i have new, lots and lots of new


PDA






MandH2010
March 3, 2010, 04:10 PM
i'm new.
i need advice on a home defense/CCW
i found the 325 dp and i really like it. but i hear that the grip is no good and i worry that since it is a 45 ACP it will punch through an attacker and into a loved one. i want to bore a large hole into an attacker and leave the bullet in him.

should i get a smaller caliber, buy a special ammunition, or is the 45ACP ok? what does 45 acp have the tendency to do?

thanks much

If you enjoyed reading about "i have new, lots and lots of new" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
rocinante
March 3, 2010, 04:13 PM
45acp is a big slow round not known for over penetration.

Go to a range and rent different guns is the way to decide on what you want.

bluetopper
March 3, 2010, 04:15 PM
The 45 in my opinion is the best home defense caliber made. Don't base major purchases like this on what you hear on the internet. Handle which ones you are leaning towards and then make your own mind up.

OldCavSoldier
March 3, 2010, 08:11 PM
Great advice above!!

Go to a nice, reputable range and rent and fire several that feel good in your hand.

Glaser Blue (Glaser Safety Rounds) are renown for 100% energy transmission in very few inches in a target and they are frangible rounds that "splatter" when they hit anything like plaster board if you miss. (#12 shot pellets contained in a "cup" that comes apart when they hit something) The Glasers are expensive, about $1 or so per bullet, but, they do NOT overpenetrate!

RatDrall
March 3, 2010, 08:21 PM
Nothing that can reliably stop a badguy could be stopped by drywall.

From what I've read and experienced, the best rounds to minimize over penetration are extremely high velocity and lightweight. I would think that something like a 110 grain .357 magnum round would penetrate much less than most .45. If you were to buy a .357 you could also load it with .38 specials for cheaper practice, basically half the price of .45.

Whatever you buy, longer barrels increase velocity, so don't get a snubby if you're worried about over penetration. More velocity means more expansion means less penetration. Someone correct me if I'm wrong...

content
March 3, 2010, 08:33 PM
Hello friends and neighbors // +1 more on renting/borrowing till one feels just right.

My HD in town: 870 12ga. with a S&W442(with Hogue extended grips) .38+P as back up.
My HD in the woods: 870 12ga. with a S&W586 .357magnum(four legged problem)or CZ2075RAMI s&w.40(2legged problem)

I use LEO Remington 2 3/4" reduced recoil 00buckshot in the Remington 870 Express Shotgun (5 slugs on butt cuff just in case)
I use JHP in both the .38 and .357
I use FMJ in the .40

jhvaughan2
March 3, 2010, 10:02 PM
45 ACP is designed to dump energy into what it hits, not penetrate. As others have said, It is a valid choice for home defense. (other rounds like .357 .357 sig, 38 super were made to penetrate.)

That said do NOT rely on ANY projectile not to penetrate. Check out: this (http://230grain.com/showthread.php?t=65428) for some contradictions to "common knowledge"

Dimis
March 3, 2010, 11:09 PM
Nothing that can reliably stop a badguy could be stopped by drywall.


i must respectfully dissagree both the CCI Glazer Safety Slugs (blue or silver) will not pass through a normal homes wall of two layers of 3/4 inch drywall with 4 inch space between but they will do sugnificant damage and penetration on ballistic gel enough to show a tremendous wound channel for an attacker that im sure would stop them

my personal load of choice is .45ACP 230 Grain Jacketed Hollow Points (the flying ashtray) as long as i hit my target i wouldnt fear over penetration

LawofThirds
March 3, 2010, 11:49 PM
Glaser blue safety slugs have an incredibly poor track record as far as a stopping round goes. The ones that they stop tend to be hits that would have stopped someone with a .25 ACP and the ones that aren't a DRT location tend to be be shallow and messy.

45 hardball is known for deep penetration but any of the quality jacketed hollowpoints (or heck, if you handload, a lead SWCHP designed for .45 colt would give you an interesting load) should do fine. Most open up to over 3/4" and stop well within the initial target.

I would not put any of my family's life at stake on hoping that a round that misses a target will break up in drywall. Murphy will often charge far more than you're willing to pay. Assume that any round you use will not only fail to break up in the drywall, but will do so in such a way as to be unrepeatable at the range. Instead, learn what directions are "safe" to shoot in your house and practice more than you think is necessary.

MandH2010
March 4, 2010, 02:11 AM
is the .45ACP JHP really well known for doing damage without over-penetration? can anyone explain to me how that works?

duns
March 4, 2010, 02:32 AM
Glaser Blue (Glaser Safety Rounds) are renown for 100% energy transmission in very few inches in a target and they are frangible rounds that "splatter" when they hit anything like plaster board if you miss.... The Glasers are expensive, about $1 or so per bullet, but, they do NOT overpenetrate!
The Glasers can penetrate plasterboard at least sometimes, see http://www.brassfetcher.com/Brassfetcher_evaluates_9mm_Glaser_Safety_Slug.pdf.

LawofThirds
March 4, 2010, 02:42 PM
.45 is known for being an excellent "man-stopper", modern JHP's simply improve this by increasing the size of the permanent wound channel and increasing the likelihood that the round will stop within the initial target.

There is no magic caliber/bullet/gun that will be guaranteed to stop the attack, not over penetrate and break up harmlessly in the case of a miss. Anyone who says otherwise is usually trying to sell you something.

In a revolver, you're limited by the gun more than the caliber on ammo capacity. The 45 auto is a nice trade between power, control and noise.

rcmodel
March 4, 2010, 03:03 PM
can anyone explain to me how that works?
Think of a 230 grain FMJ-RN as a Funny Car who's drag chute failed to open.

Think of a 230 grain hollow-point as the same Funny Car when the drag chute did open.

The expanding bullet increases in diameter up to 30% or more, which greatly increases drag.
It makes a bigger hole then a non-expanding bullet.
But not as deep a hole.

rc

Mad Chemist
March 4, 2010, 03:08 PM
Worry more about missing the target and less about over-hyped over-penetration.

If you're going to shoot then you need to have a good trajectory, no trick bullet will solve this problem for you.

Figure out which areas of your home can be used as effective "bullet funnels" without endangering your family members and immediate neighbors.

content
March 6, 2010, 06:32 PM
Hello friends and neighbors // Nice visual rcmodel very nice.

If you don't mind I'll probably repeat that and eventually forget to credit it to you.:D

C-grunt
March 7, 2010, 05:44 AM
OP. Load it up with a good hollow point. Hollow points tend to not over penetrate, but still can. Good thing is that, if it does overpenetrate, it will lose A LOT of velocity from passing through the bad guy.

Cpt. America
March 7, 2010, 05:57 AM
The tendency of the .45 acp is it tends to stop an attacker flat in his tracks. As for overpenitration this isn't a big concern with the .45. That falls to the .357 mag and others with its intended uses. For me nothing says get the h3ll out of my house like the 7.62x39 from my AK

If you enjoyed reading about "i have new, lots and lots of new" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!