Kimber poll to set the record straight


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mptrimshop
February 5, 2010, 04:42 PM
i hear so much talk of how Kimbers are not good 1911 for the money, and then i hear the argument that there are so many out there that your bound to have a few problems. I just want to see some poll # on it

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geronimo509
February 5, 2010, 04:49 PM
mine was great, so was my brother's

ttheel
February 5, 2010, 04:54 PM
I think Kimber's are good 1911's. Remember when you build 55,000 per year you are bound to hear some negatives. If say Ed Brown makes 3000 and and you have a 5% problem rate then that is only 150 problems per year. If Kimber puts out 55,000 and you have a 5% problem rate then that is 2750 malfunctioning firearms. 2750 aggravated customers equals alot more internet horror stories than 150 does. Now I am not comparing Kimbers and Ed Brown's, I am just giving you the senario for why you hear more negative on Kimber.

I think they make quality, accurate firearms and would not hesitate to buy one.

mljdeckard
February 5, 2010, 05:04 PM
You do realize that this poll won't resolve anything, right?

My Custom II is the best handgun I have ever owned. I use it for everything, and I would carry it to war tomorrow if I were allowed to. My best friend shot mine, got one for him and one for his wife. No problems. Another friend moaned about wanting one until his dad gave him one. No problems. My dad wanted one, but didn't want to come up with $670 for a Custom II, so he got a good deal on a SA Mil-Spec. But NOW, he wishes that the trigger, hammer, and sight cuts were the same as my Kimber.

I have owned a Colt 1991. I don't remember it being anything special. I have shot Nighthawks and Baers. Good? Of course. Better than a Kimber? Perhaps under subjective eyes. Worth three times as much as my Kimber? I have no idea why.

mptrimshop
February 5, 2010, 05:15 PM
i just want to see the numbers.

MrIzhevsk
February 5, 2010, 05:23 PM
I voted the last option, I've shot my buddy's which was a stainless (custom II?) it had the external extractor. It felt like a 1911, shot like one, but it had a couple FTFs. Granted this was well within the 'break-in' period (under 200 rounds I'm guessing). From what I've read however I feel the majority of the issues comes from the external extractor. I wouldn't own one just because I have more faith in other companies.

EddieNFL
February 5, 2010, 05:25 PM
Voted. Popcorn in the microwave.

mptrimshop
February 5, 2010, 05:47 PM
my popcorn has been salted and buttered

CoRoMo
February 5, 2010, 05:59 PM
Hmmmm...

I voted for the 4th option because I think they are wonderful pistols. I doubt I'll ever own one though. I'll stick with Springfield.

kwelz
February 5, 2010, 06:02 PM
If you want to know about Kimbers as serious shooters or Pistol smiths. If you are a Kimber fan you probably won't like the answer. I have given my reasons for disliking them before and see no reason to repeat them here.
But lets just say Kimber doesn't really care what we think.

mljdeckard
February 5, 2010, 06:05 PM
My smith shoots nothing but Kimbers.

texas bulldog
February 5, 2010, 06:07 PM
i doubt i'll ever buy one. i'm sure they have made many fine pistols, but i feel i get more bang for my buck with dan wesson, colt, STI and others. YMMV.

ol' scratch
February 5, 2010, 06:23 PM
I love my Custom II (internal extractor). I have read the negative things said about Kimber 1911's. I have never had a problem with mine. I even shoot 200 grain semi wad cutters (reloads I create) through mine. I think the biggest problem is with the crappy mags they (Kimber) supply. USE WILSON COMBAT MAGAZINES. I don't have any problems with mine. With the stupid Kimber marked mags (which they don't even make), the pistol jammed alot on any thing but hardball.

Many people don't seem to understand 1911s. Sometimes they need a little adjustment. Remember that the original 1911 was only designed to feed hardball ammo. If you want SOME 1911's to feed all the time you have to make some adjustments.

SideArmed
February 5, 2010, 06:25 PM
I would add a few more options -

I have owned one...not happy/unhappy with it but would not purchase another "current" Kimber.

The new models coming out are looking awesome. May look to purchase something new

Balrog
February 5, 2010, 06:33 PM
I think they are the worst 1911 on the market.

waterhouse
February 5, 2010, 06:33 PM
No, I have owned or own on or more and am very unhappy with them.

None of your options fit me. I've owned several (I believe 4 or 5), liked most of them, was unhappy with one of them, and later found other 1911s I liked more for the same or less money so I sold all of them off.

I'd have no problem owning another one, but it probably wouldn't be at the top of my recommendation list

Avizpls
February 5, 2010, 06:40 PM
No, I have never owned one but from what i have read about them i would never buy one


what the f is the point of this option? That will not set record straight. More so because there isnt an equally uninformed and subjective "yes" answer

Oh, and I voted I have an Ultra Carry II and its friggin awesome. I removed the "II" portion of the gun ;-) . Before that, I had a period where I wasnt so sure, but thousands of rounds later I trust my life on it.

CoRoMo
February 5, 2010, 06:43 PM
Does this set the record straight?

Browns Fan
February 5, 2010, 07:05 PM
If you want a pretty gun to keep in a presentation case and never shoot it, then yeah, get a kimber.

five.five-six
February 5, 2010, 07:18 PM
I love my custom carry II, bullets go in the same hole, casings fly out and new cartrage goes in the chamber every time I pull the trigger... I have had 2 stovepipes in over 2k rounds of combat training..none target shooting

Eightball
February 5, 2010, 07:34 PM
Mine's been great. Recommend it all the time, shoots better than I do, and the only malf was due to a cheap mag and low-quality JHPs.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/2323/img29082.jpg

ol' scratch
February 5, 2010, 07:47 PM
If you want a pretty gun to keep in a presentation case and never shoot it, then yeah, get a kimber.
I shoot the h*ll out of my Kimber. I shoot it more than any of my pistols including my Rock Island. Don't make statements unless you KNOW for a fact everyone who purchases a Kimber never shoots it. This sounds like a statement from someone who has never owned one let alone fired one. I could have purchased a Springfield GI for $500. I sprang for the Kimber with a MATCH GRADE BARREL, TRIGGER AND BARREL BUSHING; A FULL SIZED OPERATING ROD, LOWERED AND FLARED EJECTION PORT, FORGED FRAME AND SLIDE and MADE IN THE USA (unlike Springfield) for $750. It seemed like a no-brainer to me.

