Why don't they make a revolver in 9mm?


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Skillet
March 4, 2010, 06:18 PM
I have yet to find a revolver in 9mm. If it is the most popular round in the world, why don't they make a 9mm revolver? And so maybe they do. but Smith&Wesson, charter arms, Taurus, Ruger, and all of these big names in revolvers don't make a revolver in 9mm.

It would be great for target practicing. Think about it, you can take your 9mm autoloader and 9mm revolver out shooting and spend less money on ammo.

WHY?

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Skillet
March 4, 2010, 06:26 PM
okay, my bad, Taurus makes two. but that's it? cmon!

Jim K
March 4, 2010, 06:36 PM
S&W, Taurus, Charter, and Ruger have all made 9mm revolvers. The problem is that, as with any rimless cartridge, extraction is impossible in a swing cylinder revolver without either using clips or designing a trick extractor. S&W made some on a contract for the French police who preferred revolvers but got free 9mm ammunition from the army. In general, such guns have not been very successful. Not to mention that 9mm factory ammunition is limited due to the parameters of auto pistols, while the .357 Magnum chambering is highly flexible.

Before anyone mentions it, yes, Ruger made a single action convertible in .357/9mm, but that revolver uses an ejector rod, so the lack of a rim makes no difference.

Jim

Skillet
March 4, 2010, 06:37 PM
oh. so what caliber in a revolver would have similar ballistics and have similar recoil of a 9mm?

kludge
March 4, 2010, 06:37 PM
http://www.ruger.com/products/newModelBlackhawkConvertible/models.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruger_Security_Six

Why? My guess is there's no money in it.

The closest you'll get to a 9mm in a revolver is 38SPL+P, .357 Magnum, or perhaps the .32 H&R Mag or the new .327 Mag.

rcmodel
March 4, 2010, 06:48 PM
Everybody says they want a 9mm revolver.

But every time a manufacture tools up and makes them, nobody buys enough of them to make any money on the deal.

rc

Hardballing
March 4, 2010, 06:57 PM
Ruger made the Speed Six in 9mm IIRC, ditto the Smith/Wesson 640 and 547, with 640 being J frame 5 shot and 547 being K frame six shot.

The 547 was interesting imo in that moon clips were not reqiured to use the extractor for unloading. Had a small spring loaded arm thay popped into the rimless edge of the Parabellum case and woila!

Other posters said it...they ALL died on the vine for lack of buyers.

Shame though. At the time of their birth and deaths, we did not have nearly the diverse loadings of 9mm that are available today. Today, ALL of those 5 and 6 shooters tend to command a premium on the market.

Hope this helps and as others have noted, Taurus is making them today.

The Lone Haranguer
March 4, 2010, 07:32 PM
Everybody says they want a 9mm revolver.

But every time a manufacture tools up and makes them, nobody buys enough of them to make any money on the deal.


:D

http://www.stcloudbonanza.com/chicken6.jpg

Look for a used S&W 940 or 547, or a Ruger Speed Six or SP101. And good luck.

Rexster
March 4, 2010, 07:36 PM
Yep, as already posted, there is no money in it. There is indeed a small cult of folks who do like 9mm revolvers, but their collective buying power is small. I remember seeing ads in Gunlist and Shotgun News, posted by distributors trying to get rid of all the unwanted S&W Model 547 revolvers that nobody wanted. When they were still being made, within my memory, the 9mm Ruger revolvers were s-l-o-w sellers.

mesinge2
March 4, 2010, 08:05 PM
The taurus 9mm is actually a well built revolver and hogue makes grips that are far better than the factory rubber ones.

116977

I actually asked this question a while ago:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=427615

dbarale
March 4, 2010, 09:47 PM
Everybody says they want a 9mm revolver.

But every time a manufacture tools up and makes them, nobody buys enough of them to make any money on the deal.

rc

I wonder if what was true a few years ago still is? With the current CCW craze it may be a better market for a 9mm revolver as their main advantage is the better ballistics (than .38 special) out of a short barrel...

mesinge2
March 4, 2010, 09:53 PM
The 380 wasn't nearly as popular as it is today with this popular pocket pistol craze, perhaps its time for a new 9mm revolver.

BCRider
March 5, 2010, 01:17 AM
There's been a few big threads over the past year about 9mm revolvers. And you're not the only one that lusts after one. I'd give up a seldom used or spare body part to get a nice 9mm revolver that used moon clips so that I could use it in matches as well as for fun.

