Anyone here a fan of the Beretta 92FS?


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Triggernosis
February 4, 2010, 12:22 PM
I just picked up a police trade-in for a measley sum, mainly to build a National Match Bullseye gun out of. But doggone, it feels so nice in my hand and doesn't seem to be any bigger than the typical revolver that I carry around the farm/woods that it may become my everyday knockabout and home defense arm.

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jem375
February 4, 2010, 12:27 PM
Nothing wrong with the 92, could be one of my next buys also..

M2 Carbine
February 4, 2010, 12:30 PM
I was not much of a fan of the Beretta because I think it is too big and bulky a gun for a 9mm.

A while back I came across a Taurus PT 99 AFS. After shooting it a while I liked the gun and if Crimson Trace made a laser for it I'd use it for a HD gun.

So lately I've been looking to get the Beretta. CT makes a laser for the Beretta.

EddieNFL
February 4, 2010, 12:31 PM
Bought one, once. Sold it nine or ten years later without ever firing a shot through it. Not for me.

1KPerDay
February 4, 2010, 01:24 PM
Action like buttah. Racking the slide on mine is a sensual experience. However it's huge through the grip frame and I'm not enamored of the safety/decocker placement or movement; gets in the way when racking the slide.

But I still dig the gun.

Steve C
February 4, 2010, 01:49 PM
Mine is a 92F and its a great gun. Full sized service pistol not "big" like many say, just not a compact. Smooth action with good accuracy. Magazines and other accessories are easy to find and relatively inexpensive. Handles +P+ Ranger and milder ammo with equal reliability. What's not to like?

uh-oh
February 4, 2010, 02:02 PM
I just picked up a police trade-in for a measley sum, mainly to build a National Match Bullseye gun out of. But doggone, it feels so nice in my hand and doesn't seem to be any bigger than the typical revolver that I carry around the farm/woods that it may become my everyday knockabout and home defense arm.I am a huge fan of Beretta firearms. For a bullseye gun, be prepared to spend some major dough on accurization as there are few people who are experienced in working the guns to the level needed to win those NM Bullseye competitions.

SigP229R
February 4, 2010, 02:25 PM
I have a 92f it is the pistol I used to qualify for my CCW with and was the first semi-auto I ever owned. It is a little large on the grip but it's a keeper.

OregonJohnny
February 4, 2010, 02:50 PM
The Beretta 92FS is probably my favorite handgun of all time. I love mine, and it's seriously one of the smoothest operating semi-autos I've ever fired. If you accept the fact that it's just too big and bulky for comfortable concealed carry, you'll really appreciate it for what it is. A full-size, rugged, reliable, and beautiful service weapon with a long and proven history.

TheProf
February 4, 2010, 04:16 PM
Super reliable. Super safe. Super accurate. 100% recommendation as a house gun. (Too bulky for CCW...but great bed side gun.)

Action_Can_Do
February 4, 2010, 04:52 PM
They work fine now but the gun does have a dubious past. You might want to look into it, especially if you have an older model.

buy guns
February 4, 2010, 04:57 PM
I had a 92fs Inox and loved it. I wish I had never sold it.

Guillermo
February 4, 2010, 04:59 PM
I am not a fan for two reasons

1- the double action triggerpull is horrible

2- the safety works the wrong way (up for FIRE is idiotic)

351 WINCHESTER
February 4, 2010, 05:09 PM
The gun is way too big for a 9mm. Grips are gorilla size.

mljdeckard
February 4, 2010, 05:18 PM
I agree with all of the complaints listed above. It's too bulky for a 9mm design that can't ALSO be a .45 design. It has a long DA pull. I don't like 'positive' slide-mounted safeties. I do NOT like the grip shape.

Having said that, I could conceal it just fine if I had to. While I don't like the DA pull, I don't really ever plan on using it, the vast majority of the time I think I will have time to cock the hammer. And while I might not PREFER the positive safety or the DA pull, I know how to operate both just fine. The SINGLE action trigger is about as good as it gets. The bulk and weight make it very stable to shoot. I remember the first time I shot one, I couldn't believe how it bounces right back to the point of aim as you shoot it rapidly. As a service arm, I think there are more durable options, but if you test it, and it works, and keep it clean and check it frequently it will be fine. (My main complaint about it as a sidearm is the NATO ammo. If I were allowed to use 147 gr jhp ammo I would like it just fine.)

I just shoot 1911s better. And I don't rely on handguns for HD.

chopper180
February 4, 2010, 05:50 PM
They work fine now but the gun does have a dubious past. You might want to look into it, especially if you have an older model.

What dubious past? Never heard of them being anything but reliable. Never owned one but several friends have and they've never had any problem with them. Didn't know there was an issue. Was there a recall or something?

James T Thomas
February 4, 2010, 06:35 PM
I've never owned one, and prefer revolvers, however.

I do like the design.
The open slide where the breech is exposed.
The all steel construction.
That grip does look good.
I'm supposing the lock up is the Browning design as on the High Power, and there for -good as well.