NJGunOwner81
February 5, 2010, 07:55 PM
When I first saw the Kimber II Stainless (Internal Ext) I fell in love! I bought it as my first gun ever and I have not regretted that decision for one second!

http://i45.tinypic.com/2v0hfnt.jpg

I've told all my friends ... well, the gun loving friends that care anyway ... I have NEVER had one problem with that gun! NO misfires, NO FTFs, NO jams ... nothing! There was no break-in period for my gun because from bullet one it functioned flawlessly and that is why I have a hard time understanding people who do have problems because it is in such contrast to what I experienced.

I own other types of guns (Sig P250 & Taurus Judge Magnum) and have shot other types of guns but I LOVE my Kimber. It makes me look good because, in reality, I don't think I shoot as well as I do ... think the gun helps out a good deal.

Are Kimbers expensive? Compared to some others on the market they are but I think they are more than worth the money! But that's just my two cents! I always let people shoot my Kimber if they want to because I want them to see and feel how good they are!

Take Care & Stay Safe!

Frank
NJGunOwner81

ol' scratch
February 5, 2010, 08:00 PM
For what you get, I really don't think they are that more expensive.

mljdeckard
February 5, 2010, 08:42 PM
I shoot mine to death too. When I run out of .45, I put on the .22 slide and crank through a couple of hundred of those too.

I paid $630 NIB for it in like 2003, I think. Now I can find them for $670. I added night sights, Hogue wrap-around finger groove grips, and dropped the full-length guide rod. (I think a critical of the 1911 design is the ability to rack the slide by pushing forward against something.)

Zerodefect
February 5, 2010, 08:45 PM
I like my Kimber Custom 5" CDP II.

But:
-Kimber barrels corrode too easy. (IME all 1911's corrode easy)
- Lose the MIM, even if it works fine, MIM shouldn't be there.
- I will find who came up with the idea for the plastic mainspring housing and...
-Stainless isn't so stainless
- how about a model with a black melonite coating on everything so I don't have to carry my Glock on rainy/sweaty days.
-Kimber mags stink.
-they don't allways work too swell out of the box.
-wrong recoil spring

I think the Dan Wesson Valor is a superior 1911.
I prefere the Glock 23 for CCW now.

I didn't vote. Can you add a "My Kimber is Ok but my Glock is better" or "I like turtles." as an option?

rfwobbly
February 5, 2010, 08:48 PM
Brand new owner of a Kimber Stainless Target II in 38 Super. Shoots and handles like a dream.

I had heard bad things about their mags so I ordered 2 Metalform mags. In side-by-side comparison, the Kimber mag IS a Metalform mag !!

JDGray
February 5, 2010, 09:33 PM
Even after a few glitches, mines a keeper. Very accurate for a 3 incher, never a FTF or FTE in over a thousand rounds. If it weren't for the slide stop, holding open on a full mag, it would be perfect!:cool:

Balrog
February 5, 2010, 09:37 PM
Even after a few glitches, mines a keeper. Very accurate for a 3 incher, never a FTF or FTE in over a thousand rounds. If it weren't for the slide stop, holding open on a full mag, it would be perfect

Well gee most guns would be perfect if they didnt have problems.

ckone
February 5, 2010, 09:44 PM
I've had 2, they both sucked and put me off of 1911's for quite a while... IMO, a $400 RIA will run better than a Kimber 9 out 10 times.

xXxplosive
February 5, 2010, 09:47 PM
Not a Kimber fan.............................:neener:

rklessdriver
February 5, 2010, 10:29 PM
I bought a brand new Tactical Pro II back in 2004. Saw one on the cover of "Handguns" when I was on my first tour and as soon as I got back home I went looking for one. Ended up having to go to my local FFL and ordered it. Very high demand item at the time and I had to wait 2 months and paid MSRP...

First couple of range outings I kept having Fail To Extract problems. Called Kimber they told me that it needs a 500rnd break in.... 500rnd later still FTE at least once per mag. Kimber sends a call tag and I send it back. A month later I get it back and go to the range.... First round out of the first mag out of the box had a FTE... Wasted 50rnds that day and still FTE at least once per mag.... I call Kimber absolutely pissed. They send another call tag and keep my pistol for another 3 weeks.... Get it back and it still has the same problem.... Another call to Kimber and I get another call tag.... 3 weeks later same story.

At this point I'm so discouraged - I just put it in the back of my safe and refuse to touch it for 2 yrs. I get it out one day and take it to the range just out of spite and yep it still FTE's like no body's business....

Real shame it is a such a POS, because it is a beautiful pistol.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f303/rklessdriver/Weapons/DSC00836.jpg

It is somebody else's beautiful POS now. I took a huge loss on it and was glad to see it go. All I can say is that there are plenty of other 1911 mfgrs in this price range and from now on I'll spend my hard earned $$$ with them.
Will

Kingofthehill
February 5, 2010, 10:40 PM
Didn't see an option for my answer.

Sure their good 1911's.. I just think they are over hyped and Trendy.... in the Polymer world of "Tacitcal" its all about Glocks... in the world of "COOL" 1911's its Kimber.

There are tons of 1911's of better value and better finishes than a kimber... but kimbers do have a lot of options, they look good and they are always mixing it up... and yes, they shoot very well.

JOe

1858
February 5, 2010, 10:52 PM
I bought a Tactical Entry II late last year and it seems that it'll shoot 230gr ball ammunition (Blazer) just fine but it doesn't feed my 185gr SWC reloads at all. It seems to be very accurate, comfortable and controllable and it's definitely a beauty, but would I bet my life on it? Not yet but it's early days. Maybe it'll end up being my favorite auto but for now my SIG 220 still has the top spot. As for the poll, since there wasn't a "I'm still thinking" option, I voted that I like them and would recommend them based on fit, form and function (with factory ball ammunition).

