[TASimpson]

I bought this 12 gauge from a coworker because he said he needed some quick cash and I had been thinking of buying a home defense shotgun anyway. I payed him $175 cash as is with no other info about it. He said he bought it new and had shot a box of bird shot through it. It had stayed in his closet till I got it. I've shot several 5 count boxes of 00buck and one box of slugs. The barrel is stamped "2 3/4 or 3 in" shells. I would like to pick you-alls brains about this shotgun and would appreciate any info, opinions, or comments.

Thanks.

[19-3Ben]

Do a search. There are lots of threads discussing this shotgun, especially as it compares to the Remington 870, of which it is a copy.

General opinion is that it's a very sturdy and well made gun for the money. Many don't like that it's a Chinese copy of a classic American design.

[md7]

19-3Ben pretty much hit it. seems like alot of folks swear by em far as reliability is concerned.

some do not like that it is a chinese copy of the remington 870. all economical, political, pro american, or anti chinese thoughts aside, it should reliably sling buckshot downrange.

[RevolvingGarbage]

I have the same gun. Basically it is everything a good pump shotgun should be.

You got a decent deal. I bought mine for ~$190-$200 brand new a few years ago, and prices have gone up. $175 in fair condition with no issues is about going rate.

Also, the brand of buckshot you have happens to be my guns favorite so far as far as patterns go. Enjoy!

[jmortimer]

It is a good gun at a great price. I just paid $200.00 for a new one plus tax and other fees - from my perspective you got a good deal. I doubt anyone ever regretted getting a Pardner.
Max100 knows a lot about these guns and essentially it is a copy of an 870 - total parts compatibility and barrel compatibility with minor adaptation. H&R did it right and I intend to buy another.

[Fred Fuller]

TA,

Seems like a decent deal on a decent shotgun. As has been said, it's e clone of the venerable 870, Chinese made, and some sell it short for that reason alone. I got one a while back, just so I could see how well put together they are and if parts/accessories from 870s would fit. I've been horsing it around some in intervening weeks, and so far so good. Of course, it'll take 20 or 30 years to really know if it's as well built as an 870, but so far no problems.

The main thing is to learn to run the gun. Fighting with a shotgun is a different order of business than shooting one at the range or in the hunting field. At least, avail yourself of some of the excellent videos out there on the fighting shotgun (I'd suggest Louis Awerbuck, Clint Smith, or Tom Givens for those) and, when time and circumstances permit, get in a basic shotgun class from whatever good instructor you can locate. Your skillset is the most important thing about that shotgun, or any shotgun, that winds up in your hands at a critical moment.

Stay Safe,

lpl

[jlv08]

I've taken some lumps defending the quality of the Pardner Pump by NEF.

Some folks call it "cheap Chinese junk" and if the truth be known, those folks probably have never held one in their hands.

There is a lot of anger toward goods from China and while I respect others feelings as to their beliefs, I remain objective when it comes to firearms.

I have had and have several weapons from Russia and China that are excellent firearms and reliable as gravity.

The Pardner Pump is a commercial shotgun built to NEF's specs and is a very well made field shotgun.

I had the 12 ga. in walnut and blue and it was a robustly built firearm. I let it go to a friend who is happy with it. It was a bit heavy for me.

I have the 20 ga. Compact with 21" barrel and simply love the gun.

It's bone stock and shoots very well.

You didn't hurt yourself at all with your purchase but don't expect to find a whole lot of love for the Pardner Pump for the reasons previously mentioned.

[MAX100]

You can't go wrong with a Hawk Ind made shotgun, Hawk 982 or NEF Protector.

Savage/Stevens has a Ithaca 37 copy coming out soon called Stevens 350. I believe they are made in China because the retail price is about the same as the 982 & Protector. It would be nice if they are made by Hawk Ind.


GC

[jlv08]

There was a version of that gun a few years back and I wonder if this is the same gun reconfigured to fit and finished as specified by Stevens. :)

I looked at one some time ago and it was 139 dollars and that kinda scared me off. I thought it was a cheap copy and now I wished I would have rolled the dice on that gun.

[Ben86]

I have one and I love it. What drew me to the gun was the compact size, 870 similar controls, and low price. Honestly I did have to send mine back for a new feed latch and a chamber polish about a week after shooting it. The repair was free and had only a three week turn around. However, since then it has been 100% and I don't at all regret paying the $189 NIB price for it. To me the recoil is pretty light for a compact shotgun. I believe this is because of the hefty weight and nice recoil pad. It's a great all around HD shotgun for someone on a budget.

[Big Bill]

I'll gladly pay the price difference for a real Remington or Mossberg. It's political for me. I just can't patronize a country that uses slave labor to manufacture the goods it sells. In my experience, there's only about $100 difference between a cheap gun and a good quality alternative.

