[The Tengu]

Alright. Yesterday I was out at lunch with my co-workers and as I was sitting there eating I noticed a guy with a knife clipped to his pocket. No big deal, really. It's always good to notice that kind of thing, sort of an FYI.

Then he turned around and I saw that he had another knife in his other pocket.

Was this guy overdoing it?

It is obviously a better idea having two knives on your person than one knife. From a tactical standpoint, it is always advantageous to have a backup knife, or a BUG.

But as an average civilian citizen, is there a point that is going too far? If that individual was carrying two knives and a Kimber with two extra mags, would that be overdoing it? Or would that be preparedness?

With all this talk of carrying stuff like cane swords, sai, flashbangs, and belt buckle knives, people start to sound like mall ninjas at best. At worst, they sound like members of a terrorist cell. This can be a liability issue as well.

Personally, I feel that the defensive tools I carry daily and legally are adequate and are not over-the-top.

So, how much do you believe is too much?

[Joe Demko]

If it is carried discreetly, I guess I don't put an upper limit on how much I think is "acceptable." If a person feels the need to be a show-off about it, even a keychain knife is too much. This is, of course, also dependent on context.

At some point, I believe that one can cross over into paranoia. Carrying a concealed handgun, a knife (or two) and/or a pepper spray strikes me a s prudent. I can even see having a long gun stored in your vehicle. Constantly going about loaded out like you are going to single-handedly invade Mogadishu strikes me as a tad outre, though.

The biggest sign of things being not quite right, IMO, is when a person concentrates on weapons to the exclusion of other "survival gear." Do you have a gun and 1000's of rounds of ammo in your car, but not a blanket, 1st aid kit, or jack? Do you festoon yourself with weapons but not have a cell phone or even a pre-paid phone card? Do you have a house that has so many guns in it that it looks like a military arsenal, but not enough food in the pantry to finish out the week much less weather a disaster of any kind?

[Smoke]

Lots of people carry two knives...and a gun.

But just from a knife standpoint I don't find that excessive at all. I always carry two knives. One for utility duty...one for emergency.

I am abusive on knives. I keep one dedicated to cutting boxes, rope, cleaning fingernails, using as a screwdriver, etc. The other is saved for a situation where I really need to cut something fast, cinch, seat belt, rope, flesh, etc.

Now if you saw 2 and lets say he had two more knives concealed, and a Kimber, and a bug and 2 extra mags for each, and a camelback, and a surefire, and a streamlight, and a expandable baton, and pepperspray, and a back up pepper spray,.....that might be excessive.

Smoke

[Skunkabilly]

I can see carrying two knives...one for defensive use and one as a beater for opening boxes and cutting other things. But I carry my Leatherperson Wave for the latter, not a folder.

Smoke, what happened to your Possumabilly photos?

[brownie0486]

How much is too much?

It's a personal decision each of us has to ask ourselves as well as determineing what is "too much" for us.

I've been know to carry three handguns, three knives, asp, and cane at the same time. Didn't think I needed that much equipment for the day but carried it anyway.

You would not necessarily know who the person you saw was, perhaps a detective, sherrifs deputy serving felony warrants, maybe a personal aid [ bodyguard ], or perhaps he was none of these and just felt like being an equipment junkie for the day.

When I worked the PD undercover drug buys, I had several knives and a few guns on me if the situation warranted it and I had been there before so I was not going to be searched again, especially when the big buys went down and the raids would be performed as I exited the buildings after signalling the "go".

You never know who the person is, what he is up to, who he works for, etc.

Two knives, one on each side pocket? Hell, that describes me almost everyday as well. I'm ambi-dextrous and see no reason not to carry on both sides, it cuts the odds in my favor if attacked as far as I'm concerned, as I can parry any incomiong and retrieve from the opposite side at the same time if necessary.

I also carry an e2e surefire, victorinox multi-tool on the belt line besides the blades. It's not overdoing it to be prepared. I think it actually begs the question why others do not carry with forethought as to what might take place and act accordingly myself.

