police marked guns


PDA






kennedy
February 23, 2010, 10:19 PM
Is there a collector forum for police marked guns? Are they any more collectable then non marked?

If you enjoyed reading about "police marked guns" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
nicholst55
February 24, 2010, 08:20 AM
Some are more collectible, depending on make, model, condition, and the agency they belonged to.

kennedy
February 24, 2010, 08:49 PM
I have a colt commando, marked BPD

Jim K
February 24, 2010, 08:58 PM
Ideally, the marking should be precise enough to identify the agency/department and it is even better to have a sales slip or auction record showing when the sale was made. Just letters like XPD won't help the value, but a gun marked, say, "Texas Rangers" (I don't know if they actually marked any that way) would be quite valuable.

On the buying end, beware of fake markings. It is easy to put on markings but hard to duplicate a factory marking. (On large contracts, the factory will put on the property marking, using a roll stamp.)

Jim

Steve C
February 24, 2010, 09:27 PM
This is the dept identifier on my used police trade in S&W M67. Have no idea what department carried this weapon. The "B" at the end even looks like it may be over stamped.

Never though that it would add any value to it but its been a great pistol.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=116379&stc=1&d=1267061195

Jim K
February 24, 2010, 09:34 PM
Maybe a cop shop, maybe not. Oklahoma Highway Bureau or Otis Harvey Blinkenboomer? Who knows?

Jim

kennedy
February 24, 2010, 09:53 PM
I bought the commando since I am a colt collector, did not notice the police markings until I got it home

gearjammer711
February 25, 2010, 02:03 AM
on the O.H.B. , my guess is Ohio Highway Patrol over stamped, WHY?

Nathanael_Greene
February 25, 2010, 09:16 AM
on the O.H.B. , my guess is Ohio Highway Patrol over stamped, WHY?

Maybe Otis Harvey Blinkenboomer bought this from the Ohio Highway Patrol...

The Bushmaster
February 25, 2010, 10:52 AM
How about RHKP and their serial number on a S&W mod 10...??

hiram2005
February 25, 2010, 10:57 AM
Royal Hong Kong Police

TexasBill
February 25, 2010, 12:20 PM
Most Texas Rangers carry their own sidearms and standard issue is the same SIG P226 issued to regular troopers, so there's no such thing as a "Texas Ranger" stamp.

The Austin Police used to have "Austin Police Dept." stamped on the back of the grip frame. They had the S&W N-frame .38 Specials in nickel finish with the 4-screw sideplate. Unfortunately, APD didn't dispose of retired firearms, they destroyed them. They also had Winchester Model 12 shotguns and 1928 Thompsons. Collectors offered to replace all the department's firearms with any new ones the department wanted or give them department a truckload of cash, but the department refused and all the guns were crushed and melted. They wouldn't even let officers purchase their old sidearms. Sad.

And, no, the police chief was not a liberal, by any stretch of the imagination.

nicholst55
February 26, 2010, 02:33 AM
I have an old Colt Cobra that once belonged to the Maryland State Police. You can just barely make out the inscription on the backstrap, even though they were thoughtful enough to deface the marking with what appears to have been a die grinder.

I'm very surprised that the gun wasn't destroyed - the Baltimore PD normally sends their old guns to U.S. Steel for destruction (read: melting down), so they can 'keep them off the street.'

whitecoyote
February 26, 2010, 02:57 AM
S&W model 10-7
http://i48.tinypic.com/qs8a42.jpg
http://i49.tinypic.com/2jffxch.jpg

The Bushmaster
February 26, 2010, 10:35 AM
Yup...You are correct Hiram2005...A 10-7 and a 10-9 in 4" dress...

pezo
February 26, 2010, 11:50 PM
I like seeing the old detroit police revolvers. :rolleyes:

charliemopic
February 27, 2010, 09:47 AM
It's been a few years since I have post on THR, hope I do it correctly.
I just took delivery of one of the 'Detroit Police' revolvers in the way of a nickle plated model 10-5 in .38 Special. Just like the one 'whitecoyote' posted pics of above except mine has a 5 inch pencil barrel and mine came with nice Hogue finger grips.
Just like whitecoyote's mine has 'Detroit Police' and a 5 digit number.
Does anyone know what that number on the back strap is?

Hey whitecoyote, I would trade you my nice Hogue grips for your old wood grips!

Thanks anyway.

TEAM101
February 27, 2010, 10:25 AM
I would pay less for one than a commercial example, but I like them.

jcowan
February 27, 2010, 10:32 AM
I have been looking for this one. Teddy Roosevelt ordered 2000 of them, since then service revolvers have not been marked in NYPD. They have been purchased by the individual. I missed out on one recently. If anyone sees one please keep me in mind.

whitecoyote
February 28, 2010, 06:15 AM
Colt 1908 Pocket Hammerless, .380acp, Mfg. 1914.
New York Police Dept. Approximately 800 were made for the N.Y.P.D.
Issued to Detectives.
http://i50.tinypic.com/35nd3yr.jpg

Guillermo
February 28, 2010, 11:48 AM
And, no, the police chief was not a liberal, by any stretch of the imagination.

