Yes, I'm new and have a basic question


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ROC
December 15, 2009, 02:48 PM
What would be the minimal accessories you'd buy for your brand new Colt AR-15 (I think he has the LE 6920) and Ruger mini 14? I'm trying to convince a friend that buying the actual gun is probably the cheap part. :)

I've done tons of searches and found some great stuff, but, I'd like to hear from those that have been there and done that.

Thanks in advance.

ROC

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General Geoff
December 15, 2009, 02:49 PM
1. magazines
2. sling
3. ammo. lots of ammo.

ROC
December 15, 2009, 02:51 PM
Speaking of ammo and mags, are there any that you'd definately stay away from?

Dr.Rob
December 15, 2009, 03:08 PM
AR-1: Magazines: Colt, USGI and Pmags good and inexpensive. A good sling is useful (if you know how to use it and aren't just looking for a 'carry strap' DPMS makes a great leather one), as is an A2 sight tool. You might consider a brass catcher (UTG makes one for about $10) if you reload and for range use.

Mini 14: Magazines: Factory Ruger and PMI are good.

Best 'accessory' you can buy is ammo to practice with.

memphisjim
December 15, 2009, 03:12 PM
those grenade launches are pricey

briansmithwins
December 15, 2009, 03:26 PM
Mags: Pmags are tough and cheap.
Ammo: Check gun-deals.com for prices.
Class: Good training classes go for $300 a day or so and up. Most of them sell DVDs so you can get a handle on the basics.

Everything else can wait. BSW

Tirod
December 15, 2009, 03:39 PM
Slings are nice if you have an actual requirement, say, hunting or MP work. where the rifle may need to be under control but out of the way. In the combat arms, I was taught to remove it - it hangs up, it's noisy, it's lazy, it keeps the rifle Not Battle Ready.

Even hunting I tend to carry the rifle in a low ready rather than slung. Time in field is not wasted if you are ready first step on the trail to a stand. I've jumped enough game going in.

Magazines: It's popular to suggest a large number of them, like 20-30, but very few actually use that many unless in competition. I got by for years with two for an HK91 I used for hunting. Of course now that it's gone, they've dropped from $25 to .50 friggin cents a piece. At that price, I would buy a couple of dozen.

One good optic for the primary purpose of the weapon is ok, not required. Enough ammo to be a good shot at 300 yards with iron sights will get you more results. Then, the 10X improvement of an optic will really show up.

What might be a real disaster is anything else on the rifle. The majority of accessories seem to reduce in size by half every five years, and the long term need of a four rail handguard to mount a mall ninja warriors half dozen lights and lasers is nil. A simple front handguard with an accessory rail or two will be all anyone uses in the future. Very few users really keep $1000 worth of stuff clamped on the fore end just to rot away in the trunk or a corner of the bedroom. The cost/benefit ratio is ridiculous.

Sure, things add up, but a lot of it doesn't have so much to do with the rifle as the activity. I don't cost a new GPS against the rifle, but hunting in general.

wishin
December 15, 2009, 03:58 PM
A bipod is nice to have, and not expensive.

ROC
December 15, 2009, 04:02 PM
Good info. Thanks a ton.

61chalk
December 15, 2009, 04:31 PM
I like scopes...gotta have one myself.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
December 15, 2009, 04:39 PM
Dunno about the Ruger, but for the Colt, besides mags (maybe 3-5 total) and ammo, I like to have a scope or other optical sight with high-quality rings, ERGO brand grip, & a sling. A "Tac-latch" is useful if the scope is mounted low and/or far back. Of course, lube/grease and cleaning supplies.

VFSniper
December 15, 2009, 04:51 PM
Personally for the AR-15, a couple of new mags, a Ergo grip (I've got a Magpul MIAD on mine), a nice optic, and a .22LR conversion kit for inexpensive practice.

Avenger29
December 15, 2009, 05:16 PM
Speaking of ammo and mags, are there any that you'd definately stay away from?

