[Nematocyst]

This thread is about Filipino Martial Arts.

I'm hooked on the concept.

When I asked about training over in this thread about daggers (http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=502841) as back up weapons,
some - especially Hso (thanks, dude) - recommended that I look into FMA.
I'd heard of it before, but never looked into it.

They said that they'd rather enter a SD fight with a stick than a knife any day. I now totally agree.

Within 24 hours after I started researching it, I was totally hooked. It's as if FMA is the martial art and training discipline that I've been wanting to find all my 60-year life, but didn't know where to look. (Yeah, physically 60, but work out a lot; my bike is my main car; I ride fast, am a major dancer, and in general an active scrapper.)

I like the tools - how novel: simple sticks that have been effective for the Filipinos against invaders with swords for centuries,
the techniques for which can be employed with swords, knives, (tomahawk, I suspect) and open hand. How cool is that?

I've spent many hours over the last couple of weeks researching FMA, reading articles, watching videos, contacting local martial arts studios to see if they offer FMA - none in my small city, but I've found some great resources just up the road two hours.

I've made my first **** stick out of a hardwood broom handle: 28", carved, fire scared.
Well, I made 2, but gave one to my love, who is also hooked.
Images of my stick forthcoming.

I even carry it around in town on my day pack, strapped to the side where I can reach back and draw it quickly. I already feel more secure.

I've been practicing on trees and tires, and "shadow boxing" with the sticks, sometimes with her. I feel I've learned a lot about basic strikes; footwork; wrist, arm, shoulder and whole body involvement in strikes. I've learned about figure 8 swinging, and Abiniko hi/low.

So now, I've decided to see what I can learn here on THR, my gun home. I often start threads to see what I can learn about some new tool.

I'd like to learn lots about these arts. Yes, I intend to seek professional training in the form of classes, workshops, seminars.
I've found a group here in town that has bought a video and trying to train themselves. Not the best, but hey ... it's a start.

So, let's get started.

Please share your questions, experiences, training, ideas, caveats ...

I'm here to learn.

Nem
____________

Below are some links that I've found useful so far.

Wiki articles

* Filipino Martial Arts (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filipino_Martial_Arts)
* Eskrima (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskrima)
* Modern Arnis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_Arnis)

Videos

* Dan Inosanto (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH309YwzxsY) (this is the video that got me hooked)
* Eskrima on the History channel: first of 4 parts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfWp0fV0gMQ).
* Combat Arnis (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vwhZlDZKJk&NR=1)
* Twelve strikes of united Arnis (http://www.metacafe.com/watch/2263538/12_strikes_of_united_arnis/)
* Arnis 12 basic strikes : Bruce Chiu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16myQqtAnJc&feature=related)
* Arnis drills : Bruce Chiu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izZVKwDSTBw&feature=related)
* Kombatan Arnis - Grand Master Ernesto G Presas Jr (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQltqe2FFcE)
* Basic Arnis drills (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLmoZhvqj04&NR=1)
* ****/Eskrima combo strikes (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Auxya9eLKb4&NR=1&feature=fvwp)
* Shadow boxing with the stick (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrmXIYW2_mc&feature=related), plus basic stance
* Single stick disarming (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1WLCdULACAI)
* Abaniko 10 Count -****, Arnis, Doce Pares
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMWGz7Mi-QU&NR=1)

Books

* Book/DVD: Dan Anderson : Basics (http://www.danandersonkarate.com/store/FMA_Book_&_DVD.html)

Weapons

* Sticks 1 (https://www.fmapulse.com/fma-pulse-line-store/eskrima-sticks/labsica-rattan-eskrima-sticks)
* Sticks 2 (http://www.canemasters.com/escrima-sticks-pair-p-108.html)
* Barong (knife) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barong_%28knife%29)

[shockwave]

In your link section, under "weapons" the "sticks 1" option has an economical set of rattan sticks. They are inexpensive and will give you years if not a lifetime of reliable service.

[Nematocyst]

... an economical set of rattan sticks.

Thanks, Shock.

I'll get those, also.

But the fancier ones call me.

I love the patterns burned onto them.

[hso]

"Stick" to the simple ratan sticks at first. They don't shatter throwing shrapnel like other materials. It would be a pity to loose the use of an eye from an exploding dowel.

