Are there any iron sight rifles?


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dashootist
February 25, 2010, 07:24 PM
None of the local gun stores seem to carry bolt action deer rifles with iron sights. Just looking for a decent beginner's rifle for all-around bolt gun (hunting, homestead defense, plinking, etc). Perhaps, something in .308 WIN. Who still makes bolt action rifles with iron sight? I'm new to rifle shooting, but I shooting handguns and reload. I plan to reload my rifle rounds also. By the way, I want to spend around $500.

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Cosmoline
February 25, 2010, 07:31 PM
CZ makes some really nice 550's with iron sights. Sadly most US makers have abandoned them because most American rifle shooters don't know how to use them. I've even seen some argue that irons are useless for hunting (!). To me it's like a stick shift--it's not a real car without one.

AT2
February 25, 2010, 07:33 PM
I've been eyeballing the 550 FS, it looks friggin cool and appeals to the C&R side of me.

stchman
February 25, 2010, 07:37 PM
Mosins, Mausers, K31 Swiss, Lee Enfield, are all excellent large caliber bolt action rifle. They are relatively inexpensive and have iron sights.

If you are wanting new then AR-15 or Mini 14 will do, but they are smaller calibers.

schlockinz
February 25, 2010, 08:00 PM
Levers still come with sights on them!

Abel
February 25, 2010, 08:16 PM
Levers still come with sights on them!

That's a big 10-4. But you can put aftermarket open sights on a sightless rifle pretty easily. Williamns, XS, Marbles, & some others make them.

FIVETWOSEVEN
February 25, 2010, 08:24 PM
Yeah the mosin nagant is a good choice.

R.W.Dale
February 25, 2010, 08:34 PM
It's not a bolt but take a look at the rem 7600

they come with sights and are chambered for the rounds you're into and will shoot with boltguns of similar weight.

Abel
February 25, 2010, 08:42 PM
It's not a bolt but take a look at the rem 7600

The raised comb on the 7600 makes it a hassle to use as a dedicated open sight gun. I would suggest going to the older 760 model pump with a low comb. The 7600's sight are fine in a pinch if your scope craps out, but you have to move your cheek to a weird position to line up.

sarduy
February 25, 2010, 11:21 PM
get a mosin... and practice a lot... 7.62x54R is between a 308 and a 30-06
http://inlinethumb18.webshots.com/13201/2960183140095461090S500x500Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2960183140095461090dhrpEx)

dashootist
February 25, 2010, 11:34 PM
I didn't think about getting a used WW2 vintage gun. If I walk into a reputable gun store, how can I tell if a used Mauser/Mosin/Lee/ is reliable and accurate? I mean, how do I inspect a used 50 year old rifle!?

zhyla
February 25, 2010, 11:35 PM
I recently found (yes, found!) an Arisaka Type 99 that's been rechambered in .30-06. I haven't shot it yet (looking for a bolt) but the sights are not bad. It's a peep battle sight that flips back to give you a smaller peep sight that is elevation adjustable. It's also a pretty light rifle compared to the Mausers.

You might look around on Gunbroker, I've seen them there in .308 and .30-06.

Sarduy - that's a great pic.

Isher
February 25, 2010, 11:40 PM
Dang -

Just everybody knows that

The American Revolution was won

With those nasty flintlock long guns

Mounted with Swiss glass!

Not to mention the American West;

Those 1880 Winchester levers with the Eotech

Were simply the best.

Yeeeshh.


isher

wgaynor
February 26, 2010, 03:54 AM
If possible, bring a light with you to check out the bore. You want to make sure there isn't any pitting or rust. If you see any, pass it up. There are plenty more out there. You also want to make sure that everything "looks good". Check the barrel bands (make sure they are present), make sure the front post isn't bent (seen them...sad sad sad), and check to see if you can test fire it. Some of them are more accurate than others and it is by chance that you get the really accurate ones.

If they tell you it was a "sniper rifle" they are probably lying. If it really was, it would be expensive.

Average cost of a Mosin Nagant M91/30 is $90 or so.

Girodin
February 26, 2010, 04:05 AM
Sadly most US makers have abandoned them because most American rifle shooters don't know how to use them.

A statement that seems much more likely to be accurate is that most US makers have abandoned them because enough American rifle shooters don't deem irons a significant factor when the buy a rifle and not putting irons on is cheaper. I doubt the makers care much one way or another about what people know how to use. They care about what they will buy and what increases profit margin.

tju1973
February 26, 2010, 07:29 AM
get a mosin... and practice a lot... 7.62x54R is between a 308 and a 30-06
http://inlinethumb18.webshots.com/13201/2960183140095461090S500x500Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2960183140095461090dhrpEx)
+1...

