Makarov for concealed carry?


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WardenWolf
February 6, 2010, 09:29 PM
Well, I just got my Arizona CCW license, and I'm looking for a decent carry piece as all my other pistols are either physically too large or too small-caliber. I'm considering a Bulgarian Makarov. Its weight isn't really an issue, as even my Tokarev doesn't cause me any problems. I can conceal even the Tokarev IWB without any issues; it's simply too large to be comfortable. The Makarov seems to be short enough and small enough overall to conceal well. Does anyone have any experience carrying a Makarov concealed?

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gbelleh
February 6, 2010, 10:05 PM
I've carried Makarovs occasionally. They carry pretty well. Of course they're larger and heavier than many CCW pistols available today, but they're nice and thin. If you can conceal a Tokarev, you'll have no problem concealing the Makarov.

Shadow 7D
February 6, 2010, 10:22 PM
use the search (third tab from the right)
well covered, many people carry the mak, or feg/PA-64 because they are quite slim, also consider the CZ-82, not as slim (in the muzzle it is, but double stack makes the grip fatter) but it carries 12+1 and is a CZ, little long in the trigger, but a true joy to shoot.

WardenWolf
February 6, 2010, 10:55 PM
The main thing seems to be shoulder width. As long as your shoulders are wide enough to support a shirt that hangs down over it, you can conceal just about anything. My shoulders are plenty wide for my height, and I managed to stuff my full-size Tokarev kangaroo holster IWB and you couldn't tell I was wearing it with my shirt hanging over it. My only real concern is with the pistol being comfortable enough to carry this way.

StorkPatrol
February 6, 2010, 11:12 PM
Yes, the Makarov is a great carry gun...if you recognize it's limitations. Like any handgun, the Makarov and its other eastern block cousins is a compromise. I carry my Bulgarian Makarov about 60% of the time and usually don't feel under-armed with it. It's great for a grab-and-go gun when I am going somewhere I perceive as low threat, can't dress around a larger gun, or am just feeling to lazy to holster up my CZ-75b. Many people use a snub nose revolver for this role. I like to carry the Makarov because it is reliable, thin, and holds almost twice as many rounds as a J-frame. The main limitations are the borderline weak cartridge and the smallish sights. I overcome these limitations through practice. I've got close to 5k rounds through that gun, and I know what I can and can't do with it. I hope my post helps you make a more educated decision.
--Stork

WardenWolf
February 6, 2010, 11:27 PM
I understand the 9x18 round is roughly midway between .380 ACP and 9mm Luger. Given that most commercial concealment guns are .380 and a lot more expensive, I do not really see this being an issue. I also found plenty of hollowpoints available for it. I think I may purchase a Makarov, and keep my Tokarev (also loaded with hollowpoints) for when I want to carry something more serious without worrying about concealing it as much.

StorkPatrol
February 6, 2010, 11:50 PM
Mike the Wolf, I have also come to the same conclusion as you concerning 9x18 vs. .380 ACP. There is nothing that .380 can do that 9x18 can't do for half the price. How do you think I could afford to shoot 5 thousand rounds through my Makarov? (and another thousand plus through my CZ-82 come to think of it) How much does 6k rounds of .380 cost? Additionally, the 9x18 does have a performance edge on the .380 ACP.

Incidentally, AIM Surplus.com has Bulgarian Maks on their website as of last night. They're a little pricey compared to the good old days of 2004 when they flooded the market, but hey, ya take what you can get.

--Stork

jonnyc
February 7, 2010, 12:04 AM
You would be well-served carying a Makarov. I have carried my DDR Mak often. Lots of good ammo and nice holsters for them.

Pilot
February 7, 2010, 08:11 AM
I have four Makarovs (Russian, East German, and two from Bulgaria) and will on occassion carry one of my Bulgarians. I feel well armed, but I also carry a .380 and am fine. I think of the Mak round as a very hot .380, contained in a well made, accurate and reliable service pistol which is easily concealed due to its slimness.

If you can finds a Bulgarian, get it.

Trebor
February 7, 2010, 08:23 AM
I understand the 9x18 round is roughly midway between .380 ACP and 9mm Luger.

No, the 9x18mm Makarov round is MUCH closer to .380 ACP then 9mm Luger. No "half-way between" about it.

If you consider 9x18mm Makarov to be like a "hot .380 ACP" you'll be closer to the truth.

This is per Wikipedia (I know, I know) just because it was the quickest source. Feel free to dig more for a better source if you like.

.380 ACP http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.380_ACP

95 gr (6.2 g) FMJ 980 ft/s (300 m/s) 203 ft·lbf


9x18mm Makarov http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9x18mm_Makarov

95 gr (6.2 g) FMJ 319 m/s (1,050 ft/s) 313 J (231 ft·lbf)



9x19mm (9mm Luger) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9x19mm_Parabellum

7.45 g (115.0 gr) FMJ 390 m/s (1,300 ft/s) 570 J (420 ft·lbf

woad_yurt
February 7, 2010, 10:27 AM
The Makarov's a great gun. Some folks say it's underpowered, which I don't understand because Fiocchi makes a very affordable 9X18 FMJ that rates 267 ft lbs, which puts it right in the 38 SPL power realm.

Get yourself that Mak. You won't be sorry.

harmon rabb
February 7, 2010, 10:42 AM
how are you guys carrying your tokarevs? condition 3, right?

WardenWolf
February 7, 2010, 11:17 AM
Thanks for the responses. Looks like I'm going to be getting myself a Makarov.