Of course, you can wrap the one you have with tape.

Explain the presence of the stick as being for dogs. Common enough for a bicyclist to carry a stick for dogs. Also consider a bike pump about the size of an eskrima stick. Look into carrying one of those and practice enough with it to learn the balance and speed.

Our charter here is more focused on tools than techniques.

[shockwave]

Yes - exactly as hso says, the concern is for shattering wood. Consider that in Singapore, when you're sentenced to be beaten with a cane, they use rattan. Here's my set, with a balisong from Manila:

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r136/southerneditor/swescrima.jpg

[Nematocyst]

^ ^ Good advice there from Hso and Shock. Thx.

Yes, I plan to get a set of rattan (https://www.fmapulse.com/fma-pulse-line-store/eskrima-sticks/labsica-rattan-eskrima-sticks) soon.

I see this one as the ritual first, much like my first walking stick,
a willow branch acquired 50 years ago, but still in my possession.

We won't spar with these, just practice strikes - shadow and on heavy bag.

Would post a pic, but the digicam isn't cooperating.

[Nematocyst]

"Don't be fooled by the simple stick."

---- Dan Inosanto (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH309YwzxsY)

[bikerdoc]

My canes come in at 33 inches for me, - I am 5' 6" . Helps me walk and I can practice stick arts with it.

Just a thought. Think about it.

[Searcher1970]

Here's some more videos to check out.
http://www.albokalisilat.org/videos.html

[Gunfighter123]

Hello N,
After you get used to Rattan sticks , think about getting a pair of Kamagong wood sticks or Bahi wood sticks ---- they are great for improveing grip , strength ,etc. and IMHO , are way more deadly then Rattan.
Here are links to my two fav. places for Sandata type weapons;
http://kriscutlery.com/documents/philippine.html
http://traditionalfilipinoweapons.com/

I've bought blades/sticks from both and they are very good people to deal with. I've bought from Cecil at Kris Cutlery for many years and have two blades from TFW , this; http://traditionalfilipinoweapons.com/Balasiong.html and this one;http://traditionalfilipinoweapons.com/Blade-Art-Slideshow/1/lg/DSC_0132.htm

I can not get the site at TFA to display correctly on my screen --- don't know if its on my end or theirs !!!

[hso]

Eric Draven who posts here makes some synthetic sticks that can't be broken under "normal abuse". Anything can be broken by someone willing to go beyond reason, but I have seen these things abused and not break.

[Nematocyst]

I sent Eric an email earlier from his company web site, but it bounced: mailbox full.

I'll send him a PM from here. His sticks are wicked cool looking, but not in my budget at the moment.

Interesting that he's close to where I live (well, within 100 miles).

[Nematocyst]

Over the last couple of days, I've been experimenting with an idea.

Imagine a stick with a metal electrical conduit coupling device screwed to the end.

Something like this (http://cdn3.ioffer.com/img/item/114/298/012/x7GV.jpg) or this (http://www.delikon.com/images/ycnb.gif), but the one I'm playing with is more similar to this one (http://www.globalindustrial.com/site/images/n-picgroup/78279.jpg):
single bolt/screw holds it on the stick. The threaded end allows a ring nut with 8 blunted spikes ~ 2 mm deep.

The impression left on skin or skull would not be pretty.

Also weights the end; good for practice.

My partner has blacksmith skills, including passable knife-making. We're dreaming of a genre of fittings for the end that include 2.5" blades on a fitting that attaches to the end of the stick. Some blades are sticking straight off the end. Others are 90* angle, like a little tomahawk.

A tricked out one might have both: one blade on the head and 3 or 4 around the collar.

Slice and dice from 28" away.

I would not want to be on the unfriendly side of that.

Just dreaming out loud, mind you.
No production plans. Would probably be illegal.

And probably wouldn't be eskrima, either.

Postmodern battle ax, maybe.

But in some future world that's different from this one,
where different laws apply, it could be a useful tool.

I'm just sayin'.

[Nematocyst]

[Erik Draven's] sticks are wicked cool looking...The ones on this page (http://fmatalk.com/showthread.php?5002-Draven-Industries-****-Sticks-and-MORE-Heres-some-of-my-work) are amazing to me.

