what to do for a Glock 19 I want to shoot competitely


PDA






UniversalFrost
January 17, 2010, 01:11 PM
OK picked up a Glock 19 (killer price) and wanting to shoot it in some matches I go to that are a mixture of IDPA and IPSC and really have no rules on mods to guns like the IDPA and IPSC (some guys run full up races guns and others run bone stock and in all calibers).

I already am going to get either a stainless or tungsten guide rod (captive i think) and was going to get an assortment of recoil springs to experiment (I will be shooting reloads and factory ammo). also going to get a magwell and a 3.5lb connector. looking at other options, let me know what you think I need to do to a bone stock Glock 19...




also should mention the gun came with a lone wolf barrel (and the factory barrel)

If you enjoyed reading about "what to do for a Glock 19 I want to shoot competitely" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
rcmodel
January 17, 2010, 03:12 PM
Learn to shoot it stock, and then decide what mods you might want to do later after you have enough experiance to make calls like that.

Wait and see what the others are using and what works and what doesn't.

IMO: The very first thing all Glocks need is a set of steel sights to replace the stock Flexie-Flyer plastic ones.

rc

S&Wfan
January 17, 2010, 03:27 PM
Get a new barrel that will allow you to shoot reloads with lead bullets!

Sam1911
January 17, 2010, 03:31 PM
rcmodel hit it right on the head. Don't change anything (except maybe the sights and maybe the lighter connector) and put 5,000-10,000 rounds through it. That will give you decent familiarity with what is good and bad about it.

Once you have a little experience with the gun, you'll be in a decent position to evaluate what might help you shoot more accurately/faster and what won't.

Also, you'll by then have an idea of what kind of competition you'd like to participate in (beyond those informal "grab bag" matches you're attending now). When you do get involved in more structured matches you'll find that neither IDPA nor USPSA(IPSC) has a "sky's the limit" policy on gun mods. Don't want to have to "unlearn" your reliance on a bunch of bolt-on crutches when you get to more serious competition.

-Sam

UniversalFrost
January 17, 2010, 09:55 PM
S&Wfan wrote:

Get a new barrel that will allow you to shoot reloads with lead bullets!

already have a lone wolf barrel for reloads (came with the gun)

Sam1911 wrote:

Once you have a little experience with the gun, you'll be in a decent position to evaluate what might help you shoot more accurately/faster and what won't.

Also, you'll by then have an idea of what kind of competition you'd like to participate in (beyond those informal "grab bag" matches you're attending now). When you do get involved in more structured matches you'll find that neither IDPA nor USPSA(IPSC) has a "sky's the limit" policy on gun mods. Don't want to have to "unlearn" your reliance on a bunch of bolt-on crutches when you get to more serious competition.

and i already have IPSC and IDPA guns. this is a fun gun.

UniversalFrost
January 18, 2010, 01:08 AM
also should mention that the trigger is just so bad that I will be fixing it by putting in new springs and a connector then doing some polishing and if that don't work to improve the "feel" (i know it will knock it down to around 3-3.5) then I will pickup a glockworks complete trigger assembly.

also , should mention for all those thinking I want to use this pistol in IDPA and IPSC and trying to give me advice I need to let you know I have much better pistols that I used when I shot IDPA and then IPSC. I am through with those games and the matches I shoot now are for training that combine aspects of both and add a real world twist. No scoring, no timers, just lots of practice with new scenarios each week (we had some new reactive target stages last week that were rather challenging). This gun will be used in the matches because I don't feel like dragging out my race gun or any of my other 1911's and while I shot very well with one of my 92FS's that is fully upgraded, i just never carry that gun as a CCW piece and I want to shoot a gun in the matches that I would actually carry in real life.

also , a stainless captive guide rod and complete set of springs (under and over powered) are on order so I can experiment to see what works best in this pistol with the reloads and factory ammo I shoot through it.

basically anyone providing input, please tell me what you found as a must have or must do for your glock pistol when shooting (recreational, carry, or matches). as I said earlier the trigger is the first thing I am looking at. then might look at the extended slide release and mag release. and of course i am at least gonna ditch the cheap plastic factory front sight (was looking at a few sights and might stick with a heine or similiar to the 8ball sights).

MarkDozier
January 18, 2010, 01:13 AM
The best thing you can do for wanting to shoot a Glock competeily is put in your safe a get a kimber

jigglyjames29
January 18, 2010, 01:27 AM
What I'd do:
Vanek trigger kit
Warren Tactical sights
Extended mag catch
Magwell
Talon grips... or any other griptape-like grips
SS captive guide rod with a 13-15lb recoil spring (experiment)

David E
January 18, 2010, 01:44 AM
and i already have IPSC and IDPA guns. this is a fun gun.