Avoid AMERC (American brand) ammunition and avoid CProducts, USA Magazine, National Magazine, Promags, and the HK magazines. Avoid those mystery "gun show reloads". Wolf, PMC, Privi Partizan, Remington, Hornady, Federal, Winchester are all good brands to buy.

Good magazines to buy are PMAGs (my first choice) Tango Down magazines (my second choice) and aluminum GI magazines (NHTMG, D&H, Bravo Company are all good sources of these). I'd guess Lancer L5 magazines are OK, but I have no reason to buy them...Figure about 10-15 or more magazines as a minimum to keep on hand.

I definitley prefer an optic, and a quality red dot (Aimpoint or Eotech) is going to run you $350-500 depending on which model and features you want, plus $120 or so for a quality mount or Eotech riser.

Tim the student
December 15, 2009, 05:25 PM
1. magazines
2. sling
3. ammo. lots of ammo.

I agree with this, but I don't think that a sling is necessarily in the "absolute minimum" category, unless his shooting style dictates it.

Texpatriate
December 15, 2009, 05:35 PM
What is the intended use and configuration of the gun? The answer to this question will determine which accouterments you should choose. I am shocked that no one has even bothered to ask this basic question. Mags and ammo are obvious, but you can't even choose which mags and ammo until you've answered the above question.

ROC
December 15, 2009, 05:50 PM
Well. I guess the intended use of the AR is for defense. For when the **** hits the fan type of thing.

The mini will be used for use in California. Varmints, targets etc.

WIth all the accessories available, it's hard to get a good grasp of what the essential good starter kit would comprise of. Kind of confusing actually. Part of my question I guess was an attempt to get some common knowledge that the experienced members have. For instance, if a bunch of you would have said something like...................."You gotta 86 the (place part here) on the out-of-the-box LE6920, they're junk, and replace it with the (place part here)".........I would have a good starting point.

For instance, your take on the "type" of mags is exactly what I'm looking for.

Brands to stay away from for things is also important to me.

Thanks for taking the time. :D

Avenger29
December 15, 2009, 07:31 PM
For instance, if a bunch of you would have said something like...................."You gotta 86 the (place part here) on the out-of-the-box LE6920, they're junk, and replace it with the (place part here)".........I would have a good starting point.


There's nothing wrong with the stock LE6920, but for defense, I and many others consider a light and a quality red dot sight the main "upgrades" that would be useful. Other items, like the pistol grip and stock, are more of personal preference/comfort items.

MrCleanOK
December 15, 2009, 09:30 PM
For a serious defensive carbine, here are what I consider "must haves" for hardware.
Tactical level light (60 lumens or more). If you keep a rifle for shooting things with two legs, you better darned well be sure of what you're shooting it at and why. $150 and up for a quality light and mount (Surefire 6P and Larue mount, for example), as much as $400-500 for a dedicated long-gun light.
Single point or two point sling depending on use and user preference, absolutely no three point sling. Weapon retention matters. $50-60 for sling and mounting hardware.
Quality magazines. Pmags or USGI mags with enhanced followers. 20 or 30 rounders, no 40 rounders or drums. $10-15 bucks each, get at least 6 to start out with, more never hurts.

Somthing that will improve speed and capability with the right training.
Red dot or holographic optic. Aimpoint, EOTech, etc. $400+ depending on model/options.


More important that hardware, is SOFTWARE. Train, train, train.

mljdeckard
December 15, 2009, 09:38 PM
I'm a fan of just about everything on the Magpul website.

You can get really silly really fast buying optics.

Dr.Rob
December 15, 2009, 09:47 PM
You might get him a .223/5.56 mm boresnake, it's a handy item to have in your range bag. Colts ship with a steel cleaning rod & brushes, just saying it's a useful and inexpensive stocking stuffer.

Lights/grips/optics these are all more 'personal' choices customizing the rifle for HIM. For instance, I have no use for a 3 point or loop sling that hangs off my neck so I can search cars, I use my sling as a shooting aid and as an occasional carry strap. I use 'adjustable leather military type' slings on all my hunting rifles so thats exactly what I wanted for my AR.

