Anyone with a Kimber .45 ACP able to shoot 185gr (or any) SWC loads?


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1858
February 3, 2010, 07:42 PM
I bought a Kimber Tactical Entry II pistol late last year and it's a real beauty but it won't chamber my 185gr SWC reloads (mixed brass). The round won't even make it up the feedramp. My SIG P220 that I've had since '92 has spat out thousands upon thousands of these loads with ZERO problems. I'm not complaining since the Kimber is what it is. If I have to shoot RN through it exclusively then so be it. Just wondering if the condition will improve with wear or I simply need to give up the idea that it'll ever feed SWC loads reliably if at all. It was flawless with Blazer 230gr TMJ ammunition.

This is the load that I'm talking about. The cases are trimmed to the proper length and the OAL is within spec.

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/reloading/45acp/185gr_swc_w231.jpg

Thanks.
:)

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EddieNFL
February 3, 2010, 07:44 PM
I have an Eclipse that eats everything. Had a Tactical that was anorexic.

1858
February 3, 2010, 08:00 PM
I have an Eclipse that eats everything. Had a Tactical that was anorexic.

"Had" being the operative word. Did you get rid of it because of the feeding issues? Is this luck of the draw, by design or even fixable? Like I said, I can always load RN bullets for the Kimber if that's all it likes but I'm just trying to figure out my options. Naturally, if it'll feed most any kind of bullet then that's a good thing but the Kimber may have been designed for accuracy with factory ball ammunition rather than for the typical reloader.

:)

The Lone Haranguer
February 3, 2010, 08:02 PM
It is not your handloading skills, nor is it a fault with the gun - it was simply never designed to feed such a bullet. 1911s for target shooting with these loads usually require feed ramp/throat reshaping. Perhaps a bullet with more of a truncated cone (straight-sided with no abrupt shoulder) profile might feed better.

EddieNFL
February 3, 2010, 08:07 PM
"Had" being the operative word. Did you get rid of it because of the feeding issues? Is this luck of the draw, by design or even fixable? Like I said, I can always load RN bullets for the Kimber if that's all it likes but I'm just trying to figure out my options. Naturally, if it'll feed most any kind of bullet then that's a good thing but the Kimber may have been designed for accuracy with factory ball ammunition rather than for the typical reloader.

:)
Repaired it, but never could spit out the bad taste.

it was simply never designed to feed such a bullet.

I agree, but I've shot a ton of 'em through out-of-the-box 1911s without incident.

Walkalong
February 3, 2010, 08:10 PM
My Kimber Ultra (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=113515&d=1263749343) feeds the Berrys 185 Gr SWC's (http://www.berrysmfg.com/product.aspx?i=14515&c=17&pp=8&sb=0&p=0) loaded at 1.190 O.A.L. 100%, but it also feeds everything else.

1858
February 3, 2010, 08:30 PM
Walkalong, my 185gr SWCs are from Nevada Bullet Company (long since out of business I think). I bought 1000s of them 10 or 12 years ago and am still working my way through them. The COL is 1.155" which is fine but I could try seating longer to see if it helps. Lyman's 49th Edition lists the OAL for a 185gr JSWC at 1.135".

EddieNFL & The Lone Haranguer, thanks for the help. I have some experimenting to do. I'd rather not get the feedramp/throat modified unless my "research" indicates that this is a good way to proceed. I have lots of options so it's not all bad.

:)

The Lone Haranguer
February 3, 2010, 08:33 PM
I would rather see you use a different load or bullet than start messing with the ramp and throat, if the pistol is reliable with hardball and hollowpoints.

1858
February 3, 2010, 08:34 PM
Walkalong, that Kimber of yours is a beauty by the way!! I notice that it has "Custom Shop" on the slide. Does that have anything to do with the fact that your Kimber basically eats anything?

:)

Drail
February 3, 2010, 08:38 PM
Don't feel bad. A LOT of 1911s won't eat 185 grainers without some tuning. It just a matter of how bad you want to run them. I would just run 200 grainers and live happily ever after.

mljdeckard
February 3, 2010, 08:38 PM
I have never tried 185s, but I've shot a lot of 230 SWCs. Is there a reason you used 185s?

1858
February 3, 2010, 08:38 PM
I would rather see you use a different load or bullet than start messing with the ramp and throat, if the pistol is reliable with hardball and hollowpoints.

Absolutely!! My life doesn't depend on this Kimber so I have the luxury of time along with trial and error. I don't really want to put the Kimber under the knife this early in the game. I'll try increasing the OAL of the 185gr loads as well as using 200gr RNFP bullets from Oregon Trail. I have thousands of those so it's no big deal.

:)

1858
February 3, 2010, 08:47 PM
Don't feel bad. A LOT of 1911s won't eat 185 grainers without some tuning. It just a matter of how bad you want to run them.

My SIG likes 'em so I have a use for the 1000's that I have. I'm simply trying to determine my options at this point. If a bunch of Kimber owners stated that their pistols have no problem with 185gr SWCs then I might not feel so lucky.

I have never tried 185s, but I've shot a lot of 230 SWCs. Is there a reason you used 185s?