It doesn't look like you really need any of our advice..........

But were it mine, I wouldn't throw on a silly mag well, I'd get an "Internal magwell" as masterfully done by Accurate Iron. (www.accurate-iron.com)

I'd get good sights, like some Warren Tacticals, a G-34 mag catch and a trigger job.

I'd get a holster for it from KyTac (www.kytac.com)

I'd also make sure I had at least 20 hicap mags for it.

Sam1911
January 18, 2010, 08:11 AM
It doesn't look like you really need any of our advice..........


Agreed. U.F., most people coming here asking "I've got a pistol and want to get into competition -- what do I need to change or add?" don't have any IDPA or USPSA experience. And our advice for such folks is pretty standard -- go shoot what you have, spend that mod money on ammo until you develop the discernment to know what will help and what won't.

If you've already got that experience, then sorry to have assumed wrongly -- you probably should have said prefaced your question with some background.

Having said that, David's right on.

BUT, the idea of combining IDPA with USPSA and adding "a real-world twist" doesn't really jibe well with competition add-ons. If you'd carry it in the real world, fine. Otherwise...

-Sam

BlayGlock
January 18, 2010, 08:21 AM
The best thing you can do for wanting to shoot a Glock competeily is put in your safe a get a kimber

Certainly not true in the least. First of all, its a Kimber and will jam on you. Second, tell that to these guys:

http://pistol-training.com/archives/32

distra
January 18, 2010, 09:23 AM
Best thing to do is get the 3.5lbs connector, 3 or 4 good mag pouches, good holster and most important a lot of ammo. Not real need to change recoil spring and/or guide rod will not help your shooting. You might have a spare recoil spring on hand since you don't know the round count on your 19, but chances are good it will shoot a lot more rounds before needing changed. Shoot it this way for a month or two. You'll find those other gadgets will only distract from learning to shoot the 19 in the matches. Remember the good IDPA/IPSC shooters are not fast, they are smooth and efficient almost effortless in their movements. I've been running these matches for 3+ years and the race gun doesn't win all the time, but the best/smoothest shooter does.

The best thing you can do for wanting to shoot a Glock competeily is put in your safe a get a kimber

Farthest from the best thing to do. :rolleyes: You put any Glock or any gun for that matter in the hands of experienced IDPA/IPSC shooter and they will do just fine. Kimber, Springfield, S&W, CZ, etc you name it there is a race gun/heavily modified gun from all these manufactures. Are they better than a Glock, not really. Cost more, look exciting, but function worse in my experience.

Browns Fan
January 18, 2010, 09:48 AM
Quote:
" let me know what you think I need to do to a bone stock Glock 19..."

I'm with the "just shoot it" crowd. I bought my 19 bone stock almost 2 yrs ago and the only things I got for it was 2 holsters, more mags, mag pouch, snap caps, and ammo. Stock trigger is good enough for me, I even like the sights. I shoot mine in IDPA matches.

Browns Fan
January 18, 2010, 09:52 AM
I agrre with distra's comment about Kimbers. Had one, didnt like it (wouldnt function reliably). I wont get another unless it is a Clakamas.

Owen
January 18, 2010, 10:28 AM
I'd improve the sights, go have fun.

Girodin
January 18, 2010, 02:37 PM
It depends on what you want. Is your goal to become more proficient with a practical self defense weapon. Is your goal to be competitive with the guys shooting race guns. There are also concerns of how much you want to spend. There is the whole spectrum from keeping it stock to building a full out race gun. If I wanted the later I might consider selling the G19 for a 17L or 34. There is no right answer just depends on what you are trying to do.

GForceLizard
January 18, 2010, 02:39 PM
don't buy the glockworks trigger assembly. get a vanek trigger.

Zerodefect
January 18, 2010, 03:06 PM
I'm love the Glockworx/Zevtech Fulcrum trigger. Mine came set to a safe but good setting. You have to do a little "gunsmithing" to the drop safety on the trigger so that it'll clear the frame if you have your trigger finger in a less than appropriate spot. Too high on the trigger may make the safety bind on the frame when the trigger is pulled. Not a likely thing, but a little fine tuning to get it just right is worth the time and effort.

I'd recommend:
Lonewolf SS or tungston captured guide rod.
STOCK recoil spring only!!
Stock FP safety.
Zevtech/Glockworx 3.0 or less connector.