Scroll down to the ones with olives, browns and cream.

So future primitive.

Not sure what I'd think of the 550 handles,
but the sheaths are very interesting,
and the synthetic shafts are ...

In other words, I want a pair.

[Gunfighter123]

Just a note --- be it battle sticks , nunchucks , etc. ---- while a round shape is good a rectangle,square,or octagon shape is much better IMHO. The round shape has a better chance of "glanceing off " a skull/bone etc. compared to the other shapes.

My "battle sticks" are rectangle with both sides tapering to a "blunted" knife edge. Think of a bed slath shape --- such a shape will "dig in" and are bone breakers !!!

Another set of "battle sticks" that I have , I drilled into both ends about 3" and then poured in melted lead --- got around 6 oz. in each end and they also hit like a train.

The truth is I carry/use the rectangle shape more --- the lead weighted pair I leave at home ---- I slightly worry that if I was forced to use these outside my house , a DA/SA or jury might frown on a "sap/blackjack" pair of sticks.

[hso]

Nem,

Don't try gilding the lilly. Stick with simple sticks and shy away from ghetto mace ideas or you'll end up with badly balanced fugly stuff.

OTOH, if your blacksmith wants to work up modern maces or fantasy maces there's always a market for such.

[Mikhail Weiss]

I've spent many hours over the last couple of weeks researching FMA, reading articles, watching videos, contacting local martial arts studios to see if they offer FMA - none in my small city...

Have you tried looking for Jeet Kun Do? I had my first introduction to **** when I studied Karate, then had much, much more when I studied JKD, as it's one of the staple arts. Remember, too, that a stick isn't just for bashing, but can also be used for manipulations and chokes. Google Dog Brothers.

[Nematocyst]

Not to worry, Hso. I won't embarrass you by going mall **** ninja. :rolleyes:

I'm less interested in the high tech feel of those, esp the 550 wrap of those sticks, and more interested in their synthetic material. I'll definitely start with rattan. I plan to order a set - actually two or three sets, for extras and to have some here at the studio for others - once March client payments start coming in - but just keeping options open for future times.

Gunfighter, good ideas about the non-rnd shape; that makes sense. Are such sticks available commercially, or do you make your own?

Mikhail, I have done some reading on JKD,
am aware of it's history w/ Bruce Lee,
that it involves sticks and includes so much more ...
Given time (and enough years left), I'll look into it.

But right now, given my severe time constraints, I'm going to focus on sticks; I'll add the other elements later.
___________

This is an interesting and helpful discussion. Thanks for the input so far.

Please continue. I'm sure I'll have more questions as this evolves.

Nem

[Searcher1970]

The thing I like about FMA is the techniques can be applied to sticks, blades or empty hand.

[Gunfighter123]

Google Dog Brothers.

Those Dog Brothers guys are BAD ASSSS !!!

I think they have a few vids posted on youtube.

[Nematocyst]

Those Dog Brothers guys are BAD ASSSS !!!Yeah, I'll say. They seem to be pretty no-nonsense people.

[docnyt]

This should be entertaining when it comes out. Note that the official website is still under construction.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?v=info&ref=mf&gid=345346948419

P.S. Not sure if you need to have an FB account to view it.

[docnyt]

Two icons.

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs238.snc3/22542_237346389861_716224861_3204515_7360063_n.jpg

[lloveless]

The two Icons are whom? I see they wear Inosanto t-shirts.
ll

[docnyt]

Dan Inosanto himself, and Jeff Imada.

[hso]

I see they wear Inosanto t-shirts.

I know that not everyone would be expected to recognize Guro Inosanto, but I did get a nice momentary chuckle out of that. Thanks.

[Gunfighter123]

I also smiled when I seen the T-Shirt post !!!

In the early 1990s , I was lucky enough to have had some instruction from Guro Inosanto.

There was a post around here about "slapping" a knife out of a persons hand --- Guro Dan is the ONLY PERSON I have ever seen that could do that to me time after time. Even thou I KNEW he was going to do it , no matter how hard I tried --- my knife would "just appear" in his hands after the slap.

A kinder and deadlier man you will never meet --- he truely is a "one of a kind" !!! I do have some photos of me and him working out together with blades/sticks --- I will have to scan them and then post them here in the next few days.