I may be talking myself into getting one.

mljdeckard
February 4, 2010, 06:42 PM
I was an assistant armorer in Germany when we switched to M-9s. I immediately started having problems with them, but it was mostly from soldiers taking them apart and playing with them. There are stories about the slides breaking, where the thin sections band around the barrel, resulting in the slide shooting off the back and hitting the shooter in the teeth, because the army allowed cheap alloy for the contract guns, but I never saw, nor know anyone who ever saw this.

flinch
February 4, 2010, 06:47 PM
World Class gun. Never fails on you. You get little girly men who can't hold the grip. Dont touch it except to shoot it.

Dave in PA
February 4, 2010, 07:00 PM
I have a 92FS. I can conceal it IWB with my regular gun belt and an untucked T shirt as easily as my G23. I shoot IDPA with it, as 9mm is cheaper than 40S&W. I like the grip, the trigger, the safety to me operates by pushing the end of it forwards with the tip of my thumb, so that is good too, for ME. Plus, it is accurate! For me, it is a natural pointer. In short, I like it.

Jenrick
February 4, 2010, 07:06 PM
Great full size service pistol. Very easy to maintain and runs very smoothly when maintained. I really enjoy the fully open slide as it makes malfunction clearances a snap.

-Jenrick

Erik M
February 4, 2010, 07:10 PM
I cant say enough good things about the 92. I have a Beretta 92 and Taurus PT99. They are both excellent firearms and have never failed to feed. THe Taurus was purchased new and the Beretta was a 'like new' police trade in.

mljdeckard
February 4, 2010, 07:13 PM
Flinch-

The thing is, I have petite female soldiers who have to use it too. Should I just tell them to man up?

halfded
February 4, 2010, 07:23 PM
Just got one a couple weeks ago. Gotta say it's one of the better autos I've owned. Nice and accurate, a pleasure to shoot with big enough hands.

I cut 2 or 3 coils off the mainspring (hammer spring) and that smoothed and lightened the trigger a bit. Might try Olhasso's comp spring. I also installed a skeleton hammer, just for cool-ability.

I like guns I can tinker with and find parts for and this is one of them.

Haven't tried to carry it yet though...

Mags
February 4, 2010, 07:50 PM
It (Beretta M9) being issued to me I sought out a similar design, found the Taurus PT92 and liked the ergos better bought two of them PT92s one in stainless and one blued.

Black Knight
February 4, 2010, 08:06 PM
That is the gun I carry on duty. There is nothing wrong with them that the right ammo can't solve. I just wish we were allowed to carry hollowpoint ammo instead of FMJ on duty but the powers that be say no. The 92FS is easy to work on as well. If the trigger pull is too heavy it can be taken care of by replacing one part (easily done). If your trigger finger is too short, a short trigger can be installed with little trouble. There are many holsters available for it.

Confederate
February 4, 2010, 08:22 PM
I love the Beretta design, but two things I don't like. Magazine longevity is not very impressive and springs need frequent replacement. The second thing I don't like is that the Inox is too expensive. These things aren't exactly Rolexes! I hope the guns are more robust than the early ones, which were known to crack slides and separate (military models). I'd like to think the guns could go tens of thousands of rounds, but I haven't heard of any actually doing it, so who knows?

I sold my early Italian Beretta and bought a S&W 5906, which I love. It was cheaper, all stainless steel, including the frame.

They are reliable guns.

3446
February 4, 2010, 08:48 PM
I've got a Taurus PT99SS that I really like. It's a Beretta clone' I can carry it concealed with no problems. I've been looking at police trade in Beretta's. What's the price range for them? The one's in my area are all around $450.

Triggernosis
February 4, 2010, 10:21 PM
The "FS" model is the latest model which pretty much addressed the supposed issues of cracked slides flying off.

C-grunt
February 5, 2010, 02:04 AM
Im a big fan of them. Very accurate and reliable handgun. Very nice looking to.

Ben86
February 5, 2010, 12:37 PM
They are good guns, but I've never been a fan of it's open slide design.

I just wish we were allowed to carry hollowpoint ammo instead of FMJ on duty but the powers that be say no.

You've got to be kidding! What is their reasoning for that?

Ronsch
February 5, 2010, 02:58 PM
Yes. I have had (and have) several. My hands aren't "large" but I have long fingers, so it fits me just right.

Easy to disassemble and clean. Both of my children can fire it with no problems.

Action_Can_Do
February 5, 2010, 04:09 PM
Chopper180
The older 92f had a serious problem of the slide battering the frame on firing, to the point that the lugs would break permanently wrecking the gun. A few soldiers were injured by having the slide come back into their faces while shooting. A slide stop was added that ended this problem, but created a new problem. If the slide locked back from the lugs breaking, the slide was stuck for good and the gun couldn't be fixed. There was another problem with a rare element somehow getting mixed into the steel used for the slide, but I don't know much about that one. Kinda like the M-16, there were some serious design flaws and major growing pains, but a few million dollars of research can make just about anything work most of the time.

tomwalshco
February 5, 2010, 09:05 PM
I love my 92FS. Big - yes, heavy - yes, accurate and fun to shoot - you betcha.

Getting beat up by 3" pocket guns at the range gets pretty old.

