How angry should I be?


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gdcpony
March 5, 2010, 09:16 AM
I ordered 1000 Lake City brass decapped, reamed, and polished. When it arrived I had;
72 Winchester
153 R P (Remington)
172 FC (Federal)
265 WCC (Western Cartridge Co?)
310 LC (Lake City)
22 Misc (Hornady, S&B, ect)

The company, who I won't mention because everyone makes mistakes, is unable to replace with LC for some reason. They are asking how I wish to resolve the issue. At least, they are honest and admitting the error. Apparently their LC got mixed with the rest.
Looking at the site the "Commercial/Military Decapped / Reamed / Polished" is actually more expensive for some reason:confused: so I may have made out on the deal in some way. I don't know why anyone would want such a mix rather than one brand, regardless of what it is, but there must be someone.
I am a low volume shooter so I can load in one brand at a time, and leave the others alone. I can use some for my daughters' loads too. It really isn't a killer, but it is rather inconvenient. I don't know that I want to work up loads so often, but the price was good, and won't be matched elsewhere (I looked).
So do I send it back and ask for a refund, ask for a partial refund, or ask for a discount once they can get some LC brass and give them another order then? Those are the options going through my mind right now. I hate being a jerk, but I had hopes of working a load and having it for a long time.

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Afy
March 5, 2010, 09:39 AM
Just load them and shoot.

Alabama2010
March 5, 2010, 09:41 AM
You're the customer- don't let someone take advantage of you. Insist that they refund you the full amount, and if they want their brass back then they'll need to send you the postage. If they refuse, go to your bank or call up your CC company and they'll give you a form to fill out and you'll get your money back.

Bush Pilot
March 5, 2010, 10:23 AM
Ask them to send you 200 once fired cases of one head stamp for your inconvenience. Give the seller the benefit of the doubt for an honest mistake. In the scheme of things this doesn't rank in the top 10,000 things to worry about.

rooter
March 5, 2010, 10:28 AM
I would do business with this merchant before I would do business with Alabama2010.

Do you somehow believe having headstamps which all say LC means you have more consistent brass? Do you think you are receiving LC brass from a single lot? Neither is true and the lot to lot variations in consistency will equal brand to brand inconsistency. You did not purchase matched weight match brass, you purchased and received plinker/hunting quality brass that has likely been fired from loose chambered machine guns. Either way, you received what you paid for.

kelbro
March 5, 2010, 10:56 AM
The WCC is good brass. Winchester mil-spec stuff.

I would toss the Federals.

kludge
March 5, 2010, 10:59 AM
Either way, you received what you paid for.

Disagree.

LC commands a price premium where I am from, and mixed brass is always discounted.

gdcpony
March 5, 2010, 11:00 AM
I would do business with this merchant before I would do business with Alabama2010.

Do you somehow believe having headstamps which all say LC means you have more consistent brass? Do you think you are receiving LC brass from a single lot? Neither is true and the lot to lot variations in consistency will equal brand to brand inconsistency. You did not purchase matched weight match brass, you purchased and received plinker/hunting quality brass that has likely been fired from loose chambered machine guns. Either way, you received what you paid for.
No, I am under no illusions that LC brass is the best match grade stuff out there. And as a Marine I can imagine what a machine gun chamber must look like to cycle the junk we send through it. Hence my variety of sizing dies and measuring tools. I expected to be doing some sorting. However, one company's inconsistencies is different than 7 or 8 and all the differences that go along with them. So, yes, I think having just one brand is more consistent no matter the brand.

Remington brass has a different neck thickness than Federal, WCC brass is a touch beefier in the head area. Differences do exist and that has always been the case. Does it matter? Not if 100yd plinking was all I planned. But LC brass, properly prepped, is fine for 300yd groundhog shots. Not to mention the soft spot I feel for the brass that has helped me to shoot nothing but expert in my 8yrs of service. It must be somewhat consistent to give me "possibles" (10/10 in a groundhog sized area of the target) about every time I shoot my rapid fire courses at both 200 and 300yds.

I paid for one brand not a mixed bag. It would have shortened the sorting quite a bit and given me fewer bags to achieve the same level of similarity. I am here not wanting to be the a-hole, but not knowing what level others would take it to. I am usually easy going, but this mistake is going to cost allot of time no matter how I approach it.

I know that if I had wanted a truly matched set of brass I would have paid allot more. I ordered the level I could based on needs, wants, and budget. Is that not what we all do?

If I wanted to cause a ton of grief, I would plaster the name of the company all over the dozens of forums I belong to. I do not. I simply want a solution.

Walkalong
March 5, 2010, 11:09 AM
That is aggravating when you don't get what you expected. Bad news is they don't have what you ordered, and can't fix it that way. Good news is they admitted the mistake, and are asking you the customer what you want to do to resolve it.

Just gotta figure out what you want to do. What you intended it for has a lot of bearing on that.

gdcpony
March 5, 2010, 11:18 AM
I have multiple .223's to feed in different platforms. Bolts, single's, semis all with a preference of their own for loads, which sucks. Any brass will work for any one of them, but I am anal enough to work up loads for each change in brass.
My pet project was my predator AR (another thread about it started). I wanted a precise load for 'yotes and other varmints. No matches, no long range work (400+ for .223), but not plinking ammo either.
My daughters will throw anything down range, but they are learning to load so I'd like to teach them right not mix and match.
We were all ready to prep the brass last night and when I was done sorting it they looked as disappointed as me.

Just checked the drum of the 223 brass and you are quite correct. It started out as LC and now has mixed headstamps. We will take it down from the website tomorrow. I have nothing to replace the 223 you have now other than more of the same. How would you like to work it?

The reply I have received. A polite email, and I appreciate it. But...

