Old men rule!!!


PDA






Arkansas Paul
February 27, 2010, 11:59 PM
I was in a small local gunshop the other day, and there were a couple of guys in there talking to the owner of the place. They were all in their 70s, and here I am, still on the comfortable side of 30. I hung around and listened at first and gradually joined in the conversation. They acted just like I was one of them.

They were old school handloaders with many, many years of experience between them, and once we were all comfortable with one another, I started picking their brains. They were extremely helpful and willing to answer any questions I had. It was awesome. I ended up staying for over an hour, shooting the bull with these guys. Talking to them, I realized why they're known as the greatest generation ever. They were incredible guys.

I had questions that I know were basic and elementary to them, but they answered every one of them and never once acted superior because of their knowledge. I am glad to be involved in a hobby that has men like these who are willing to share their wealth of knowledge with relative newbies. When I left, one of the men gave me directions to his house without me asking and told me to stop by anytime and bring my brass and he would show me anything I needed to know.

I just wanted to share this with you guys. People like that make it even more fun. Sadly, I don't think there are a whole lot left though.

If you enjoyed reading about "Old men rule!!!" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
ants
February 28, 2010, 12:07 AM
Very cool, Paul. Them old guys is tops. :)

Got any newly learned gems of wisdom you can share with us?

bds
February 28, 2010, 12:11 AM
The old guy who taught me to reload and shoot was also like the guys you mentioned. He told me the mistakes I was going to make shooting/reloading before I made them. You just cannot substitute experience.

We have an "older gentleman" who would come to the pistol matches and pull out his 357 with moon clips and absolutely outshoot us with our semi-autos (he never miss and his tight groups never deviate). First time I saw him shoot, my jaw dropped and murmured "that is not possible ..." He said, "Son, it just takes practice" and we became instant mentor/pupil.

Arkansas Paul
February 28, 2010, 12:31 AM
What they told me was probably pretty basic stuff, just stuff I haven't learned yet. I've only been at this for a short time.

They were good friends with one another. They reminded me of the two guys in "Grumpy Old Men" when they talked to each other. But brother let me tell you, they knew their stuff.

retsub
February 28, 2010, 01:51 AM
I can barely remember the old farts that got my dad and uncles into hunting and loading. They are gone now. But the traditions that were eventually passed from them to my generation are priceless. Surely they have made happen what might not have.

I had forgotten that. Sincerely,thanks for the post.

Randy1911
February 28, 2010, 01:51 AM
I have learned that older folks are the best source of wisdom to be found.

Arkansas Paul
February 28, 2010, 02:18 AM
I truly hope that one day, I'll be that old guy at the counter, sharing what I've learned with youngsters.

bds
February 28, 2010, 02:21 AM
Knowledge/wisdom comes from experience. Experience comes from making bad judgments/mistakes.

Older guys have been there and done that and alive to talk about it all. :D

qajaq59
February 28, 2010, 08:26 AM
A little respect and a polite manner can get you a lot of info from an older guy.

JimKirk
February 28, 2010, 08:57 AM
The old guys that I learned my reloading skills from came from that same mold. I have been that guy to quite a few young guys myself. They know what time I'm home and when to call, some come and visit at the shop with me. I guess that's the good part of getting older.

Jimmy K

jcwit
February 28, 2010, 11:26 AM
Years and Years ago almost 60 actually, an older man told me, When the old guys start talking, be quite, you'll learn more.

AirForceShooter
February 28, 2010, 11:40 AM
And be very respectful of Little Old Ladies.
Even us old farts are afraid of them.

I know one that's approaching 90 and she shoots a SSA .45 LC like she was born with it in her hand.

She'll teach you more about trigger control than you ever wanted to know.

AFS

BullRunBear
February 28, 2010, 12:34 PM
Like a lot of folks here I've benefited from the knowledge and generosity of some older shooters. I've been privileged to play that role for others but I'm really looking forward to this summer. We have some dear young friends. They already shoot but want to learn muzzleloading and how to reload. Their two little girls (my wife and I are honorary aunt and uncle) are old enough to learn to shoot and they've asked us to help. It's some extra eyes on the girls and I get a little extra authority form age and the white beard. :rolleyes: There's nothing like the look on a youngster's face when they first make the steel target clang with their 22.

Jeff

ljnowell
February 28, 2010, 12:49 PM
Soundsl like the gunshop I am heading to right now. Congrats finding a home.

Bush Pilot
March 1, 2010, 12:33 AM
Sometimes I'll head to the range loaded and ready to go for the day. Many a day has been derailed by sitting in on a BS session with the old timers, worth the time IMO.

Seedtick
March 1, 2010, 12:56 AM
Paul,

What shop are you talking about?

