Newbie SBR Q


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sv51macross
February 18, 2010, 10:44 PM
As can be seen under my username I'm from a state that disallows SBRs. However, can a SBR be registered with ATF while having a 16" barrel, and even if it wears that 16" barrel, will the SBR'ed receiver be permitted in Michigan?

Also, I assume that ATF does not require barrel length specification for SBRs? A SBR lower may wear many uppers?

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Zak Smith
February 18, 2010, 10:50 PM
I am pretty sure they will not approve the Form 1 for a resident of a state that does not permit them.

A barrel length is required on the Form 1, as is overall length.

sv51macross
February 18, 2010, 10:57 PM
So it is illegal to use different length uppers on a SBR AR? Or is the length just for registration?

Zak Smith
February 18, 2010, 11:03 PM
It is a moot point because the BATF will not approve a Form 1 in a state that prohibits the item.

sv51macross
February 18, 2010, 11:22 PM
Yes, I know, I read your first reply. I was just asking for G's&G's.

TexasRifleman
February 19, 2010, 07:47 AM
So it is illegal to use different length uppers on a SBR AR? Or is the length just for registration?

This one is iffy. Way back when several years ago the ATF would approve Form 1's with things like "under 16 inches" or "various" in the place where the length goes. I have a couple like this.

ATF has said that you have to meet whatever is on the Form 1, so in the case of "various" it appears you are good no matter what.

Now, that said, ATF at some point stopped approving those forms without a specific length so the best way to deal with it now is to put ALL barrel lengths you might want to use on the form, as well as all the possible calibers if you intend to use different uppers. They won't approve "various" in the caliber portion of the form either.

So for length, I would put "10, 11, 14.5," for mine, since that's what I want to be able to have the options to use. Maybe even shorter if you wanted to put a pistol upper on it.

Then put ".22, .223, 6.8SPC," etc in the caliber section.

Not legal advice of course, I'm not even sure a lawyer would know this one since ATF seems to make it up as they go to some extent.

CoRoMo
February 19, 2010, 10:18 AM
I always wonder how sticky the ATF might get in regards to these measurements. Overall length especially. If you swap the stock from the SBR/SBS receiver you change the OAL. Or if your upper is technically 11", but you wrote 11.5" on the F1 because of some typo on the dealer's part.

Makes me want to list every quarter inch increment between 7" and 16" on my next F1.

TexasRifleman
February 19, 2010, 10:21 AM
Makes me want to list every quarter inch increment between 7" and 16" on my next F1.

Might as well..... no harm in it. Pretty silly really since the actual law doesn't say anything about it, just that you have to have a tax stamp for "less than 16".

CleverNickname
February 19, 2010, 10:37 AM
The OAL, bbl length and caliber entries on the form are for identification puposes only. The entries you use don't limit you from changing them to something else in the future.

If you make a permanent change then the ATF requests that you send them a letter notifying them of the change. If it's just a temporary change (e.g. swapping between two uppers on an AR15) then they don't care. Just pick an upper and register the rifle as configured with that upper.

TexasRifleman
February 19, 2010, 11:02 AM
If it's just a temporary change (e.g. swapping between two uppers on an AR15) then they don't care. Just pick an upper and register the rifle as configured with that upper.

There's an ATF tech branch letter I've seen posted elsewhere that conflicts with that which is why the idea of putting all the lengths on the form started.

I'll see if I can find it. Seems like it was on Arfcom but it's been a long time since I saw it.

What you say makes sense, but ATF told at least one person they intended to hold people to what was on the form. I personally don't think they have a leg to stand on but... who can afford to argue with them.....

CoRoMo
February 19, 2010, 11:19 AM
...ATF requests that you send them a letter notifying them of the change.

I figured as much. When you register it one way, but later decide to sell it and that F4 description doesn't match the original F1...

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