John Wayne
March 5, 2010, 11:22 AM
If you paid more so that you could have brass from one manufacturer, I would be mad.

If the brass you bought was the same price as the mixed bags, I would be upset at the false advertising, but probably wouldn't go to any great trouble to resolve the issue.

gdcpony
March 5, 2010, 11:30 AM
actually they charge more for the military/commercial mix! That I find odd.

R.W.Dale
March 5, 2010, 11:36 AM
You actually counted them all!!!!!!???????


My suspicion of getting a buyer like you is why I always understate the qty on component sales rather than giving an exact count and turning up to be 1 bullet short!


I personally don't like to mix headstamps for rifle loads unless they're really bottom o the bbl FMJBT blastin loads

gdcpony
March 5, 2010, 12:00 PM
You actually counted them all!!!!!!???????


My suspicion of getting a buyer like you is why I always understate the qty on component sales rather than giving an exact count and turning up to be 1 bullet short!


I personally don't like to mix headstamps for rifle loads unless they're really bottom o the bbl FMJBT blastin loads
I would have separating them anyways. I wasn't worried too much if it was a few off. In fact, haven't added them yet. Just put them into loading blocks as I sorted stamps. (Edit:994 I just added it up LOL!)

I dislike mixing too. That is the biggest bone of all is having to rework for each. I can trust a single maker (regardless of lot) to be safe from load to load, but different makers?

I am thinking of asking him to get me enough of any one stamp to make 500 of it. That would be for my AR which is the biggest consumer. Then I can divvy up the rest for other rifles. Might be a way to keep round separate if they use the same bullet and get mixed up. Thoughts?

raz-0
March 5, 2010, 01:49 PM
the federal is too soft in .223 IMO. I've also had bad experience with S&B rifle brass in the past (too brittle). I'd pick out the crap and ask them to replace it and call it even. IMO.

R.W.Dale
March 5, 2010, 02:48 PM
the federal is too soft in .223 IMO.

I agree to an extent, IME Federal is still good for 5 or 6 loadings. But still I like it for a few reasons

It's proven to be very accurate

It's typically free

It comes in well under the max case length so I do no trim or other brass prep beyond sizing

since it wears out quick I don't feel bad about not picking the stuff up

Walkalong
March 5, 2010, 02:51 PM
Yep. I use it too. It's not junk. I don't understand just tossing it because it won't last as long.

Mal H
March 5, 2010, 03:22 PM
If they are genuinely asking what you wish them to do, ask them to send another 1000 cases. Then you will have 600+ LC brass (if the mix remains about the same as when you received it). And you will have several hundred of each of the other headstamps so you will be able to load a good sized batch of each without worrying about case capacity.

FROGO207
March 5, 2010, 04:38 PM
An alternative would be to tell them how many LC brass you got and could they make up the difference with what they have left in stock. Call the extra that was sent to you their "lesson" to pay attention. FWIW In all the dealings with my brass (250 + lbs) I have never got mixed unless it was stated so. My best luck has been with Ed's Brass & Reloading.com for quality and honesty.

grubbylabs
March 5, 2010, 05:12 PM
If you wanted all of one brand I would let then know that is what will make you happy. I to would be upset if I ordered one thing and got some thing else. Your right there is nothing to be a jerk about but I would ask them to make it right and either send you what you ordered or take the stuff back at their cost.

Otto
March 5, 2010, 06:14 PM
actually they charge more for the military/commercial mix! That I find odd.

Maybe thats because it's already been processed.
Did you order from Cheyenne Brass?

dc.fireman
March 5, 2010, 07:34 PM
I agree with Bush Pilot - ask them for a couple hundred extra to make up for the mix up and shortage, and call it a day. I separate my brass as well, and can appreciate Lake City brass and the desire for it, but in the end, as long as you didn't pay more for it (Lake City only lot), then you still hav some decent brass to reload. Just my $0.02.

-tc

smokey262
March 5, 2010, 11:17 PM
Mail these to me

72 Winchester
153 R P (Remington)


And I will mail you same qty of LC (mixed years). Pay my shipping and I will send all the same year :)

Seriously, if you want LC that bad I will swap with you, provided your brass did not have crimped primer pockets at any time

gdcpony
March 5, 2010, 11:39 PM
Maybe thats because it's already been processed.
Did you order from Cheyenne Brass?
Processing wasn't listed. I would re-size it anyway. It was decapped and reamed, but the pockets were dirty so it must have been polished before it was deprimed.
Don't want to mention company name as they are willing to work with me. If they were being jerks I would put their name on a couple dozen shooting forums and call it a day. In the end I might give them a thumbs up for manning up and fixing things to make me happy. I am not a high dollar customer, but I tend to be a loyal one.

gdcpony
March 5, 2010, 11:44 PM
Mail these to me

72 Winchester
153 R P (Remington)


And I will mail you same qty of LC (mixed years). Pay my shipping and I will send all the same year :)

Seriously, if you want LC that bad I will swap with you, provided your brass did not have crimped primer pockets at any time
I couldn't tell you if they did. They reamed them out regardless. I would take the trade too. Winchester is good brass, but I haven't used it in .223 since I let my Howa go (the remaining 500rds went with it). My current rifles have loads based on FC and LC brass because that is what I have now.

Balrog
March 5, 2010, 11:48 PM
I would rather have the commercial brass than the LC brass. I have a large lot of LC brass (several 5 gallon bucket fulls), and some of the brass is from M16s and M4s, and some is from SAW's. The M16/M4 brass resizes great, but the SAW brass does not always resize well, and I have to reject about 10 to 20 percent of it. So my point is, be careful of LC brass, you won't always be able to work with it, depending on what kind of gun it was fired from.

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