Up here we aren't allowed the "evil" short barrelled gun options but with the short cylinder and frame that would be possible with a dedicated 9mm revolver coupled with a 3 inch barrel I would imagine that the final size of the gun would be considerably smaller than a J frame gun.

clang
March 5, 2010, 01:29 AM
I own 3 9mm revolvers:
S&W 547 - think of is as an M&P/Model 10 in 9mm
Blue Ruger Speed Six - needs moon clips. They also made it in SS
Ruger New Model Blackhawk - I fitted my 6.5" .357 mag with a spare 9mm cylinder

They all work well, but finding full moon clips for the Speed Six was not easy. Most of the ones on the market were too thick to work in my gun.

lanternlad1
March 5, 2010, 02:45 AM
Check out the Charter Arms CARR.

http://www.charterfirearms.com/products/CARR.html

It was supposed to be out already but I understand they were waiting on the patents to be issued before they sold the guns.

obed_ned
March 5, 2010, 03:11 AM
Superior ballistics to the .38 Spl about half the size- if you could make a 9mm revolver smaller than a j-frame you could make a .380 revolver about half the size as a j-frame- it would be hard to hold onto, though. And there's the rimless clip problem.

I love S&W wheel guns- the actions are just so sweet- my favorite CCW one is a Mod 37 with a bobbed hammer-

My carry gun is a .380 Kel-Tec, though. Like a mini-Glock.

LawofThirds
March 5, 2010, 03:37 AM
Cylinder length would be reduced but part of the reason for the position of the cylinder on a wheel gun is so that your fingers are not anywhere near the gap when the gun fires. Taking advantage of the short round would require some sort of moving guard or an awkwardly forward lock mechanism.

The diameter of the cylinder would remain unchanged, .357 vs .356

Dimis
March 5, 2010, 05:41 AM
But every time a manufacture tools up and makes them, nobody buys enough of them to make any money on the deal.

this is probably only partialy true

alot of great ideas in firearms arent successful not because people arent will to buy them but moreso are not bought in mass histerical numbers and preordered to death to the point that some pencil pusher justifies them continuing production
there have been multiple designs that have a cult following but no one will produce new models because its not the latest whizbang that will make the companies millions
ive been dying for a .45LC 5 shot snub well guess what the only company to make one was taurus and they didnt feel a need to continue the model for "lack of interest"
now every 450 owner i have spoken with thinks its the greatest revolver since bread was sliced
and thanks to the judge they dont feel a need for another .45colt revolver in the lineup

ive never been interested in 9mm revolvers but i know alot of folks are but the gun companies want to produce what sells and thats simply .38 .357 .45ACP .40 and 9mm almost every other hand gun is a specialty deal

companies make 100 .357s to every .44 they manufacture because thats what they think everyone wants
problem is more people would buy these other calibers if they gave us a chance
but if the pistols dont sell 100000 in the first six months they pull the model and retool for yet another 357

ifit
March 5, 2010, 07:03 AM
i was fortunate to pick this up last year from a friend, fun little revolver has a nice kick for a 9mm

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/kadiindo/409.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/kadiindo/413.jpg

Bill B.
March 5, 2010, 07:40 PM
i was fortunate to pick this up last year from a friend, fun little revolver has a nice kick for a 9mm



Does the Ruger SP 101 need moon clips?

Confederate
March 5, 2010, 08:43 PM
Why would anyone want a 6-shot revolver that's a pain in the ass to load and unload, when they could have a decent auto that shoots up to 20+ rounds?

If they had cases with good rims, fine, but no one except the crazy military and police of countries like Egypt and Sudan ever request them. What's next on the list, a 15-round .25ACP pocket pistol with a red-dot scope or laser grips?

A .38 +P should do nicely, and one that takes .357 would be even better.

bdb benzino
March 5, 2010, 08:57 PM
Why would anyone want a 6-shot revolver that's a pain in the ass to load and unload, when they could have a decent auto that shoots up to 20+ rounds?

The problem with thinking like this is that not everyone feels that they need 20 rounds, and futher more alot of us do not like thick grips on our pistols. In fact since getting into 1911's I have got rid of all my double stack pistols but one. I have large hands and shoot narrower pistols better, and revolvers as well.

FYI I find my 9mm revolver to be one of my favorites, and the speed of moonclips is amazing, I cant understand why people dont like them (moonclips).

mesinge2
March 5, 2010, 09:51 PM
Why not a .380 Auto revolver?

This is the only 380 revolver I know about:

.380 ACP Russian Tula R-92
117049



It was also made in 9x18 Mak


P.S. note the position of the cylinder, the flash often burned the user's hand and the russians advised against powerful ammunition.

arizonaguide
March 6, 2010, 01:02 AM
Why would anyone want a 6-shot revolver that's a pain in the ass to load and unload, when they could have a decent auto that shoots up to 20+ rounds?

Reliability, simplicity, and fit in a smaller hand.

If (and it's never happened yet in over 2000rounds so far) I had a FailureToFire in my little J-frame snubby...
I don't have to do an extraction/rack/tap/BS/etc....I simply pull the trigger again.
Also, I've NEVER had a FailureToFeed jam, stovepipe, etc.
I Don't have to worry about magazine spring pressures wearing out, etc.
Reliable simplicity (especially for my wife). Point/squeeze. She doesn't have to remember anything complicated (extraction drills) under pressure.

5 reliable (easy to CCW) shots, ON TIME and UNDER BUDGET.