Harmon rabb, I carry my Tokarev on the half-cock position normally in an open holster. I've practiced cocking it as I release the retaining strap, and can cock it, release it, and draw it in a smooth motion. I wouldn't be afraid to carry it condition 1, though. I just don't because I dislike the idea of keeping the spring compressed constantly. All the springs on it are the original 1953 springs. Even though some people may not like the idea of carrying it locked and cocked, the trigger pull is long enough and the hammer design is such that the risk of it firing unintentionally is effectively nil, even if dropped, and the trigger safety adds additional insurance. My experience with this gun has given me absolute confidence in it.

woad_yurt
February 7, 2010, 11:19 AM
Pls. disregard. Sorry.

WardenWolf
February 8, 2010, 08:17 PM
Ordered my Mak. =)

makarovnik
February 9, 2010, 04:08 AM
Awesome.

m2steven
February 9, 2010, 06:29 PM
I purchased a Mak last summer and it's one of the most wonderful pistols i've owned. It was in nearly pristine condition, beautiful finish, easy to hold and shoot, and pretty comfortable to carry due to the varying shape of it's design. And, most importantly, it's gone bang every time i've pulled the trigger. It's a superb design and I believe you'll like it.

FIVETWOSEVEN
February 9, 2010, 07:42 PM
i know someone who carries a east german mak with a .380 barrel

harmon rabb
February 9, 2010, 08:41 PM
Harmon rabb, I carry my Tokarev on the half-cock position normally in an open holster. I've practiced cocking it as I release the retaining strap, and can cock it, release it, and draw it in a smooth motion. I wouldn't be afraid to carry it condition 1, though. I just don't because I dislike the idea of keeping the spring compressed constantly. All the springs on it are the original 1953 springs. Even though some people may not like the idea of carrying it locked and cocked, the trigger pull is long enough and the hammer design is such that the risk of it firing unintentionally is effectively nil, even if dropped, and the trigger safety adds additional insurance. My experience with this gun has given me absolute confidence in it.

condition 1? the tokarev never originally came with a safety. the added on safeties (i have a romanian ttc) just block the trigger, and i don't think render the gun safe at all for condition 1 carry.

speaking of confidence in the gun -- i have a couple thousand rounds through mine with not one issue at all. i'm 100% confident it will go bang every time i pull the trigger and not jam. i'm just not confident at all in a way to carry it in anything but condition 3.

WardenWolf
February 9, 2010, 09:11 PM
Consider this: the Tokarev's trigger is a long-pull slider trigger with a very good spring behind it. Properly holstered, it's not going to be set off accidentally. The safety is just added insurance. The striker also has a spring in front of it, so it cannot contact the firing pin without the hammer striking it. For the Tokarev to fire unintentionally without a trigger pull, even if dropped while cocked, it would have to (1) strike the low-profile hammer in just such a way as to provide forward pressure, (2) have enough force to defeat the primary locking nubs, and (3) defeat the half-cock locking nubs. I honestly cannot see a way, other than intentionally abusing the gun, that it could fire without a trigger pull. It simply is not going to happen.

dobrzemetal
February 10, 2010, 12:37 AM
been carrying my mak for awhile now. I got really into them a year or so back and did some gel tests with some ammo and found out the 95 gr xtp penetrated 11"< at 10 yards, so that really cleared up any doubts i had. although there isn't a great selection of high quality self defense ammo available, it still can be a good ccw. i personally carry a staggered mag with xtp and ficcochi jhp, i know some ppl are against that but after countless boxes of ammo it has never missed a beat. the only thing i have to say is dont take this into the woods for protection because i personally know it will not stop a boar, even with jhp they seemed to ping off his forehead....

denfoote
February 10, 2010, 02:35 AM
Ordered my Mak. =)

From where??????

I have 7 Makarovs, at least one from every country that made them.

J and G used to have 'em.

I got my Biakal IJ70-17A (9mm kurz) from them many years ago when they had their shop in Mesa.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v22/denfoote/IJ70-17A.jpg

The rest I purchased from Mandalls in Scottsdale back when they were in business.

I carried that .380 Mak for years in an old Nylon Acumold Bianchi belt holster that is now over 20 YO. I also have a custom made Kydex IWB holster from a company that went belly up years ago!!

I understand that Mike Dillon sells a decent Makarov holster.

I've been carrying a Mak, off and on, for quite a few years!! :cool:

wnycollector
February 10, 2010, 07:16 AM
I carried a Russian commerical as my CCW a few years ago. As other posters have stated it was reliable, accurate and heavy for its size. It makes a decent CCW. After I sold my mak, I shot a CZ-82...I really liked that pistol. If I were going back to 9x18 for a CCW, I would take a long hard look at the CZ-82, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with a mak1

Janos Dracwlya
February 10, 2010, 12:37 PM
My Bulgarian Arsenal Mak was my regular CCW gun for several years until I got a Sig P225 and I still carry it occasionally. My wife's Baikal IJ-70 has been her CCW gun since we both got our permits in the late 90's.

Both guns have been nothing but reliable and they are quite accurate. I replaced the safeties on both with Simson-Suhl safety upgrades from Makarov.com (wish I'd bought extras...); this was an upgrade created by the former East German factory that allows the slide to be racked while the safety is on. I also switched to slightly heavier springs from Wolff and added walnut grips. My Mak has the extended threaded barrel and sometimes wears a compensator.

I'm going to be looking out for deals on the Bulgarian Maks to pick up another.

WardenWolf
February 10, 2010, 02:46 PM
From where??????

AIM Surplus. They have some very fine Bulgarian Makarovs for $270. Not a bad price on today's market, in my opinion, considering you're getting an almost-new pistol. I look at it like this: either buy a NEW handgun for CCW and probably pay close to $400, or buy a Makarov. I don't see any disadvantage in going with the Makarov, considering its features, power, and accuracy outperform virtually all commercial "pocket pistols" available today. Plus I get the "cool factor" of a surplus pistol. I win, no matter how I look at it. I save money, get a better gun, and have a cool piece of history.

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