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/kimber/kimber_te2_left.jpg

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/kimber/kimber_te2_right.jpg

:)

garyhan
February 6, 2010, 02:14 AM
I have owned 1911's by many manufacturers and the Kimber has been far the best, and I think they are the best you can buy for anything near a reasonable price.

gary

rswartsell
February 6, 2010, 02:24 AM
New 5" Custom II Target, 3rd Kimber used, always liked 'em. 100% brand new with 230 gr FMJ and Black Hills and Double Tap +P HP. A close second for most accurate handgun I own (for me) to a classy old S&W Pre-K-38 Masterpiece with a 6.25" bbl.

JDGray
February 6, 2010, 08:10 AM
Well gee most guns would be perfect if they didnt have problems.
As long as they don't reoccur, I'm happy;)

Browns Fan
February 6, 2010, 09:04 AM
ol' scatch, sorry if I disparaged your gun, it's just that I got caught up in the Kimber hype, bought an ultra carry. Back then, I was foolish enough to carry it before I actually fired it. It turned out to be a jam-o-matic. You buy a beautiful gun, especially a pricey one like a Kimber, and you expect it to run like a swiss watch. It was a major disappointment.

Balrog
February 6, 2010, 09:04 AM
First couple of range outings I kept having Fail To Extract problems. Called Kimber they told me that it needs a 500rnd break in.... 500rnd later still FTE at least once per mag. Kimber sends a call tag and I send it back. A month later I get it back and go to the range.... First round out of the first mag out of the box had a FTE... Wasted 50rnds that day and still FTE at least once per mag.... I call Kimber absolutely pissed. They send another call tag and keep my pistol for another 3 weeks.... Get it back and it still has the same problem.... Another call to Kimber and I get another call tag.... 3 weeks later same story.

This is the way Kimber is. I have had several Kimbers that are that exact story. The guns don't run right, and Kimber tells you to waste 500 rounds breaking in a jamming gun. Thats about $200 of ammo. Kimber does not understand what a break in period is for. You can't take a jam-o-matic and fix it with break in. Also, when I have sent something to Kimber customer service, they have never been able to fix it either, and they send it back with the same problem.

swinokur
February 6, 2010, 10:08 AM
Maybe I'm lucky. I have 550 rounds through my TLE/RL II. This was 500 rounds of WWB 230g FMJ and 50 230g HST +p JHP. Not a single problem. I even used 4 Kimber mags and 2 Wilson 47D's. Not a single problem. It's a keeper.

:)

Jonah71
February 6, 2010, 10:52 AM
I've never owned one. But I do as of 2 days ago. Nice looking pistol that fired when I pulled the trigger. A used older model .45 cal. Only paid $500. I know absolutely NOTHING about Kimbers. But I was in the market for a .45 and it seemed like a fair price to me (after he came down from $650 tag price....this is the 5th gun I've bought from him in less than a year.) I hope I didn't waste my $500. My gun dealer has been fair to me so far. Hope I'm still saying that after my next trip to the range.

M2 Carbine
February 6, 2010, 11:55 AM
I own 5 Kimbers. The only reason I don't own 6 is I haven't seen another one that I want, yet.

Friends own about another 8 or so.

I can carry any gun I want and I have dozens of good carry guns.
Because of experience with them I choose to carry Kimbers.

I am not brand loyal. I don't care what brand it is, if it doesn't preform I don't want it.

MachIVshooter
February 6, 2010, 12:41 PM
Never a problem with my Stainless Target II 10mm, and at some point I'll pick up an Eclipse. Just have other priorities right now for $1k.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/KimberStainlessTargetII10mm.jpg

As far as the poll, should have been only 2 options, and only answerable by owners, former or current. Would you buy another Kimber? Yes or No. That would be the only way to get a half-way accurate summation. Opinions about a gun's reliability/durability from people who have never owned one count for nothing. Shooting one that doesn't belong to you is not a good way to assess a firearm in that regard, as you have no idea it's history of reliability and maintenance/repairs.

ol' scratch
February 6, 2010, 03:19 PM
I bought a Tactical Entry II late last year and it seems that it'll shoot 230gr ball ammunition (Blazer) just fine but it doesn't feed my 185gr SWC reloads at all. It seems to be very accurate, comfortable and controllable and it's definitely a beauty, but would I bet my life on it? Not yet but it's early days. Maybe it'll end up being my favorite auto but for now my SIG 220 still has the top spot. As for the poll, since there wasn't a "I'm still thinking" option, I voted that I like them and would recommend them based on fit, form and function (with factory ball ammunition).

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/kimber/kimber_te2_left.jpg

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/kimber/kimber_te2_right.jpg

:)
I had the same problem with 200 grain semi wads produced by Rainer. My pistol will digest the 185 and 200 semi wads made by Hornady. Try switching bullet manufacturers, it may make a difference.

wilkersk
February 6, 2010, 03:31 PM
There's a lot of boo-hoo-ing about the Swchartz safety and about FTF problems. But, I've never been bothered by either.

With the Swchartz safety, I think understanding how the darn thing works, and the benefits of developing a good instinctive grip is key to avoiding the "problem" associated with it.

http://www.handgunsmag.com/tactics_training/HGcombatg_100206A.jpg

As far as the FTF problems I'm hearing about, I'm at a loss. I've never had an FTF with mine, except the time I was experimenting with OAL on some 230gr Hornady XTPs.

ol' scratch
February 6, 2010, 03:36 PM
ol' scatch, sorry if I disparaged your gun, it's just that I got caught up in the Kimber hype, bought an ultra carry. Back then, I was foolish enough to carry it before I actually fired it. It turned out to be a jam-o-matic. You buy a beautiful gun, especially a pricey one like a Kimber, and you expect it to run like a swiss watch. It was a major disappointment.
I went back and reviewed my post and I was very abrasive. Sorry about that. I had just gotten back from the range and had been listening to Mr. Tact-i-cool explain to the guy shooting with him that I paid too much for my $1200 pistol (paid $750). He said that Kimbers are junk and I should have bought a Glock because they don't jam. I had just sent 50 rounds down range without a problem. I thought you were a Glock guy posing as a Kimber owner.

crawfobj
February 6, 2010, 03:45 PM
Had an Ultra CDP II. Great looking, and almost too pretty to carry. Shot and functioned fine, except for an annoying tendency to launch one empty case per mag directly at my forehead. I traded it and went back to carrying my XD subcompact.

wrc
February 6, 2010, 04:35 PM
Oh, Kimber. My first Kimber was a regular old Stainless II. It immediately revealed itself as a FA machine pistol. After a trip back to the factory (All on Kimber's dime), it came back better than new with a really good hand-fit trigger and sear. It has not shown even a ghost of a problem since. I have not handled it with kid gloves, either. Lots of gouges on that gun.