ST

:)

RippinSVT
March 1, 2010, 01:32 AM
I always always always listen to the old guys. It's how I've learned 75% of what I know beyond the basics.

Arkansas Paul
March 1, 2010, 02:35 AM
Seedtick, it's a little gunshop in Lincoln Square shopping center in Benton. It's called Arkansas Gun Traders.

Seedtick
March 1, 2010, 02:58 AM
Thanks Paul. I think I've heard about it but I've never been to it. Sounds like a fun place to hang out.

ST

:)

FROGO207
March 1, 2010, 06:58 AM
I am well on my way to being one of those that you talk about.:) Be patient and you will one day become one of them yourself. Remember that day then and pass on the culture.:D

ArkieVol
March 1, 2010, 08:01 AM
If you ever get up a little farther north there is another shop just like the one you're talking about...Heber Guns on Hwy 25 B north... in Heber Springs. Always have the checker board out, the coffee pot on and some mighty friendly folks and customers.

I'm not an expert, just an old (age 73) customer but come on down :)

jimmyraythomason
March 1, 2010, 08:37 AM
I had questions that I know were basic and elementary to them, but they answered every one of them and never once acted superior because of their knowledge. They are a treasure store of knowledge just waiting to be asked. The problem is that too many young folks already know it all and won't listen.

Offfhand
March 1, 2010, 09:18 AM
One of the best educations on handloading, and guns in general, you'll ever get is by visiting a benchrest tournament. One of the guys I met at a big bench match was only half jokeing when he told me that benchrest competition is a game for rich old men. Which seems true enouch when you look at their pricey rifles and equipment, and a lot of them are into their 60's and even well beyond. But you can pick up some valuable knowledge just by listening to what those old guys have to say and by asking a few questions. And when you see the tiny groups those old guys shoot it's obvious they know what they're talking about.

Arkansas Paul
March 1, 2010, 10:49 AM
You're right jimmyray. My dad always told me that there was a reason God gave us two ears and only one mouth.

jamesicus
March 1, 2010, 11:10 AM
I am in my eighties now -- it wasn't until I was in my forties that I realized my father wasn't as ill-informed as I thought he was when I was in my twenties.

Rembrandt
March 1, 2010, 11:10 AM
Gray hair has it's advantages......just hope the younger generation won't get their nose rings caught in equipment.

ranger335v
March 1, 2010, 11:43 AM
"I had questions that I know were basic and elementary to them, but they answered every one of them and never once acted superior because of their knowledge."

Well, in all fairness, not all old poops are so open and helpful. But, seems more likely it's the younger folk who need to establish a "pecking order", wanting to appear to be, if not be, at the top of the chain; that's childish. I see it from time to time on the web. But, eventually most of us grow out of that and we get comfortable with who and what we are, without delusions of grandure. We usually remember that none of us were born knowing a damp thing, that makes it easier for us to try to help others without being condescending...IF the youngters mind their manners. (We have also out-grown our tolerance for much foolishness or arrogance in anyone else!)

I only respond to web questions if/when I feel the question is a valid one, if it interests me, if I know the answer and IF it seems the poster might listen. (Seems some may be more interested in building a high post count and a place in the pecking order than actually helping anyone. ??)


"just hope the younger generation won't get their nose rings caught in equipment. "

To be truly funny, a quip has to have an element of truth and that's funny, I don't care who ya are.

Roccobro
March 1, 2010, 12:05 PM
just hope the younger generation won't get their nose rings caught in equipment.
If I had any more room in my signature line, I'd ask permission to use this gem. :D

Justin

Arkansas Paul
March 1, 2010, 01:02 PM
Rembrant, I wish to hell I had grey hair. Then I could brush in a little "Just For Men" and be okay. Sadly, mine has decided to vacate the premises. By the time I'm 40, I'll look like Mr Clean. lol

And thankfully there are no piercings to get in the way either. My pops was old school. If I'd walked in the house with a piercing anywhere, it would have likely gotten ripped out. I'll be 30 in July and I'd still be scared to walk up with something like that. That's not a joke either, just a fact.

Offfhand
March 1, 2010, 02:32 PM
When I'm getting on an airplane I take a look into the cockpit to see if the pilot has gray hair. I feel a lot safer if he does, and with good reason.

ranger335v
March 1, 2010, 03:04 PM
"We have some old pilots and some bold pilots. But we have no old bold pilots"

snuffy
March 1, 2010, 03:39 PM
......just hope the younger generation won't get their nose rings caught in equipment.

I just can't see why anyone would want to poke holes in themselves, then put hardware in them. I pierce myself at least 2 times daily taking blood sugar counts and injecting insulin, I sure wouldn't to it to put some hardware in myself. When I was growing up, women had earrings, men didn't.