BTW, I understand that for some people their is no alternative because times are tough and money is in short supply. But, since I can afford to be picky, that's what I am.

[jmortimer]

Since you have never owned a Pardner and apparently never will it is ignorant to state that the Pardner is "a cheap gun" and that for $100 more you get a "good quality alternative." The Pardner is a "good" gun - you may not like that but that is a fact for every one who owns one. We all owe H&R, Marlin, and Remington thanks for offering such a good gun for a low price.
Thank you H&R, Thank you Marlin and Thank you Remington.

[Big Bill]

...it is ignorant to state that the Pardner is "a cheap gun" and that for $100 more you get a "good quality alternative."I didn't specifically state that the Pardner Pump is a cheap gun. But, since you broght it up, it actually is a cheap gun. Some say it is a good cheap gun. But, lots of people also say that a Hi-Point is good gun. Maybe it is? I'll never know - because I'll never buy one.We all owe H&R, Marlin, and Remington thanks for offering such a good gun for a low price.I think you ought to thank the Chinese slave labor force for providing such a "good" gun for such a cheap price.

[jmortimer]

Don't tell me you drive one of those full size Dodge Trucks made in Mexico. Are you asserting as a fact that the H&R/Marlin/Remmington Pardner is made by "slave labor" or is that more speculation. Right, you have no idea just a general idea that there is slave labor in China. I bet every employee at Hawk Industries is grateful for their job. I love people living high on the hog hoping that world wide commerce will fit into some neat little package. And by the way, why would any sane person making the argument you are making say they would rather have a "real Remington" when Remington is behind all of this in the first place. Why not throw Remington, Marlin and H&R under the "slave labor bus" as well? Right - that would make sense. Thank you Hawk Industries.

[reckless carolinian]

All things considered, if its the only shotgun in the house, then its the best one in the house. As long as it goes BANG when called upon, does it matter where it came from? Is the bad guy(god forbid it happens) know that its not an 870? Some folks get whatever comes along first that will fill the role. I did. Just so happens that I got a 500, and I love it. This person got a NEF Pardner. As long as she'll answer the call of duty, I see no problem. It's been said better by wiser men than me, but isn't rule 1 to have a gun?
Is this gun unsafe? Is it of substantially lesser quality than an American made Shotgun in a similar price range?

[jmortimer]

Right - I would never slam someone for buying a particular gun. Get what you want. Shoot what you want . I had a Mossberg 590 with GRS and it was a good gun. Please be consistent and not bang on someone else for no good reason.

[Big Bill]

Are you asserting as a fact that the H&R/Marlin/Remmington Pardner is made by "slave labor" or is that more speculation.Yep! It even says "Made in China" on the damned thing.Americans can be a frugal lot. We always seem to want something for less than it is worth. The results of that are found in every gun shop across the country: we really dig the cheap stuff, evidenced by Chinese pump guns (H & R Pardner, ugh!) and the bastardization of once great names such as L. C. Smith.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/turkish_invasion.htm

Let there be NO doubt about it!Qiqihar Hawk Industries Co.,Ltd.

XU

[China] Posted Date: November 29, 2006

Qiqihar Hawk Industries Co., Ltd., located in the Industry City of Qiqihar in North of China, is specialized in designing and manufacturing of shotguns. It was established in 1954 and had been certified as an ISO9001:2000 enterprise in 2000. The brand was awarded as the most famous brand among China shotgun industries by the Ministry of China Industry.
With advanced produce and testing equipments and a group of research talents, the company has a mass production capacity. So far, we have developed hunting guns, sporting guns and protection guns with more than 20 models. Those models including single barrel, semi-auto, super magnum, pump action etc. Especially, our newly developed Over and Under shotguns, are highly honored among domestic and overseas customers. The products have been exported to more than 20 countries, including USA, European, Middle East and East Asian.
Be honesty and credible, keep exceeding ourselves ; is our principle. We d like to keep improving the quality of our shotguns and cooperating with our friends from different countries and areas and sincerely hope to make mutual benefits between us.


http://www.tradekey.com/profile_view/uid/470083.htm J - you're sure taking this personal, aren't you? I never slammed anyone for buying a PRC pump. All I said is that I will never buy one. I buy other items produced in other countries. I just won't buy a gun that says "made in China" as does the PRC Pump.

I personally don't give a damn what you buy or, for that matter, think. I just don't want to feed the mouth that is eating me/us. If that isn't a good enough reason for you, then too bad.

[chevyforlife21]

awesome gun mine had 600 rounds with no jams and a very high quality feel

[Almond27]

lol Big Bill do you always have to bash the pardner because its made in china it might just save some American's life some day. A made in China shotgun is better than no gun at all.

[eldiabloe1]

I started with one and then two. Some how the little bastards created a third one! I keep them as truck guns and havent had any problem with them. 00 is hell on varmints and the gun is cheap enough that I won't lose too much if some thief breaks into my truck.