My last Kimber was a Grand Raptor. Very pretty. Works great. Nothing has broken. The trigger isn't as good as that first Kimber's, but I'd like to think Kimber *owed* me that trigger.

People complain about the MIM parts, which can be valid if there's a bad QA guy for the batch, but what I hate is the awful plastic backstrap. Pay the premium for a 'factory custom' and you still get the lego backstrap. It fills me with irrational rage.

Note: Colt will also give you a lego backstrap.

Anyway, in my experience, any problems with a Kimber reveal themselves quickly and will be taken care of in similar haste. After that, they are reliable and durable.

HisSoldier
February 6, 2010, 04:55 PM
Mine is a fine functioning gun, the most accurate of all my 1911's, but had I known they had so much MIM in them I wouldn't have bought it.


I had just gotten back from the range and had been listening to Mr. Tact-i-cool explain to the guy shooting with him that I paid too much for my $1200 pistol (paid $750). He said that Kimbers are junk and I should have bought a Glock


Tact-i-stupid. A guy like that doesn't have a clue about what makes a fine gun. I wouldn't trade my 'MIMber' for ten glocks. At least it's not made of plastic!

Perseverance
February 6, 2010, 05:20 PM
I don't like the price for a gun made with lower quality parts. Given a lower price I'd say they were a fine gun, but as of now I think people are overpaying for a lower quality pistol. Does this mean there junk, no, just overpriced.

nwilliams
February 6, 2010, 05:27 PM
I've met plenty of very happy Kimber owners although I've never owned one myself.

My friend has had one for about five years and he loves it.

Boats
February 6, 2010, 05:40 PM
The jokers in Yonkers can keep their MIMbers, with their Barbie font roll mark and inflated asking prices for 1911-ish shaped objects.

If I want a basic 1911A1, I'll go with Springfield Armory de Brasil. If I want a basic American made one I'll go Colt and look down upon the clones. If I want a higher end production 1911 that flat out embarrasses MIMber's line-up, Dan Wesson gets the call. If I want a 1911-ish shaped object, at least S&W has a better warranty.

Whatever market niche MIMber is trying to fill is one I don't want to be caught dead in. They are the all more show than go. Poor SIGARMS is currently being MIMbered by the former CEO from Yonkers and it shows in all of the pimpalicious models that came out as if serious shooters were bling collectors.

Rexster
February 6, 2010, 05:40 PM
None of mine worked with Kimber magazines. One worked ONLY with McCormick Power Mags. Another worked ONLY with Metalform 7-shot mags. The other worked with Metalform 7-shot mags and Colt mags. None of the three worked with Wilson mags. All three required parts replacement, when new. Two required new slide stops, in order to lock open when empty, and one required a new extractor. Mine were from the much-worshipped first generation, or whatever Kimber fanboys call the pre-Schwartz safety era.

Moreover, of the friends of mine, known to me personally, who own or owned Kimbers, only one was happy with his. All the others were displeased to downright enraged that they bought Kimbers.

I have repeatedly heard that Kimber makes good slides, frames and barrels, but and that everything else is problematic. That may well be so.

Kimber won't get any more of my money.

Some will say it was user error. Well, if so, why did all of my Colt Government Models and Govt-sized Springfield Armory work just fine, and my Les Baer also work just fine?

Jonah71
February 7, 2010, 08:10 AM
Maybe I'll get lucky and all the kinks will have been worked out of the Kimber I have by now. I admit to paying for the Kimber name (plus the $500 price sounded good), but untill I get it on the range, the jury is still out for me. Now I have my eyes on a CZ Mod. 75 SS 9mm. Don't know a thing about them either, except I like the fit and as dependable as my 24/7 Taurus Pro C has been, I just don't like carrying it chambered. At least that sounds good...l just like the look of the CZ. I can lie to myself all I want about needing it.

txgolfer45
February 7, 2010, 08:31 AM
Kimbers are good production guns. They are nice looking, fairly accurate and reliable. I have a Pro Raptor II. Definitely good looking, functions well and accurate for typical SD ranges. Are there better Commander size 1911's out there? Yes. I like my Kimber.

I have to say that I like my STI Trojan and SA TRP better. I think STI and SA produce a better product than Kimber.

erickg
February 7, 2010, 02:41 PM
I own one and it shoots fine, but I will forever hold a grudge against Kimber for popularizing the hideous forward cocking serrations. Damn they are ugly and you cant find a decent 1911 without them anymore.

mptrimshop
January 20, 2012, 08:44 PM
Lets get a few mire votes.... bring it back

Feanor
January 20, 2012, 09:27 PM
I think they are the worst 1911 on the market.

I will second that opinion. Crummy sights, crummy safeties, crummy beavertail, crummy barrels, and virtually a MIM catastrophe.

Feanor
January 20, 2012, 09:32 PM
I have owned a Colt 1991. I don\\\'t remember it being anything special.

Well I will tell one way their special, next time you see a used Kimber next to a used Colt, check back with us on the price difference, would you? :)

ApacheCoTodd
January 20, 2012, 10:42 PM
I'm happy but my opinion may be skewed by only having owned Det-1 pistols. The shooter has had over 1500 rds of Miwal cheapo bulk reloads and not one single mag or ammo compatibility/performance issue.

I remember a time when folk said they were too finicky to be an off the shelf pistol but if they're capable of making such an outstanding service pistol as the Det-1 I'll throw a positive vote in support.

muncherndn
January 21, 2012, 12:52 AM
I have had my Custom CDPII for 7 years or so and have been quite pleased with it. Within the first 500 rounds or so, I had around 15 FTE's. I read the manual and it clearly stated that it needs 500 rounds of break-in. Spending that amount of money, albeit mid-level, I'd expect it to be reliable from the beginning. I say mid-level as in 1911 markets go - a nice chunk of change for me.

For me, the CDPII just "felt right" when I picked it up. Sometimes, you just know. I picked up a Kimber Crimson Carry two years ago, and haven't had any FTF's/FTE's yet. I'm only around 300 rounds into it - dang deployments hurt my range time.