Avoid National Magazine like the plague, they are by far the worst sloppy painted crap-tastic excuse for a magazine shaped 'object' ever made. I wouldn't GIVE them away to someone I didn't like.

C-Products USGI contract mags have Mag-pul followers and have a pretty good rep and are even cheaper than P-mags.

You may also try a few different brands and weights of ammo. Those Colts have a fast twist barrel that can stabilize heavier bullets (62+grains, while most Minis shoot better with 55 gr. ammo)

Roadkill
December 15, 2009, 09:56 PM
Get a good cleaning kit and brushes. Can't go wrong with a military one. Next step should be a reloading set up. Single stage press, .223 dies, powder dispenser, shell holder, loading block, powder, bullets, and primers, a good manual, calipers, You can get brass free. Roll your own bullets. Removes a big control aspect of shooting which is ammunition availability.

mohunter55
December 15, 2009, 09:58 PM
ive had good luck with c-products & p-mags. I've bought all of mine through aimsurplus when they have been on sale. I'm thinking i paid $7 something for the c-products not to long ago when they were on special and they usually have p-mags with free shipping. Although there are plenty of other sites where you can find good deals on magazines, just do a few google searches

Texpatriate
December 16, 2009, 12:56 AM
Well. I guess the intended use of the AR is for defense. For when the **** hits the fan type of thing.

For a Colt 6920 configured for defensive use, just about all of the metal parts are quality. Not much to improve in that regard. Here are some other things he can add/change:

Mags- 10 or more Magpul PMags, or quality GI issue aluminum mags (Brownells mags are good too) with good followers such as the magpul followers.

Sling attachments and a quality 1 or 2 point sling such as the Magpul MS2 sling or the Viking MK2, among others.

He would do well to add an appropriate quality optic such as an EOTECH or Aimpoint CompM3, CompM3L, CompM4, or the smaller, lighter T-1 or H-1. I personally prefer anything with Aimpoint on it over anything with EOTECH on it. YMMV

I would personally change out the stock and the A2 grip for whatever his preference is. I like Magpul CTR stocks on rifles that are less front heavy, and Magpul ACS stocks on rifles that are more front heavy or in situations where better cheek weld is desirable. I think its kind of a toss up, so pick whichever one is your preference. VLTOR stocks are good too, but I like that the Magpul stocks I listed lock up tight. For the grip, 95% of shooters will hate the standard A2 grip. Probably will want to switch it out for something more comfortable such as a Magpul MOE or MIAD grip, or the ERGO grip. Hogue grips are good too.

If he wants to add a railed handguard, I would look first at the Daniel Defense Omega 7.0 rail. It is the easiest to install, requires no permanent modification to the rifle and is reasonable at about $250. Once he decides to add the rail then there needs to be some stuff mounted to it to justify it's existance. He'll probably want a foregrip, a light, and some rail covers to protect his investment. The new Magpul AFG (angled fore grip) is coming out in a couple weeks, looks pretty smart, and is only about $35. There is also the Tango Down foregrip, and several others. Lights are another one that can get expensive. Everybody raves about surefire x300 and x400. They should for the price. Streamlight has one similar that goes for about $175. Or he can get a Surefire G2 for $35 and a VLTOR mount for it for about $40. Whatever he wants to spend.

OR, he can just leave it the heck alone and shoot it just like it is, which might be a good idea for a while until he decides what he actually needs and likes. No need to rush out to buy a bunch of crap to put on a rifle that he's never even shot. But, you asked about good quality accessories, so there you go. Hope that helps.

