isn't this illegal??


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noob_shooter
March 1, 2010, 10:33 PM
http://www.gun-shots.net/make-silencer.shtml

***??


A firearm silencer, also known as a suppressor, works in the same way as a car muffler. The muffler consists of chambers for the compression to be dispersed and the sound to be redirected or absorbed. Heat is also reduced throughout the muffler system. A firearm silencer works on the same principle.

There are generally three sections to a firearm silencer:

The first stage of the firearm silencer ususally consists of something that will absorb and dissipate heat rapidly. It also allows for part of the compression to be reduced due to the quick cooling of gases.

The second stage of the firearm silencer usually consists of rubber or plastic washers or discs that help slow down the bullet to sub sonic speeds. It also helps reduce compression.

The third and more complicated stage of the firearm silencer usually consists of tall wooden washers with rubber discs between them or thick chambers of soft plastic. The end of this stage has a low wear rubber cylinder to slow down outgoing air.

The entire firearm silencer is contained within a one and a half inch 300 PSI (Pounds per Square Inch) plastic PVC pipe.

Parts list:

* 1x 6-14" 300psi plastic PVC pipe
* 10-15x Rubber or medium hardness plastic discs
* 11-16x Soft Wood washers with 1 1/4" internal diameter
* 1x Rubber cylinder
* 5x Rubber discs
* 6x tall wooden washers, plain
* 2x steel plugs for the middle and front of the firearm silencer
* 1x heat and pressure dispersement rod with positioning rings, black.
* 2x stabilizer donuts to keep the firearm silencer straight, red.
* 4x separator discs, green.
* 1x Adapter to attach the firearm silencer to the firearm.

Discs can be cut out with a hole saw, purchased from any local hardware store. The materials can be bought there also. Rubber or plastic can be cut out of tires or trashcans. wooden washers can be cut out of particle board. The steel plugs can be bought at any automotive store as freeze plugs. The heat and pressure rod can be bought at any metal shop; buy at 4-6 inches long Aluminium tube at about 1/8" thick with an ID (Internal Diameter) as close to the bullet size as possible. Stabilizer donuts can be cut out of birch or oak wood and then drilled with a hole drill. All discs and inserted materials except the head rod should be slightly under 1 1/2" diameter so that they will fill snugly in the tube.

The heat rod should be drilled full of holes 1/4" from each end. These holes should be about the same size as the bullet. Leave about a quarter inch gap between each hole. Place a wooden donut at each end and wrap the rod in aluminium screen. Screw the rod into the wood or use epoxy. Place this part into the tube first, this should be very tight and could even have to be hammered into the tube, however do not use screws or glue to hammer it in place.

Now place a steel plug in the tube so that the rounded end is facing the top or exit hole. Now place the adapter in the tube followed by the stabilizer donuts. Make sure the barrel will seat securely in the adapter and that the donuts are snug on the barrel. Make sure you place a separator disc between each stage. Drill little holes in the tube about halfway into the adapter and donuts and place small screws in place to hold them securely.

Note that a small angle is cut into the adaptor to facilitate the sight of the gun. The adaptor has to be reamed at an angle so that the sight will not interfere.

Place a smaller PVC pipe in the front end and push the heat dispersement chamber up to the separator disc, next to the adaptor.

Now from the top, place a wooden washer then plastic disc, washer, disc etc. 9mm ammunition usually requires 12-15 and a 22 usually 6-9. There should be 12-15 discs and 13-16 wooden washers, do not end up with a washer, now place another separator in place.

Last you will need to insert two rubber discs and a tall wooden washer, two discs then a washer. Now place another separator in place. Place the large rubber cylinder in place, this should be about 1/2" thick. Place the steel plug in place so that the rounded end is facing outwards and rivet it into the front carefully.

Before using be sure there is a clean hole all the way. Use a wooden dowel to see if the firearm silencer is lined up with the barrel hole. All inserted parts should have a hole in the center that is comparable in size to the size of the bullet's diameter.

Things you should know:

* Suppressors will slow down the bullet and cause it to defract in another direction.
* Suppressors do not operate well in cold wheather but this one will for the first few hundred rounds.
* If you wish to shoot full auto you must double the quantity of internal parts and use an aluminium pipe covered with neoprene sleeve, remember that metal dings.
* Firearm silencers are illegal in some areas; be safe and know the firearm silencer laws in your location.

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lions
March 1, 2010, 10:36 PM
Not if you fill out a Form 1 with the BATFE.