[hso]

You're a lucky man to have trained with him.

[Harold Mayo]

Kinda reminds me in "Apollo 13" when Lovell's grandmother was introduced to Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin and she asked, "Are you boys in the space program, too?"

Inosanto is just such an iconic figure but I guess if you aren't a life-long martial arts geek, you can't be expected to know him.

[Nematocyst]

This has been, and continues to be through Saturday, one of those ... week's from hell at work.

I'd like to take a metaphorical pair of sticks to this week.

But it'll be over soon.

Just by way of saying, I haven't lost interest in this thread.

My love and I did some drills with sticks a couple of nights ago. She's already got some moves down better than me.
In particular, she has a natural flow with 2 sticks in terms of that "twirl" thing they do before striking.
(Does that have an "official" name?)

Here's why we think she gets it. She jumps rope like I've never seen anyone I know do before.
She did competitions in her youth. Fancy stuff doing crossovers and stuff.

She uses the same motion with sticks, and it looks really amazing. Very intimidating.

[shockwave]

Inosanto is just such an iconic figure

Trivia question: Which Bruce Lee movie was he in, what did he do, and what did he say? (And then what happened to him?) It is almost impossible to study martial arts and know of him and his contributions.

[hso]

Start with single sticks before going to double sticks. One for each person. Much easier to learn the drills. Also, you're far more likely to have a single stick than a pair around.

[Nematocyst]

^ We both agree re single sticks. We're doing far more drills with singles than doubles; nearly all, in fact.

It's just every once in a while, we like to play with both just to get a taste, to see what the challenges are.

[BullsAndClays]

I have to admit, I never thought that I'd see a picture of two, well-known Filipinos on THR. Awesome. I feel extra good about my heritage today!

[Nematocyst]

I learned some new moves today, along with a new understanding of and appreciation for footwork.

I'm learning a lot on my own just by shadow sticks, or better yet, sticks against a modest sized tree (for that skull feeling) or a 4x4 loft support wrapped in a packing blanket. (I also have a heavy bag in the studio that I'm using. Need to move it out of a corner, though, where it has been for punching; too tight in there to swing sticks much.)

Later in the weekend, maybe after dinner tonight, I'll try to describe what I learned and let others comment or critique.

It has to do with angles and orientation of the body relative to ones opponent, and how that effects the power and versatility of the strike - especially wrist snap, full arm, shoulder and body.

Yeah, something like that.

I'm liking this martial art more every day. I'm rarely without my stick nearby these days, and do several little practices during the day.

Added by edit: I'm finding that a lot of the same principles that apply to racket ball and Frisbee (both of which I've spent a lot life time with) for getting maximum power and control with footwork, shoulder and arm movement, wrist flicks, etc, also apply to these sticks.

Ok, dinner time. Red snapper, roast potatoes, broccoli and a lager. Chocolate cookies for desert.

Life is good, no?

[Gunfighter123]

Ok, dinner time. Red snapper, roast potatoes, broccoli and a lager. Chocolate cookies for desert.


What time should I show up ???:D

[Nematocyst]

Oh, sorry, fighter. All gone; no leftovers. :(

But it was delicious. :)

[RatDrall]

Welcome to FMA :D

I started training more than a year ago. The first few months, learning footwork, striking angles, etc. nothing seemed to work well. A few months in, it all came together and...wow, just wow. I was able to swing both sticks accurately without hitting myself, while moving. Take the sticks away and I was able to get three times the empty hand strikes that I could before I realized that I had two hands to work with, put a knife in one hand and look out :uhoh: I haven't been able to train lately (winter layoff, training was near work) but still practice with my wife. The basics need to be done over and over, so that's what I'm doing.

[Nematocyst]

Thanks, RatDrall. That's encouraging.

Feel free to tell more stories about your training, tips you've learned, etc. (Of course, that goes for all of you.)

I'm reading.

[hso]

Don't use a stick on a punching bag. It will break the bag down faster than punching.

Moving pads on a column/tree is a good idea. Easily replaced when they get broken down.

Look at the pressure points and weak mechanical points on the human body. Sticks work especially well against those. Hands, elbows, knees, collar bones, etc. Whacking large bones is not the objective.