SC_1911Shooter
February 6, 2010, 12:31 AM
I absolutely LOVE mine. Love the design, looks, heritage of what the 92FS is. I have an Italian-made Inox (there are also US-made Inox models) and it is supremely accurate and reliable...almost amazingly so.

AcceptableUserName
February 6, 2010, 12:50 AM
My favorite pistol, I think. Smoothe, reliable and pretty. There isn't anything I don't like or can't live with about it. It's not a concealed carry piece, so what? Has nothing to do with whether it's a good gun or not. I love the large grip as I have big hands and it feels very sturdy and positive in my hands.

KurtC
February 6, 2010, 12:51 AM
The 92 design is state of the art. I've never had much use for any auto with two different trigger pulls, but luckily Beretta made the D models. This one I carry daily, and the lower one on special occasions. :)

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e85/Stutzen/InoxDAO008.jpg?t=1265431650

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e85/Stutzen/M9A1023.jpg?t=1265431825

SC_1911Shooter
February 6, 2010, 12:53 AM
Awesome grips on that Inox just above me!!!

johnnylaw53
February 6, 2010, 08:35 AM
I was issued a beretta in the 80's when I was assigned to the drug unit with the S.O. I work for. Before that we was buying our own weapons the sheriff at that time use some of his drug money to buy them for us and the criminal investigators since they would help us a lot on raids and things. The only other auto I ever used before that was the 1911's when I was an Army M.P. in the 70's. So I had nothing to really compare it to. It was big but shot well hard to hide but was able to carry it concealed when needed to. I was able to take it with me when I got reassigned to warrants. Then around 1999 another sheriff went ahead and began issuing weapons to all the deputies this time it was the sig. They took the beretta away. That was when I leaned how much I like it. Went ahead and got my own, a 92fs INOX. Still kinda of big but it is a full size duty weapon. Too big for a 9mm? I don't understand that there are many sub compact .45's out there are they too small for a .45? If you looking for a small weapon for ccw you might not be happy with the beretta but for a good house gun, range gun I really feel they are very good. And like i said I did carry one concealed a lot and have done a few times now just have to dress for it.

be safe

wbwanzer
February 6, 2010, 12:03 PM
I couldn't believe no one had posted any pictures and then Kurt beat me to it. Here's my Italian Inox from 1995 that I just recently purchased. I've been to the range with it once and really enjoyed it. It felt good in my hands and was enjoyable to shoot. And it's a looker too, in my opinion.
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m145/wbwanzer/Beretta92FSInox006.jpg

stangfan93
February 6, 2010, 12:19 PM
Ever since i was young I have always loved the look of the Beretta 92f. I do not know what but I think it is one of the finest looking pistols ever.

That being said I do not have one. I have come close to buying one but I always back out. I just can not bring myself to buy it. They are such a big pistols for such a "small" caliber. I know people do CC the 92 but I just don't think I would be comfortable. Maybe if I live in a state that had open carry I would've bought it. But I don't.

Maybe one day i will buy it for a range gun or as a side arm while hunting.

StarDust1
February 6, 2010, 01:18 PM
Bigtime fan of the FS,

steveracer
February 6, 2010, 01:51 PM
I love them. If the grip is too large for you, try the Hogue Extreme aluminum grips. They are thinner than factory, and reduce grip size. Or try the Vertec. All the benefits of the 92, but with slimmer grip, and rail, for those who HAVE to mount crap on their guns.

perris
February 7, 2010, 12:52 PM
Love mine. :D I have two of them (one is an INOX). I installed Houge wrap around grips on them. They shoot well and are among my favorite target guns. I can hit whatever I aim at....

tackleberry45
February 7, 2010, 03:29 PM
YES - love it. My son carried one as a duty rig in the Army. He was one who did NOT bash the thing. I now own one and love it.

jon_in_wv
February 7, 2010, 05:43 PM
I carried one as an MP in the Marine Corps. I never felt like I wished I had a different weapon. HPs would have been nice but the M9 went bang every time I pulled the trigger. It was also extremely accurate. I got out of the Marine Corps a 4th award expert with my M9. I haven't had one since thin but it is squarely on my short list of must haves.

Triggernosis
February 7, 2010, 06:19 PM
What kind of holsters are you guys using?

EChryst
February 7, 2010, 09:24 PM
Flinch-

The thing is, I have petite female soldiers who have to use it too. Should I just tell them to man up?
Not to sound like a ******, but yes, they need to. They have no other choice. It's not like it's a beastly .44 mag or anything like that.

Hobbesbuff
February 8, 2010, 12:01 AM
Went to the range to put the first rounds throught my new FNP-9---loved it! Felt good to shoot was more accurate than I am and ate whatever I fed it with no complaints or burps!

Afterward I went to the range gunshop and handled a new 92FS and was duly impressed with that gun! It wasn't as big as I thought (and I have small hands), felt good in the hand and had a nice trigger pull in both SA/DA. Breakdown is wildly easy and the controls seem well-placed.

My son, who often shoots with me, likes the feel of the 92 and I see no reason to discourage him from acquiring one when he earns the dough to do so!