How long ago did was this? In the last twenty years Austin has only had liberal, anti gun police chiefs of limited intelligence and totally void of character.

And to the original query, I always look for police marked guns. The markings do not have any value to me but many policemen do not shoot very much. Their duty guns are often carried a lot but shot a little.

ky40601
February 28, 2010, 02:38 PM
Here's the one I have.

1965 Colt Police Positive Special Royal Hong Kong Police .38 S&W
http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff159/ky40601/Guns/aColtPolicePositiveSpecialRoyalHong.jpg
http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff159/ky40601/Guns/aColtPolicePositiveSpecialRoyalH-3.jpg

SaxonPig
February 28, 2010, 05:07 PM
Steve C- I would bet a nickel that your M67 was an issue revolver for the California Highway Patrol. They stamped the guns CHP and then when they sold them as surplus they over-stamped OHB.

Collectors of police guns seek stamped examples. Most shooters aren't greatly moved one way or the other. I have a number of department marked guns. Here are a couple.

A 1938 357 Magnum factory inscribed for the UHP.


http://www.fototime.com/E1D8FD41A486F94/standard.jpg


A 1975 Model 27-2 sent to the FHP and so stamped.


http://www.fototime.com/635FB0E85DE7885/standard.jpg


This Model 64 is stamped CCPD for the Corpus Christi Police Department.


http://www.fototime.com/1C758B07D0C2E58/standard.jpg

7.62 Nato
February 28, 2010, 05:49 PM
I have the Detroit Police nickel 10-5 with the thin 5" barrel in 38 Special with rubber grips. The number on the backstrap is also 5 digit like Whitecoyote and Charliemopic.

NCSUPackman
February 28, 2010, 09:02 PM
More than likely, that gun was carried by the California Highway Patrol (C.H.P.). They were originally marked C.H.P. but got over stamped to O.H.P. when they were suplused out to hide the fact that were issued CHP guns. I have a model 68 that is chambered in .38 spl that was CHP issue; I can see on the O and the B where where the C and the P originally were and over stamped.

Look carefully at the "B" in the picture above. You can see the bottom loop is smaller than the top loop; like it was added after. If the letter was stamped from a "B" die, the loops would be the same.

I sent off a request to Smith & Wesson for my model 68 and got back a two page report with all the over stamping information along with some other great info.

I also have a Detriot Police marked S&W 10-5, 4 inch barrel, nickel finish with the box and all the papers.

NCSUPackman
February 28, 2010, 09:13 PM
I have an interesting story regarding a S&W model 10-6 police marked revolver:

I picked it up in a shop in West Virginia and it was marked "WAYNE P.D." When I got my history request back it said "...company records indicate that your handgun, with serial number D6######, is open on our records, therefore no further information is available."

Confused by that statement, I called Smith & Wesson customer service to ask for an explination. My call was forwarded to Roy Jinks himself and he said that statement meant that according to their files, the gun never left the factory.

I was a little dumbfounded for a minute before Mr. Jinks asked if it was a police gun. I explained that it was and had markings along the backstrap. He informed me that what probably happened was the department ordered a shipment of several guns, and someone either double wrote a serial number or skipped one when hand recording what guns were being shipped out.

His answer made me think that wasn't the first gun with that issue someone called about.

That left me curious as to what Wayne PD it came from. There is Wayne, WV outside Huntington so it's possible the gun made its way accross the state to coal country from there.

M16
February 28, 2010, 10:21 PM
Unfortunately, APD didn't dispose of retired firearms, they destroyed them.

This is not true. I bought one a couple of months ago. It is a S&W Heavy Duty.

SaxonPig
March 1, 2010, 09:42 AM
"OPEN" S&W records are not rare. It seems quite a few guns were shipped without proper logging or mistaken recording. Before 1968 when the strict law on recordkeeping went into effect it was not unusual for a company official or salesman to bag a handgun once in a while for personal use or to give as a gift.

Also, as in your case, multiple guns in a shipment can be skipped by mistake.

sig220mw
March 1, 2010, 09:51 AM
Never heard of a Colt commando. What is it?

Jonah71
March 1, 2010, 11:49 AM
I have an old 1888 Merwin Hulbert .38 marked C.P.D. and a 3 digit number. When I had it appraised I was told this detracted from it's value. I think it may have been different if I had all the paperwork to trace it back to the original owner. Kinda difficult since a fire (in 1909 I think) destroyed a lot of the info.

Jim K
March 1, 2010, 03:14 PM
The original Colt Commando was the Official Police in wartime dress, Parkerized and with plastic grips. Some 50,000 were made during WWII; they went to authorized, non-military, users. All (AFAIK) were in .38 Special and none were part of Lend Lease.

