Chinese Security- LEO weapons


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curlyme
January 8, 2010, 07:49 PM
Hi, I'm going with a team to china and I am apart of a two man security team.
I wanted to know if anyone has information on the weapons the chinese police are carrying. We aren't expecting any trouble on our trip but my boss wants me to find out all sorts of stuff so any help would be great.
Thanks.

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Ohio Gun Guy
January 8, 2010, 07:52 PM
You had better do your homework!

LeonCarr
January 8, 2010, 07:53 PM
Check this website:

www.fas.org

Shows everything the Chinese have from nukes to small arms. I would think the same small arms their military uses are used by their police, kinda like the cops in Russia that have Makarovs and AKs.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

Sam1911
January 8, 2010, 07:55 PM
Here's a place to start:

http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg00-e.htm

-Sam

curlyme
January 8, 2010, 07:57 PM
Thanks for the links, I know i better do my research, I just thought i would ask.

exabrial
January 8, 2010, 08:16 PM
Have a safe trip! I'd follow what your passport says, "Avoid breaking local laws, but demand US consul if accused"

PS:
http://www.strategycenter.net/imgLib/20080802_01.jpg

kingpin008
January 8, 2010, 08:27 PM
You had better do your homework!

...Which is precisely why he's here, asking questions.

curlyme
January 8, 2010, 10:13 PM
Ya I was reading that on the passport the other day... do the police carry pistols there?? i know some countries they can't. I know stupid questions but this is a private group I'm with and don't have very many contacts.... Thank you kingpin, exactly

curlyme
January 8, 2010, 10:14 PM
Great pic

jonnyc
January 9, 2010, 12:21 AM
I always found good, up-to-date info here:

http://www.china-defense.com

RedLion
January 9, 2010, 12:23 AM
When I was there I never saw an armed police officer or guard.... or many police to begin with

Jermz1987
January 9, 2010, 12:46 AM
Same here, Ive been twice. Both times I barely saw any LEO, And when I did they didn't have guns.

Stringfellow
January 9, 2010, 02:50 AM
Jermz's experience exactly.

I was there twice in the last 6 months. I don't think I saw any police outside of the airports, and I don't remember seeing any pistols on any of them.

But I did see a lot of baddarse technology such as birdseye infrared scanners and laser thermometers, checking for people infected with swine flu...

beltjones
January 9, 2010, 03:16 AM
I actually saw quite a few cops in Shanghai. None were armed, and they were almost all wearing sort of sloppy uniforms that didn't match what other cops were wearing. I would have thought they were impostors or security guards except that the Chinese nationals I was with assured me they were real cops.

NG VI
January 9, 2010, 03:30 AM
I think some of the Chinese police are issued short barreled revolvers in an anaemic 9mm cartridge, but I think it is a very small number.

legion3
January 9, 2010, 04:33 AM
Here is a bit better of a pic of the Olympic swat team ;)

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x49/roman3/Military/segway-anti-terror_684090n.jpg

faizi
January 9, 2010, 06:08 AM
Chinese police use CF-98 9mm pistol.it has polymer frame and rotating barrel locking system.this pistol is purely china's self designed pistol.i have this pistol and found it very accurate.

Full Metal Jacket
January 9, 2010, 06:45 AM
http://www.texasescapes.com/TexasBooks/Images/ChineseTexasCowboy.jpg

Ohio Gun Guy
January 9, 2010, 07:35 AM
Figuring out what the Chinese Police and Armed forces carry is fine....but....

If you are going to China, they have VERY DIFFERENT LAWS. If I were the OP, I wouldn't necessarily be going to China on a "Security" mission for anyone; except the good Ole' U.S.A. (And then there wouldnt be this posting). They dont play games & take their authority seriously. They just executed a British National for drug smuggeling. Dont go to China and then figure out the laws or expect them to give you a pass due to your passport.

If you want a good joke for the Police / National Security in China....tell them about the Bill of Rights!


