[eye5600]

There has been a certain amount of ridicule heaped on the pronouncements of Holder and others about guns in Mexico allegedly sourced from the US. Posters on THR have tended to believe the drug cartels bought their weapons internationally.

I'd like to point out an article in the (very liberal) New Yorker that supports the THR point of view. It has to do with the pursuit and capture of a major illegal arms dealer.

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/02/08/100208fa_fact_keefe

[Free2game]

The funny thing about the ATF thing is that even they say that the mexican authorities are extremely picky and hard to trust about how many guns they pick up, because of course the guns they can source come from the US, but that doesn't mean that most of them coming in are guns that can't be sourced. Coming in from rebels in central america, military desertion, and things like that. Since there's no way that they're buying M4s with 203s from a gun shop in south texas. That and it's no secret that there's a drug war in mexico, a drug war costs money, and people will come over trying to make money on other people's suffering. Either way the issue is more border security than gun rights.

[cuervo]

For the US guns, it would be interesting to see a break down of:
1. Private sales smuggled from US to Mexico
2. Guns given to Mexican military by US Govt. and stolen/blackmarket
3. Guns given to other countries and have ended up in Mexico

I have no doubt that #1 exists, but will be in far fewer numbers than #2 and #3. But of course, new gun control laws would target only #1.

[Ohio Gun Guy]

However they are getting them the anti's here have the same solution in mind. Their equasion is always the same:

What ever the problem (Real or not) = Ban guns in U.S.

Ironically, it is often the law of unintended consequences they have absolutely no grasp over. I find it HUGELY ironic that they think they can pass a law and keep guns out of the hands of the drug cartels.....THE VERY PEOPLE WHO SPECIALIZE IN MOVING ILLEGAL THINGS AND ARE MUCH BETTER THAN THE GOVERNMENT AT IT!

Hurts your head!

[bplvr]

Oddly enough there was an article in the San Diego Union 2/7/10 about the stepped-up security of people going from Ca. to Mexico. The beefed up security has been in place since early October and by Dec 31st they have confiscated a small arsenal . In this idiot state {4} four guns is a small arsenal. That's more than one a month.

[JellyJar]

Don't forget firearms that are made here in the US and are legaly sold and shipped to Mexican citizens; police and military.

[billdeserthills]

I remember a year or so ago, the ATF finally "closed in" on the Mexican police that had been illegally buying private sale guns for almost One Full Year. Really makes me wonder just how many chances the ATF has to give a lawbreaking illegal entrant to our country before that person can be arrested.

[danprkr]

I couldn't get the article referenced through the link supplied. Any help appreciated.

[eye5600]

This is the abstract that is at the other end of the link. Ya gotta buy the magazine (or go to the library) or subscribe online to read the whole thing.

ABSTRACT: A REPORTER AT LARGE about Syrian arms dealer Monzer al-Kassar. Writer describes two Guatemalan men who, in 2007, visited Kassar's house in Marbella, Spain, to negotiate the purchase of several million dollars' worth of weapons for the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC). Since moving to Spain some thirty years earlier, Kassar had become one of the world's most prolific arms dealers. Authorities in multiple countries claimed that Kassar had been involved in smuggling drugs, financing terrorist groups, and ordering the assassination of various rivals and witnesses against him. As Kassar negotiated the deal that day, every word that he said was secretly being recorded. He had become the subject of an international sting orchestrated by a unit of the American Drug Enforcement Administration. The two Guatemalan men worked for the United States. Writer visits D.E.A. counternarcotics agent Jim Soiles, who has spent two decades pursuing Kassar. One of Soiles's colleagues likened Kassar to Keyser Söze, the mysterious, semi-mythical villain in the 1995 film “The Usual Suspects.” His father was a diplomat and Kassar was mentored by his brother Ghassan, who entered the drug trade in the sixties. During the eighties, Kassar began to focus on the arms trade. Kassar often acted as what is known as a “third-party broker.” From his home in Spain, he could negotiate between a supplier in a second country and a buyer in a third. From the moment Kassar moved to Marbella, he cultivated a flamboyant image. He purchased a mansion and hired a staff of forty to maintain it. Devoted to his family and surrounded by friends and business associates, Kassar became known for his hospitality. Writer interviews the British mercenary and arms dealer David Tomkins about his dealings with Kassar. Discusses Kassar’s involvement in the Iran-Contra affair and allegations of a role in the terrorist attack on the Achille Lauro cruise ship. Rumors always trailed Kassar, not least because he had always evaded charges for so many years while American authorities tried and failed to accumulate enough evidence to prosecute him. Tells about the preparations for the 2007 sting operation and the arrest of Kassar in Madrid. In 2008, Kassar was extradited from Spain to the United States to face trial. The jury found him guilty and he was sentenced to thirty years in prison. Writer interviews Kassar's daughter Haiffa, who remains fiercely loyal to her father.

Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/02/08/100208fa_fact_keefe#ixzz0f4WI0A4X


The sting operation mentioned near the bottom was to supply FARC with a very large number of full-auto rifles, plus other weapons.

[lloveless]

Jellyjar, I thought guns were illegal in Mexico?
ll

[StarDust1]

The entire issue is founded upon a totalitarian wish-list of LIES! I'd love to discuss this but it's a political issue(and it is a political issue)that will call down the wrath of the "virtual inquisitors" and close the thread, too bad, because you can't celebrate the RKBA without being able to confront such outrageous dishonesty in your own government and it's agents.

[JellyJar]

LLoveless

Not completely. IIRC handguns are hard to legally acquire but rifles and shotguns, that don't use military ammo, are more easily available. Of course that only applies to civilians. I am sure that lots of police departments down there buy most of their firearms from the US and that probably goes for the Mexican armed forces as well.

Who knows how many police and military firearms end up in the hands of criminals.

Google about a man named Skeeter Skelton. Back before the Mexican government enacted new guns laws in the late 60s, he would often go down to Mexico to see if he could find any old Colt SAAs or other collectible firearms. Since the new laws that is not possible any more.

Also, I understand that in many rural areas of Mexico the new guns laws are almost completely ignored. Not certain but I would not be surprised.