Don't discount thrusts with a stick. Two hand thrusts to the solar plexus, sternum, and chin are very effective.

Punyo

Honestly, get some training from a qualified trainer. Learning bad habits is ... bad.

[Nematocyst]

Aw, this bag is old anyway, and we don't use it that much for punching. May as well make it earn it's keep. :D

I'm practicing thrusts, often on trees and telephone poles as I walk by.
(A guy in the park yesterday said to me, "Hey, what's that tree done to you?")

So far, training from watching the hell out of basic videos.

Yes, will seek training, but there is none in my city - that's zero -
and getting up to where it's offered isn't in my cards for another few weeks at least.

So, we so what we can do.

Still, I take your point about had babits, er, bad habits.

[Gunfighter123]

I have seen/used many types of "targets" -rolled up carpet , parts of rubber auto tires , sandbags ,smaller green "springy" tree branches ,old couch cushions, etc. --- as HSO stated , with full power strikes , you will break down the innards and split/rip the outer of almost any heavy bags with stickes.

I like useing two types of targets --- one like the above for "power" hitting with Rattan , Bahi , or Kamagong sticks. The other favorite target of mine is a double ended strikeing ball. That is a 3-6 foot length of "bungie" , then the strikeing ball , and then another length of "bungie' fastened at the bottom of ball to the floor etc. ----- being suspended in the middle , with every hit the "ball" rebounds in a unpredictable angle as it comes back at you. Useing this item , IMHO , you will improve your "footwork" and learn to use your off-hand to block {or the ball WILL hit you in the face etc.}

Here is a link for what I am trying to explain ---- you can find them much cheaper;
http://www.centurymartialarts.com/By_Brand/adidas/adidas_leather_double_end_ball.aspx

And of course , if/when you progress to "training" or "live" blades ---- be VERY VERY carefull or you can/will get hurt --- I have the scars to prove it !!!

[Gunfighter123]

Other links;
http://www.blackbeltshop.com/proforce_double_end_striking_ball_-_vinyl.htm
http://www.fitness-equipment.com/acatalog/Double_Ended_Striking_Ball.html

[Nematocyst]

Gunfighter, those are wicked cool bags. I'll see if I can find one.

As for the other bag, we don't use it for full on strikes. We're really being pretty gentle with it (and trees). We're really working hard right now on basic strikes, and it's just a useful "stop" for easy to moderate strikes, just to see what our positions are, etc.

The full length heavy bag is also useful for practicing hip and knee strikes, and is so hard down there that we limit our strikes there.

After getting some instruction, I hope eventually to buy a practice dummy ... well, if such things exist. Any opinion?

[Gunfighter123]

After getting some instruction, I hope eventually to buy a practice dummy ... well, if such things exist. Any opinion?

Save yourself HUNDREDS of dollars and make one yourself useing Wolmanized {sp?} 2"x2" and wrapping the limbs etc. with old carpet and then duct tape.

[Nematocyst]

^ Good idea.

Yes, correct spelling.

[Nematocyst]

On a recent, very nice (read relaxing romantic) weekend on a farm
in the coast range near the Pacific, I took this photo of our sticks.

http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=116688&stc=1&d=1267428924

Yes, they are 28" starter models cut from a hardwood garden handle.

But they've been through a few changes :
some fire; some carving to etch
some hand reference points.

Mine is more carved than hers.
Just something I enjoy doing.
It reminds me of my first walking stick
that I found in a creek when I was 10,
and whittled a grip as I walked back home.
Still have it 50 years later.

Yes, we will get a pair of rattan soon.

But these have worked well for getting started.

[hso]

Don't bother wasting money on a purchased practice dummy. My mook cost $500 and that was "wholesale". Your money would be much better spent on training. See if the guro "nearby" will come to you for private lessons before dropping that sort of coin.

Take Gunfighter123's advice and build your own. Check around for a large lawnmower repair shop that might give you a bunch of riding mower tires. They can be used to make a "tire man". Use whole tires for the body and partial tires for the arms and legs. Wrap rope around your padded column. That soaks up the impact well. Mark the wrapped column to differentiate the head, neck, upper torso and lower torso so you can target your attacks easier.

