[Victor1Echo]

So I have started to to reload for my 308. I am using Rl15. I was using a 1/2 teaspoon measure, and it was weighing in at almost 40 grains everytime. Other times, what looked like the exact amount would end up weighing 47 grains. My question:

Is the density of every powder particle different?

Are there powders that equate with a physical measure and a weight measure? For example, I think I read somewhere that Varget is somewhat like this, and that people will not weigh it once they have an idea of how much mass a particular load is.

Thanks,

[Galil5.56]

Big problem I am seeing is a shallow wide scoop, and a propellant with flow/packing qualities about as good as a pile of sticks when scooped with your teaspoon. Scoops work best that are deeper than wide, like the Lee ones, or like the ones I have made from old cartridge cases. Also getting into a very consistent routine is absolutely essential in order to get accurate weights, how you dip and strike them, etc.......

[Jim Watson]

A teaspoon, geez.
Well, Elmer Keith said he knew a guy who judged his load by the size of the pile of powder on a sheet of white paper.

Each granule of powder is as close to the same density as the last as possible. Powder is made by extruding long strands and chopping them into granules. Obviously granules cut from the same strand are identical. (British Cordite was not chopped, loads were given in the length of a bundle of strands.)

BUT, that is not what you are seeing. You are not loading by the gravimetric density of nitrocellulose, you are loading by the bulk density of a measure, pile, or spoon full of loose granules. Settling and packing have a strong effect. (We black powder cartridge rifle shooters make use of the fact.)

In factory production and bulk reloading with good equipment, powder is measured by volume, calibrated by weight. A good powder measure won't vary much when adjusted to the desired load and operated properly. A benchrest shooter goes strictly by measure setting, it is common for them to exchange loads in "clicks" on a Culver measure dial instead of actual weight.

Suggest you get a good rotary measure or at least the Lee dippers shaped for consistent scooping of loads. Or just weigh them out.

[bullseye308]

Try a piece of cut down brass with a piece of wire soldered/welded/epoxied on it for a handle. You can adjust the volume by trimming the case to meet your needs. Once you get one made you have to be very consistant every time with the dipping, leveling, everything.

It will work for that powder only, if you change powders or amounts, you will need to adjust the dipper or make another one.

[RandyP]

here's the best $8.30 you can spend if you want to scoop your powder:

http://factorysales.com/html/xcart/catalog/powhan1.html

Or go wild and crazy for $22.80 and get this:

http://factorysales.com/html/xcart/catalog/powhan1.html

[oneounceload]

Get a scale and weigh the charges to get some consistency (and safety) into the operation.

hat people will not weigh it once they have an idea of how much mass a particular load is.


That line of thinking can get you seriously injured......

[Victor1Echo]

I do not want you to think that I am using a regular spoon. I have 2 Lee dippers but they are small, so I started experimenting with plastic measuring spoons. The first one I used was 1/2 teaspoon and it weighed 40 grains on my digital scale--exactly what I wanted. I double checked the weight on my balance scale, and it was 40. I tried another scoop, and lo and behold--40 grains. After that it went from 38- 47.

I WANT YOU ALL TO KNOW I DOUBLE CHECKED THE WEIGHT ON ALL LOADS WITH 2 DIFFERENT SCALES.

THE ONLY REASON I WAS USING THE 1/2 TEASPOON WAS THAT IT WAS LARGER THAN MY LEE DIPPERS.

Settling and packing have a strong effect

Thanks Jim--I think this is what I was after.

But now I am thinking about a video I saw with an old guy using a lee loader, and he just measures the powder out with a dipper. No weighing. And that is where Randy P comes to save the day. Man I love this place and the people here!!! Thank you one and all!!

[Victor1Echo]

Randy, I actully have a Lee auto powder kit, but I have yet to learn to use it. You have given me new inspiration!
Thanks

[1SOW]

The Pro-Auto Disc update is a gift from God. It is scary consistent used properly.

I'm not as thrilled with the consistency of the adjustable charge bar for lighter loads/pistol.

V1E: Use it, you'll really like it for many powders.

Oh yeah! Density and packing is pertinent with the Auto Disc too. Keep the hopper at least half full to get the most consistency.

[Walkalong]

You are not getting anywhere near consistent volumes doing it like that.

We never weighed charges in Benchrest when loading. We usually knew about what weight we were throwing to start the weekend, but did not bother to weigh it. We might adjust up or down a click or two, but not weigh anything, just shoot it on target to check.

We used high quality measures, not spoons though.

[qajaq59]

I WANT YOU ALL TO KNOW I DOUBLE CHECKED THE WEIGHT ON ALL LOADS WITH 2 DIFFERENT SCALES. Sigh of relief..... ha ha ha

[dmazur]

Your statement -

THE ONLY REASON I WAS USING THE 1/2 TEASPOON WAS THAT IT WAS LARGER THAN MY LEE DIPPERS.


and previously, (Galil5.56) -

Scoops work best that are deeper than wide, like the Lee ones, or like the ones I have made from old cartridge cases.

It appears that using a flat measure (like a teaspoon) is inherently inaccurate due to its shape. A "deeper than wide" measure should be purchased, or improvised, if you want consistency. And consistency = safety when reloading.

[jmortimer]

The nice thing about the Lee dippers powder is that once you know what powder you are using - that the powder is not mislabeled or mixed with another powder, you can put away your scale. I use Unique - .45 Colt and .38/.357 only. I buy 8 pounds, dump a dipper load on a scale, make sure it is Unique, and put away the scale until I buy more Unique. It is nice not to weigh powder. Richard Lee strongly recommends loading by volume not by weight.

[qajaq59]

A cut off case or a powder measure. The only difference is that the measure's adjustable. And it's bigger so I wont lose it as quickly. lol

[Walkalong]

When I first started I made one from a 9MM case with a little handle soldered on. I "adjusted" it by cutting it shorter until it gave me the weight I wanted with the powder I was using. I also made one from a .308 case for loading .223. I "adjusted" it the same way.

I soon got a Hornady pistol measure in a used reloading stuff deal, and it was my mainstay for loading pistol for many years. I even set it up to work automatically on my Projector. I bought a Redding measure for rifle soon afterwards as well. (The main stuff in the deal I wanted was the Lee Turret press (origial 3 hole) and the Lyman tumbler)

That used reloading stuff deal included some .44 Spl brass. Naturally I had to buy a .44 Spl (Ya'll understand) and thus began my love affair with .44 Spl.

You could cut down a 30.06 case to load .308, and it would work much better than a spoon.

[RandyP]

To V1E,

That 'old guy' video you are referring to features none other than Mr. Richard Lee himself. If ANYONE on this planet better know how to use a Lee Loader, it's gonna be him -lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeEl9wZyabc