[BCCL]

Can anyone here actually document that "slave labor" is involved in the making of these guns, and I don't mean just make a blanket statement that it is because "it's made in China", but actually prove it about these guns?


I've got the same gun, plus a .20 gauge pump, and both have been flawless.

[Snarlingiron]

Big Bill, I like the way you think. They keep score at the bank, and if anyone bothers to check, China is winning right now.

I know there is no choice much of the time as far as buying Chinese products is concerned, but when I have a choice I choose to buy products made here.

I have handled some of the Chinese guns, and there is nothing wrong with them, I just don't want my dollars going to China when I can help it.

My money, my choice.

[broken]

yeah,i used to balk at chinese made,till my wife showed me 90% of the stuff in my house is from china or taiwan or malasai,i shoot a old 1200 riot,i almost bought a chinese 870 copy,wouldnt hurt my feelings none,for a defense gun,just this load of dirty winchesters was cheaper that day.

[Big Bill]

Can anyone here actually document that "slave labor" is involved in the making of these guns, and I don't mean just make a blanket statement that it is because "it's made in China", but actually prove it about these guns?So, let me see if I understand you. It is OK to buy a PRC shotgun IF it cannot be proved that it was made by slave labor? What convoluted logic do you live by?

BCCL - check these stories out:

Child Slave Labor in China (http://ihscslnews.org/view_article.php?id=57)

Slave Labor in China Sparks Outrage (http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1635144,00.html)

How China Hides Its Slave Labor From the Free World
Wes Vernon
Saturday, Jan. 11, 2003

Editor's note: See part one of series, Americans Fund Slave Labor (http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/1/8/191237.shtml), and part two, China's Nazi-like Genocide (http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/1/9/202829.shtml).

WASHINGTON – The biggest cover-up in the long parade of Clinton scandals was probably the sell-out to the communist Chinese. Harry Wu had a front-row seat on that tragedy, from the inside of Chinese labor camps.

In his book “Troublemaker,” published by NewsMax.com, Wu compares those living hells (or laogai) to Hitler’s concentration camps.

The trade with China, paid for by Americans who are finding it harder and harder to find merchandise they want that does not bear the “Made in China” label, was already in force when the Clintons came to Washington. After they saw the political benefits to be had for selling out, the relationship took off like a rocket.

Thanks in large measure to the Clinton White House's cover-up, we do not know to this day the full story of Chinese espionage that enabled them to gain access to U.S. nuclear weapons know-how through the theft of highly sensitive classified data on sophisticated warheads or the missile-related technology that was compromised.

But Harry Wu saw the Clinton/Beijing relationship from a deeply human perspective: the blue uniforms and shaved heads in Chinese prison camps.

For years, he had been one of the estimated 50 million blue uniformed “troublemakers” who had worked in the camps under totally inhumane conditions. Some of them literally worked themselves to death.

The forced labor had turned out for the American market such items as rubber-soled shoes, boots, kitchenware, toys, tools, men’s and women’s clothing, and sporting goods.

What really bothered Wu was that in 1992, candidate Bill Clinton had criticized the first President Bush for being too lenient in regard to China’s human-rights behavior. Yet in his first year, he renewed China’s trade benefits. True, he attached some strings to the deal, including insistence that China abide by a 1992 agreement banning the export of prison labor products to the United States.

But much of China’s forced labor is carefully hidden from the Western World. A 1992 “white paper” issued by the Chinese regime in defense of its labor camps raised more questions than it answered, as far as Wu was concerned.

For example, he asks, “[W]hy do they put phony names on their prison camp factories, as if trying to conceal the profitable use of forced labor?”

At one camp of lost souls hunched over their machines, stripped of their identities (in some cases for decades), the security officer was asked if he could guarantee the quality of his products.

“No problem,” he answered. He then cited an example of a German manufacturer who bought steel pipes from the camps, and labeled them as being made in Germany. So the products were good enough for the Germans. “How about that!” he marveled.

'Getting Wise'

A manager at Shanghai’s Laodong Machinery Plant, where hand tools were made, boasted that because the U.S. Congress had recently made “quite a fuss” about the prison camps, he and his bosses had devised a way to get around the problem.

“We always go through the import-export company,” he said, meaning they set up companies to handle the shipment of goods. That way, as Wu explains it, “nobody quite knows where the goods came from. These guys were getting wise to the ways of the world.”

This wording in a law on the books in the U.S. for decades specifically forbids the importation of products made by slave labor. Wu cites a little-known section of the 1930 Smoot-Hawley Law. That controversial measure is widely known for having imposed a high tariff in an attempt to protect American jobs during the Great Depression. Critics say it made the Depression worse.