Not everyone is an equipment junkie. These types will see me as one who is way beyond the realm of sanity for carrying the above gear on me daily. Ever had someone ask to borrow a knife? If you have only one and lend it out, thats the time Murphy could raise his ugly head and you need your knife right then and there, but alas it's in someone elses hands at the moment of truth.

Forethought goes a long way to keeping you breathing in todays environment on the streets anywhere in the world.

As an example, in training 18 swat types one day, I had purposely put 8 knives on, secreted around different locations. I let them do a "search" to find weapons on me. Two made the search twice. They missed the small crkt folder clipped to the underwear.

I don't think the question should be is that too much, but more "is it enough" for a worst case scenario? Plan for the worst, hope for the best, have a plan, have a backup/alternative plan.

Those who think one knife is sufficient may one day find it was not. Though I hope that I never need one of them to defend with, if I do, it's nice to know that if I drop one, lose one during a struggle, I can yank another quickly from another location on my person and not have to "go to ground" to retrive the only one I HAD in my hands at one time.

Forethought, if it can happen, it will. The only question is, will it be me it happens to. Think like a Boy Scout, be prepared and stay safe out there.

Brownie

[hso]

2 knives is reasonble, even 3 (utility 55 gal drum opener, light utility/nail cleaner, antisocial repellant). Now, if you're carrying enough to pull you down after falling into the river, wellllll, that might be just a little over the top:neener:

I usually carry 2. I often carry 3. It depends on where/when I'm going.

[brownie0486]

hso:

If you are carrying enough to pull you down if you fall into the river, learn to swim better, not carry less knives.

Ya!!!!!!!!!

Brownie

[Ed]

When I was in the military, one day I counted. My benchmade in wasteband, Swiss army knife in front pocket, Knife on my keychain, cause it was always there, Gater on belt, leatherman on belt and Knlfe on my LBE. It was just a coincidence that I had them all that day. I promise I'm not a mall ninja or paranoid.

[MarkScottShow.US]

Well would a Katanna, a Small Battle axe, two handed Battle axe, a bowie, and a folder be over dressed for most urban encounters.....<G>

[Moparmike]

A friend of mine has a broadsword that is taller than he is...:eek:

3 knives is nothing. I carried 2 in highschool. A cheapo leatherman-wannabe from autozone, and a 3.5in pocket folder from Schrade. Just useful tools in school. Had more than one teacher need a screwdriver or a knife. Hell, I busted out a knife when the pencil sharpener went TU. I sometimes carry a Swiss Army knife when it doesnt lose itself in the confines of my desk. :)

Ya know, there are some advantages to going to a small school with some modicum of common sense.

[Dr.Rob]

I'm amazed at the number of folks (who have never been in a knife fight) carrying an emerson cqc folder "just in case".

Or using same $200 tacticool knife as a letter opener. These folks I suspect often have bandaids on their fingertips.

What? Nobody carries a straight razor anymore?

Even more suprising is how few folks still carry a boy scout/swiss army knife.

Granted when I go in the woods chasing the mighty wapiti I'm carrying a lot of blades: Cold steel tanto (my hunting knife), Swiss army knife, Wyoming knife + spare blade, lightweight commercial bone saw, plus a multi-tool in the day pack.

[scbair]

I work in an office environment. It is well known to my associates that I have a "pocketknife." This is a bone-handled, fairly small slipjoint that is frequently used to zip open envelopes and cut packing tape, pry out staples (if not near someone's desk with a staple remover), and such mundane uses.

Known to none of my coworkers is the fact that I have a somewhat larger, always-shaving-sharp, one-hand opener in my other front trouser pocket. When I leave the office and enter my vehicle, this blade is clipped to the front of my waistband, easily accessible while seated/driving.

I have a CWP, and also keep a .45 Auto and 2 spare mags secured in a locked box mounted inside my vehicle (employer outlaws weapons in the facility; the folding knives, legally, are "tools" unless and until deployed as weapons.

It works for me.

[CWL]

Its the people I see who carry two cell phones AND a pager that gets me scratching my head.

[brownie0486]

scbair:

I didn't know knives were regulated by tool laws in SC. Thats interesting as every other state has dangerous weapons statutes whjere knives and their regulations are listed.