Guillermo
February 8, 2010, 12:48 AM
I've got a Taurus PT99SS that I really like. It's a Beretta clone' I can carry it concealed with no problems

The Taurus is not a clone of the 92. The Beretta has a slide mounted safety and up is "fire", down is "safe" That is the exact opposite on your Taurus.

As far as I know Taurus has never had slides spit and maim the shooter

JTQ
February 8, 2010, 01:11 AM
The Beretta has a slide mounted safety and up is "fire", down is "safe" That is the exact opposite on your Taurus.
The Beretta used to have the same configuration as the Taurus, before it became the "F".

rrruuunnn
February 8, 2010, 02:11 AM
I ordered one at my local shop. My bro had one and was very picky. I suppose he chose it because of the grip. Because he orginally liked the glock. I have yet to fire one.

Guillermo
February 8, 2010, 09:35 AM
The Beretta used to have the same configuration as the Taurus

tru dat....Beretta screwed the pooch and made their "safety" work the wrong way

and I cannot imagine a more dangerous situation than having 2 similar feeling guns with opposite controls

benderx4
February 8, 2010, 10:01 AM
Beretta screwed the pooch and made their "safety" work the wrong way

Get yourself a Beretta 92FS like this one and you'll never have to hear these comments again. The safety is in the exact correct place, and it works exactly like your 1911s. Easy on the eyes too! Long live the Steel I.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2627/3861736957_49d34311db.jpg

Guillermo
February 8, 2010, 10:40 AM
Get yourself a Beretta 92FS like this one and you'll never have to hear these comments again

point made

Taurus 617 CCW
February 8, 2010, 10:51 AM
I went from the Beretta 92 to a Glock 19. The Beretta was a nice gun but too big for everyday concealed carry. I know it's possible to conceal it but it's just not practical. I too bought a police trade-in Beretta. Never had a problem with it and it was a very smooth functioning gun.

uh-oh
February 8, 2010, 11:32 AM
Get yourself a Beretta 92FS like this one and you'll never have to hear these comments again. The safety is in the exact correct place, and it works exactly like your 1911s. Easy on the eyes too! Long live the Steel I. I also shoot a SAO Steel-I. It's a spendy gun if you can find one, but they are built so well, you can't beat it. Mine is a very low serial number example and is put together with every part fitted tightly to the next like my semi-custom 1911s.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g129/Silver_Bullet_photos/INOX/P1080067.jpg

Ronsch
February 8, 2010, 03:40 PM
Guillermo,

I use a Fobus Paddle Holster for mine on the hip, and a Galco Miami Classic when carrying under-arm.

Guillermo
February 8, 2010, 04:11 PM
Guillermo,

I use a Fobus Paddle Holster for mine on the hip, and a Galco Miami Classic when carrying under-arm.

Taurus 617...I think that was directed at you

Highland Ranger
February 8, 2010, 04:21 PM
I liked the Inox I bought so much, I bought one in steel. Added a guide rod laser as well. Points naturally, fits the hand, great sights - love them both.

Agree that people with small hands might have issues . . . . .

Triggernosis
February 8, 2010, 04:33 PM
Thanks, Ronsch.

labhound
February 8, 2010, 08:18 PM
Just bought a 92FS INOX this weekend and shot it the first time today. Most accurate gun I own. Grip size is perfect. Recoil is very soft. I personally like the safety/decocker. Best purchase I've ever made. I've enjoyed reading from this board for several months and joined up today! Couldn't resist the chance to talk about the Beretta!

WRGADog
February 8, 2010, 09:47 PM
I have a 92FS Inox and an M9A1 and love them. They are great nightstand guns and range funs, but are too large for CCW.

docsleepy
February 9, 2010, 12:35 AM
I have the taurus 99 (adjustable sights).

The early Beretta was known to break the locking block, the odd little piece of metal inside. A redesigned locking block was done (maybe twice). It is avialable retail for about $75. I changed the one in my Taurus to the Beretta 3rd generation.

It is widely reported that Beretta showed convincingly that the ammo that caused the broken slides (not the locking block) was way way overpressure ammo.... I think they did a demo with tens of thousands of shots and no damage. They did however put in the mmodification, see earlier post by someone who knows more than me about that.

The Beretta design passed all the tests including firing after being in mud. (I have no idea if they were allowed to do any cleaning). It has some interesting features that appear to be designed to make certain it ALWAYS goes bang.

For one, you can wiggle the muzzle a significant amount; it is not tight within the end of the slide. Compare it to a glock and you'll see. The wiggle may disappear during the high pressure of firing, but I have seen "cones" that were placed on the barrel at the muzzle end in an apparent attempt to remedy this. Accurate yes, but I don't think it is the MOST accurate 9mm.

Its a wonderful defensive gun, obviously made to do just what the military wanted. Mine is stainless and should last almost forever.

carbuncle
February 9, 2010, 02:10 AM
I like them, my ex had a stainless model that was a real tack driver. Definitely on my list of future buys.

P.B.Walsh
February 9, 2010, 01:02 PM
I have heard of negitave reports of the open barrel slide about crud getting into the reciver easier than say a 1911.

