Problems loading 9mm


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LopezEL
January 26, 2010, 10:34 PM
Okay, when I first started loading 9mm on my RCBS Rock Chucker single stage, I grew frustrated and gave up because it was slow and I did not understand the process very well. I then started loading .223 on it after reading and asking buddies at the range. I had no problem loading and shooting my reloads.

I ventured into loading .38 and .357 on the rock chucker with no problem and then bought a Dillon SQDB for $60 off a friend (I know, I pretty much stole it). It was set up for .45 and I have loaded/shot thousands of rounds with the Dillon... I recently purchased a Dan Wesson Pointman in 9mm, bought the expensive SQDB dies and tried to load 9mm again (this time on the Square Deal B).

I suspect that my problem lies in the resizing phase because my reloaded ammo is not allowing my pistol to go fully into battery. Then when I try to rack the slide back to get the bullet out, the slide is VERY hard to pull back. I have measured my bullets against factory rounds and it seems that its the bottom portion of the case that is swelled out a bit.

I figured, "okay, I know what the problem is: its old brass shot through my unsupported Glock 19 barrel". So i tried different brass, new brass, that feeds perfectly fine in my Dan Wesson even without a bullet in the case and yet after the resizing, depriming, etc 75% of my reloads jam my gun. What gives???? I have lessened the crimp, crimped more, used different brass, different OAL, etc. What is my problem? I don't know what else to try. PLEASE HELP!?

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twofifty
January 26, 2010, 10:49 PM
How does your DW deal with factory ammo in the same bullet weight and ogive shape?

Walkalong
January 26, 2010, 11:18 PM
I purchased a tight chambered EMP a couple of years ago. It had the same problem with some of my reloads. (Reloads that worked in every thing else) I now use a 9MM case gauge (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=888465) to check every piece of sized brass. If it fails the gauge, I toss it in the scrap brass bin. I have about 10% of range brass fail the gauge. No big deal. I have plenty of 9MM range brass. Problem solved.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=114165&stc=1&d=1264566765

1SOW
January 26, 2010, 11:22 PM
It sounds like it' a full length sizing problem or an OAL problem.
Crimp has little to do with it: .377-.378 should be fine. Recheck and double check the full length sizing die set-up.
I'm not familiar with your press, but after you triple check the die set-up, size a case and seat a bullet.
Don't use powder or primer, just the bullet.

Remove you gun's barrel and check that the sized case with only the bullet will drop in easily all the way AND the case can be rotated when its in the chamber . If you are loading too long an OAL the bullet will hit the leade/rifling and jamb.

If it's not hitting the leade but still won't drop in, either the die is faulty or the set-up is incorrect.

Hope this helps

Quoheleth
January 26, 2010, 11:28 PM
Yep. The previous two posts nailed it. I have the same problem with my CZ, if I use published OAL info, down to the difficulty to extract. Problem: rounds were too long.

Now, I break my gun down and use the barrel as a check gauge. If it won't seat fully, or it won't fall out of the chamber when I tip the barrel up, I'm not short enough.

Bullet ogive (curve of the tip of the bullet) and where the leades of the barrel begin are probably the culprit.

Good luck, and don't give up just yet.

Q

LopezEL
January 26, 2010, 11:31 PM
The Dan Wesson functions fine with factory ammo. Very accurate gun.

What I dont understand is that I have checked my brass (before sizing or depriming) and it will chamber in the gun perfectly fine. However, after I resize, deprime, seat, and crimp, the case gets bulged near the bottom end. It almost seems like my sizing die is not sizing correctly, or not doing an overall length resize?

LopezEL
January 26, 2010, 11:32 PM
I will try different OAL sizes tomorrow, although I have tried loading them pretty short already. Thanks for the tips.

1SOW
January 26, 2010, 11:45 PM
Quoheleth: I shoot CZ too. :D

Edit too add: Just a WAG, Measure the case length before depriming & sizing, and then again after depriming & sizing. If anything, it should get 'longer' not shorter.