You may use it as a tool until otherwise needed, but you may find the state of SC doesn't have tool laws covering knives, but does cover any restrictions of samer under the dangerous weapons laws.

Just something you might want to check on. If in fact knives are listed under tool laws somwhere in your state, I'd like to see the statute.

In your mind it may be a tool, I will be really surprised if you can show me the state doesn't consider knives dangerous weapons though.

Thanks

Brownie

[scbair]

I wasn't referring to a specific law identifying knives as "tools." Unless it's a really vicious or single-purpose specimen, LEOs and prosecuting attorneys don't consider a folding knife a "weapon," unless the knife is used as such (or, of course, if I were to act like a real jerk, it might be an "aggravating" factor). My Benchmade folder would be ignored by law enforcement, even if I drew & opened it in an officer's presence for a routine task.

If I were to use it against another person, it would be considered a deadly weapon; so, of course, would my pickup truck or my ink pen, if used to assault someone.

My point is, even if the folder were to become known to my employer, it would be difficult to justify any disciplinary action. My pistol, on the other hand, is undeniably a weapon; so, it stays outside the office while my folder rides with me.:D

[brownie0486]

Got it, thats a good law you have in SC. I know the weather isn;t bad there either.

Thanks for the clarification

Stay safe

Browmie

[hso]

Brownie,

Nawww, that's what the helmet and PFD are for!

[brownie0486]

HSO:

Nice picture there sir. Looks like nice rapids in that shot.

I'd enjoy that type of thing if it was ever made available to me. Probably kill myself in trying though, novice and all that don't you think?

Do you know Mike Sastre of Rivercitysheaths?

He's big into kayaking, when I was at his house this year, his garage housed at least 20 in different flavors.

He had somwething to do with the US Olympic team entries as well but I'm not sure which years games.

Stay sharp

Brownie

[dav]

Brownie0486 wrote:
it's nice to know that if I drop one, lose one during a struggle, I can yank anotherBrownie,

Excellent point. Despite practice, never having been in a "real" knife fight, I can just see myself pumped full of adrenalin and trying to bring my folder into play, pulling it out of my pocket and having it snag on something and fall right out of my hands. Uh-oh. :uhoh:

Sure would be nice to be able to pull the other one out (while my opponent is still laughing at me) rather than try to pick up the fallen one while being attacked!

[hso]

Brownie,

Met Sastre years ago at SHOT and took him over to Gerber to tell them their sheath for their River Shorty was a POS and Mike made a better one that they should jump on if they had any sense. I've got a boat and my wife bought a "ducky" from him this year and I also got a Gaijin Warrior he had. He tried to get me to go to Riddle this year (several times), but couldn't schedule it. Mike's always welcome at my house.

If you come down this way I can kit you up for a run on a nice little class I, II, III river. The only requirement is that you self rescue and hold onto your paddle while doing it. We'll fish the big pieces out, but loosing a paddle is bad form.:neener:

[brownie0486]

One day with luck.

Brownie

[Mikul]

I sat across from a Miss America contestant having dinner with her family and friends one night. They were from a western state and from all appearances a very down to earth group. When they got up to leave I noticed one guy was wearing BDU pants and a knife clipped to each pocket. I said, "Shooter" as soon as I saw him. Too bad I wasn't able to talk with him.

I also worried what the NJ police would do if they saw him.

[10-Ring]

2 knives is reasonable; 2 knives & a handgun is okay; 2 knives, a handgun & 2 extra mags is okay; 2 knives, a pistol w/ 2 extra mags & a BUG is okay; 2 knives, OC, a pistol w/ 2 extra mags & a BUG is okay....but I"m gonna need a stronger belt!
It really comes down what you're preparing for...Church or Al Quaeda uprising???

[Tamara]

Yesterday I was out at lunch with my co-workers and as I was sitting there eating I noticed a guy with a knife clipped to his pocket. No big deal, really. It's always good to notice that kind of thing, sort of an FYI.

Then he turned around and I saw that he had another knife in his other pocket.