ETA: Link to Form 1:
http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-5320-1.pdf

noob_shooter
March 1, 2010, 10:38 PM
and that grants you to make your own suppressors? cool! i need to fill one out too then..

kingpin008
March 1, 2010, 10:42 PM
and that grants you to make your own suppressors? cool! i need to fill one out too then..

As long as you live in a state that allows NFA items, and your paperwork comes back approved, you are correct.

Also, in the future it would be great if you could post a little summary of what the link you want us to click on contains - it's considered bad manners to just drop a link and expect us to click on it without at least a sentence worth of description.

NMGonzo
March 1, 2010, 10:51 PM
pin. .. you gave yourself a wedgie

Leanwolf
March 1, 2010, 10:54 PM
NOOB SHOOTER - "and that grants you to make your own suppressors? cool! i need to fill one out too then.. "

You did not list where you live.

As Kingpin said, check your State's firearms laws Some States allow private ownership of suppressors, with proper Federal taxes paid, etc., and other States don't.

I.e., California doesn't :( , whereas Idaho does. :D

L.W.

nalioth
March 1, 2010, 10:59 PM
<sarcasm> I so enjoy reading all of these "Ugly American" threads </sarcasm>

Is that page available to a worldwide audience?

Is is remotely possible that folks outside the USA could make a suppressor w/o having to jump through legal hoops?

Can a 12 year old legally read a driver's education manual?

Can a 15 year old legally read material on voter's education?

If that page was "illegal", then we'd all be in jail for reading about making NFA weapons here on THR.


Some of you folks need to widen your outlooks.

hso
March 1, 2010, 11:02 PM
Not illegal if you follow the rules, but I think some of the information on that link is incorrect.

You are providing a cavity for the gasses to be trapped and cooled in so that they loose energy and produce less sound, but you aren't slowing the bullet down. If I'm incorrect on that I'm certain one of our real suppressor experts will provide the correct information.

Zak Smith
March 1, 2010, 11:15 PM
and that grants you to make your own suppressors? cool! i need to fill one out too then..
As far as federal law is concerned, an approved Form 1 allows you to build and possess one suppressor and no extra parts.
I think some of the information on that link is incorrect.
Some of it is, but more of it is incorrect. The part where they describe "There are generally three sections to a firearm silencer: [...] " does not resemble modern centerfire suppressors at all.

Also, I would strongly counsel against using an outer tube made of PVC for a centerfire caliber. Bad idea.

If you want to build a Form 1 suppressor, you can find much, much better information on modern suppressor designs on the internet.

-z

kingpin008
March 1, 2010, 11:19 PM
pin. .. you gave yourself a wedgie

I don't follow. Care to explain?

w_houle
March 2, 2010, 12:05 AM
It's not necessarily illegal, although I can't see why... Besides the wildly inaccurate information given (bullet slow down, deflection, et c.) If you were to put paperwork, money, time and effort into this thing: You wouldn't end up with a worthwhile product. Especially when they say that some of the parts need to be this big (holds fingers apart) Yeah, that big:rolleyes:

Ranb
March 2, 2010, 04:15 AM
I make silencers as a hobby registering them on an ATF form 1. That page had to be some of the ugliest info I have seen on silencers in a long time. Non-metal parts? Jeez! My silencers are much simpler; aluminum and steel, the baffles do not touch the bullets and certainly do not degrade accuracy.

Some of the silencer best info on the net can be had at http://www.silencertalk.com and http://www.subguns.com . THR should be a much better place for NFA info since this section was created. Hopefully there will be fewer people claiming silencers are illegal too. :)

Ranb

Friendly, Don't Fire!
March 2, 2010, 06:37 AM
I had some guy at the range a number of years ago telling me how I could make a silencer by jamming an empty plastic soda bottle onto the muzzle.

I could see me trying that just one time and the one time I do, there happens to be a state trooper watching. :what:

No thanks, I prefer the noise. :)

Can I get a Loudener for my .22 Target Pistol? ;)

CleverNickname
March 2, 2010, 09:50 AM
Yeah you can get "loudeners", they're called muzzle brakes.