The tariff section of the law was changed by the Reciprocal Trade Act of the 1930s. But the anti-slave-labor section is still “the law of the land.” It specifically bans importing anything made by forced labor. Its final paragraph reads, “Forced labor, as herein used, shall mean all work or service which is exacted from any person under the menace of any penalty for its nonperformance, and for which the worker does not offer himself voluntarily.”

The law is routinely violated or circumvented, in part because of devices used by the Chinese (such as those cited above) to hide the true origins of the products, but also because of political pressure on politicians here at home not to probe to deeply into the matter. As Wu bluntly puts it, “Many American business people do not know - or do not want to know — the implications of purchasing forced-labor products.”

When the Clintons ascended to power in the White House, ignoring those “implications” became de facto policy in Washington. We will discuss that next.

http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/1/10/200712.shtml

BCCL - If you have any doubt about slave labor in China, just google the topic and see for yourself.

Almond27 - I agree that a Chinese gun for some is a good thing for those who cannot afford anything else. Sheesh, didn't anyone read my initial post?

As a Christian, I have to try an live by this admonition:

Malachi 3: 5
5 And I will come near to you to judgment; and I will be a swift witness against the sorcerers, and against the adulterers, and against false swearers, and against those that oppress the hireling in his wages, the widow, and the fatherless, and that turn aside the stranger from his right, and fear not me, saith the Lord of hosts.

I didn't try to make a fuss in this thread. Just to express my opinion of what I personally do.

[BCCL]

Hey Bill, would all that not apply to your using a PRC made computer as well?

You've been asked twice to prove your claim these guns are made with "slave labor" and have curiously enough not only not done so, but start slinging mud to deflect from the fact that you can't back that claim up.

I read a book once, that had something about "not bearing false witness".....

I suggest that before you comment on what "convoluted" rules you think someone else may live by, you check a mirror.....

And I don't want to hear anything about "I don't have a choice when it comes to computers, I have to use them"...no in fact you don't. If your convictions were as devout as you claim, you could choose to make a stand that would actually cost you something and boycott them entirely.

That would carry more weight on what you "actually do"........

The truth is, the more the Chinese have traded with us, the more they have moved towards freer markets, which is a good thing. Are they perfect no, but change takes time, isolationism won't help.

[BCCL]

My apologies to TASimpson, you asked some decent questions about the guns, and your thread got drug into the mud.

In my experience, as someone that actually owns and uses 2 of these guns, they are very good quality and work great. I successfully took a deer last year with my .20 gauge one, and my .12 gauge has held up just fine under a diet of entirely 00 buck and slugs without a hitch.

Enjoy your gun!!

[TASimpson]

Thanks to all who have posted and all of this interesting info. Actually I don't mind where this has gone and if I did not have to leave for work like ten minutes ago I would interject some of my families opinions right now (maybe tomorrow before work). We are american and have american friends who followed work from NC to Hong Kong and the subject of economy and communism has come up before. It is freedom to bear arms and freedom of speech that made this thread even possible and thats the most american thing of all. And to think that a Chinese made gun, poor economy price friendly arms, and the God given right to defend oneself lead to this discussion is fantastic. I have to go but please keep posting.

[Fred Fuller]

Well said, TA!

lpl

[Big Bill]

BCCl - nice rant. I had already guessed that you owned a PRC shotgun. I guess you have to justify it somehow. But, in reality, I could care less about what you do and buy. The only person I can control is me. So, I don't buy anything made in China as a matter of how I do things. Have I ever bought something made in China - yes. Will I ever again buy something made in China - yes. But, I will try hard NOT to do so.

If the product was made in Taiwan, I'd have already bought one. BTW, I love the Chinese people. Three of my kids are married into that race and society. I have several euroasian grandkids that I love dearly. And, it pains me that so many Chinese people are slaves in China. To me, anyone who lives in a Communist country by definition is a slave; they are slaves of the state. And, anyone who can't see the real issue here is blind. Taking advantage of low cost slave labor eventually ends with the consumer. I don't want to contribute to that system in any way. Perhaps someday that may mean that I won't buy any guns.

[BCCL]

I don't have to justify a thing to you Bill, I'm the only one of us that's actually being honest. You rely on Chinese made products every moment of your life, whether you have the intellectual capacity to know it, or the intellectual integrity to admit it. Everything you said about slave labor in China, applies equally to all the products you buy, now and in the future, so throwing out the things you said to me and others on here was nothing more than hypocrisy.

Refusing to buy Chinese made products, will not help those workers in China one bit, but increasing trade and Capitalist concepts already has and will continue to. Both China and India have seen great economic expansion, by relaxing government controls and allowing more free market ideas, not by slave labor. We want them to continue that don't we?

[jakemccoy]

I got one a while back, just so I could see how well put together they are and if parts/accessories from 870s would fit. I've been horsing it around some in intervening weeks, and so far so good.