Is this just hearsay or a fact.

Trying to figure out which 9mm to buy (G17, 92FS, XD, FN9, Sig).

Thanks,
P.B.Walsh

bds
February 9, 2010, 01:58 PM
Trying to figure out which 9mm to buy (G17, 92FS, XD, FN9, Sig).

If you are going to compete in stock form, get the G17.

If not, follow your heart (I shot all of them and like them all - also don't leave out CZ75).

BTW, 92FS comes in 2 grip sizes as I recall.

KurtC
February 9, 2010, 02:23 PM
I have heard of negitave reports of the open barrel slide about crud getting into the reciver easier than say a 1911.

Is this just hearsay or a fact.


Hearsay. The 92 obviously did exceptionally well during the "crud" phase of the XM9 trials, and the Walther P-38 served the Germans well on all fronts.

In all seriousness, it is very difficult to "crud" up the operation of any pistol, as long as the breech is closed when it goes into the crud.

If anything, the open slide allows for the crud to come out easily as well. Sand, dirt and water will eventually work their way into everything. Having an outlet for it once parts start moving is very important.

tomwalshco
February 9, 2010, 04:28 PM
The 92 is one great gun, but if you want simplicity, I'd vote for the Glock. The Beretta is as good a shooter as anything on your list. The open slide thing is a myth, but I've never had one in a muddy, dirty, sandy combat zone, either. The 92 is my favorite range gun and also has the best trigger of anything I've shot. Even my Colt 1911. But mine is well broken in.

Ronsch
February 9, 2010, 08:22 PM
Yep, Guillermo...My bad...

No problem, Triggernosis. I have been using Fobus holsters since I got back from Israel a long time ago, which is where I first picked one up. I have one for a Browning Hi-Power that I got rid of, and it worked very well.

Nick5182
February 9, 2010, 08:27 PM
I bought a 92fs INOX as my first carry gun almost 2 years ago, and still swap between it and my glock 22. I think the trigger on it could be better and I don't like the red dots on the INOX sights, but other than that I love it and will probably never get rid of it.

Mr.Davis
February 9, 2010, 10:01 PM
Most of the gripes you see about the 92FS are people complaining about the cartridge used with the military version (M9). FMJ 9mm ammo isn't the best man stopper, but there's nothing wrong with the gun when you load it with quality SD hollow points.

SharpsDressedMan
February 9, 2010, 11:08 PM
The Taurus is not a clone of the 92. The Beretta has a slide mounted safety and up is "fire", down is "safe" That is the exact opposite on your Taurus.

As far as I know Taurus has never had slides spit and maim the shooter
__________________
The original Beretta 92 had a frame mounted safety...................

Triggernosis
February 10, 2010, 08:37 AM
As far as I know Taurus has never had slides spit and maim the shooter

And as far as I know, there's never been a Taurus that has been subjected to the high round count of overpressured ammo like the Beretta has....

KurtC
February 10, 2010, 01:11 PM
There's lots of internet BS floating around about early slide failures and alleged injuries. Here is an actual NY Times article from 1988 (22 years ago).

Army Reports Problems in Its New Beretta Pistol
AP
Published: May 19, 1988

WASHINGTON, May 18 The Army says it stopped accepting deliveries of its new 9-millimeter Beretta pistol last November because of cracking in the frame and that it is now investigating a second problem involving the gun's slide mechanism.

Beretta U.S.A., a subsidiary of the Italian arms maker Armi Beretta S.p.A., has submitted a plan to deal with the cracking problem and the Army expects to resume accepting deliveries next month, Paul Powell, a spokesman for the Army's Armament, Munitions and Chemical Command, said Tuesday.

However, the Army said it had begun a new test program to determine why two slide bolts on M-9 Berettas cracked while being fired, throwing shards of metal into the chests of the shooters. A similar incident occurred with a nonmilitary Beretta made for commercial sale that was being tested by the Navy.

No one was injured in the three incidents, which occurred late last year and in February, Mr. Powell said.

Col. Richard Williams, the Army manager for the Beretta program, said, ''We don't like the fact that if a slide ever did break it could go back and whack a guy in the face.''

The problems with the pistol were disclosed this week by the trade publication Defense Week and subsequently confirmed by Army officials.

Beretta maintains that the slide failures occurred only after special ammunition was fired.

''U.S. government engineers and technicians have extensively examined the metallurgy, dimensions and manufacturing of the pistol and can find nothing which indicates that the cause of the breakage lies with the weapon,'' the company said.

Mr. Powell disputed that statement in part, saying the Army had not concluded that special ammunition caused the problem. ''We are still running tests to determine the cause of this problem,'' the spokesman said.

Beretta U.S.A., which operates a manufacturing plant in Accokeek, Md., beat out seven competitors in 1985 for the right to provide the 9-millimeter gun to replace the military's venerable Colt .45. The Army, serving as the executive buying agent for all the services, awarded Beretta an initial contract of $75 million for 316,000 pistols. New Competition Set

Mr. Powell said that 109,000 guns were delivered before the suspension of deliveries in November. All told, the spokesman said Beretta would fall about 36,000 pistols behind in its deliveries before shipments resume in June.