[JShirley]

Two good targets:

dead trees
old duffel bags filled with rags and hung

[Nematocyst]

Great ideas, guys.

[shockwave]

I'm finding that a lot of the same principles that apply to racket ball and Frisbee (both of which I've spent a lot life time with) for getting maximum power and control with footwork, shoulder and arm movement, wrist flicks, etc, also apply to these sticks.
Right. The power you have is generated from the feet, delivered by the hips, and the arms and wrists are there just to aim the sticks. It's a tough thing to learn because it's natural to want to use arm muscle to power the stick, but that will slow it down and speed and accuracy are everything in escrima. When you can feel your weight shifting from leg to leg like you're a giant slinky, and then capture the weight transfer with your hips and deliver the strike with that, you're on the road.

[ozarkgunner]

I've been training with Escrima style stick fighting for a about a year and a half at home. Using techniques that I have found in book and videos on line. I have also developed my own style and techniques.
I just started taking Hapkido classes last month. about a week ago the instructor had an Escrima class. The basic forms that he started us with were almost identical to what I have been studying on my own. And as many are aware and have learned, Escrima fighting lends it self to many other weapons types.
As a self defence weapon in the home or on the street, sticks can be very effective for defence against anything, even a person with a gun at point blank range. Just the act of swinging a stick can block, dis-arm, and dis-able an attacker. With a little, or a lot, or practice, depends on the person, blocks and strikes can become second nature. With more practice and the addition of hand to hand combat training, minimal force and movement can block and stop an attack.
By adding hand to hand combate techniques to your weapons defence studies, it becomes quite easy to stop an attacker using minimal force, and minimal damage to the attacker. Which comes in very handy when standing in court and having to defend your self from a greasy lawyer, when you are in a nice suit and your attacker in in a neck brace and arm cast.
As stated over and over again, self defence force needs to be kept to the minimum needed to stop the attack. With proper CQC training and stick fighting, this becomes very easy to do. A couple of simple swings, a side step, and an elbow or shoulder lock, and your attacker is stopped, detained, and given a new look on life, as LE shows up and sorts things out. You may be detained as well by LE as the facts are sorted out, but you have your wallet and your health. And by the would be attacker not having any bruises, cuts, or broken bones, things will look very good for you.
I have been training my son as well. And with the few simple things that I have taught him, with a stick, he can defend himself against some one twice his size. And he won't be out of breath.

Escrima, ****, etc, an excelent non-lethal tool, not weapon, for close range self defence.

[hso]

Let's make sure that we discard the idea that sticks/canes are non-lethal. They can be used in a less-lethal manner, but make no mistake, they can kill.

[Nematocyst]

Someone famous once said,
Walk softly, but carry a big stick.

[Nematocyst]

So, here's the next topic to go with sticks: Jeet Kune Do.

Over the weekend, while researching treatments for rotator cuff injuries (http://www.thestretchinghandbook.com/archives/rotator-cuff-injury.php)
(got a little too aggressive with the dips),
looking at Tai Chi for stretching led me to JKD.
(Yeah, I know; it seems a stretch. But work with me here.)

Well, suffice to say, watching this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJQUOohK2kA) of stick master Dan Inosanto
discussing Lee's original ideas led to this Wikipedia article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeet_Kune_Do).

Then, I found Tommy Carruthers (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fs8QA8fnSz4&feature=related) stuff.

Add some sticks, call it good.

If that doesn't work, pull out the gun.

Right?

[Nematocyst]

Well, as my post above indicates, in the last few days, I've become very intrigued by Jeet Kune Do. I remembered that someone in this thread recommended it a month or so ago. Searching, it was Mikhail in post 18 (http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=6296924&highlight=jeet#post6296924).

I've been watching parts of that History Channel documentary on Bruce Lee (much of it available on YouTube). I'm quite impressed with his philosophy, and see it's relevance to most of life. I can already see the appeal for those of us who like to follow our own path.

I'm heading to the book store now to pick up a copy of Tao of Jeet Kune Do (http://www.amazon.com/Tao-Jeet-Kune-Bruce-Lee/dp/0897500482) that's being held for me.

I'm already starting to look for sources of training in it, especially in upper New England which is where I'm heading next.

I searched on it in this subforum, but found little outside of this thread.