So parts are fitting OK?

What parts have you tried (or not tried)?

[Big Bill]

BCCL - I don't expect you to justify anything. Enjoy your PCR pump shotgun. I don't own any Chinese guns myself. I don't own any Chinese knives either. And, to my knowledge, I don't own any Chinese JUNK that my life relies on. The only thing that you've been honest about is that you contribute to the ongoing slave labor situation in China through your purchase of the JUNK the commies sell that they force their slaves to make. Good luck with your ongoing self-deceit.

Hey Pal, I've got an idea. Why not let the thread proceed as the OP intended? I've had my say.

[jlv08]

The Pardners and the Hawks are catching on and folks are buying them and are happy. Pretty soon, the naysayers will be singing in a hurricane ,if they aren't already doing so.:D

Hijacking a thread is discourteous to those trying to enjoy a discussion of what ever firearm is the topic to make a political point. :banghead:

[Izzy77]

Good rep. Solid gun, good buy.

That is all this second hand buyer should be reading.

[Hunterdad]

I love reading about people bashing Pardner Pumps. It reminds me of the gun snobs from the range. Let me put it this way:

I bought this for $550
http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r197/adam11082/DSCF0704-2.jpg

And this for $179
http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r197/adam11082/DSCF0732.jpg

The latter is the better gun....hands down. They were made a year apart. I don't care where it was made, lets be honest, the US makes some crap too.

[BCCL]

Like I said Bill, your purchasing and use of Chinese computers does the same thing you accuse others of doing, so your nothing more than a flat out hypocrite.

If you can convince yourself otherwise, then self-deceit is something you seem to have personal experience with.

[broken]

hunterdad"love that thumbhole stock on that gun,thats a nice pair of shotguns,o yeah,i collect knives and 90% of them are chinese,im sorry to say i cant afford a high dollar american made knife.but i have a few.

[Hunterdad]

hunterdad"love that thumbhole stock on that gun,thats a nice pair of shotguns

Thanks man. The stock is really comfortable and handles like a bench rifle. I love me some shotguns!

[amd0709]

my husband and i recently bought the same shotgun last weekend. when we got home naturally we played around with it. the guy that sold it to us at academy said it held 5 shells but we could only get 2 in so we looked it up online and found one website that said it isnt normal and should hold 5. so my husband took it apart and instantly 2 long pieces fell out when he pulled the trigger part out. looked up on youtube a disassembly video and that didnt happen to every person we watched. then my husband got it back together after trying for 2 hours because those two metal parts wouldnt stay....one goes on each side in a track sort of thing of the trigger part...and now its stuck and we cant put the rest of the shotgun back together...anyone have this happen or do we just have bad luck??

[MAX100]

instantly 2 long pieces fell out when he pulled the trigger part out.

It sounds like the shell latches fell out. They will need to be restaked. I had one Pardner Protector that I was doing for a customer that the shell latch fell out. I restaked the latch and it was good to go.



GC

[Onward Allusion]

My wife and I were shopping for shotguns to start shooting trap. We handled Mossbergs, Remingtons, & H&R/NEF's. Believe it or not, the NEF Pardner Pump with the ventilated rib, walnut furniture, & pakerized finish had the best finish. The Remington 870 Express had laminated furniture and the Mossbergs had hardwood and synthetic. We picked up the H&R/NEF, btw.

Also, do y'all know that Marlin, H&R, NEF, & Remington are the same dang AMERICAN company??? I would rather have my money go to an American company any day.

[Hunterdad]

my husband and i recently bought the same shotgun last weekend. when we got home naturally we played around with it. the guy that sold it to us at academy said it held 5 shells but we could only get 2 in so we looked it up online and found one website that said it isnt normal and should hold 5. so my husband took it apart and instantly 2 long pieces fell out when he pulled the trigger part out. looked up on youtube a disassembly video and that didnt happen to every person we watched. then my husband got it back together after trying for 2 hours because those two metal parts wouldnt stay....one goes on each side in a track sort of thing of the trigger part...and now its stuck and we cant put the rest of the shotgun back together...anyone have this happen or do we just have bad luck??

You should ALWAYS read the owners manual before even taking the gun out of the box. I can't stress that enough. It really is too hard to explain in writing how to get the gun back together. The reason you could only get 2 shells in the tube is because the gun come with a "plug" put in the magazine which is a must for hunting migratory waterfowl. If you take the barrel nut off, take a flat head screw driver and press the end cap down and twist, the end cap will come out as will the spring followed by the plug then the follower. Take thee plug out and reverse the procedure. It shows you how to do it in the owners manual. And of course, make sure the gun is unloaded!

Good luck

[amd0709]

well my husband tried to put it back together and he got the trigger assembly back in but now its stuck and wont come out?? should we just send it in to the manufactuar?