Beretta is about to face a Congressionally ordered competition with the Massachusetts gunmaker, Smith & Wesson, a division of the Lear Siegler Diversified Holdings Corporation, and any other interested arms maker for the next 9-millimeter gun contract. Mr. Powell declined to discuss how the production problems might affect Beretta's chances.

The Army said the first problem with the Beretta came to light in November when tests for quality control discovered the pistols could develop hairline cracks on part of the frame. The problem was considered minor and posed no danger to soldiers firing the gun, but the Army had made it clear earlier that it wanted the cracking the problem solved, Mr. Powell said.

The problem involving the slide bolt, which is thrown backward after a shot is fired as part of the process of chambering a new round, came to light in tests by the Navy and Army after delivery of the gun was suspended.

Photo of a Baretta M-9 pistol (AP)

Correction: May 24, 1988, Tuesday, Late City Final Edition Because of an editing error, an article last Thursday about the Beretta pistol misidentified the parent company of a Beretta competitor, Smith & Wesson. It is F. H. Tomkins, a British corporation, which acquired Smith & Wesson in 1987 from the Lear Siegler Holdings Corporation.
A version of this article appeared in print on May 19, 1988, on page A27 of the New York edition.

Nick5182
February 10, 2010, 01:30 PM
Here's some quick (albeit crappy) pics of my 92fs Inox
115265

115266

115267

115268

Sidewinder600
February 11, 2010, 10:41 PM
For anybody with some time to kill, these are the official GAO reports on the investigations into the slide and frame cracks:
http://archive.gao.gov/d16t6/136824.pdf
http://archive.gao.gov/d15t6/137930.pdf
Should be required reading by anyone who's about to post something about slides flying off with such force as to kill soldiers, maim entire families, and travel back in time and kill Kennedy. As any good engineer/scientist would tell you, "Show me the data."
Another more casual read from American Rifleman: http://www.americanrifleman.org/Webcontent/pdf/2009-11/2009111213533-beretta92.pdf

But back on topic, I think they're great guns. Comfortable if you've got the hands for them, easy to handle, reliable, reasonably accurate, easy to strip and clean, fires whatever garbage ammo you found on discount in a bucket at Jim-Bob's Auto Salvage and Ammo Reloading, plus it readily takes +p/+p+ JHP if you've got issues with standard "wimpy" 9mm rounds. Some people complain about complexity, but that's only a problem if a complicated / hard-to-get-to part ever breaks. The most complicated part I've heard of breaking is the locking block, which is pretty rare and a 10-second swap if it does break, and the occasional spring that might break on any other autoloader. Everything else seems to just keep going.
And oh yeah... they're dead sexy.

ZionistInfidel
February 12, 2010, 12:23 PM
The M9A1 I carried while spending 18mos in iraq left a bad taste in my mouth for Beretta's. It was beat to hell, abused, and not maintained. It looked like a holocaust survivor. I don't know if the open slide thing is a myth or not, but I can promise you a little sand on one that hasn't been properly maintained and it'll fire once and jam. Check out some of the videos on youtube. There's a guy dropping one in mud and it shoots and jams. Theres a guy with a 96 (40 cal) dropping one in mud repeatedly and it keeps shooting.

I think it comes down to how you maintain a firearm. If the slide mounted safety isn't a killing point for you, I say go for it. Take care of it though.

Not to suggest these are bad firearms. I want to buy one now, I was Glock fanboy for years and now I hate them with a passion and will only own firearms that have a hammer (SA, DA/SA, or even DAO).

They got my vote. Also check out the Cougars. Beretta or Stoeger (same thing) are both very fine firearms for the small amount they ask for them.

- ZI

bds
February 12, 2010, 02:17 PM
The M9A1 I carried while spending 18mos in iraq left a bad taste in my mouth for Beretta's. It was beat to hell, abused, and not maintained. It looked like a holocaust survivor. I don't know if the open slide thing is a myth or not, but I can promise you a little sand on one that hasn't been properly maintained and it'll fire once and jam.

I clean my Glocks once a year. I brush/swab the barrel once every several thousand rounds.

A Glock that went through the same treatment with a heaping dose of sand would still shoot and cycle - Glocks have four self-cleaning rails that clear the crud out of the slide when racked/cycled.

I took a brand new G22 and threw it into a dirt pile and kicked it around so it was completely filled with dirt/sand. Shook and cycled the slide a few times and ran my shooting match stages with no malfunction.

YMMV :D

Jenrick
February 12, 2010, 04:52 PM
Both a Glock and a Beretta will run in the dust and sand when LUBRICATED. A Glock will require less then a Beretta. Does that much CLP on a gun attract dirt/sand that is a pain to get out later, oh heck yes. However the tolerances in the weapons are such that if there is an adequate layer of lubrication on surfaces that they will function. Basically it'll start to sling sandy sludge all over the place when you shot, but it'll work. If you're really in a firefight in a standstorm, be prepared to dunk you're weapon in CLP almost most every couple of mags. It'll be a mess but they'll run.