Gunner Mike
March 6, 2010, 12:06 PM
I've owned a representative number of handguns. Small hands didn't allow the 20 round monsters to be comfortable. My 1911 feels best, but the girlfriend doesn't want to learn how to keep her running.

I'd repeat what Arizonaguide said. This gun (686) can sit on a shelf for 10 years, fully loaded and go bang till empty, when picked up again.

I don't like the paranoid feeling I get when I think of my mag springs, being under pressure for 3 years.

:uhoh:

RatDrall
March 6, 2010, 12:12 PM
A 9mm Model 60 would be a great backup gun to a 9mm automatic pistol, and a nice finish to a trio if you had an Uzi as well.

Short of that, I fail to see the purpose.

oh. so what caliber in a revolver would have similar ballistics and have similar recoil of a 9mm?

.38 special is very similar, as far as bullets of similar weight moving at similar velocity. Keep in mind that with revolvers, every inch matters in terms of velocity.

The .38 special has the edge, because the bullets are not limited by having to feed into a chamber reliably. They can use any material and any profile, like:

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/38%20Special%20158gr%20LSWCHP.htm

mesinge2
March 6, 2010, 12:34 PM
A 9mm will generally out-perfom a 38 special+P in a 2 inch revolver.

RatDrall
March 6, 2010, 01:07 PM
A 9mm will generally out-perfom a 38 special+P in a 2 inch revolver.

So will a .357, which like the 9mm will have much higher pressure, blast, flash, and recoil. The 9mm will also be firing a compromised automatic pistol bullet.

125grain .357 goes about 1200 fps out of a 2" revolver barrel last time I checked, which is about what most +P 9mm will do out of a small auto.

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/38vs357snub.htm

W.E.G.
March 6, 2010, 01:12 PM
Minimal demand, compounded by the fact that the would-be buyers cannot agree on configuration.

mesinge2
March 6, 2010, 01:33 PM
So will a .357, which like the 9mm will have much higher pressure, blast, flash, and recoil. The 9mm will also be firing a compromised automatic pistol bullet.

125grain .357 goes about 1200 fps out of a 2" revolver barrel last time I checked, which is about what most +P 9mm will do out of a small auto.

However, the 9mm will have less felt recoil. I have a Taurus model 905 9mm revolver with a 2 inch barrel and a S&W m649 with a 2.2 inch barrel. The 649 has noticably more recoil that the 905. Both are J frame or J-framed-sized all steel revolvers with houge wood grips.

Also, 9mm ammo tends to be cheaper than either 38 SPLs and 357 Mags.

And with proper leather a moonclip is a much faster reload than a speed loader or speed strip. Ask Jerry Miculek

WC145
March 6, 2010, 02:04 PM
So will a .357, which like the 9mm will have much higher pressure, blast, flash, and recoil. The 9mm will also be firing a compromised automatic pistol bullet.

Not true. Though a 9mm does operate at higher pressures than a .38spl, the blast, flash, and recoil are nowhere near that of a .357mag out of a gun of similar size, barrel length, and weight because it's more efficient out of a short barrel. I have a custom S&W 360J that has been rechambered to 9mm and the recoil is comparable to .38spl +p and very manageable even though it weighs only 13oz, and it is nothing compared to my friend's M&P 340 when shooting .357mag.

Also, how is the 9mm compromised by it's "automatic pistol bullet"? The projectile doesn't behave differently from a revolver vs an auto. If anything, it's a plus in a revolver because the shorter round combined with a more conical bullet is very fast to load with moonclips and fully clear the cylinder when ejected.

arizonaguide
March 6, 2010, 07:56 PM
I've owned a representative number of handguns. Small hands didn't allow the 20 round monsters to be comfortable. My 1911 feels best, but the girlfriend doesn't want to learn how to keep her running.

I'd repeat what Arizonaguide said. This gun (686) can sit on a shelf for 10 years, fully loaded and go bang till empty, when picked up again.

I don't like the paranoid feeling I get when I think of my mag springs, being under pressure for 3 years.


Thanks Mike. Exactly.
I'm upgrading to .357 snubby, and the wife get's the .38 :cool:
We still have 2000+ more rounds of Wadcutter to train her with.
And I've got plenty more standard .38training ammo (for MY classes) that will work in the .357 (as well as Buff Bore 158LSWCHP's for defense). Can use the Same holsters, training methods, etc.

I will also be getting a fitted 9mm cylinder that I can "swap" with my .357 cylinder whenever I want.
As well as getting the existing .357 cylinder cut to be able to use (optional) moon clips with normal .38sp/.357 ammo...as I LIKE the speed reload available with the moonclips. Better than a speedloader.
Here's the link: (conversions page halfway down)
http://www.pinnacle-guns.com/revolver.asp

12ga in the bedroom for the home, but for all else I LOVE my easy/comfortable/reliable snubby!!!

Okay, I been dying to get up the nerve to put this in print:
My WIFE LOVES my 12ga in the bedroom, but she loves my Snubby as well. :cool:

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