[Hunterdad]

No. Take it back to Academy and have them put it back together for you. They might charge you a couple bucks. Pretty unnecessary to send it back.

[19-3Ben]

well my husband tried to put it back together and he got the trigger assembly back in but now its stuck and wont come out?? should we just send it in to the manufactuar?

What's the joke about men and instruction books?;)

As Hunterdad said, take it back to Academy.

For future reference, they printed stuff in that little instruction manual for a reason. It's not just to pad the inside of the box.
In case you lost it, here is the link:

CLICK HERE (http://www.hr1871.com/documents/manuals/NEF_Pard_Pump_Manual.pdf)

The good news to come out of all of this is that if you've gotten the trigger mechanism out, you can give the gun a good thorough cleaning!

[amd0709]

the funny part is i called academy and they said the only thing they can do is send it back to the manufactuer....sooo. :fire:

[jmortimer]

First thing I did was read the instruction book and remove the plug. Great gun - great price. Will be getting another.

[Shpadoinkel]

I wish Remington had half of the Buy Amer-kin'! loyalty that some posters here have. After all, Remington does own the company that owns the company that makes these dirty Chinese junk guns.


I LOVE my Protector. It's like buying a Rem 870 for $100 less AND you don't have to worry about a bad extractor!

If I had to do it over again I'd probably go with a Hawk 982 because it's practically the same gun as the Protector, for the same low price, with free Ghost Ring Sights.

All parts except barrels and mag extensions are interchangeable between a Protector and a Rem 870 (I have a Knoxx stock and forend on mine that was made for an 870 and it fits like a glove). Which isn't a bad thing at all considering you can buy new barrels for Pardners for about 1/2 the price you can for a Rem and MAX100 who hangs around these forums custom makes mag extensions for these. I don't have one myself but everyone that does says they work perfect.

[Hunterdad]

the funny part is i called academy and they said the only thing they can do is send it back to the manufactuer....sooo.

Thats a shame. I find it hard to believe that no one at Academy can put an 870 copy back together. They are so easy to assemble if you know what you are doing. Do you have a Gander Mountain, Bass Pro or gunsmith in the area? If so, take it to them and they should do it.

[jakemccoy]

870s suck ass, and Pardners are awesome. That's the gist of this thread if you didn't know any better.

[Onward Allusion]

Er, I wouldn't go that far... Both are good shotguns. The Remi has a much longer history and is proven.

What I didn't understand was why the Remington 870 Express had a laminated (ie. particle board) stock and forend while the NEF had WALNUT and cost $100 less?! I mean, marketing 101 - don't cannibalize your sales!

jakemccoy (http://www.thehighroad.org/member.php?u=48235)

870s suck ass, and Pardners are awesome. That's the gist of this thread if you didn't know any better.

[Cornhusker77]

I've got both a Pardner Pump Protector and a Remington 87 Wingmaster.
I kinda like them both.
The 870 is my good pheasant hunting gun and my Pardner is my "throw it on the 4 wheeler and head for the hills and don't care if it gets dirty or scratched" gun.
Each has a different purpose to me.

[jlv08]

There are videos on youtube to aid you in reassembling your Pardner asit it like the 870 and it is not difficult to do. In fact it's so easy that it is hard!

The Pardner Pump should be field stripped as with any new shotgun and cleaned of all the preservative.

I did both my Pardners like this and they were cleaned and niclely lubed.

I do this with any new OR used aquisition as it just make good sense.:)

The Pardner Pump has a matte type parkerizing/bluing and I applied liberal coats of Breakfree on the overall exterior of the gun and it seems to work into the finish.

Way better that the rustomatic Express's my brother in law and I had a while back.

[Big Bill]

Like I said Bill, your purchasing and use of Chinese computers does the same thing you accuse others of doing...I don't buy Chinese computers? Where did you come up with that? I've been doing computers since you were wet behind the ears and one of my last jobs was as a Dell Technician. I know some parts come from Taiwan. But, Taiwan isn't China!

I hope that every time you pick up one of your two PRC pumps you'll remember that YOU support the communist Chinese state that produced it. So, why don't you just get off it now. Your rants are getting tiresome.

It's a hell of a deal when a person can't express his/her ideas without some half wit calling you a hypocrite.

[jlv08]

It seems as though, when folks bring up the Pardner Pump, that there is an attempt to turn the threads into a forum for political rants. What does it serve to do other than cause division among us here in the forums?

The Chinese goods coming into the US will keep coming and will do so under free trade pacts made by our elected officials.

Now,the OP was inquiring about the Pardner pump protector and did so without looking for an argument.

It did not take long for the argument to rear its head and now this thread is going in the same direction as other threads regarding the NEF and Hawk
pump guns.

"It's a hell of a deal when a person can't express his/her ideas without some half wit calling you a hypocrite."