I would recommend Kimber to friends and family, with the caveat that the weapon only comes with one sub-par magazine. Spending the amount of money involved, one would think that there would be more than one magazine - or at least one of higher quality.

Mauser lover
January 21, 2012, 01:12 AM
I probably wouldn't ever buy a Kimber, but not because of them being bad quality. They are just too expensive for me. I would love to have one, but the one I want is their second or third most expensive one. :)

mljdeckard
January 21, 2012, 05:34 AM
Feanor, why would I possibly want to do that?

bkundingerii
January 21, 2012, 06:40 AM
I have a Pro Carry II TLE/RL, best pistol that I've owned yet. Great a accuracy for the shortened 4" barrel.

mavracer
January 21, 2012, 07:50 AM
None of the answers fit me.
Need one that say's
I've owned several and all but one have been great. But that one had me deal with Kiimber customer service and now I won't buy another Kimber given another option.

EddieNFL
January 21, 2012, 10:02 AM
How many "Yea" voters don't own one, but have a buddy...

Discounting the "Don't own one" voters, about 43 percent aren't happy.

rbernie
January 21, 2012, 10:22 AM
Or maybe that forty three percent have just bought into the common Internet meme that 'Kimber's are overpriced and overhyped junk' that became all the fad about 5-6 years ago when Kimber had issues with their transition into MIM..

I have owned a BUNCH of Kimbers. I still own a goodly number. Most of the ones that I have owned have seen fairly solid use (>10K rounds, and some significantly more than that) with no issues. The MIM issues of the last decade appear to be just that - past history - and Kimber seems to have successfully gotten through the teething pains of the MIM transition.

My current EDC is a Kimber. My range beater is a Kimber. And yes, they get used quite regularly.....

EddieNFL
January 21, 2012, 10:51 AM
Or maybe that forty three percent have just bought into the common Internet meme that 'Kimber's are overpriced and overhyped junk' that became all the fad about 5-6 years ago when Kimber had issues with their transition into MIM..

Or have owned several and experience issues not related to MIM parts...even after the much hyped "500 round break-in"

Maybe the 57 percent refuse to admit buying/owning a less than stellar product.

orionengnr
January 21, 2012, 10:55 AM
Maybe the 57 percent refuse to admit buying/owning a less than stellar product.
Yeah, that's it. :rolleyes:
That's why I have bought eight so far...and carry one every day.

ApacheCoTodd
January 21, 2012, 11:04 AM
I think the average person who is saying.... Wait, this isn't the Taurus thread? Not even a Glock thread? Well, at least the Road is High on this thread.:scrutiny:

sgtstryker
January 21, 2012, 11:28 AM
When I go to the range, I shoot my Combat Commander and my Custom II. I like 'em both. I've had the Colt lots longer and it's one of many I've owned over the years. I got the Custom II because it was the lowest priced Kimber, wanted to see what they were about. It's a good one, once broken in it's great. I want a rail model, but, the price is a little high, IMO. So, with Wison mags and good ammo, I enjoy them both. I also like Glocks, oh and drive a Chevy, too...

mljdeckard
January 21, 2012, 11:45 AM
Here's what I think.

For decades, there were only a few options for 1911s. A handful of imports, G.I. guns that have been in circulation for years Colts, a handful of low-volume boutique shops like AMT, and a few very expensive custom shops. You had one end of the scale or the other. If you wanted a tight-fitting, match-grade gun, you had to spend a lot of money. Then Kimber started mass-producing guns with hand-fitted slides and match-grade parts for less than half what anyone else could produce them for. They turned the entire market on its ear and set the competition scrambling to match production. They all had to re-think the entire gameplan about price point. Everyone knew the emperor was naked.

Some people have never gotten over this. They are still upset that they paid more than a thousand dollars for a custom pistol, and someone else came out with one that does the exact same thing for less than half the sticker. This means one of two things must be true. Either someone figured out a better way to do it (with a large investment in CNC machining,) or they must be flawed. It is easier to believe that they are flawed, because otherwise they feel like they wasted money. This means a bad Colt is a lemon, but a bad Kimber is typical.

What percentage of people who complain about something on the internet means little, because people who are upset about something complain more loudly and more often than someone who is content and has no reason to complain. People who are mad let their attention get grabbed when someone asks, people who are content have no passion to respond, and ignore it. It is only those of us who have come to recognize that good products and service deserve to be recognized that go out of our way to praise them. We are far outnumbered by whiners.

A larger number of units sold may reveal a higher number of units with problems. This does not equal a higher RATE of problems. I call this "Ford Taurus Syndrome" For many years, Ford sold a very high number of Tauri. I started to hear about a lot of them having problems, and I let this put an idea in my mind that they were bad cars. Over time, I realized that I ONLY heard about problems, I never heard about the vast majority that ran fine and no one complained about.

I have bought and carried guns from Auto-Ordnance, Para Ordnance, Colt, Kimber, Smith and Wesson, and a lot of other non-1911 pistols. I have shot pretty much every brand you can name. Some were fine. I had a Nighthawk jam on a rental range. My colt was rough and sticky out of the box. I never picked up a 1911 that shot as well and ran as smoothly out of the box as my Kimber. As I stated in my original post in this thread (over two years ago,) all of my friends and family shot mine, and either bought Kimbers, never had any significant problems, or something else, and wished they bought Kimbers. It is the best gun I have ever owned, and I would carry it to war tomorrow if I had to. If I had the time and cash to compete regularly (which might be happening soon,) I would take my Kimber. If I were allowed to take any sidearm I wanted to to war tomorrow, it would be the Kimber. I am about to take delivery on a commemorative Para SF-45A, and based on the experiences of friends who already have them, I don't expect it to be perfect out out of the box. I bought it for sentimental reasons. I will still default to the Kimber for pretty much everything.

My experience is only mine, and worth the same amount online as anyone else's. But when people ask about a Sigma, which was by far the worst pistol I ever bought, and I tell my horror story, I get mocked and derided, told I just got a lemon, when all I ever did was tell exactly what happened to me. On the internet, it's like it's fashionable and accepted to mock Kimber because a few people do it so loudly. If Kimber was as bad as some people in here wish they were, they would have upset so many people that they would have folded long ago. Or I suppose it's possible mine keeps running on happy thoughts and pixie dust.