I have two hands and two pockets, so why not carry two knives? Suppose I really need to cut/slice/open something and one hand is tied up?

[carpettbaggerr]

That's why I don't have a clip showing on the outside of my pockets. Too many prying eyes. :scrutiny: I don't want everyone to know what (and where) I'm carrying

[jacketch]

I also carry two knives, almost all the time. Occasionally I have three and less often I might have only one.
One SD knife, one work knife and sometimes a second SD or workknife depending what I am doing.

p.s. one reason Richmond, Virginia is such a great place to live is the class 3 rapids running through downtown. I think it is the only major metro area with them.

[Prodigalshooter]

Yup, two is my minimum as well, but not two swords.:p One SAK and one good large-ish folder is standard, sometimes I'll have a little neck-knife too, like my Spyderco Spot, ot the Hideaway that I have on order from FrontSight. I have had one or two people tease me about the more than one thing tho, one guy I shoot IDPA with thinks it's silly. But, that's why we have horse racing, right?;)

[JShirley]

For several years, I carried a large Cold Steel Voyager Tanto and the small Mini Pal or Ready Edge. I used the little knives for tasks.

[mercop]

I always have a pistol and 4-6 knives. Yeah I have issues - so what. I like knives and guns.

[Al Thompson]

Columbia has a stretch of the Saluda River that's claas 4 or 5, depending on who's rateing. :)

The knife laws here are actually a bit of a mess. FYI, Columbia city restricts locking blades. IMHO, nobody gets charged with the city statue very often, but it's on the books.

[TechBrute]

Now if you saw 2 and lets say he had two more knives concealed, and a Kimber, and a bug and 2 extra mags for each, and a camelback, and a surefire, and a streamlight, and a expandable baton, and pepperspray, and a back up pepper spray,.....that might be excessive. Or that might be Skunkabilly...:D

[Betty]

I'm guilty of using a $200 tacticool knife as a letter opener (not the one in the pic).

Masters of Defense = The Total Absence of Fear! :p
http://www.olegvolk.net/newphotos/tn/absence-of-fear_s.jpg

I'l also tote along this little gem for utility:
http://www.dd-b.net/~betty/misc%20pics/superknife2.jpg

Buy one from hso! :cool:

[Skunkabilly]

Or that might be Skunkabilly...

Nope, can't carry an ASP in California :(

[45+]

Quote:
Now if you saw 2 and lets say he had two more knives concealed, and a Kimber, and a bug and 2 extra mags for each, and a camelback, and a surefire, and a streamlight, and a expandable baton, and pepperspray, and a back up pepper spray,.....that might be excessive.
--------------------

Okay, it's a Glock not a Kimber and I will leave the back up pepper spray AND the baton at home.

Seriously, here in Texas we had two "incidents" that make me stop and consider. The shootings in the Luby's Cafeteria in, um, Waco and the shootings in the church building in Dallas or Ft. Worth. Crazy people decide to kill people in all kinds of locations. I carry everywhere it is legal and I try not to sit with my back to the door. You only have to be unprepared once...

[TechBrute]

The Luby's incident was in Killeen, and the church shooting was in FW.

[45+]

TechBrute:

Thanks for the reminder of the correct locations. I need that more often as the + in 45+ gets bigger.

[mercop]

Is there anywhere you feel so safe in your car that you leave your spare tire at home. If we could determine when we would need it we would just stay home.

[hso]

Betty,

Thaks for the recommendation. The Huskey version of the Superknife is available in Home Depot at such a low price I don't even try to get your little folder anymore, I just refer folks to HD who's price is below my cost.

OTOH, I've got a nifty $700 handmade damascus, Ti, and carbon fiber folder if someone wants to pry staples (office or surgical :evil: ) out in style!

[Betty]

Ah, but I can say, "I bought it from another THR member."

It's a "family" knife. :D

[mantispid]

Hmm.. I think you're "going too far" in carrying weapons when you can no longer move.

[mercop]

I am still agile like a jungle cat, guess I need more hardware. :)

[Erik]

I know quite a few folks who carry two folders and a multi tool. Only one of which is thought of in trms of somethig to ever be called on for defensive purposes.