Tell our creditors / bankers hello :fire:

REAPER4206969
January 9, 2010, 07:37 AM
Their "serious" police use the Glock model 19.

Ohio Gun Guy
January 9, 2010, 07:40 AM
They could use bb guns....there's enough of them!

wishin
January 9, 2010, 10:55 AM
Been there, haven't done that! When I was there, I only saw military uniformed men with weapons. Do they have a paramilitary police? I don't remember what they were carrying. AK's probably.

LightningMan
January 9, 2010, 11:19 AM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.8x21mm

jon_in_wv
January 9, 2010, 12:44 PM
Their "serious" police use the Glock model 19.

Cite a source for that. And what are "serious" police? Do they have clown police too or something?

REAPER4206969
January 9, 2010, 01:33 PM
And what are "serious" police? Do they have clown police too or something?
Most of their police are unarmed.

GLOCK H.K. Ltd.
3102 China Merchants Tower
168 Connaught Road Central
HONG KONG
Tel.: +852 2375 - 3858
Fax: +852 2654 - 7089
http://www.glock.com/english/index_contact.htm

Canuc Shooter
January 9, 2010, 02:39 PM
Been to Beijing and a few other cities over there twice, they are all around the cities. Just observe the number of well dressed so-called businessmen with their so-called black man-purses. If you don't screw up you'll be fine. China is a great and interesting country to visit. Enjoy

jon_in_wv
January 9, 2010, 04:41 PM
Quote:
And what are "serious" police? Do they have clown police too or something?
Most of their police are unarmed.

Quote:
GLOCK H.K. Ltd.
3102 China Merchants Tower
168 Connaught Road Central
HONG KONG
Tel.: +852 2375 - 3858
Fax: +852 2654 - 7089
http://www.glock.com/english/index_contact.htm

Yeah, thats a distributor in Hong Kong. That does nothing to support what you said. You said "Most SERIOUS (defined as armed by you) carry Glocks" I asked you to cite your source which you apparently can't. Even if cops in Hong Kong carried Glocks that would have nothing to do with main land China. You should really stop spreading ridiculous claims about Glocks.

REAPER4206969
January 9, 2010, 04:50 PM
I did not say "most". What do you think a Glock factory importer/repair facility is doing in Hong Kong? Selling to civilians? Why would Glock go through the trouble and expense of setting up there if the military and/or police do not use them?

# Hong Kong: Special Duties Unit, Hong Kong Police Force.[48]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glock_pistol

REAPER4206969
January 9, 2010, 04:53 PM
Even if cops in Hong Kong carried Glocks that would have nothing to do with main land China.
So that's how it is now?

SaMx
January 9, 2010, 04:58 PM
hong kong is politically and economically pretty different from mainland china

REAPER4206969
January 9, 2010, 05:01 PM
hong kong is politically and economically pretty different from mainland china
Is there a specific part of China that you people approve of? If so I'll see if they use Glock's.

9mmepiphany
January 9, 2010, 05:03 PM
i hate to tell you this, but Hong Kong isn't representative of how the PRC security units are equipped. it has it's own flag and is semi-self governing...it's actually just a back door for hard currency/trade depending on the political climate.

the Hong Kong SDU also used the H&K MP-5 to patol their airport, but you won't see their use in the Mainland.

most "police" you'll see when visiting the major cities are unarmed and are little more than a security guard unit...much like the old English Bobbies.

the only armed "security" i saw when i was last there, were the armored car guards transporting money from a business. the money "carrier" was walking between two guards who had their handguns out and held in both hands (it was some kind of semi-auto pistol). they had the hammers back and were holding them at "low ready" while walking through the lobby of the building

SaMx
January 9, 2010, 05:04 PM
I'm just saying, Hong Kong is politically and economically almost a different country. I wouldn't be surprised if they use different equipment than mainland china.

DC3-CVN-72
January 9, 2010, 05:08 PM
jon in wv, "clown police" that's funny.