Post-war, 1984-86, Colt made a "Commando Special" similar to the Detective Special but with a matte-blue finish and rubber grips. I recall seeing them, but can't find much on them.

Jim

1KPerDay
March 1, 2010, 04:55 PM
A 1938 357 Magnum factory inscribed for the UHP.


http://www.fototime.com/E1D8FD41A486F94/standard.jpg

WANT. :cool:

ky40601
March 1, 2010, 06:49 PM
sig220mw,

Here's a picture of the Colt Commando .38 Sp. I read Gen Eisenhower carried one.

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff159/ky40601/Guns/aColtCommando38Sp1942-43SNG239.jpg


Here are parts of the article:

"The Colt "Commando" revolver, Caliber .38 Special was produced in fairly substantial quantities, totaling over 45,000 revolvers through February 1945. This revolver gave a very good performance and was distributed through Defense Supplies Corporation to police officers, factory guards and other nonmilitary personnel."

"Orders for the Counterintelligence Corps, Military Intelligence and the Office of Strategic Services totaled nearly 12,800.
Only about 1,800 Commandos went to the U.S. Navy, but this was not because the Navy didn't want them. During the mobilization period and the early war years, the Navy favored the S&W Military and Police. In addition to the 3,000 revolvers for Naval Civilian Police bought in the spring of 1941, the Navy bought 65,000 S&Ws directly from the factory and many thousands more through the Army. The S&W "Victory" model became the standard issue sidearm for Naval air crews and shore-based personnel. However, in early 1944, the accidental death of a sailor resulting from a dropped S&W led the Navy to request Colt revolvers instead of the S&Ws the service had been receiving."

"Some Commando revolvers were definitely used in the war zone. General Eisenhower is reported to have had one. OSS records indicate some overseas issues of Commando revolvers, and most of the early two-inch barreled revolvers were sent overseas. But for the most part, the Commando was bought for the DSC. The SOD historical report for April-June 1944 stated:
...all Commando Cal. .38 Special revolvers were being allocated to the Defense Supplies Corporation."

whitecoyote
March 1, 2010, 07:50 PM
I have an old 1888 Merwin Hulbert .38 marked C.P.D. and a 3 digit number. When I had it appraised I was told this detracted from it's value. I think it may have been different if I had all the paperwork to trace it back to the original owner. Kinda difficult since a fire (in 1909 I think) destroyed a lot of the info.
I would love to see a photo of you Merwin Hulbert.

W.E.G.
March 1, 2010, 08:13 PM
Say hello to Stinkbutt.

This is a trade-in I bought last Friday.

The rubber grip is SATURATED with the rank cologne of the prior owner.

I tried washing the butt with hot soapy water.
No dice.

If you still even touch it your hand smells like stinkbutt.
The grip is that grippy kinda rubber that sticks to you like a southeast asian venereal disease.
I tried to hide it from my wife. When she came in the door, she said "What is that smell?!!!"
So, I'm busted, and I totally have to replace that grip.

Gotta love the high-tech inventory system the former agency-owner utilized.

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/pistol%20pics/686-5/stinkbutt-smaller.jpg

ky40601
March 1, 2010, 10:43 PM
I have this 1951 Colt Police Positive Special stamped "R.M.C. 209". I have no idea what it stands for.

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff159/ky40601/Guns/aColtPolicePositiveSpecial3dIssue38.jpg

rogertc1
March 2, 2010, 06:38 AM
Mk4 Singapore Police Dept.

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c248/rogertc1/firearms/MK4-2.jpg

SaxonPig
March 2, 2010, 10:07 AM
1KPerDay- that RM came from the estate of an advanced collector who passed on a couple years back. As I was told 2 of the 50 UHP guns are known. The other 48 are still out there, somewhere. My guess is that most are still in the Beehive State, hidden in sock drawers or such since grandpa (the former state trooper) died.

Here are two photos of some UHP troopers wearing their Registered Magnums. Maybe my gun is one of those pictured. Who knows?

PS: All 50 were shipped with 6" barrels and returned to S&W 1948-1952 to be cut to 4".


http://www.fototime.com/4D0A16C7EAE5FF5/standard.jpg


http://www.fototime.com/D5F1099500730E2/standard.jpg

Jonah71
March 2, 2010, 12:42 PM
I would love to see a photo of you Merwin Hulbert.
I'll try. I'm kinda lacking in computer skills, but I do want to take some pics of some of the guns I have. Will find someone else to help me post them. I was really dissapointed with the $5-600 "appraised value", even though I have no plans to sell it. I thought it would be worth more. I was told that the larger frame revolvers go for a better price. Also that I could get more for it if I found the right collector. But as I said, it's a gift from a good friend, and imo a piece of history. But I will try to get a pick posted.

If you enjoyed reading about "police marked guns" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!