-Jenrick

EmGeeGeorge
February 12, 2010, 11:37 PM
used one in the Navy for 4 years... never shot less than expert... don't own one but I wouldn't kick one outta bed for eatin' crackers.

sparkyfender
February 13, 2010, 03:07 PM
Quite possibly my favorite semi-auto.

Yes, it is "big" for a 9mm, but what a great pistol! Smooth action +.

Fits my hand very well, and I have small hands.

I do carry it concealed at times, even if it does has a tendency to peek out a little from underneath my cover shirt.

Not a problem, since I live in an open carry State.

jon_in_wv
March 15, 2010, 12:17 AM
I carried one in the Marine Corps and I thought it was a VERY capable weapon. I've never found another weapon as smooth shooting as the Beretta.

Airman193SOS
March 15, 2010, 12:22 AM
It would be hard for me to describe how much I dislike the Beretta. As a result, I'll simply say that it might actually be the last handgun I pick up before I'm forced to resort to something made by the Ring of Fire.

Give me a Glock, Sig, Ruger... hell, give me a Taurus. Anything but a Beretta Model 92/M9.

YMMV. And probably does.

easyg
March 15, 2010, 12:33 AM
Way too fat and bulky for a 9mm pistol.
I don't care for the decocker/safety either.

skipsan
March 15, 2010, 12:58 AM
I bought a new 92FS Inox Vertec a few years ago and added the factory adjustable sight and wooden grips. Have since added a Beretta .22 conversion kit and a 96FS upper. Everything was plug and play.
The .22 kit doesn't like the "D" spring mod (about 20% missfires) but aside from that the whole package works just fine.

outerlimit
March 15, 2010, 01:31 AM
Great gun, one of my favorite 9x19mm's. The main duty for my Inox is car gun and range gun, but it doesn't get used often for either purpose. I have CCW'd the 92FS without problems, though I'll readily admit CCW is not it's greatest strength as it is a service sized handgun, not a compact. It's strengths are that it feels good in the hand, has a reliable open slide design, it's easy to work on, parts are incredibly easy to find and it's accurate. It also carries 20+1 with the latest Mec-Gar mags, but I typically use the factory 15's with Wolff +10% springs. In addition to these strengths the military M9 and commercial 92FS is made with high quality parts, (except for the ones with plastic).

Weakness are that it's a little large for the caliber, the trigger return spring can break and the front sight of the 92FS model is not dovetailed. The trigger return spring problem is easily fixed with a Wolff INS trigger spring unit which will end the breakage problem. (Taurus PT92 has the same problem). Also, if you are shopping for one avoid the plastic parts models and hold out for an (almost) all metal gun, as they have started making those again.

A couple people mentioned the slide safety getting in the way when racking the slide, this can easily be overcome by having your thumb and index finger slightly below the safety. Also, if doing it fast without looking, it can be overcome by pulling slightly up when you pull the slide back.

And a some people also mentioned that up for fire is stupid. Well maybe on a frame mounted safety, but the 92FS has a slide mounted safety, therefore down for fire would be stupid. It is the same as most any other slide mounted safety, such as the one on the S&W 5906. If you think that pushing a slide mounted safety down with your thumb is easier than pushing it up, you're goofy.

outerlimit
March 15, 2010, 01:55 AM
Afterward I went to the range gunshop and handled a new 92FS and was duly impressed with that gun! It wasn't as big as I thought (and I have small hands), felt good in the hand and had a nice trigger pull in both SA/DA. Breakdown is wildly easy and the controls seem well-placed.

My son, who often shoots with me, likes the feel of the 92 and I see no reason to discourage him from acquiring one when he earns the dough to do so!

Yeah, while the gun is a tad large, I think the size issue is often overstated.

NG VI
March 15, 2010, 02:16 AM
Doesn't use a Hi-Power type lockup, it uses the same lockup as the Walther P-38, which it basically is a modified version of.

Good looking guns.

carbuncle
March 15, 2010, 03:49 AM
I love them, my ex had an Inox that was a tack driver and I'm hoping to pick one up in the future.

Bullseye_shooter
March 15, 2010, 11:26 PM
I like my berreta 92fs but its not my favorite plenty of 9's out class it
and the 92 is specificly for tactical use so, i douby it would make a good bullseye gun even after a good smith takes a whack at it

NG VI
March 16, 2010, 03:29 AM
I think the Army Marksmanship Unit has done some pretty crazy things to their 92s, I think with enough gumption and resources you can make any pistol into anything you want.

outerlimit
March 16, 2010, 04:25 AM
I like my berreta 92fs but its not my favorite plenty of 9's out class it

An argument and counter-argument can be made that all 9x19mm's outclass it since most are smaller.

Yet I would rather use it for defense than most other 9x19mm handguns, except for one exception, the Browning Hi-Power.