EddieNFL
January 21, 2012, 12:37 PM
That's why I have bought eight so far...and carry one every day.

Proving there are at least eight good ones out there.

I have one I do and have trusted to carry (we're up to nine). The other two...not so much.

Or I suppose it's possible mine keeps running on happy thoughts and pixie dust.

After reading Dillons are over-priced pieces of junk, I increased my number of happy thoughts. Working so far.

So, the 43 percent are full of organic fertilizer, but the 57 percent are direct descendants of George Washington.

EXODUS 20:17 (a) Thou shalt post no hurtful opinions on the net.

klmmicro
January 21, 2012, 01:32 PM
Having worked on a range, I have had the opportunity to shoot many Kimber's...some extensively. I have never had one fail to feed, fire or eject in my hand. There have been a few complaints from owners that said they had problems that required factory work to correct. Most people report that they work well out of the box.

I would buy a Kimber. That said, I have also fired Springfield, RI and Wilson. All of those were as reliable for me. There are options available that are as viable as Kimber. If there is something that you read or hear that turns you off of the Kimber brand, you can still choose and purchase a quality, reliable and affordable pistol from another manufacturer.

1858
January 21, 2012, 02:39 PM
even after the much hyped "500 round break-in"

Even Springfield is recommending a 500 round break-in these days but that doesn't seem to result in incredulous responses typical of Kimber threads (see post #13).

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=635648

I posted my first response in this thread almost two years ago. Since that post I've bought three Ed Browns, two Dan Wessons and another Kimber. I've shot many thousands of rounds through my TEII, mostly in USPSA matches, and I'd STILL recommend Kimber, particularly models in the $800 price range. If someone is prepared to spend $1,200+ then I'd suggest a DW from Dave Severns of Severns Custom.

jackpinesavages
January 21, 2012, 04:02 PM
Never bought one. I have bought a new STI, used Caspian, and a used Para GI Expert. All excellent shooters-knock on wood.

A friend works at a Kimber dealer and has shared the horror stories of their CS, and the nightmares experienced by customers in shipping, etc.. So, I share his thoughts by vicarious ownership experience; should be higher quality and/or customer service level for the prices charged.

Buy one used that's broken in? May be an entirely different ballgame....

csa77
January 21, 2012, 08:20 PM
my kimber has 4000+ rounds though it. still using the original ~12 year old recoil spring and original factory mag.the only failures i ever have had with it are 2 stove pipes, that i think are related to the cheap bulk umc ammo i shoot

its amazingly accurate, infact its hands down the most accurate pistol i own, better then my target 22/45, browning hi power,Beretta 96 and my old usp45.

trex1310
January 23, 2012, 06:39 PM
Is the record straight yet?

rbernie
January 23, 2012, 07:55 PM
Buy one used that's broken in? May be an entirely different ballgame....I'm going to share a personal anecdote to address this. I've hesitated to post this because it's actually about somebody that does occasionally frequent this forum. Hopefully, he won't mind my sharing this....

Right before the Christmas holiday break, a gunnie that I know decides that he wants to buy a bunch of 1911 pistols (all 5", in 45ACP) to put away as future gifts for his not-yet-shooting-age kids. He didn't want to gift the pistols right away, but he'd come into an end-of-year windfall and wanted to spend it while he had it. He decided to buy the pistols and put them away until the time was right to gift them. His one concern was putting them away unfired, since if one/some provided defective he might have issues years down the road in getting them serviced under warranty. He decided to buy them now and shoot 400 rounds ('break-in') through each of them before putting them away. He elected to buy Kimber pistols - many of the Kimber models met the price/feature point that he wanted. In the end, he bought a passel of pistols and started to prep them for break-in and subsequent storage in the back of his safe. Over the last six weekends, I have been helping accomplish this break-in.

To date, I have shot 400 rounds each through:


Kimber Custom II Stainless
Kimber Custom II Blued
Kimber Custom II TLE Stainless
Kimber Custom II TLE Stainless
Kimber Custom II TLE-R Stainless
Kimber Custom II CDP


That means that I fired 2400 rounds of ammo through six (6) NIB Kimber pistols. Ammo used was predominantly S&B 230gr FMJ, with a smattering of 230gr FMJ Aguila and Blazer Brass.

During this break-in shooting, I experienced two (2) stoppages (other than running out of ammo). One of the TLE's and the one TLE-R had one instance each where a round failed to load, and wound up with the rim not quite slid up under the extractor hook in what almost looked like a 3-point jam. (I was moving fast and didn't stop to really examine the jam..) A simple malf drill ejected the offending round, and the round was subsequently fired in a later string without issue. I was using a CMC PowerMag+ magazine and S&B ammo when both malf's occurred.

The only things done to the pistols before firing them (other than oil/grease) was replacing the mainspring housing with a Colt arched unit and replacing the FLGR with a USGI-spec guide rod and plug. (In the FWIW department, C&S is the only outfit that I know of that makes a true USGI plug, and that is what was used in these pistols...) We also used a smattering of magazines; I used my standard and well-used CheckMate/Colt hybrid 7rd units initially but mostly used a bunch of new CMC PowerMag+. We did not make any effort to use the provided Kimber magazines. The pistols were not cleaned during this shooting; they got an initial break-down and lube and then a final clean and lube when the shooting was completed.

So there you have it; I can personally vouch for a sample size of six (6) new 5" Kimber's, none of which needed anything special to get them through their first four hundred rounds. Four (4) of these Kimbers shot 400 rounds without a single issue at all, and two (2) had a single malf. Maybe the shorter barreled variants would provide different results, but I'm pretty well settled on the notion that the 5" variants represent a decent package for the money spent.

Oh, and yes - I got the keep the brass. :)

wmcc75
January 23, 2012, 08:13 PM
My brother has one and I love it wish I had the money to buy my own

solman
January 24, 2012, 02:05 PM
I bought one years ago before the prices went crazy. Its a custom stainless target that shoots great and is comfortable enough to shoot all afternoon. It had a little teething pain at first FTF where the slide would not close completely. I called Kimber they told me to change the slide spring. After I did that its been a great shooter.

dcarch
January 24, 2012, 06:24 PM
My Custom II just passed 700 rds. flawlessly.