[TechBrute]

The biggest sign of things being not quite right, IMO, is when a person concentrates on weapons to the exclusion of other "survival gear." Do you have a gun and 1000's of rounds of ammo in your car, but not a blanket, 1st aid kit, or jack? Do you festoon yourself with weapons but not have a cell phone or even a pre-paid phone card? Do you have a house that has so many guns in it that it looks like a military arsenal, but not enough food in the pantry to finish out the week much less weather a disaster of any kind?
This has to be one of the best points I've heard in a long time about "how many guns is too many" or similar.

[mercop]

Kinda like when people ask me what kind of should they have for home defense. I ask them if they keep a flashlight next to the bed. If they say no, I tell them to work on that first.

[Anthony]

Personally, I believe arming oneself is a personal matter and have never passed judgement on anyone for being too extreme or otherwise since someone judged me for carrying two handguns and a Spyderco as paranoid.

Use good judgement in selecting your gear.

Practice the color codes.

Act when you must.

And you will survive.

[Mannlicher]

so we are now going to decide how many items another person can carry?
First we pass judgment on IF they should do something, and now we want to decide on the depth of their involvment?

Best if we all care for our own needs, and not worry about the wants and needs of others.

[The Tengu]

ROFL

Thanks guys, you rock. :D

[Glamdring]

" Armed to the teeth? Or just being prepared. "

I don't think you have ever been to a TFL or THR get together! :neener:

I have only been to two, on the short and lightly armed trip I had a rifle, couple of handguns and at least couple of knifes (not counting the hatchet in the BOB in the trunk).

On the longer trip went with a buddy and we had my Scout rifle and 12 gauge and his AR for long guns. And at least two handguns per person, might have been more I can't remember for sure :D

:

[Wanderer]

Some people carry two guns in case one fails.

Why should a person who carries two knives be considered paranoid.

If he did have the misfortune of getting into a knife fight, and had his strong arm hurt, he could draw the spare with his weak hand. Just preparation for an unsavory possibility.

[Mr Jody Hudson]

I have a PC, laptop and Palm... is that too much?

Cold Steel Voyager, Swiss Champ, lock Rooster, small slipjoint, clippers, Blue LED, Surefire, Bic lighter, two pens, THREE credit/debit cards and cash, cell phone, Leatherman Wave, keys and button opener for car, bandana, digital camera, watch with compass on band, a couple of other "tools", Bic lighter, 2 oz. 99% alcohol in squeeze bottle, dental floss, pocket toothbrush, flat roll of clear duct tape, flat hair/beard brush, note pad, pepper spray... in my pockets. Lots more in my shoulder bag with the laptop, printer/scanner.

The reason I travel so light is that I'm not really an outdoorsman anymore and I have the rest of what I might need in my car and I'm always near or in my car (it has extra capacity springs, air bags, air shocks and a big trunk)! :D

[Glamdring]

JHudson: Just curious, but what kind of car? I switched to an "economy" car couple years ago from a '71 Impala and miss the storage space and mass (and a real engine!) of the old boat. Planning to get full size blazer as soon as budget allows.

[learnedmonkey]

Apparently, if you forget about your knife the day you're taking your dad to see the statue of liberty, ONE is too many... :cuss: :banghead:

[Mr Jody Hudson]

Crown Victoria and Mercury Grand Marquis; these are basically the same care by Ford or Mercury and interestingly they are very inexpensive, have high reliability scores and very low resale values!!! Buy used!

They are usually owned by old people and driven gently, although they have serious get up and go. Both have rear wheel drive however, so are not as good in snow and ice as front wheel drive, unless you have technique.

[SapperLeader]

I personally carry a minium of two knives and a multitool. Im not carrying the knives for defense but for utility. My sidearm is for defense. I usually carry one beater knife and one nice knife. Currently im carrying a benchmade griptilian and a 941ti. I usually try to carry knifes that complement each otehr, such as one big and one small, or one nice and one beater. Its not due to paranoia, but different tools for different jobs.