[Nematocyst]

I'm heading to the book store now to pick up a copy of Tao of Jeet Kune Do ...Got it.

Not what I had expected, but probably better.

I've scanned it, perused the table of contents, starting now to read.

The introduction is by his wife, Linda, and a second essay by Gilbert Johnson, editor of this volume, who organized it. His introduction greatly helps to explain the organization of the volume.

This part of Linda's introduction caught my eye. Within it, she explains that he wrote it during a six month recovery from a severe back injury, relevant to me as I recover from a rotator cuff injury.

He did not intend [this book] to be a "how-to" book or a "learn kung-fu in 10 easy lesson" book. He intended it as a record of one man's way of thinking and as a guide, not a set of instructions. If you can read it in this light,there is much to be aware of on these pages. And, you probably will have many questions, the answers to which you must seek within yourself. When you have finished this book, you will know Bruce Lee better, but hopefully you will also know yourself better.

Now, open your mind and read, understand, and experience, and when you've reached that point, discard this book. The pages are best used for cleaning up a mess - as you will see.Now, I'll confess that I will probably pass it along rather than "discard" it. And I certainly won't clean up a mess with it, though I do hope to use it to make my own life less messy.

His sketches are wonderful. I can see from them that this is relevant background material for those preparing to study open hand, blade or stick arts, or - as in JKD - all of the above in whatever combination works for you.

I've also benefited greatly from watching the History Channel snips, especially this part (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59BMxK6Q6z0) which makes clear in the first 30 sec that his JKD philosophy applies to any part of life, whether martial arts, professional or personal.

Gilbert Johnson's last line in his introduction speaks to that.

Jeet June Do, you see, has no definite lines or boundaries - only those you make yourself. I think I'm going to like this book.

[docnyt]

Unfortunately, the only "real" JKD schools are in Oakland and Seattle. Carruthers is one of the more famous proponents. JKD has always seemed the most practical and original martial arts systems to me, Krav Maga being a close second. If there were a JKD school nearby I would sign up in a heartbeat.

[Nematocyst]

Docnyt, why do you say "the only "real" JKD schools are in Oakland and Seattle"?

I'm not going to question your assertion; I'll leave that to others to discuss.

I'm just curious about your reasoning.

[docnyt]

Those were the original locations and as a student I would rather have an instructor who learned JKD from one of the original students that actually were trained by Bruce Lee.

Also, you may want to pick up a copy of "Bruce Lee's Fighting Method". It contains more of the actual techniques. "Tao" is more of a philosophical book, in the same vein as "The Book of Two Guns: The Martial Art of the 1911 Pistol and AR Carbine" by Tiger McKee is to guns.

[MariusDP51]

After reading this thread I tried a light stick I have at home (for other purposes) on the heavy bag.

Love it. I'll be including this training in my normal programme. Being proficient with a stick can be VERY handy. Love it. I can only imagine what a slightly heavier, more solid stick, would do.

[shockwave]

Jeet Kun Do has been an enigma in the martial arts. We do have Lee's text on the subject, but he didn't run a school teaching it, leaving behind a cadre of students who could carry on knowledge of the style. But there are a few people out there who claim to have studied with him - and the number of these people is larger than credence allows.

So. Like Stephen Hayes and his "ninjutsu," you have to be extremely skeptical of anybody claiming to know anything about JKD. On the other hand, JKD is really more of a mindset about learning and training. Don't be bound to the philosophies of a single art or style, be flexible, if it works - add it to your arsenal, etc.

For today's fighter, there are more options than ever before. Krav Maga schools are becoming easier to find, Gracie jiu jitsu studios are everywhere, and I might be mistaken but I'm getting the impression that "McDojos" are on the way out and students have become a bit more discriminating.

The important thing is to get started. Some arts, like Karate and Krav Maga, can be learned fairly quickly, but others require a serious investment of time. The health benefits of practice are a bonus and being in good condition is a great thing in and of itself.

[Nematocyst]

Docnyt, thanks for the clarification.

Also, you may want to pick up a copy of "Bruce Lee's Fighting Method". Yes, saw that yesterday. Perhaps eventually I'll do that, but would like to be able to read such a tome in conjunction with actual training.