Dogguy
January 25, 2012, 10:17 PM
It's interesting that there are more people who say they would not buy a Kimber based on what they've read (presumably on web forums) than there are people who own the gun and are unhappy with it.

I don't have an opinion here since I don't care much for the 1911 platform. I just think the poll shows the power of negativity over positive experience.

Dnaltrop
February 17, 2012, 01:33 PM
My physical experience with a Kimber has been one, a very well made one, before the move out of Oregon. Did not get to fire it, but was VERY nice in the hand.

As they left my state for New York, and now New Jersey... (No offence meant, but Newark left a lasting impression with me :D !!) it's a bit more polarizing with the few other owners here I've talked to.

Apparently, for many of us Oregonians, anything they made after they left us is Junk :D Kind of hard to find unbiased opinions locally.

I'll admit however to being tempted at times by their entry level models, mostly because I prefer to buy US made products if possible before foreign.

Winkman822
February 17, 2012, 03:39 PM
I voted no. I've had three of them and three of them were problematic, each in their own special way.

Eclipse Target II - VERY picky about mags and ammo.

Royal II (before Kimber offered them with Turnbull bluing) - lots of issues with the Series II safety, on multiple occasions with a round in teh chamber I would get on target and squeeze the trigger only to meet with a click rather than a boom

Desert Warrior - VERY loosely fit, but fed fired and ejected everything, experienced small parts breakages (slide release and thumb safety in particular) within the first 1500 rounds of a gun that was purchased BNIB from my local Kimber "Master Dealer".

Never again will I own a Kimber or recommend them to another.

Peakbagger46
February 17, 2012, 04:55 PM
Bought a 3" version in 2007. What a jamming POS it was. Beautiful pistol, but after two trips back to Kimber I would never trust my life to it. Yes, it was kept clean and lubed and no, I didn't limp wrist it at all. FMJ's would jam often and duty rounds were jamming every other shot, this was after being "worked on" by Kimber.

Ky Larry
February 17, 2012, 05:21 PM
I've owned my Kimber Custom Defender II for 10 years. I bought it used so I have no idea how many rounds were fired thru it. I've fired just about every type of ammo thru it.I've shot thousands of 200gr LSWC and 230gr JRN rounds of my reloads thru it. It has had exactly one fte. (A-MERC case I knew was bad. I just wanted to see if it would work.) No parts breakage. No failure to feed. No failure to fire. One failure to extract. Thats with Chip McCormack, Kimber, and no-name gunshow mags. I shot 1,000 of my reloads thru it with no cleaning or maintainance except keeping the rails oiled with Colt gun oil. I think I have a keeper. YMMV.

Stevie-Ray
February 17, 2012, 09:20 PM
My Kimber Ultra CDP has been my EDC for over 8 years. I'd say that's a pretty good recommendation as I doubt many carry anything they're not 100% sure about. I fired it for 250 rounds when I first got it, then strapped it on. It's never failed, even though the 3" is the most maligned. It now gets shot anywhere from 14 rounds to 1 box of HydraShoks depending on how badly I shoot. I doubt I've put more than 28 rounds through it in any one range trip, as it's simply the most accurate out of the box weapon I've owned, and it completely outclassed the HK USPC it replaced. I've owned only one Kimber, mostly because I'm a Colt guy. But there's no doubt I got one of their best. Based only on this, I would definitely recommend them to anyone.

I did nearly choke on the $950 I paid for it. But if I knew then what I know now, it would have been easier on the wallet.

CZ223
February 18, 2012, 06:13 AM
you had nothing that came close to my feelings on the subject. I think that all in all they are good guns but, they are overpriced. Don't get me wrong, I own five of them, but I didn't buy any of them new and probably won't ever own a new one. I generally get them for about 60-75% of new in like new condition. I have two duo-tone Taurus PT 1911's that I paid $600(new) and $400(barely used). I can't see spending $200 more for a bare bones Kimber Custom that probably won't shoot as well as my Taurus guns.

seelawyer
February 18, 2012, 07:10 PM
800+ rounds through CDP 3" which I is my EDC. Three failure to battery in first 50 rounds. No worries since with all types of ammo and mags and more accurate than me.

needmorecowbell
February 18, 2012, 07:23 PM
My custom II has been 100% reliable out of the box and is extremely accurate. I think it's a great 1911 value for the $679 before tax price I paid for it. Only thing I didn't care for were the all black Novak sights so I put 3 dot night sights on mine.

dcarch
February 19, 2012, 09:13 PM
Update: Just passed the 1000 round mark with nary a hiccup. No problems to report.

wally
February 20, 2012, 07:06 PM
I didn't vote as I didn't see a relevant option.

I own more than one and they never given me any troubles, although the recoil springs on the Ultra Carry need to be replaced a lot more often than on the larger 1911s, but I wouldn't really recommend them as I think you can do as good for less money or better for the same money.

But then I'd say the same thing about Colt, who IMHO have been living off their reputation for a very long time now. My first Colt was about my worst gun ever and why I learned to be a pretty decent 1911 mechanic to get it to run. Buy a Colt if you plan to sell it later, buy something else if you plan to shoot it a lot.

Armed012002
February 20, 2012, 10:07 PM
They're "ok" for the money, in my opinion.

The barrel looks like stainless steel, but it's actually carbon steel in the white with no protective coating or finish. If you don't keep all surfaces of the barrel coated with oil, it will rust.

The thumb safety, grip safety, hammer, sear, trigger, and just about everything else is metal-injection molded (MIM). For under $1,000 MIM is acceptable, but don't pay over $1,000 for MIM parts.

Their magazines suck.

They're not known for great customer service.

If you run into problems:

1. Buy good magazines.
2. Make sure the extractor is tuned properly. It's pretty easy to do yourself. Google tutorials on "1911 tune extractor".

If the above does not fix your problems, don't even bother with Kimber's customer service. Find a gunsmith to help you.

Good luck.

Road Less Traveled
February 20, 2012, 10:44 PM
"The barrel looks like stainless steel, but it's actually carbon steel in the white with no protective coating or finish. If you don't keep all surfaces of the barrel coated with oil, it will rust."

