed dots into the frame and the windage and elevation slides. Match up the dots for the load and I'd be pretty dang close to dead on after a change. The Williams FP does a 1/4 MOA click adjustment, I now have a Weaver 1-3x20mm on and I would use that the same way as the scope, remember, or mark down, your click adjustments and dial it in.

Asherdan, thanks. This is the kind of advice I needed! One can speculate this would work. It is good to hear it actually worked for someone. I will try the same but with the Laser-Cast 405gr, which I like for plinking. Maybe later I will pick a lighter 350gr for hunting loads. I am a .45-70 newbie, but I've noticed that for small and medium game a cast boolit is enough, and a JFP is overkill. Is that right? How much expansion you get?

The LevelRevolution would be fine for a grizzly, I guess. :p

civilian75
November 17, 2009, 08:44 PM
rogertc1 said:
try a 405gr JSP doing around 1750-1800fps.

I would like that. I did not buy two boxes of LeverRevolutions because I was afraid of recoil. :) Like other guns, one needs to learn to master. I just haven't had enough time with it.

So, what's under your 405gr, 45gr of H4198?

Rob96
November 18, 2009, 04:33 AM
So, what's under your 405gr, 45gr of H4198?


I want to ssay 49grs. of H322. I'll check my load book then.

chas08
November 18, 2009, 06:58 AM
Can I ask how much these GG's are going for?
I just bought a blued non-ported model NIB out the door for $515.

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