I guess I'm qualified for that term old fart! But if anyone wants info about shooting or reloading, I'll do anything I can to help. Including letting someone visit to use my equipment. Or I'll come to their house to help them set-up their loader.

I only respond to web questions if/when I feel the question is a valid one, if it interests me, if I know the answer and IF it seems the poster might listen.

Ranger, EXACTLY! If I don't know about a question, I go onto something else. OR if the question isn't complete with all pertinent info, I won't respond. Or I'll post something like more info please!?

Like; I can't get my remmy 700 to shoot, what's wrong?-----------HUH? What caliber, what ammo, what you mean won't shoot, won't fire, bad accuracy---the list goes on!!!

gdcpony
March 1, 2010, 04:18 PM
I learned to reload sitting in a gun shop listening. I ordered my stuff from them based on their advice and what I was doing. They told me what books to get, how to not go broke experimenting (odd since they were getting my money), and even demonstrated a few things that confused me. The other customers and the owner helped me out a ton in figuring out what I might be doing wrong.

Once I got some punched primers and was worried about the gun even though it was a minimum load. A simple "Did you wipe off the lube?" fixed it.

It has since changed hands and while not quite as helpful, they guys are still willing to answer questions.

content
March 1, 2010, 05:16 PM
Hello friends and neighbors // Great story and learning experience

You have found a great source of informed knowledge, instead of uninformed opinion.
You must be an exceptional youngman to appreciate, these oldtimers.

Maybe you can offer to help them with whatever you are good at.

loadedround
March 1, 2010, 05:49 PM
I can remember vividly as a young man arter my army time sitting around deer camp and Saturday afternoons listening to the stories from the olt timers about shooting and reloading firearms and cartridges I could only dream about. In those days you just listened unless unless they directed a question to you. Now I'm one of the Old Farts and enjoy telling my "war stories" to the younger crowd at my gun club. But the difference now is they do ask the questions and they are good ones, and respectfully they await the answers....really a bunch of good young men.

ranger335v
March 1, 2010, 05:50 PM
"When I was growing up, women had earrings, men didn't."

Snuffy, real men still don't. It's an image thing for those who don't have one, real men don't need it. IMHO, of course.

bomb dropper
March 1, 2010, 06:24 PM
cough RCMODEL WALKALONG cough

not saying there old but they help with a lot of problems Ive had and ones that I search for usually have one post left by one or both.

My dads that way hes 69 and remembers so much from the old days. He hasn't messed with anything more then his Remington rand 1911 ($125) and his rugger .44mag. He was amazed when I showed him my ar. even though he bought two of them new for $150 each back in the early 70's one with the origanal 3x20 scope. He tells me things all the time that open my mind.

arizonaguide
March 1, 2010, 07:21 PM
GREAT THREAD!

I am 48, but live in a retirement community. My wife is JUST old enough...so it makes ME eligable.
I LOVE it here, because the older folks still have the old fashioned values.

When you hold a door they say "thank you"...they are NEVER to BUSY (like some younger folks on their cellphone) for common curtousy.

They are very active...and healthy..and are ALWAYS willing to share their wisdom with someone who shows just a bit of respect.
In fact they are often anxious to do it. My life has taken a big turn for the better since I have moved here.
I have learned more on the golf course in the last couple years than in ALL my college days.
My normal interests are Golfer/shooter and wildlife photographer (Grand Canyon Guide), and there are plenty of folks here that share those same interests. 50 is the new 40, etc.
My Dad's 82, and works out with me at the Gym 3days/week!!! Going STRONG!!! Looks like he's 60, and teaches computer photography, etc.

Great Thread, ArPaul...you are smart enough to learn this at the comfortable side of 30...and are AHEAD of the game.
:cool:

Arkansas Paul
March 2, 2010, 12:44 AM
Thank you very much for all the comments.
When I started this thread, I didn't think it would take off like this.
This is a little off topic, but I think the problem with the generation coming up is that family values and respect for elders has lost it's importance. I'm fortunate. My dad grew up in the Mississippi delta in 1947, picking cotton every day from the time he was nine or ten. He only went to school through the eighth grade, and had to quit. After serving fifteen months in Vietnam, he came home, got his GED and went to college. He was handed nothing. Everything he has came from sweat and blood. And let me just tell you, he don't give a rat's a$$ about this new breed of young people walking around with their pants hanging off their butt, looking like they fell face first into a tackle box, thinking the world owes them something.
If he'd saw me being disrespectful to an elder growing up, I'd have had some problems sitting down for a while. There were just some things a man did, if he wanted to call himself a man. I consider myself very fortunate to have the upbringing I've had, and if I'm half the man he is, I'll be just fine.

arizonaguide
March 2, 2010, 03:13 AM
if I'm half the man he is, I'll be just fine.
Same way I feel about my Dad. Lied about his age to go fight in WW2 at 15yrs old.
Purple Heart.