And get plenty of Icy Hot for your shoulder, and enjoy the awesome spectacle of the firebomb at dusk from the end of your rifle!

ArmedBear
February 26, 2010, 08:14 AM
Remington makes bolt actions with irons. So does Savage. Browning's BLR is a modern lever action that works like a bolt internally, and can handle .308 and a lot heavier even. It also comes with irons.

You can have them added to just about any rifle. Marbles makes them.

There are a few reasons you won't see many in stores:

1. A stock set up for irons is not set up for a scope, and vice versa. Probably 99% of bolt actions get scopes, so knowledgable buyers tend to want a stock that's made for a scope, not irons.

2. Modern scopes are very reliable, and variable scopes allow for close and distant use. For hunting, modern rifle rounds are wasted on irons. Why get a 400-yard elk round and use sights that aren't good for much past 150? You'll note that lever action .30-30 rifles still come with irons. The .30-30 is not a long-range cartridge like the .300 Win Mag, and it's a better match for irons (although serious lever action shooters generally consider upgraded iron sights to be part of the purchase cost of a rifle).

3. Open sights suck. Peep sights, OTOH, are easy to use with excellent accuracy. Competitive iron sight rifle shooters use peeps unless rules prohibit them, whether they're at Camp Perry, the Olympics, or at a local range. You'll also notice that militaries that have been serious about marksmanship haven't used anything else since WW I. The Enfield No4, the M14, the M16, they all have peep sights -- of course our current fighting forces are using optics, mostly, with peeps as backups. The problem is, hunting bolt guns have been supplied with open sights, and seldom good ones. Nothing will drive you to using a scope quicker than those things. Before scopes were reliable, books were written about hunting iron sights, and people knew what to look for. Now, it seems the lever gun fans and black powder cartridge shooters are knowledgable, but a lot of bolt gun buyers have never even seen good iron sights, so they wouldn't know where to look.

HGUNHNTR
February 26, 2010, 08:31 AM
CZ would fit the bill, otherwise the AR platform will provide plenty of iron sight/caliber options.

Hatterasguy
February 26, 2010, 10:10 AM
Get an old military bolt action rifle. They are extremly accurite, the ammo is usualy pretty cheap, and they have good sights.

K31's are easy to find in really good shape, since the Swiss never faught in a war with them! But they are all good.

http://www.mauser.org/
If you just want a shooter, I'd talk to these guys.

skipbo32
February 27, 2010, 09:10 PM
did somebody say "iron sights"?

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k141/skipbo32/DSC_6833.jpg

black_powder_Rob
February 27, 2010, 09:52 PM
ahhh your saftey is open!!!!! made ya look. NIce rifle skip.
there are some bolt action rifles out there with sights but they sure are hard to find in most local gun stores.

W.E.G.
February 27, 2010, 09:57 PM
NAGANT!!!!

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/rifle%20pics/m44muzzleflash.jpg

TexasPatriot.308
February 27, 2010, 10:06 PM
You're not looking hard enough.

R.W.Dale
February 27, 2010, 10:08 PM
The raised comb on the 7600 makes it a hassle to use as a dedicated open sight gun. I would suggest going to the older 760 model pump with a low comb. The 7600's sight are fine in a pinch if your scope craps out, but you have to move your cheek to a weird position to line up.
true but the fix is easy as swapping over to a 20ga rem 870 buttstock

A 7600 fitted with a receiver sight can be a poor mans national match rifle if you have the skills to match the gun's ability. IMO the heavier bbl on the 7600 vs the 760 is well worth it to have.

here's my old 7615 I used to shoot in 300m HP matches (and be competitive)
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y96/krochus/REM%207615/HPIM1320.jpg

SaxonPig
February 27, 2010, 10:15 PM
I agree that it can be difficult to find a hunting rifle with iron sights. Fact is that the vast majority of shooters scope their rifles and the manufacturers decided to save money by not installing parts that most often don't get used.

But some rifles still have sights, or they can be ordered with them. Someone mentioned the CZ 550 FS. I have one and although I did scope it as can be seen it came with sights.


http://www.fototime.com/C7710EDF75A683A/standard.jpg


I built this Mauser Sporter from a commercial action that was drilled for the receiver sight but the barrel was devoid of sights or tapped holes. A smith fixed this situation for me.


http://www.fototime.com/19173A2BA269235/standard.jpg


Went a different route with this one. Front sight is for a Ruger M77 and the rear is a 3-leaf folding sight that I got from Numrich or Sarco (don't recall, now) for about $59. Definitely Euro trash looking.


http://www.fototime.com/3AEA8863E2A6F5C/standard.jpg

52grain
February 28, 2010, 12:32 AM
You might be able to find a new (but discontinued) Remington 700 ADL at Walmart in that price range, but it would probably be a .270. Otherwise whoever mentioned the Swiss milsurps is on the right track.