SwampWolf
March 16, 2010, 04:43 PM
Beretta screwed the pooch and made their "safety" work the wrong way

and I cannot imagine a more dangerous situation than having 2 similar feeling guns with opposite controls

Good point, to a point. The "solution" is to do what most law enforcement agencies (at least mine and others that I know of) do: carry the pistol with the safety "off". My agency actually required us to carry (per manual of arms) our Third Generation Smith da autos with the safety in the off position. No different than carrying a double-action revolver.

gmh1013
March 16, 2010, 04:46 PM
should have never sold mine....now I have a taurus 92 and 917c

1KPerDay
March 16, 2010, 05:07 PM
Good point, to a point. The "solution" is to do what most law enforcement agencies (at least mine and others that I know of) do: carry the pistol with the safety "off". My agency actually required us to carry (per manual of arms) our Third Generation Smith da autos with the safety in the off position. No different than carrying a double-action revolver.
Yep. or a Sig. Hammer down on a loaded chamber, safety/decocker off. My only complaint is the placement of the safety. It gets in the way when racking the slide. For me.

Lv4snobrdg
March 16, 2010, 06:29 PM
Yes, was my first pistol and never gave me any trouble.

michiganfan
March 16, 2010, 06:35 PM
Great gun. Very accurate.

SwampWolf
March 16, 2010, 07:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SwampWolf
Good point, to a point. The "solution" is to do what most law enforcement agencies (at least mine and others that I know of) do: carry the pistol with the safety "off". My agency actually required us to carry (per manual of arms) our Third Generation Smith da autos with the safety in the off position. No different than carrying a double-action revolver.

Yep. or a Sig. Hammer down on a loaded chamber, safety/decocker off. My only complaint is the placement of the safety. It gets in the way when racking the slide. For me.

You're right about that. Same situation exists with Smith autos. Apparently, one of the unavoidable bugaboos associated with slide-mounted safeties.

KevinR
March 16, 2010, 07:35 PM
Have owned two of them, love them, will not get rid of this one.
Highly recommended!;)

THE MACHINIST
March 17, 2010, 01:46 PM
had this one for 8 years. trigger spring broke and had to be replaced with a wolf hevier unit. very accurate.....about 5,000 rounds thru.....usually use it for open carry here in arizona and new mexico.

pitty920
March 17, 2010, 06:05 PM
Anyone who says the Berreta 92/96 is too big, bulky, or not the gun for them is not giving the right chance, it is so close in size to a S&W sigma but more accurate with the longer barrel, feels perfect in hands, especially with hogue rubber grip!!!

This gun has more conversons and accesories than almost any other handgun, besides 1911 and equal with glocks.

It is known for being one of the most reliable and accurate semiaut pistols in the world, and all u 45 fans need to look at ballistics, a 40 cal has a better chance at a one shot stop than a 45, more velocity and muzzle lbs than 45, and is much cheaper. That is y most LE use them! look at chuckhawks pistol ballistics chart and u can see for yourself, and that is not even with the best 40 rounds, a 135grn Corbon rnd has over 585 ft/lbs of muzzle energy which will blow ANY 45 OUT OF THE WATER!

Not raggin on the 45, it is big and slow and has great stopping power, but the 40 cal is a great round for people who want the speed and clip capacity of a 9mm and the stopping power of a 45, that is why this round is used buy our finest!

easyg
March 17, 2010, 06:16 PM
Anyone who says the Berreta 92/96 is too big, bulky, or not the gun for them is not giving the right chance, it is so close in size to a S&W sigma but more accurate with the longer barrel, feels perfect in hands, especially with hogue rubber grip!!!
If you've got big hands and long fingers then the Beretta might feel good, but the width is 1.5" which is even fatter that a Glock 17 (1.18").

Do the Hogue grips reduce the thickness or add to the thickness?

mgregg85
March 17, 2010, 06:44 PM
I don't own one but I have shot them and liked the one I shot. I think its probably one of the best if not the best looking auto pistol out there.

WRGADog
March 17, 2010, 11:02 PM
M9A1. The 92FS is one of my favorite pistols. I added a SS guide rod and Wolf 16 pound main spring. The gun is incredibly accurate and reliable. The M9A1 is NIB and I may sell or trade it in the future. No particular reason for not firing the M9A1 just haven't had the desire to do so. I bought the M9A1 on the spur of the moment and really didn't need another 92 variant.

golden
March 18, 2010, 09:51 AM
I have several BERETTA 92 and 96 models and have shot many others. The 96D Brigadier was agency gun for about 8 years.

I prefer the D models with double action only triggers without a manual safety, maybe because that is all I have been issued for the last 12 years.

BERETTA has hands down the best double action only triggers I have tried. They are much better than the S&W and SIG pistols that I have used.

On the other hand, the 92 fits my hand well, but the COMPACT grip fits even better and I shoot it slightly better than the full size model.
I have also found the VERTEC model fits my hand better than the standard pistol.

I wear the 92d COMPACT when I am off duty and keep the .40 S&W caliber 96d as my house gun.

Jim

jon_in_wv
March 23, 2010, 06:43 AM
The agency I work for issues the Berreta Vertec 9mms. I just did my yearly qualification and I shot a 328 out of 330. Our course of fire includes 15 shots at 25 yards. We had no malfunctions of the weapons either. I like them better than the Rugers we used to carry. The Vertecs have a smaller grip than the older Berettas and I don't find them overly large for the caliber at all. In fact I would say my M&P is a little bulkier though it is lighter.

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