SaMx
January 9, 2010, 05:11 PM
anyway
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ministry_of_Public_Security_of_China#Firearms
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hong_Kong_Police_Force#Firearms_and_Protective_Gear
hong kong police carry glocks, mainland chinese police carry norinco pistols.

nathan
January 9, 2010, 05:16 PM
TOkarev and makarov pistol s are still highly used by police.

henry-ctc
January 9, 2010, 05:25 PM
Iīve been there many times. Actually too many.
In HK youīll find policemen carrying SW revolvers, HK MP5 SMG and even Security Guards carry good stuff there. And you feel safe in HK, be sure.
In China cops arenīt ussually armed. Those who are carry semi autos chambered in somewhat .32 ACP size rounds. Dontīt know the round they use but itīs stopping power is... guess.
There are also many SMG chambered in the same tiny round but youīll only find them in airports, police stations and so on.

The only place where I found real stuff, I mean AKīs in 7.62x39, machine guns, anti aircraft guns and much more, was in a military-industrial area in the South of Beijing. It was three years ago.

Anyway itīs not easy to see a gun in China. Better this way.

9mmepiphany
January 9, 2010, 05:44 PM
Dontīt know the round they use but itīs stopping power is... guess.

i would say that judging by the YouTube vids of the hostage situation a while back and the recent civil unrest in ruaul areas, they're using something that works for them

Full Metal Jacket
January 9, 2010, 05:52 PM
I did not say "most". What do you think a Glock factory importer/repair facility is doing in Hong Kong? Selling to civilians? Why would Glock go through the trouble and expense of setting up there if the military and/or police do not use them?

yep, reaper is correct on this discussion. most japanese police are unarmed, but the one's that carry use g19's. it's illegal for civilians to posess guns in japan, so only the yakuza have them lol



Cite a source for that. And what are "serious" police? Do they have clown police too or something?

making statements like "clown police" is simply trying to cover the fact that you don't know what your talking about when it comes to this issue.

9mmepiphany
January 9, 2010, 05:59 PM
yep, reaper is correct on this discussion. most japanese police are unarmed, but the one's that carry use g19's. it's illegal for civilians to posess guns in japan, so only the yakuza have them lol

when did we switch countries in this discussion?

wishin
January 9, 2010, 06:47 PM
when did we switch countries in this discussion?

What the hey, they all look alike.:uhoh:

jon_in_wv
January 9, 2010, 08:18 PM
Not to mention that Hong Kong is a small administrative section of China with a population of about 7 million people. That is like saying that since the cops in one city of the US carry Glocks that proves that all "serious cops" in the United States carry Glocks. You argument is even more nonsensical than your first statement. Chinese police and military have NEVER used other countries weapons to my knowledge. They have always produced their own versions of them to use. They don't use or carry Glocks in China.

I agree they DO sell them in Hong Kong. To claim more based on that is just silly.

REAPER4206969
January 9, 2010, 08:20 PM
China is China.

9mmepiphany
January 9, 2010, 08:25 PM
China is China.

that's what the PRC says about Taiwan too

jon_in_wv
January 9, 2010, 09:07 PM
China is China

Well then. I guess that proves it huh.

Full Metal Jacket
January 9, 2010, 09:35 PM
Well then. I guess that proves it huh.

actually, he's already proven his point.

....what have you proven? besides the fact that you like to jump into threads and try to cause arguments about things you know not about.

Autolycus
January 9, 2010, 09:51 PM
Tag for later.

I believe the Chinese police use a Norinco semi-auto of some sort.

As far as Glock bieng in Hong Kong, well they are just a corporate office most likely. I am sure they ship the pistols to the police and military as well as security clients from Europe.

jon_in_wv
January 9, 2010, 10:32 PM
actually, he's already proven his point

Your kidding right? He has done no such thing. That is absurd. Even if he did prove the Hong Kong Police use them, which he didn't, that doesn't have anything to do with his question. He was asking about CHINA.