He told me one time he may get old, and I may get tough enough to kick his butt, but he'd always be strong enough to Break my Dinner Plate.
He's never had too yet.

You're ahead of the game, Paul...just with the wisdom you've mentioned.

dalegann
July 26, 2010, 12:34 AM
Paul is my brother! And I am blessed to have the TWO greatest men in the world as dad and bro. He is exactly what you see in these post and Paul you are just as great as dad and I am very proud of you!

Guncollector1982
July 26, 2010, 01:22 AM
the people i most respect and are best friends with are old guys. Somethings take a lifetime to learn and dont be fooled cause some old boy is over 70 and never finished high school he knows more then a college grad in most cases. Have very few friends my own age.

ArchAngelCD
July 26, 2010, 02:22 AM
I'm not quite considered old at the age of only 53 but I'm getting there. I try to help anyone who wants help. IMO it's the best way to keep or sport alive. I know several gentlemen in the age group mentioned and they are all extremely knowledgeable and willing to share it all. I've listened to them talk for countless hours.

azyogi
July 26, 2010, 02:29 AM
snuffy/ranger I only answer the dumb questions cause that's right up my ally.

sig220mw
July 26, 2010, 05:46 AM
I was raised by my maternal grandparents so communicating with oldsters has always been quite natural for me. I'm not so "new" anymore being 57.

There are some older guys in a gun shop in Longview, Texas and when I go there if I have questions about loading they love to share info with me and I soak it up.

rfwobbly
July 26, 2010, 09:00 AM
It was awesome. I ended up staying for over an hour, shooting the bull with these guys. Talking to them, I realized why they're known as the greatest generation ever. They were incredible guys.

What? You didn't stick around for checkers? Man, you completely missed it. :D

Hondo 60
July 26, 2010, 11:20 PM
Well, I'm a middle aged fart (50).

as far as bald - my dad always said "God only made a few perfect heads, the rest he covered with hair". (mine's perfect) LOL

as far as nice old guys - My first trip to Cabela's was an eye opener. I was so confused on what I needed! There was a nice old guy there who helped me better than any Cabela's employee ever did. No, he didn't work there, he was just a nice guy willing to share his reloading knowledge.

GaryL
July 27, 2010, 12:49 AM
I have a friend who lives and frequents a range near Huntsville, AL. Was down there visiting a couple years back, and he took me out to the range one afternoon. On the way, he told me "if you get into a discussion with one of the old farts, be careful about getting sucked into any arguments because you could find yourself arguing with a retired rocket scientist with nothing but time on his hands".

1SOW
July 27, 2010, 01:07 AM
This is a noteworthy thread.

The respect that goes both ways between the generations is also tied to the shooting sports in general. Father taught son (who listened) and neighbor talked to neighbor to share and learn from experience. That tradition is more evident at the 'range' than most other places.

Not only that, it makes you feel good too. Just look at all those "I remember when....." and you can almost see the smile on the poster's face.

Ever play golf? You won't find a lot of these good folks to talk to.

Maybe it should be mandatory to get a gun and go the range and especially that gun shop with the back room.

Bluehawk
July 27, 2010, 06:01 AM
When you guys refer to SSA...don't ya mean SAA (Single Action Army)?
Don't mean to be picky but I've seen SSA a few times now.

qajaq59
July 27, 2010, 07:53 AM
Most of us older guys want to help the young ones because we grew up with guns. And we'd hate to see the tradition die. When I was a kid everyone had a gun, and we didn't use it on each other. It was nothing to go to school on a city bus with a rifle case and then keep it in your locker until it was time for rifle team practice. It was normal. And I'd like to see it be normal again. So the more young guys I can help get into the hobby the better.

Roccobro
July 27, 2010, 01:46 PM
On the way, he told me "if you get into a discussion with one of the old farts, be careful about getting sucked into any arguments because you could find yourself arguing with a retired rocket scientist with nothing but time on his hands".

My favoritestest quote so far...

Justin

rfwobbly
July 27, 2010, 01:56 PM
This is a noteworthy thread.

The respect that goes both ways between the generations is also tied to the shooting sports in general. Father taught son (who listened) and neighbor talked to neighbor to share and learn from experience. That tradition is more evident at the 'range' than most other places.

Ever play golf? You won't find a lot of these good folks to talk to.

Maybe it should be mandatory to get a gun and go the range, and especially that gun shop with the back room.

You could go further than that. I firmly believe that every kid should be given a reloading press and a banjo at birth. That way the "back rooms" of America will always be full. If for no other reason than the banjo players ran everyone out of the "front room".

If you enjoyed reading about "Old men rule!!!" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!