I started reloading .45 ACP back in '92 and 185gr SWCs were commonplace since they offered(ed) light recoil and excellent accuracy. Back then, my 5' and 100lb wife used to shoot 1000's of .45ACP rounds a year so everything was rosy. As I mentioned above, I still have a use for them but it'd be easier (convenient) to load 185gr SWC .45 ACP exclusively for all four .45 ACP handguns (I have a couple of Ruger Blackhawk Bisley convertibles .45 ACP/.45 Colt revolvers).

Maybe I'll end up shooting 200gr RNFPs exclusively through all four .45 ACPs once I've used up the 185gr SWCs.

Thanks to everyone for your help.

:)

jmr40
February 3, 2010, 09:06 PM
My Custom II has never had a problem with anything. I don't reload handgun ammo but have put a bunch of GA Arms reloads through it including their 185 gr SWC's

railroader
February 3, 2010, 09:11 PM
Your problem is the profile of those 185s. I have a bunch of 185s but they are the same profile as the 200swc bullets. They run fine in my kimber. I've seen the same profile bullets as yours choke 1911s at local matches. I also have 155swc bullets which feed fine. The profile on them is the same as the 200s except the nose is a little narrower. Here's a pic of what my 185s look like. Also here is a page that shows the difference in the 185s. http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.keadbullets.com/155swc45.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.keadbullets.com/45_ACP.htm&usg=__aLVT8zmsh5iFTzkHfsAHNypNqQM=&h=72&w=74&sz=3&hl=en&start=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=ceg7lZHoe6WhMM:&tbnh=69&tbnw=71&prev=/images%3Fq%3D155swc%2B45acp%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1Mark
http://www.reloadsnmore.com/images/bullets/45_185gr_SWC.png

Walkalong
February 3, 2010, 10:28 PM
Walkalong, that Kimber of yours is a beauty by the way!! I notice that it has "Custom Shop" on the slide. Does that have anything to do with the fact that your Kimber basically eats anything?
I think it's on most of their guns. I am not sure it really means anything. Maybe it does. The slide stop is a Wilson (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=418414), and the thumb safety is a "Wilson Combat Tactical (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=556979)" modified by myself to resemble the Colt Combat & L/W Commander safety.

Thumb Safety pic (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=48751&d=1165086284)...Before I did the grip safety in black.

I would look at mags to solve your feeding problems as well as toying with O.A.L. It was never designed for the bullet to "ride the ramp" in a 1911. It should, at most, glance off of it before going into the chamber.

I had one 1911 that was finicky with all but a couple of bullet styles with most mags (Wislon, McCormick etc), but would feed anything with an old Colt mag with the "controlled feed" style lips. It was like magic. The Check-Mate mags (http://www.checkmateindustries.com/handgun.htm#tbl1) I have are real good, but they don't seem to make the exact style I have now.are real good.

My Ultra feeds anything with Kimber Pro-Tac or Wilson mags.

M2 Carbine
February 3, 2010, 10:46 PM
One reason I use 200 grain SWC is the 185 will jam feeding in some of my 1911 pistols. Even my GI 1911A1 will reliably feed the 200 but not the 185.

These 200 grain SWC bullets slide through the Kimbers and my other 1911's as smooth as glass.:)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v135/Bell406_206B/45and38reloads.jpg

INSULATION TIM
February 3, 2010, 11:41 PM
Good to know. I always wondered what the advantage was between the two. From now on, I'll only buy the 200 gr LSWC.

Thanks for the tip.

orionengnr
February 3, 2010, 11:49 PM
I have put thousands of 200gr SWCs (Missouri Bullet, Penn Bullet, Billy Bullets, Rucker Bullets and probably a few others I can't recall at the moment) through my Kimbers....weekly. I think the shape of the 200gr SWC is a bit different--yours look a bit short and square.

If you pm me I'll send some pics of my handloads, if it will help.

If you are in North Texas, we can get together at the local range, trade rounds and fire a few.

The Bushmaster
February 4, 2010, 01:31 AM
It's not on my Kimber UCC II, Walkalong. It just says "Kimber"...Can't help here as I use Hornady 185 grain HP/XTP and 185 grain HP Rainier Plated for practice.

Snowdog
February 4, 2010, 09:11 AM
I currently have two 1911s and only recently started loading SWCs. My RIA 1911 will fire anything I put in it.
My much nicer Kimber is a bit picky though.

My Kimber will choke on this profile http://www.factorysales.com/graphics/bullets/452200sw.gif

My Kimber will not choke on this profile http://www.factorysales.com/graphics/bullets/l452200s.gif

EddieNFL
February 4, 2010, 09:40 AM
M2,

Do you have a forklift to move that M548 container? That's gotta weight 250 plus.

M2 Carbine
February 4, 2010, 11:39 AM
M2,

Do you have a forklift to move that M548 container? That's gotta weight 250 plus.
No.:D

I fill the can after I place it where I want it.
Even the 50 cal cans filled with loose pistol ammo are very heavy.