Back on topic. Since we have established that the Chinese DON'T use the Glock. What DO they use??

9mmepiphany
January 10, 2010, 01:47 AM
the most common is the Type 54, chambered in 7.62x25mm, which is a copy of the Tokarev T-33.

Norinco QSZ-92 (also known as the NP-20), chamberd in 5.8x21mm, is the current LE pistol, with a revolver as a 2nd tier sidearm
http://www.marstar.ca/gf-norinco/PRC-NP-20.shtm

72IH
January 10, 2010, 01:47 AM
Hong Kong is very different, it has its own currency. The Honk Kong Dollar, which was around 7.2 today compared to one USD.

The Glock may be a knock off there, who knows. They are pretty good at counterfeit Rolex's and the like.:D

NVCZ
January 10, 2010, 03:22 AM
O.k., everyone smell like pee now? The OP, I have to ask first, can you tell us a little bit about why you are on a "security detail" and has your superiors actually defined your role?

Are you an actual bodyguard for another person or thing? I would be defining VERY clearly with my company what my role IS and IS NOT in a foreign country.

Yeah generally the PRC police have no need of weapons because THEY FRIGGIN DIS-ARMED their populace (not yelling at you). Security really depends on where you are going in China. Areas with muslim populations can be in a state of unrest at this time and prone to higher Chinese security force presence. Check the U.S. embassy and foriegn travel websites for updates.

I know this is a good place to start your search for information about your OP, but something doesn't seem right. If you are legit in your request here, I would worry about your employer and their motives. Best of luck...

NVCZ

Sox
January 10, 2010, 11:06 AM
I am with OhioGunGuy on this one. If you were going to China, would you really trust a bunch of us here on THR? Hell, I wouldn't. Also, if you are doing that kinda work wouldn't you have solid professional resources. Seems just too casual for the potential difficulty one could run into. Where is Paul Blart?

spiroxlii
January 10, 2010, 12:24 PM
When I was in Nanjing, I did see police and armed guards. The police who were armed seemed to be carrying handguns, but I didn't get close enough to see what cartridge they were chambered for. The armed guards who showed up when the ATM near my college campus was restocked were much more heavily armed. They had 12ga shotguns, though I did observe one with what appeared to be an SMG or a bullpup assault rifle.

One must remember that China is a big country, and despite the fact that everything is run/owned by the national government, things aren't always standardized. The cops in a rural town might not be regularly armed, and the weapons they use may be old Soviet-pattern weapons. The cops in Beijing or Nanjing or in special areas like Hong Kong and Macau might be armed with more modern Western or indigenous weapons. The chance that you will ever be legally armed as a foreign visitor to China are slim to none. If your boss is going to China and really needs hired security badly enough to worry about how the local LEOs are armed, my advice is not to go to China with him.

Some of the Chinese students I befriended in Nanjing (girls in their 20s) were describing their mandatory military training before they were allowed to enroll in the university where we were studying. Here in the USA, males are required to sign up for selective service. Over there, the girls I spoke with were actually required to take a crash course in basic drilling and firearms handling. The funniest part was when I pulled up digital photos of my SKS and TT-33. Two of the girls said that they had trained on an AK-patterned rifle, but three of them recognized the SKS as the rifle they had been taught to shoot. None of them recognized the TT-33. They said they hadn't been trained with handguns.

X-Rap
January 10, 2010, 12:54 PM
I'm sure in the land of sunshine,bunnys and lollipops there are few police and none of them would be armed or ever have any bad intent.:rolleyes:
Some of you sound like you are talking about some mildly blue state in the USA not that of a tyranical dictatorship.
The police there probably are layered from the neighborhood Barney Fife (clown police) to the secret police that go unseen until called upon to visit some dissident or hacker who is browsing forbiden websites.
It would not surprise me to see the state secret police packing Glocks and many other superior western weapons and tools or pirated copies.
As far as doing a security job in China, if I had those qualifications I would be doing it in a part of the world that the US has much more influence and presence.

