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52grain
November 13, 2009, 09:22 PM
I haven't seen a thread asking questions about the Garand this week. Seeing that I sent an order into CMP for my first Garand earlier this week (service grade Springfield, the 6 month wait is going to be tough). I have a few that I haven't seen answers on:

-Any chance that the rifle arrives early?
-The Garand requires special 30-06 ammo. What is the difference between standard commercial loads and the military spec ammo?
-Is it possible to replace the gas plug and use commercial loads?
-I see references to the national match Garands. The seem to be quite the collector's item, I have tried searching the internet for information on what makes them special, but haven't found anything on them.
-What was different about the "Sniper" model?

Thanks for the answers.

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61chalk
November 13, 2009, 09:55 PM
A guy ordered his CMP Garand last Aug. an said it arrives this Monday....expect 3 months....You want to shoot military ammo, or change the gas plug an shoot commercial...The sniper models had been made to have scope mounts attached.
Match Rifles I'm not sure on but believe they have higher quality parts...not sure about
them being collector items...The difference in loads is the powder burn rate an the pressure it creates..military are fast burning, commercial modern tend to be on the slower burning side creating more pressure, that gas plug can be adjusted for this.

knights_armorer
November 13, 2009, 10:01 PM
Any chance that the rifle arrives early?
from what ive heard they are improving. i would bet around 4-5 months.

The Garand requires special 30-06 ammo. What is the difference between standard commercial loads and the military spec ammo?its mainly the burn rate of the powder used. really nothing slower than varget is usually a good bet.

Is it possible to replace the gas plug and use commercial loads?
absolutely. get the schuster (spelling?) plug and follow the instructions.

I see references to the national match Garands. The seem to be quite the collector's item, I have tried searching the internet for information on what makes them special, but haven't found anything on them. mostly little things like oprod, sights, trigger, and things of that nature.

-What was different about the "Sniper" model? the most common one is the m1d. it has an integral mount that is a permanent part of the barrel just forward of the bolt lockup. it sets the scope slightly off to the left, has a raised and padded leather cheek rest, and a flash hider that is on the gas lock.

my answers are probably a bit generlized, but that is the jist of it. i might have missed something here or there. ive never owned one (the sniper version), only the standard springfields.

Seattlefungus
November 13, 2009, 10:05 PM
From past experience with CMP. I'd not expect anything early. When They receive a surplus shipment. They hand grade, inspect and gage each rifle. Then each is made 100% safe and placed in the appropriate grade. Takes time to do it right. The gas system on the Garand is what makes the rifle function. You really don't want to do anything which will effect the system. It has an off. For the use of rifle grenade blanks. This requires the action t be cycled by hand. Use of civilian loads. Well, there are plenty of folks that use them. Fact is, the ammo required to feed an M1 is not really "Special". Any 30.06 round will probably chamber and fire. But it was designed as a "Battle Rifle" and functions best with ball rounds. That is full metal boat tail bullets which you can find in many calibers. With semi-auto rifles using an enbloc clip. It's advisable to use good factory ammo or if you load your own, a decent crimp on the bullet to prevent the bullet from being compressed in to the brass while cycling, which can cause dangerous over pressure. Additionally, there have been some reports of slam fires occurring with some civilian primers (which are softer than Mil-spec) and the M1 has a floating firing pin and can come in contact when the rifle is going to battery. The M1 is a great rifle and one of historical significance. I'd try to use good standard ammo and new enbloc clips. Lastly, the difference of a service M1 and a National Match M1 is usually the barrel, op rod, gas system, front and rear sights are all designed to tighter tolerances for precision shooting. You pay for that. But, then you can't use it in any "As issued" service match.

Quoheleth
November 13, 2009, 10:18 PM
I'm the guy 61Chalk was talking about. I placed my order in late August. It shipped from the South store this morning. It SHOULD be here on Monday, per FedEx's tracking system (overnight delivery). From what I've been reading here and on the CMP forum, the backlog has about broken up. Part of it is they're out of ammo, so all attention is now on moving guns. Part of it is they are just catching up. My DBU (what the forum calls the "Don't Bother us" email that says they've gotten the order and they'll move it as quick as they can) says something to the effect of thirty days from receiving order to shipping. Not exactly...they use three dates: date received; date put into the e-store; date shipped. My DR was 9/3, e-store was 10/8, DS was today. From DR to DS was about 75 days (still beat my TXCHL, start to finish!). Nonetheless, the six month wait time that is mentioned on the M1 Garand page has been cut considerably.

The old, milspec ball has a different powder than modern hunting ammo. There's lots of speculation on the CMP forum (I suggest you go over there and read, by the way. IMHO, it's a bit more snobbish than THR, but it's more Garand-specific) that the CMP is working on new production milspec ammo, whether Greek, Privi, or "other." Currently, Hornady and Federal/American Eagle both make a Garand-friendly load, but it is over $1/pop. The "cheap" HMX Greek surplus has gone the way of the Hudson. I got two spam cans right before they ran out. Gun shows and Gunbroker still have it available, but the price is almost double what I paid. But, you gotta do what you gotta do. Reload? Might be an option...

Or, get the adjustable gas plug. For about $50, it lets you shoot commercial ammo.

Can't help you on the national match or sniper models. Might check the CMP forums.

Now, comes the worst part - waiting. It does go by fast. Wait about thirty days; you should get an email from them with your account information. That's the DBU email. Then, about two weeks later, start checking your account and watch the progress.

Good luck.

Q

52grain
November 14, 2009, 01:00 PM
Thanks for the responses. One other question: what are the differences between manufacturers? A field grade Winchester sells for more than a service grade Springfield. I am assuming that its collectability, because the CMP rifles are such a mix of parts.

Maj Dad
November 14, 2009, 01:09 PM
You might spend some time on the Culver Shooting Pages M1 Forum (url is http://www.jouster.com/forums/index.php ). Tons of good info, and where the gurus group. I have been on it since the late 90's and I still pick up tips & tidbits.

I waited about 2-3 years for my first DCM M1: 3-6 months?? :p
Cheers, and welcome to the arena of the afflicted ;)
Maj Dad

61chalk
November 14, 2009, 03:35 PM
The Winchester are more because of the name. There are far less of them than SA, an all Winchester's are also WWII era. Have been told though that their quality wasn't up to par an were shut down at end of WWII. SA made around 5-6 million, HRA an IHC made around 400,000 each in the 50's...IHC have collectability because many were sold to Iran an so there are even fewer around to buy.

nbkky71
November 14, 2009, 04:44 PM
Here's some info on NM garands. Documented USGI NM rifles can fetch some serious cash.

http://www.scott-duff.com/NationalMatch.htm

Today the term "national match" is often used to describe any service rifle (not just Garands) that has been accurized to improve accuracy, for use in competition.

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