If it gets 'shorter', that's where your bulge is coming from. The die is set too deep. Do the cases 'stick' when you're depriming?

Steve C
January 27, 2010, 03:36 AM
Likely problem is too long an OAL for your pistol and the bullet you are using is contacting the leads and jamming into the rifling before fully chambering.

Solution: check round in the chamber of the removed barrel and see if its fits like a factory round. Shorten OAL until it does.

Other problem could be not enough crimp to take out the case mouth belling. Since the 9mm is a tapered case it can get stuck if the case isn't taper crimped enough to at least remove the belling.

Solution: Adjust dies to apply more crimp.

otblue
January 27, 2010, 06:01 AM
Had the same problem with a tight chambered and very accurate Norinco in 9mm.

No problem at all with factory ammo and only ocassional problems with reloaded cases originally fired in my gun. Hopeless with cases originally fired in other guns especially Glocks.

Problem was not with either long cases or long overall cartridge length but with the design of most modern 9mm carbide resizing dies.

Most modern dies are designed for use in progressive presses and have a very wide radius opening to allow cases to easily enter the die and not get caught on the edge thereby hanging up the progressive press. Dillon dies have the widest radius but current Redding, RCBS and Lee aren't much different.

This results in cases not being sized all the way down and combining this with a tight chamber you end up with exactly the problem the OP described.

I use a case gauge and it does eliminate most of the cases that will cause problems but not absolutely everyone as my chamber is that tight.

Two solutions I have found. Either find a die that sizes all the way down, a current Lyman die works for me as does an old RCBS one, but both are a pain to use in a progressive, or use the Lee carbide crimp die in the last die station. Amazing how many cases coming through the reloading process get post sized at the bottom of the case confirming that the original sizing die failed to adequately size the cases.

Because the case now has a projectile in it which guides the round into the die, there is no problem of hangup.

Walkalong
January 27, 2010, 07:51 AM
The steel dies size a lot farther down.

LopezEL
January 27, 2010, 12:46 PM
I just got back from shooting this gun and tried various ammo. Ive concluded that its a problem with the gun and not the ammo. I tried factory ammo, they still don't chamber consistently. I can't go through a magazine without it jamming. My reloads are no good and a friend at the range who reloads gave me some of his to try but they did not work either. The chamber has to be out of spec.

rfwobbly
January 27, 2010, 01:18 PM
Lopez -
I feel for you buddy. I went through this exact same thing when I bought my first CZ some years ago. It can be frustrating. As stated above, there are generally 3 problem areas. In order they are....

1) Improper taper crimp to remove the belling. I try to achieve .002" less than the SAAMI measurement of .380" at the case mouth. I'm using .378" in a very tight CZ without issues.

2) Improper OAL. Dan Wesson is made by CZ, and if the chamber meets the CZ specs you have to worry about ANY bullet that brings the .355 diameter out past the mouth of the case. This would be any kind of conical nose FP. Start with 124gr Berry plated, which will work at 1.169" OAL in my CZ just fine. Then learn how to determine OAL for a particular bullet in your chamber. On my CZ chamber I have to ignore all the reloading manuals as to their OAL recommendations when using FP bullets.

3) If you use range pick-up brass, then you might have gotten hold of some 9mm brass used for major PF, "355 Super" or other such high power loads. In these instances, the brass expands at the rim beyond the SAAMI dimensions and will also jam half-way into your chamber. As such it mimics too much OAL. As Walkalong said, these are very EASY to spot using a 9mm case or cartridge gauge. For $12 it's the best insurance you can have. You can get these gauges at Midway, Dillon or any fully-stocked reloading site.


Try your gun again with Winchester White Box or some other common, suitably powered ROUND NOSE practice round. Dan Wesson is one of the nicest made guns around. I fully believe the issue is with the ammo you're using and NOT the gun.

All the best.

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