Do you want iron sights due to cost or because you prefer iron sights?

shephard19
February 28, 2010, 03:42 AM
A Mosin Nagant is alot of rifle for the money, but consider
getting a K-98 rifle for a little more they are generally better made and are more accurate. It is also in between the length of the carbine Mosin and the rifle Mosin so you get the best of both worlds. The safety is easier to use on the mausers and they are also known for having very good triggers.

oldfool
February 28, 2010, 07:02 AM
well, I was going to suggest Remington model 7...
but it appears they no longer come w/ irons on 'em either !
sheesh
(mine did, long ago, although it now wears the fiber optic version, front & rear)

methinks, w/ all the good advice given in thread already, your real problem is going to be deciding on rifle length and caliber
if this be your 1st centerfire rifle, might consider going a little lighter in caliber than 308, depends on lot on what big game is "big" in your locale
most any will do for "defense and plinking"

so many choices, so little time and money

762NATO
March 1, 2010, 12:13 AM
did somebody say "iron sights"?

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k141/skipbo32/DSC_6833.jpg
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D
It kinda becomes a bolt gun when you switch the gas system off. Kinda. :)

dashootist
March 8, 2010, 09:53 PM
I saw a few mausers and nagants at a gun shop. They had a "Rearsenaled...new" nagant for $130 and a Type 53 Chinese for $150. The shop owner said they were "ready to shoot." The Type 53 looks well used. Are they really "ready to shoot"? What do I need to check to ensure the rifle don't blow up in my face?

Tinpig
March 8, 2010, 11:44 PM
Here's a couple-
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc91/ccanhamjr/Guns/IMG_2393.jpg

1929 Springfield M1903 with a '44 High Standard barrel
1943 Remington M1903A3 with original barrel

Get a .30 cal. muzzle gauge and find one with a good barrel...you won't be disappointed.

JeffsJeep04
March 9, 2010, 10:02 AM
The Savage 114 euro classic has iron sights on them.

I love my remmy 7600, but the trigger is TERRIBLE on it. Gritty and creep for miles. I'm finally pulling the scope off of it and putting on a peep sight for use in the woods. It really deserves to get the trigger worked over on it, but not this year. If the S was HTF outside my house, I think I'd grab that thing. I can darn near match a semi auto for a follow up shot, and lay it out accurately. Took a neck shot on a buck last year (he didn't present a very decent broadside right away) and he took off. Before he made 4 steps, I hit him with another behind the shoulder and he was DRT. First would have killed him, but it was much easier to drive the truck up to where he laid. Got over 70# of meat off of him without being too picky :)

dashootist
March 10, 2010, 02:08 AM
I bought the 91/30. The barrel is very dirty. I've been scrubbing all night with the brush and patches and Hoppes 9, and it's still far from clean. The crap is very hard to get out. Is there a bettery cleaner out there?

dom1104
March 10, 2010, 08:19 AM
http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k141/skipbo32/DSC_6833.jpg


THIS guy is the reason AR guys in their tactical gear take three sideways steps from the M14 guys.

The multiple bracelets and shiny belt buckles frighten us to our core.

inclinebench
March 10, 2010, 08:41 AM
I bought my Rem. model 700 ADL with irons on it. It was a few years back, but I am pretty sure you can still find some "modern" hunting rifles with irons, and as has been stated, you can also ad irons onto many rifles without too much effort.

Murphys Law
March 10, 2010, 08:46 AM
I bought the 91/30. The barrel is very dirty. I've been scrubbing all night with the brush and patches and Hoppes 9, and it's still far from clean. The crap is very hard to get out. Is there a bettery cleaner out there?
Try running a very wet patch of Kroil through and letting it soak in over night. I found Shooters Choice to be a better bore cleaner than Hoppes but I think the Kroil will help the most. If you can't find any locally, you can order it from Midway.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=137203

CZguy
March 10, 2010, 09:23 AM
Plus one on Kroil.

You might also try foaming bore cleaner.

Calibre44
March 10, 2010, 09:47 AM
Iron sights no problem on these babies: :)
http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg230/woodsy_2008/Guns/misc014.jpg

win71
March 10, 2010, 12:25 PM
pre war mod. 70
http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w140/win71/peepsites005.jpg
reproduction mod. 95
http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w140/win71/peepsites006.jpg
Sako factory
http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w140/win71/peepsites011.jpg

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