Bill, those are your words and the last time I checked, there was no double standard on freedom of what one wants to buy or sharing their joy regarding a purchase of a firearm of their choice.

Let's be civil.

[broken]

well,my wife brought me home some kind of chinese fire noodles,little hot shrimp,from a chinese restraunt, for supper instead of american food im used too,anyway let me tell you,hot-hot,afteraffects,killing me,i dont know what they cook with, but goodness,just thought id lighten the mood.

[jlv08]

I had Korean today! I got some sushi (Japanese of course!) Korean potato noodles, some kimchi and whiting soup.:)

The whiting soup is a fish soup and when I stirred it there was a whole cooked fish head in the bowl!:eek:

Oh well, I did what any brave culinary crusader would do, I dug in!

It was tasty and no I did not eat the eyeballs! LOL!

My daughter and I got a good laugh out of that and had an enjoyable lunch together.:D

[Mr. T]

One thing to say about this gun is that if your ammo ever runs dry, you have one hell of a club in your hand to beat the stuffing out of anyone invading your house. These guns are sturdy and heavy and seem like they could survive a tank rolling over them. They function great and eat ammo well. For the price you got a good buy.

[jlv08]

As I mentioned earlier, I had the 12 Ga. version in the Pardner pump and it was a hoss gun.

I still have my 20ga. Compact and I simply love the gun.

I did buy American today for all of those who've opined to do so on this thread.

I picked up a beautiful Marlin Model 50 bolt gun, 28" barrel with front bead sight and some of the prettiest walnut I have seen on a gun like this.

It was sitting in a rack at Winfree's Firarms bere in Grafton,VA.

120 bucks out the door.

I had no intention of buying a gun but it spoke to me and I got it.

It looks real nice next to my little Pardner Compact as the Compact has pretty walnut in it as well.:)

I'll probably use the Marlin to still hunt with or hunt out of a tree stand.

I don't hunt with dogs so it should be dandy for what I will do with it.:D

[BCCL]

It's a hell of a deal when a person can't express his/her ideas without some half wit calling you a hypocrite.

Bill, go back and look at how you responded to my question about whether there was any evidence of "slave labor" being used for these guns.

So, let me see if I understand you. It is OK to buy a PRC shotgun IF it cannot be proved that it was made by slave labor? What convoluted logic do you live by?

That was your response to a simple question. So don't come playing the victim now, you went on the attack when you start questioning other peoples morals and values with your biblical quotes and accusations of supporting slave labor, that you still haven't proven.

Every time you use the internet, you are using computer equipment made in China, even if it isn't your personal PC, you are still completely dependent on Chinese electronics so yes, you are using them (notice I said purchase and use).

Next time someone asks a simple question, maybe you should discuss it with them in the manner you want them to talk with you, and you might not get your attitude back?

[Big D]

Although Taiwan is not directly ruled by the PRC, the PRC still claims that it is part of it, as shown here, about halfway down http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan.

[swampboy]

I have/have had (several) Mossy 500's, (quite a few) Rem 870's and a (one) Pardner Protector. The Protector is a solid shotgun at a very good price.

And it seems that there can never, EVER be an adult discussion about these shotguns without said discussion ending up on politics like this one has.

[UranusDestiny]

Although Taiwan is not directly ruled by the PRC, the PRC still claims that it is part of it, as shown here, about halfway down http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan.
So your point is...what exactly? Taiwan is a democratic country that broke away from the PRC decades ago. The PRC can claim all it wants, but Taiwan is not a part of the Mainland China.

[[Pb]]

I have one of these shotguns and I am happy with it the action is smooth and recoil is not bad. I payed $187 OTD, it is exactly like yours, 5+1 synthetic.

It was my HD gun until a couple days ago when I got a Saiga-12, now it is my mom's HD gun.

[Big Bill]

Next time someone asks a simple question, maybe you should discuss it with them in the manner you want them to talk with you, and you might not get your attitude back? I see what your are saying. I guess I was off my meds that day. I'm sorry - I hope you can forgive me for offending you. I love the Chinese people and am very touchy about their plight. I just HATE to see them used by the communists in China. I'm glad my 6 grandchildren are back over here from Taiwan for this past four years - even though Taiwan isn't a communist state (yet), the situation there is still very tense nonetheless. I just don't personally want to do anything that might make things worse for both them and us also. Sometimes, I just get too wound up. Sorry! I hope you can understand where I'm coming from.

[BCCL]

No problem Bill, take care Partner!

6 grandkids? Bet that's a fun handful!!! It's all I can do to keep up with my just the 3 of my great nieces and nephew!!!

[Ben86]

I try to recommend this gun over the mossy maverick. To me it's better quality for the same price. Also the maverick has way thinner steel so the recoil is pretty harsh comparatively.