Zevtech comp Spring kit which includes:
-lightened fp safety spring, use this
-trigger spring, use this
-lightened fp springs, do not use these except for slow range play. The lightest spring combined with the connector is too light and you can't "squeeze" the trigger for proper accurate slow shots. as soon as pull the trigger the gun goes off, I like more of a squeeze before breaking so I stick to the stock striker spring and lighten everyhting else..

Glockwrx lightened polished striker. it really deos work, I was skeptical at first.

And of course a carefully installed and tuned Fulcrum trigger.

Warren Sevighney sites. I also like Xs big dots on my CCW.

UniversalFrost
January 19, 2010, 10:27 AM
Zerodefect thanks for the response. This is what I am talking about!

for the others. looking to spend around $200 and use it as a CCW piece and shoot in the matches so I can practice actually using a CCW gun on defensive type scenarios.

The tirgger is a must do regardless of whick maker. I took my g19 over to a buddy who has a several glocks and we stripped it completely apart, cleaned the gun , then cleaned again and then ran a little bit of CLP over some of the parts. The trigger was still horribly mushy and set around 7 pounds. but the slide moved a lot easier and the stiker had deeper impacts on primers. I really think the previous owners never cleaned this gun other than a quick field strip, based upon all the crud that came out of the gun.

I compared the tirgger on my gun with several different setups my buddy had and they were excellent triggers (anything from just a rocket connector, to a full blown custom trigger assembly). We experimented with dropping in an aftermarket ghost ultimate connector, then a spring, then the safety spring and they did help a bit, but trigger was still really mushy. he dropped in a factory glock trigger and trigger bar assembly (was a take off from one of his race guns) and man did that make a difference trigger was crisp and had little over travel. he needed to keep the factory tirgger assembly as a spare, so I know what I will be buying soon is a trigger assembly (just deciding on which one to get). and I don't know if i will go with a ghost ultimate or a ghost rocket connector (depends on which trigger i get).

Zundfolge
January 19, 2010, 11:24 AM
Sounds like you already have the hardware sorted out ... now work on software.

Hit the range and start practicing! :D

cjl8651
January 19, 2010, 11:51 AM
What about an extended slide release?

bds
January 19, 2010, 12:03 PM
Congrats UniversalFrost - good to see others having fun at matches :D

I switched from shooting modified 1911s in limited class USPSA to stock Glock 22 shooting production class on a dare from the range master and I have really enjoyed it (and forced me to be a better shooter too)! I shot up to 85% of the limited class shooters with G22 and 10 rnd mags.

Glock has made factory improvements on their models over the years and depending on how old your G19 is (Gen1, Gen2 or Gen3), it will dictate what part you may need to replace. Also, which class are you going to compete in (Limited/Limited10/Production) and major/minor power factor? (probably minor due to 9mm?)

I have shot 10,000+ rounds in my Lone Wolf barrels and they are accurate and reliable with better chamber support.

Newer Glocks have better trigger groups, recoil springs, tigher tolerances and better chamber support on the barrels. Often, Gen3 Glocks shoot better and with improved accuracy. In the spirit of the production class, I run my Generation 3 G22 stock. I have Sprinco recoil reducer/full length guide rod for the G22, but Gen3 captured recoil spring does a very good job. your G19 may have the New York/police trigger since it is 7 lb (Glock standard is 5.5 lb / NY 8.5 lb) and I do not recommend that on a Glock, especially for match shooting - Try any stock trigger or Gen3 trigger group and your mushy trigger will be fixed (as you already found out with part swaps). My Gen3 stock trigger is very crisp and I like it. FYI, for improved double taps with Glock, you don't need to reset the trigger all the way back to the front, just ride the trigger forward enough to reset the trigger and press back for faster and more accurate double taps.

How about magazines? Gen1 mags are non-dropfree and bad choice for match shooting. Gen2 (square notch on top/back of steel insert) and Gen3 (slanted notch) mags are fine, but I recommend Gen3 mags for stronger tubes and better dropfree feature. Shooting longer G17 mags in G19 will help seat the magazines better too (and have more backup rounds for carry).

Extended slide and mag release will help, but change them only if you have problem with yours.

Glock now sells steel sights (front screw in) instead of the plastic ones and I find stock Glock rear outline easier/faster to use than Heine 8 sights (the rear dot tends to disappear when I look for front sight flash) - IMO

And good thinking on the match/carry idea - you fight like you train! ;) Actually, I have been thinking about running the match now with my G27 as my trigger time has increased on it.