MagnumDweeb
March 2, 2010, 03:24 PM
I went to the site. Usual Paladin Press released books. Good stuff for those folks who don't have a lathe or drill press but otherwise...I'd stick with the K-baffle design and use the necessary K-baffles appropriate. I know an old hand who's got K-baffle silencers for his 1911 .45 and 1911 .38 super. Made them himself he told back in the eighties as a hobby and has all the necessary tax stamps(paper work). Showed me he still has all the designs, most all the materials you need, and more importantly he still has the working machines. Soon as I get admitted to the bar I'm building a silencer for a 1911 .45 Commander with a spare 7" barrel using K-baffles. Gettng a 6" spare barrel for my Glock 20 in 9x25 dillon(90 grains at 1900+fps) and working up a silencer. Break down and get a Ruger 10/22 and work up a silencer for it. Man I'm going to paying the ATF some money for those tax stamps.

nalioth
March 2, 2010, 03:32 PM
I had some guy at the range a number of years ago telling me how I could make a silencer by jamming an empty plastic soda bottle onto the muzzle. Some years ago, they sold thread adapters that would accept a 2ℓ plastic soda bottle.

That fad faded out along with the Tec-9s and Mac-10s that those devices were aimed at . .

Ranb
March 2, 2010, 05:30 PM
I had some guy at the range a number of years ago telling me how I could make a silencer by jamming an empty plastic soda bottle onto the muzzle.

Can I get a Loudener for my .22 Target Pistol?

That guy must have been a real idiot. Putting an empty bottle on the muzzle can ruin accuracy, covers the sights and is much less effective than even a simple silencer made from tubing and mesh. It would only be effective enough to legally be a silencer, but nowhere near good enough to justify the $200 tax.

Anyone wanting a louder gun just needs to shorten the barrel, add a muzzle brake or use more powerful ammo. I like less blast anyday. :)

Ranb

Ranb
March 2, 2010, 05:32 PM
Some years ago, they sold thread adapters that would accept a 2ℓ plastic soda bottle.

That fad faded out along with the Tec-9s and Mac-10s that those devices were aimed at . .

As far as I know, that fad also faded out when the ATF decided that silencer parts were silencers all by themselves. This meant that the bottle (and whatever it may have been stuffed with) which only lasted a few rounds, required that another $200 tax be paid to replace it. The ATF only allows wipes to be replaced without a new tax unless done by a licensed manufacturer.

Ranb

hirundo82
March 2, 2010, 09:31 PM
That guy must have been a real idiot. Putting an empty bottle on the muzzle can ruin accuracy, covers the sights and is much less effective than even a simple silencer made from tubing and mesh. It would only be effective enough to legally be a silencer, but nowhere near good enough to justify the $200 tax.It wouldn't even have to be effective at all. The law defines a silencer as a device designed to muffle the report of a firearm. Even if it actually ends up making the report louder, if you attach something (soda bottle, pillow, potato) to the end of a firearm with the intent of muffling the report you have manufactured a silencer.

Ranb
March 2, 2010, 10:27 PM
When I said effective enough, I meant that any amount of suppression is enough to classify it as a silencer as far as the ATF is concerned. :)

Ranb

noob_shooter
March 3, 2010, 04:39 PM
wow thanks guys... i haven't check if WI allowed suppressors yet..i will though.

CoRoMo
March 3, 2010, 05:32 PM
They do.

http://grburnett.us/guns/nfa/NFADevicesbyStatewmap.pdf

Ranb
March 3, 2010, 06:11 PM
As far as I know, silencers are legal for private ownership in AL, AR, AK, AZ, CO, CT, FL, GA, ID, IN, KS, KY, LA, ME, MD, MO (with C&R), MS, MT, NE, NV, NH, NM, NC, ND, OH, OK, OR, PA, SC, SD, TN, TX, UT, VA, WA, WV, WI, and WY. They maybe owned by Class 3 dealers and Class 2 manufacturers in CA, IA, MA, and MI. WA bans use, even the police are not exempt.

I have checked some of the laws on the state websites, but not all.

Ranb

blackrussian
March 3, 2010, 06:50 PM
Is is remotely possible that folks outside the USA could make a suppressor w/o having to jump through legal hoops?

Oddly enough, Great Britain allows silencer ownerships ad lib.

hirundo82
March 3, 2010, 07:30 PM
Or at least they are not any more restricted than a firearm--in the UK you have to have a good reason and get police permission to buy firearms or suppressors.

RDCL
March 3, 2010, 08:44 PM
Interesting is it not?

Our motor vehicles MUST have "suppressors" so as to not disturb our neighbors.......

.......but our firearms must be as loud as possible to distract concentration at the range:)


Russ

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