[Big Bill]

BCCL - they're just six of thirty six (so far), and I love them all dearly. Thanks for the good discussion. You made me think outside my own little box. :)

[BCCL]

36 six grandkids??? Holy Mackerel!!!

Now there's a reason to buy guns.."Honey, I have to have one to leave to each grandkid"... :)

[TASimpson]

Ok.....where do I start? First of all, wow!!! When it comes to shotgun owners there is a lot of enthusiasm out there. When I started this I had no clue the Pardner Pump/Chinese made guns were such a hotbed of opinion or had such a following.

This is the rundown so far; its a clone of the Rem 870, its reliable, I got it at a fair price used, parts are interchangeable with the 870, its Chinese made by Hawk industries to NEF specs, and that NEF, Marlin, H&R, and Remington are all owned by the same American company. Huff..Huff..Breath..Keep typing...Which if you are one of those stimulated by political morality raises the question of who is truly responsible for all of this controversy? The consumer for buying, big industries for selling, or our elected government for allowing the outsourcing to begin with? That aside I would like to note some other things that came out of this so far.

There are other affordable clones out there such as the Savage/Stevens 350 which is a clone of the Ithaca 37. YouTube can be an excellent source of additional help, and lets face it, a picture does say a thousand words. Some good pictures were posted, thanks Hunterdad. Thanks to 19-3 Ben for the link to the manual, I needed that because I bought it used. AMD0709, I hope that you get your shotgun working and as we found out together Max100 knows a lot about these guns. Cornhusker77, there is something almost divine in the peace that can be found in a forest trail, some mud, an ATV, and a firearm to do some plinking(or even better hunting).

BigBill and BCCL....... Hummmm....... If Idaho and Illinois did not face each other in civil war they sure did now. And by God if you did not shake hands, make up, and talk about grandkids in the end. How poignant (I hope thats spelled right), is not our children's children the true benefactor of practicing our rights. Ill sum up Recklesscarolina and Almond27 in saying I agree that a gun is better than no gun and the bad guy will never know the difference between an expensive gun and a inexpensive one if you "SQUEEZE" the trigger and it goes "BANG".

The difference in gun ownership is clearly individual and ultimately what matters is defending yourself and your loved ones. If you can afford to buy one gun over the other because of you deepest convictions, then be happy in doing so. If saving some much needed cash in times of hardship is your goal, then be happy in doing so. So, in answer to the very first post. Could I have done a simple search for info and learned the same things? Yes. But, would it have been as dynamic? No. Would it have had the same human connection to other like minded people? No.

I have been so entertained and educated by this post. Thanks to all, and if you feel like doing so please keep it up.

[BCCL]

TASimpson, we're all "gun folks", in the end that will always bring us together more than pull us apart! :)

[Onward Allusion]

I'm dizzy from reading your post, but well said...

TASimpson (http://www.thehighroad.org/member.php?u=115202)
Ok.....where do I start?

[Big D]

So when did Savage bring this line out? Its a damn goodlooking copy of the Model 37.....and a dang good price to boot. Anybody seen one in their gunshop yet? http://www.galleryofguns.com/Genie/Default.aspx?item=18950&mfg=Savage+Arms&mdl=All&cat=2&type=Shotgun&cal=12+Gauge&fin=Blue&sit=All

[reckless carolinian]

I think there is something a bit off with that stock. And there is no copying for a 37, my opinion. I can pick up a real 37 in a pawn shop today cheaper than that.

[MAX100]

So when did Savage bring this line out? Its a damn goodlooking copy of the Model 37.....and a dang good price to boot. Anybody seen one in their gunshop yet?

They are new this year. They aren't available yet but should be in a few months.


GC

[broken]

ta/simpson,good post,would took" me good part of a day to type that much,i type one handed,right fingers/hand outa whack,damaged/wreck..anyway that savage stevens copy of a ithica is cool.dont see any ithicas anymore.

[Big Bill]

TA - you certainly are a gentleman. Thanks for your positive comments and observations in this thread. I think we could all learn much from you. I know I have.

[swampboy]

TA, good reflective post, but next time, for cryin' out loud brother, break that loooong post down into a few paragraphs. My eyes ain't as young as they used to be!:eek:

[jmortimer]

This was a good thread. All's well that ends well.

[AcceptableUserName]

upon evaluation, there's just no way, other than customer service, that I'd ever buy an Express over a Pardner Pump at this point. It just wouldn't make sense.


Just sayin'.

[TASimpson]

Yea, I know I made my last post a little long. I had a lot to say and not long to say it. I went back and edited it by stretching it out into several paragraphs. It should be easier on the eyes now.

[jmortimer]

"upon evaluation, there's just no way, other than customer service, that I'd ever buy an Express over a Pardner Pump at this point. It just wouldn't make sense."
Right