Have fun!

Sam1911
January 19, 2010, 12:54 PM
Also, which class are you going to compete in (Limited/Limited10/Production) and major/minor power factor? (probably minor due to 9mm?)

bds, he's already said:

I am through with those games and the matches I shoot now are for training that combine aspects of both and add a real world twist. No scoring, no timers, just lots of practice with new scenarios each week

They aren't playing by any of the usual "Classes" or "Divisions." None of the USPSA or IDPA rules apply, so he can run whatever he wants.

-Sam

bds
January 19, 2010, 01:20 PM
Dang, then it is purely for fun now! Even better.

Brian Williams
January 19, 2010, 04:27 PM
I got a few full Cap mags and a couple of mag extensions, so I have 4 G19 mags and 2 G17 mags, I got 4 Scherer +2 mag extensions and a put them on the G17 mags and 2 of the G19 mags. I also took a Mill Bastard file to my grip and the triggerguard and it is smoother now yet grippier. I took a piece of 1/8 drill rod and put it in the recoil spring guide rod and changed the sights to some 3 dot night sights. Other than these I just need to shoot it more. It shoots where I point it and when I point it right it is very accurate.

Patrick R
January 19, 2010, 07:20 PM
Both of my Glocks needed trigger work.

-3.5 LB conector

-6 LB trigger spring for quicker reset

-$.25 trigger polish job

-Lightened striker

-4 Lb striker spring

-SS rod & various springs to match my reloads

-Hienie slant pro rear sight, Dawson FO front sight (red).

UniversalFrost
January 21, 2010, 09:25 AM
well,

just got off the phone with glock.

The gun is going back to glock for a refinish (the previous owner stripped the slide for a bubba'd duo-tone) and the glock folks said they would also inspect and replace all parts. He also said that since this has the older style extractor they were going to do the mod and install the newer style, along with an extended slide release.

I mentioned the really bad trigger and he said to note that on paper and send with the gun and they would replace the entire trigger assembly (trigger, bar, connector, etc....) also i asked if they would put in a 3.5lb connector and they said to just note it and would be free of charge.

So getting a slide refinished and all new internals for only $45 (including return shipping)... the gun is boxed up and getting ready to ship out today.

JOE

Mad Chemist
January 21, 2010, 01:30 PM
Replace the crappy Glock sites with your favorite aftermarket ones.

How much trigger time do you have with the Glock action?

If you don't have a lot of experience shooting a Glock, I would recommend keeping it as-is upon return from refinishing. Instead of modding it, get a lot of practice "riding the sear" during both slow and rapid fire practice. The Glock trigger is an interesting animal, one of it's primary advantages is the short reset relative to other DA action types.

Since you are an experienced shooter you should be able to master this technique quickly. Once you do, you may not want to perform any mods that decrease the pull-weight of the trigger. From your post I get the impression that this gun is supposed fit the role of a practical CCW/ combat handgun that you also compete with informally, right? If so, I would stay away from lighter springs and metal guide rods, they have a reputation for decreased reliability with little improvement in practical performance.

I don't currently compete in any "gun games", my G19 is for social situations and my primary concerns are reliability and combat accuracy, hence your needs may differ from mine.

bds
January 21, 2010, 03:50 PM
So getting a slide refinished and all new internals for only $45 (including return shipping)

Sounds good! :D

How about the recoil spring? The Gen3 captured spring set is nice ... maybe add to your list if you have the older open spring ;)

DougW
January 21, 2010, 09:24 PM
Replace the sights with XS 24/7 Big Dots and load it up and shoot it. All 5 of my Glocks are set up that way, the G17's being used for 3 Gun Matches.

BlayGlock
January 22, 2010, 12:16 AM
So getting a slide refinished and all new internals for only $45 (including return shipping)...

Dang. Cant beat that.

UniversalFrost
January 23, 2010, 10:34 AM
yeah from what I have read they basically refinish it to like new and many times upgrade to an extended mag release (like on the 17L). then they ship back to you in a factory glock case with all the normal paperowork, lock, etc... .. even read where a few guys that didn't send a mag with the gun ended up getting a new mag sent back with the gun I didn't include a mag when I sent my in, just to see if they will send a new one with the gun).

so my glock is now gone for 6-8weeks, but I just scored a p229 to use while waiting for my g19 to get back.

If you enjoyed reading about "what to do for a Glock 19 I want to shoot competitely" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!