On the other hand, JKD is really more of a mindset about learning and training. Don't be bound to the philosophies of a single art or style, be flexible, if it works - add it to your arsenal, etc.Yes, my initial impressions support that interpretation.

In fact, that's precisely what attracts me to it, that flexibility, presumably the simplicity.

At this point in life, I don't have decades left to study any martial art in depth. I'm looking for something relatively simple and straightforward that will fit into my fitness regimen and contribute to my SD skill set while respecting my aging joints and bones.

[hso]

Unfortunately, the only "real" JKD schools are in Oakland and Seattle.

Completely disagree and the statement runs counter to JKD basic philosophy that the student shouldn't focus on a rigid style, but should instead take what is useful to integrate into what works for them. There are two different perspectives in JKD, one group that believes only what Bruce Lee taught should be taught by instructors and the student should develop their own material from that base and the other group that believes that the philosophy is unchanging,but that the material can adapt.

What's important wrt an instructor is to verify the "lineage" of the instructor is legitimate and that they're actually listed as a JKD instructor in the JKD organization.

The JKD instructor I trained with was through the Inosanto lineage and was recognized by the federation.

[Gunfighter123]

What's important wrt an instructor is to verify the "lineage" of the instructor is legitimate and that they're actually listed as a JKD instructor in the JKD organization.

The JKD instructor I trained with was through the Inosanto lineage and was recognized by the federation.



Once again , HSO is 100% correct !!!

[Nematocyst]

Is it too late to save this thread?

My sense is, even at 294 days old,
FMA and JKD are not out of date, yet.

And if we want to expand the range of topics
relevant to stick fighting, we could add koppos (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=577533) and Irish stick fighting (http://fightingfaction.com/).

[kali13]

I've studied a number of martial arts over the years and love FMA. I started with Presas Arnis when I was learning Kajukenbo. One of the instructors, a JKD guy, had studied with the Presas family. I also picked up some Senkotiros, and some of the knife and stick combatives from Hock Hochhiem. Then, a number of years later, began studying Pekiti Tersia ****. Absolutely blew me away. The knife and large blade/stick work was amazing and the empty hand techniques were very effective as well. I've been lucky enough to train with a great instructor and and practitioners as well as Tuhon Leo Gaje himself. I recommend PTK to anyone looking to train in FMA. Lots of good videos of Pekiti Tersia **** on youtube especially of the Philippine Marine Corps practicing it for H2H and CQB.

[Nematocyst]

I started with Presas Arnis...

Here's the best video I found when searching Presas Arnis a year ago.

Grand Master Ernesto G Presas Jnr

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQltqe2FFcE

In a dirt street with roosters crowing.

With sticks, they repelled invaders carrying swords and guns.

But I would not have wanted to be his assistant in this video.

Still, this is reality.

[hso]

relevant to stick fighting, we could add koppos and Irish stick fighting.


Keep this thread on the original topic and explore the separate topics by opening separate threads instead.

[Nematocyst]

I did open a separate thread about koppos (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=577533).

I'll do the same about Irish stick fighting (http://fightingfaction.com/) soon.

What I'm doing here, as any good teacher would,
is to synthesize concepts, tie them together.

Surely you recognize that.

[kali13]

Historically the Filipinos fought with a lot of blades such as the barong, parang, and ginunting as well.

[kali13]

Great video!!!
Here are a few PTK videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Di7lrhZOE3o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvrvoBIq__k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujN0-edyLs0
Hope you like them.

[Nematocyst]

Thanks, ****. I'm watching snippets of those during breaks at work.
(I'm self-employed, so I get to do such things,
even if work days stretch over 12 hours).

I'm focusing mostly on the stick work. I wish we could do youtube in slow motion.

[kali13]

Any time! And, yeah, a frame-by-frame option would be nice.

[WoodyTX]

Remember: A lot of times, the stick is a training tool for the blade. Shorten the stick, make the "window" smaller, and suddenly you're training for a knife fight...

Strong suggestion to follow through with a JKD or JKD Concepts or an FMA instructor. There are so many little tricks to the art, and so much of it is counter-intuitive (footwork, angles, speed vs. power).

(6 years FMA and JKD Concepts)

[Nematocyst]

I've started a new thread about sticks (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=579502).

This MA feels intuitive to me.