I have one 50 cal can filed with .223 55 gr bullets (about 10,000) that's way too much to pick up (for me anyhow).


THE SWC bullet question.
The cast, store bought, 200 grain SWC bullet I use the most is Rucker and Houston brand. Rucker being the better.
I bought, I don't know how many, 500 count boxes of 200 gr SWC Rucker bullets when the price was still about $18 a box. This is what I shoot in all my 45ACP handguns. No problem in any semi autos, including five Kimbers.

The cast 200 gr SWC bullet is also very accurate and will not lead the barrel.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v135/Bell406_206B/KimberUltraCarry10yds7shts1hole.jpg

Mags
February 4, 2010, 11:52 AM
Kimbers are garbage, buy a Colt!:neener:

EddieNFL
February 4, 2010, 12:13 PM
Your problem is the profile of those 185s.

In this particular firearm, that may be true, but I have a mould with that same profile and have shot many rounds through several different 1911s.

I fill the can after I place it where I want it.
Even the 50 cal cans filled with loose pistol ammo are very heavy.

I think a full .50 cal can weighs over 60 pounds. I switched to 7.62 cans a while back.

I have a multitude of M548s filled with brass, but never been brave enough to fill one with ammo.

Colts suck, buy a Nighthawk. ;)

MAUSER88
February 4, 2010, 12:23 PM
My TLEII in SS eats the 200 grain lead SWC's all day long. No problems at all.

Paints
February 4, 2010, 01:05 PM
I have some jacketed SWCs like that and just fed some successfully through my Kimber the other day, which is better than I can say for the Federal HSTs that I was also testing (premature slide lock with the HSTs).

I'd try some different magazines and see if that helps. My first 1911 (1995 Colt Gold Cup) came with a 7 rnd mag for SWC and an 8 round for everything else.

1858
February 4, 2010, 06:50 PM
Thanks for all the help ... lots of good/useful information here. Here's the Kimber and 185gr SWC Western Nevada West Coast bullets in question.

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/kimber/kimber_te2_left.jpg

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/kimber/kimber_te2_right.jpg

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/reloading/45acp/185gr_swc_45acp.jpg

:)

SwampWolf
February 4, 2010, 07:14 PM
185 grain semi-wadcutters are a staple for Bullseye shooters. That's all I've used (along with 230 grain hardball, depending on the course of fire for a specific match) for decades without incident in my Colt Series 70 Gold Cup.

1858
July 10, 2010, 07:56 PM
UPDATE:

A few weeks ago I ordered and received five Wilson Combat Elite Tactical Magazines (ETM) from Midway. A couple of days ago I put together three different loads to try along with two types of factory ammunition.

Factory ammunition
American Eagle 230gr FMJ
MAGTECH 230gr FMC

Reloads
200gr Oregon Trail LRNFP, 5.4gr W231, WLP primers, W-W brass
200gr Oregon Trail LRNFP, 5.5gr Trail Boss, WLP primers, FC65 brass
185gr WN LSWC, 5.0gr W231, WLP primers, mixed brass

Yesterday I headed off to the range with the Kimber and a plan. I was going to shoot 10 of each type of factory ammunition followed by 10 of each of the 200gr LRNFP loads. I figured the RN bullets should feed 100% reliably. Finally, if all was good, I planned to shoot 10 of the SWC loads but I wasn't too optimistic about those. Well, the GREAT news is that all five loads functioned FLAWLESSLY. I ended up shooting 25 of the 185gr SWC loads without any issues at all. I am now a believer in Wilson Combat mags. The Kimber shot like a dream and was incredibly accurate with the 185gr loads. 10 shots grouped in the center of the target in a 2" circle at 15 yards. I don't shoot pistols very often so I'm more than happy with the Kimber. Based on how well it shoots, and how good it feels in the hand, I'm now very interested in buying more Kimbers. I still maintain that 100% reliability with RN bullets would have been enough to make me feel good about my $1,300 investment. I would have considered the Kimber to be a little "specialized" but with superb accuracy I could give up a little functionality. But now, all I can say is what a difference a magazine makes. My shooting buddy suggested trying the Kimber factory magazine again to see if some additional break-in has helped. At the very least, I plan on ordering a Wilson Combat follower for it. Here's a photo of the range ... not a bad place to shoot.


http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/kimber/photos/mcbh_range.jpg

:)

1858
July 10, 2010, 08:04 PM
Oh, and many, many thanks to EVERYONE that contributed to this thread. The knowledge base on THR is truly amazing and I for one REALLY appreciate the time and effort that so many put in.

:)

orionengnr
July 10, 2010, 09:08 PM
I love a happy ending.
Now, where is that range? :)

1858
July 11, 2010, 04:45 AM
It's the FBI range at the Marine Corps Base Hawaii (MCBH) in Kaneohe. I love a happy ending too. Kimber + Wilson Combat = pure joy!! :D Thanks for the offer of letting me try some of your reloads. I'll extend the same offer to you if you ever make it out this way.

:)

340PD
July 11, 2010, 08:57 PM
CDP Ultra Carry feeds all 185 and 200 lead and plated no issues at all.

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