curlyme
January 10, 2010, 07:23 PM
NVCZ- I'm actually going to protect a religious missionary group, I won't say what religion but it is illegal to preach. The reason I ask is because there was a church that had 50,000 members that the police raided even though it was government run, 100 some hurt 20 some hospitalized.... Out of the 400 ish people that were there at the time (it was 0300). I am very aware of the laws. I will be going to a city again I can't say where. I am not a part of a large security team this is very low profile and this is one of my first jobs. I don't have the acces to very many contacts in china because 1. This is a small group 2. any body in china I contact can possibly be arrested. If I see anyone in china with a glock I'll let you all know.
Thanks.

Sam1911
January 10, 2010, 07:32 PM
I'm actually going to protect a religious missionary group, ... the police raided even though it was government run, 100 some hurt 20 some hospitalized.... I am not a part of a large security team this is very low profile and this is one of my first jobs. ... any body in china I contact can possibly be arrested.
Yikes...you're going to China to protect a religious groups that violates Chinese law -- against the POLICE? That is ... bold.

If I see anyone in china with a glock I'll let you all know.I don't think we should hold our breath. I don't think Chinese prisons allow their inmates internet access. If you make it as far as prison...

Um. Er. Good luck?

-Sam

9mmepiphany
January 10, 2010, 07:34 PM
make sure you have your affairs in order before you leave

i'm not sure how you can protect a group dealing in illegal activities and if they arrest you, they don't play around...

if you think about it, if you were to engage in a similar activity in this country, wouldn't we call you a terrorist?

Geno
January 10, 2010, 07:47 PM
Dude:

Is this your picture?! If so, your two-man-team's cover has been blown:

http://www.tncyberwalker.zoomshare.com/files/Movie_Stuff/hong_kong_phooey.jpg

Dude, I think I hear your mother callin' you for supper. Better go wash-up. ) Have fun in school tomorrow.

Geno

Cosmoline
January 10, 2010, 08:08 PM
First of all, Hong Kong has a totally different recent history from mainland China. As a British territory for a century its police force has different practices, traditions and weapons.

Mainland Chinese police forces are divided into the paramilitary PAP who look like soldiers and carry military firearms and a traditionally unarmed blue uniformed service. Per the wiki page, the Public Security police have recently started being armed with some kind of 9mm revolver, which looks less than impressive.

http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg199-e.htm

I've never been there, but a family member travels there frequently and echos the comments here about the ramshackle nature of the "local yokel" forces. They seem to be pretty underpaid and ill-equipped. The PAP boys are another matter. Hopefully you'll never run into them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Armed_Police#Mission

Google "中国人民武装警察部队" for some images of PAP

Google "公安部" for images of the security police.

The differences are pretty clear. The PAP are shown with assault rifles, going through intense combat exercises. The militia style police are shown attending conferences, talking to visiting dignitaries, etc.

Onward Allusion
January 10, 2010, 08:11 PM
When I was there I never saw an armed police officer or guard.... or many police to begin with
They don't always were uniforms. In fact, I would venture to say that they have a good number of armed plainclothes blended in.

Sam1911
January 10, 2010, 08:14 PM
So there's this 50,000 person illegal religion and they can't muster enough volunteers from among their own ranks to fight the police?

But, wait, a handful of fresh-faced shiny American youngsters will kick sufficient Chinese police a$$ to allow the other 50,000 to finish their prayers in peace?

I LOVE IT when a plan comes together!

With all seriousness, there's a lot of things in life that are worth living to see. Meeting that special someone, getting married, buying that first house, seeing your kids open their eyes for the first time, seeing them graduate, meeting your grandkids, and rather a lot else.

Or, you could die alone in a foreign land, fighting for a bunch of folks who's religion didn't inspire them with enough devotion to fight their own battles.

I sure hope you're just yankin' our chains here...

-Sam

[Ironically, his last thought on earth may be, "Hey, look, they DO have Glocks! :D]

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