This varies model by model. My Gold Match II has a stainless steel barrel.

gpjoe
February 21, 2012, 06:47 AM
Don't see a poll choice so I'll respond without voting:

There has always been enough negative feedback on Kimber that I probably would never recommend one to anyone. I believe the old adage "Where there's smoke, there's fire" and don't necessarily believe that Kimber's reputation is a bad rap based on the "fact" (I've heard it a million times) that "they sell more than anyone else, so they have more problems". Sorry, not buying into that theory.

Having said all of that, I probably would not risk buying ANOTHER Kimber. Yes, I have one (Ultra CDP II) and yes, I carry it - almost every day. It has never failed in any way, and is very accurate. But, I have purchased four 1911 pistols since, and have never had the urge to own another Kimber. Maybe I'm being too hard on Kimber, but again - I'm not willing to risk getting a lemon and for the kind of money Kimber charges, I'll stick with Colt.

Edit: Just want to add that I also do not buy into the "all Kimbers are junk" mantra. I'm sure they fall somewhere in between, I just don't have the burning desire to own another.

rbernie
February 21, 2012, 08:29 AM
I believe the old adage "Where there's smoke, there's fire" and don't necessarily believe that Kimber's reputation is a bad rap based on the "fact" (I've heard it a million times) that "they sell more than anyone else, so they have more problems". Sorry, not buying into that theory.

http://www.atf.gov/statistics/download/afmer/2010-final-firearms-manufacturing-export-report.pdf

Colt @ 29331 (1911s)
Springfield @ 12592 (various 45ACPs)
S&W @ 9323 (1911s)
ParaOrd @ 16726 (1911s)
Sig Sauer @ 63092 (various 45ACPs)
Remington @ 11017 (1911s)
CZ/Dan Wesson @ 3542 (1911s)
Kimber @ 85991 (1911s)
Ed Brown @ 1876 (1911s)
Les Baer @ 2540 (1911s)
Nighthawk @ 1439 (1911s)
Wilson Combat @ 1952 (1911s)
STI @ 253 (1911s)
Glock @ 10502 (various 45ACPS)

valnar
February 21, 2012, 08:51 AM
As long as Dan Wesson keeps making 1911's, I see no reason to buy a Kimber.

kanook
February 21, 2012, 09:05 AM
Kimber Custom II, no problems, accurate

Kimber Ultra Carry Raptor, doesn't like to feed first HP from a fully stuffed mag, one short feeds fine, (tried different mags, same thing), VERY accurate

Kimber TLE/RL, no feeding problems, grouped like a shotgun, tried lots of ammo, same thing.

Don't know if I would go out of my way to buy another one (Ruger is next on my list) but I would trade into one.

kanook
February 21, 2012, 09:08 AM
Just remembered, I traded into one commander size and haven't shot it yet.

PastorAaron
February 21, 2012, 09:45 AM
Kimber Grand Raptor II, one malf in several thousand rounds (DIRTY gun, cheap ammo).
Kimber Eclipse Pro II, no issues in around 1000 rounds. Hps included.
Next gun, another Kimber or a Valor. Never fired a Kimber I didn't like, never had an issue with one....but the Valors are aweful pretty ;)

gpjoe
February 21, 2012, 03:23 PM
http://www.atf.gov/statistics/downlo...ort-report.pdf

Colt @ 29331 (1911s)
Springfield @ 12592 (various 45ACPs)
S&W @ 9323 (1911s)
ParaOrd @ 16726 (1911s)
Sig Sauer @ 63092 (various 45ACPs)
Remington @ 11017 (1911s)
CZ/Dan Wesson @ 3542 (1911s)
Kimber @ 85991 (1911s)
Ed Brown @ 1876 (1911s)
Les Baer @ 2540 (1911s)
Nighthawk @ 1439 (1911s)
Wilson Combat @ 1952 (1911s)
STI @ 253 (1911s)
Glock @ 10502 (various 45ACPS)


OK, my fault for being vague: I never said that Kimber didn't make more pistols, just that I don't know their rate of defective pistols or, say, defects per 1000 pistols manufactured as compared to other brands.

I also admit that much of the Kimber bashing may very well just internet 'noise', but that noise is loud enough that I have no desire to own another Kimber. Not saying that's fair to Kimber, just my personal feeling. I am much more comfortable spending my hard-earned dollars on Colt pistols.

hogrdr
February 21, 2012, 04:11 PM
i have 2 colt 1911's, 1 dan wesson, 6 kimbers. the kimbers i have now are great, But i have owned 3 that were crap. the dan had problems at first too though, every brand has crap if you buy enough of them, my experience has been that the early kimbers i bought were bad but the later ones were good, i won't buy anything that doesn't say 2 on it anymore. just my personal experiance.

EddieNFL
February 21, 2012, 06:57 PM
i won't buy anything that doesn't say 2 on it anymore. just my personal experiance.

That's different.

RH45
February 21, 2012, 08:42 PM
I didn't vote because I didn't see an option that fit.

I bought a Pro-Elite, many years ago, for my wife, and almost didn't give it to her because I liked it so much. About the same time, I bought a .40 caliber, Pro-Carry that has many thousands of rounds through it, without any problems.

I've read more bad reviews on Kimbers in the last several years, than good, and as far as 1911s go, I think there are better values out there.

That said, even though it's not a 1911, I just picked up a new, Kimber Solo, and took it to the range today. I didn't count how many rounds I put through it, but, my fingers were frozen, and the palm of my hand was getting sore from the recoil. It ate everything I put through it.

I think it's going to be one of my favorite carry guns!:D

KenW.
February 21, 2012, 11:52 PM
I bought a Tactical Custom II in 2003 or 4 as a "I quit smoking!" gift. Last cigarette 12/7/2002 after a 20-year miltary career and smoking habit.
It was my duty gun for several years. I'll go back to it one day I think. I caught the XD bug.

My Kimber's been flawless. Just gotta keep a good recoil spring in it like all 1911s.

warbirdlover
February 22, 2012, 12:37 AM
I didn't vote because I never had one but my brother had one and liked it until he got a deal on a new Springfield 1911 Trophy Match.

CombatArmsUSAF
February 22, 2012, 09:11 AM
I don't think they are bad guns, but I do think they are overpriced for what they are. You can get far better quality for the same if not less money from other manufacturers.

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