Brian Dale
December 16, 2009, 01:22 AM
Well. I guess the intended use of the AR is for defense.
{snip}
With all the accessories available, it's hard to get a good grasp of what the essential good starter kit would comprise of.Thanks for the clarification. For defensive use, a person wants skill. To my mind, then, the best starter kit is a handful of good magazines (as described above) and cleaning equipment (e.g., Bore-Snake, cleaning rod, some CLP and so forth). Then focus on the motto of our "Shotguns" Forum Moderator, Dave McCracken: Buy Ammo/Use Up/Repeat.

Instruction is good; seek it out. A good, one-piece cleaning rod like the Dewey brand is nice to have ("Thirty bucks for a stick??? :what: Are you crazy?" ). As his expertise grows, your friend can add or change exactly the parts that he decides will more effectively fit the gun to his needs. In the mean time, he's developing skill. Even if he keeps his 6920 in its original configuration (and I wouldn't fault him for that) and buys no accessories but the ammo that he's going to want,I'm trying to convince a friend that buying the actual gun is probably the cheap part....you're still right. :D

Avenger29
December 16, 2009, 01:28 AM
If you shoot more than a couple of boxes of shells per year (and that describes most, if not all, of us here), then the gun will always be the cheap part. The difference is you're paying for the gun outright and everything else incrementally, so the gun just seems to be the most expensive component.

Truth is, I've spent, not counting magazines, about $750 on my first AR in quality accessories and will be spending more as I continue to outfit it to my preferences. A big chunk of that was for an optic (EoTech in particular) and mount (LaRue riser), probably the most I'll spend on an accessory for it, so the painful part is over. Magazines? I've spent about $200 more so far on magazines. And don't even get me started on ammunition, because I have no clue. And I've got a relatively basic setup.

Quentin
December 16, 2009, 02:43 AM
A few months ago I built an M4 style carbine but with a midlength upper. Very basic with removable carry handle but I'm happy with the parts I chose. If you build a rifle you're less likely to need to replace parts. So far all I've need extra are magazines and ammo (which is getting to be quite an expense).

skidooman603
December 16, 2009, 04:00 AM
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn48/gunnerlad/tacticoolAR15.jpg

This is bare ass minimum :cool:

scythefwd
December 16, 2009, 05:07 AM
Iron sights (if they don't come on the AR you are purchasing), mags, and a sling. Give me an A2 clone, and I will hit out to 300Y with irons. Get some ammo and some sight in targets. Have fun.

ROC
December 16, 2009, 03:42 PM
Can you get me a build sheet for that set-up please?

Nevermind, I'll just order one of everything in my catalog

ROC
December 16, 2009, 03:46 PM
Very nice. I learned a lot in this thread.

Basically, a quality cleaning kit, lots of good ammo and mags are gonna be first on the list. Then after that, shoot shoot shoot and go from there.

Guns and more
December 17, 2009, 12:48 AM
Well, I have the same Colt and I like it the way it is.
I bought P-Mags (I think they are the best)
and a bunch of ammo.
I'd like a ACOG sight, but I don't shoot it enough to justify the cost.
And I like the looks with the carry handle. Iron sights for me.

Oh, I have a great idea. Get him a Maglula for loading those AR magazines. It's the best thing ever and only about $25

Avenger29
December 17, 2009, 01:33 AM
Yeah, a Maglula is an utterly necessary piece of kit, IMHO. If you have a rifle for which they are made, get one. Also pick up the pistol magazine loader they make.

RockyMtnTactical
December 17, 2009, 04:31 AM
1. magazines
2. sling
3. ammo. lots of ammo.

Nailed it. If I were to add a fourth, I would say a good optic (Aimpoint, Eotech, ACOG, etc...).

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u87/RMTactical/IMG_6241.jpg

svaz
December 17, 2009, 11:29 AM
What would be the minimal accessories you'd buy for your brand new Colt AR-15 (I think he has the LE 6920) and Ruger mini 14?
I spent 10 years w/ the M-16 and the only thing I would really want for it would be a good reddot sight & a compact scope, both on quick-detach mounts.

Grassman
December 17, 2009, 11:56 AM
Now this is a must have for any AR...

http://www.bloomautomatic.com/

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