[keederdag]

I Remember seeing an article in the American Rifleman that showed a pic of a survival rifle desighned By Stoner that was in a cal larger than .22lr. Anyone able to elaborate? I would love to have an AR-7 in .22 mag or better yet .223 but I think that's asking too much...No?:confused:

[Intel6]

If I remember correctly it was called an AR4 and was a bolt action magazine fed chambered in .22 Hornet. It had a wire collapsing stock and a short barrel.

[Sunray]

A real AR 7 wasn't that plastic Phillipines made junk. It was a .22 Hornet aircrew survival rifle made for the USAF as I recall. The plastic thing was a poor mans .22.

[Gordon]

M-4 was a bolt action wire stock .22 hornet, very rare! The M-6 was a .410X.22hornet folding stock and is still made(in legal form) by Springfield. Although I just heard they "improved " it. An ideal survival rifle of this type would be a 20gaugeX.223 in something like the "improved" M-6 config, I WANT ONE IN Ti!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:cool: Yup my 1966 Armlalite AR-7 is still ticking along just fine!!:D

[keederdag]

Yes, I also have an original Armalite AR-7, and it's a very well made peice. It's quite accurate and the barrel is crome lined. Most of the major internal parts are crome plated. If you havent handled an original armalite, dont knock the desighn. I also have a charter and a survival arms. These two are in a different catagory.:)

[keederdag]

Acctually, I am familiar with the M-4, It wasnt what I was thinking of though. I just remember an article on Eugene Stoner, in the Rifleman having a pic. of an autoloading rifle similar to an AR-7 but obviously in a larger cal. I also remember the article did not mention the rifle, just included the pic.:confused:

[James Bondrock]

To my mind (for whatever that's worth ;) ), such a rifle is meant for taking edible small game. It seems to me that even the relatively mild .22 Hornet would be needlessly powerful for such duty.

[Detritus]

Note: the following is a rough outline of the accounts i have read about the origins etc of the AR-7 and it's kin, i may be wrong, but this is the info etc that i have seen


A real AR 7 wasn't that plastic Phillipines made junk. It was a .22 Hornet aircrew survival rifle made for the USAF as I recall. The plastic thing was a poor mans .22.


only partly right the AR-7 wasn't originally plastic junk, but it was also always a .22lr.

i beleive the gun you're thinking of is the second iteration of the "7"s "moma" which was built in the same config (action adn barrel stored in floating stock, and using same magazine system) but a Bolt gun.

the original concept was to give a down crewman a small lightweight and "ejection survivable" weapon to use for long term (ie after the "energy bar" rations ran out) subsistence till rescue, and leave personal defense to the crewman's sidearm. the projject hit a snag when it was discovered that EVEN IF the gun was issued "for food gathering only" etc, that a round that was NOT a "non-expanding FMJ" type, would still violate the Hague convention, and all that THAT would entail not only for the DoD but the poor Sod found with said gun/ammo. (the AR-7 auto version is prototyped about this time i believe) AND that no .22 rimfire round meeting the criteria of the time, existed.

so the rimfire gun was dropped, and for a very short time a .22 hornet version was tested, then was dismissed as having too high a risk of NOT stopping the small game, but having a high enough noise signature to alert those nearby that "someone who does not belong" was in the area.

AFTER the project was dropped the civvy versions came out, and the AR-7 as a .22 auto loader just simply outsold the others and survived where they didn't.

[keederdag]

Actually I own a box of Goverment issue .22 lr ammo in a watertight container, that supposedly contains cartriges loaded with solid copper bullets. I have never broken the seal, and I wont, but it is what I have been told by more than a few ammo collecters. I was also told it was for the M-6 survival rifle. I also have approved plated buckshot in 12 guage as well, in military gov. issue boxes. I have been told there is .410 out there, but I have never seen a box.