Improving Sigma accuracy


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Arkansas Paul
March 6, 2010, 12:48 AM
Hey guys. I've got a S&W Sigma 40VE and it hits consistently about three inches low and three inches left. This is from about ten yards. The groups are fine, I can keep them close, but the thing has fixed sights. Is there anything I can do? Can you put aftermarket adjustable sights on them? Any help would be appreciated.

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Kevin77
March 6, 2010, 01:29 AM
I had one with the same problem and the way I fixed it was by selling it and buying a 1911 with adjustable sights.

retsub
March 6, 2010, 02:19 AM
I drifted the rear sight on my SW9VE to fix my windage problem. I tapped on it with a screwdriver. Shoots a little high though.

railroader
March 6, 2010, 03:21 AM
Shoot it from a rest and if it still shoots the same contact S&W and get either a shorter front sight or a taller rear. Mark

Arkansas Paul
March 6, 2010, 10:39 AM
Kevin, I understand and if I had the funds, that's what I would do. Then again, if I had that kind of funds, I wouldn't have bought a Sigma in the first place.
Seriously though, I'm pleased with the way the pistol functions and it is consistent. I just didn't know if there were any aftermarket adjustable sights available.

Onward Allusion
March 6, 2010, 01:11 PM
I had the same issue with mine. The rear sight was too far to the left. Tap the sight to the right with a brass punch (NOT STEEL). Once you have it centering on paper, use loctite BLUE between the dovetailed rear sight and the slide. Let it seep in over night. Do it for both sides. It should lock in place.

If the rear sight still drifts due to recoil, you can remove the sight and use a drill press and drill a tiny hole in the middle so that a hex screw can fit into it. Re-install the rear sight and screw in the hex screw. The hex screw will hold the sight in place due to its pressure against the sight & slide.

As for shooting low, my recommendation is to adjust your sighting while shooting. A more radical approach would be to file down the front sight - like the old-timers used to do with their revolver's front blades.

ALSO - you might be using too much finger on your trigger pull. You might want to let someone else shoot the Sigma before doing any of the above just to see if it's you and not the pistol.


Arkansas Paul (http://www.thehighroad.org/member.php?u=93088)
Improving Sigma accuracy
Hey guys. I've got a S&W Sigma 40VE and it hits consistently about three inches low and three inches left. This is from about ten yards. The groups are fine, I can keep them close, but the thing has fixed sights. Is there anything I can do? Can you put aftermarket adjustable sights on them? Any help would be appreciated.

possum
March 6, 2010, 03:22 PM
this is a common issue, with the most common answer being shooter error. if you are hitting anywhere but where you want to hit in the biggest majority of cases it is shooter error in the form of trigger pull. i hate to say it and people hate to hear it but that is the fact of the matter.

you are getting good groupings because you are doing the same thing everytime which is normally a good thing, however in this case, you not haveing a smooth even pull could be the form of this problem, explains why the rounds are all hitting in the same spot just not where you want them too.

drifting sights, and adjustable sights will not fix marksmanship problems.

Arkansas Paul
March 6, 2010, 03:33 PM
That very well could be the case possum. I've been shooting shotguns and rifles for over twenty years, but am a rookie when it comes to the pistolas. I've probably put less than 500 rounds downrange with them, so I have much to learn.

panther22
March 6, 2010, 03:34 PM
Over on the S&W forum there is a thread by a guy who has installed a Glock fiber optic sight on his Sigma. It is a shorter sight and should bring your hits up. Adjusting the rear, as mentioned here, could fix your hits on the left.
For me, this is a gun that takes some getting used to. I've been having the same results as you, but I'm getting better with practise.

possum
March 6, 2010, 04:30 PM
That very well could be the case possum. I've been shooting shotguns and rifles for over twenty years, but am a rookie when it comes to the pistolas. I've probably put less than 500 rounds downrange with them, so I have much to learn.
yeah a handgun is much harder to master as compared to a rifle or shotgun, keep at it, you will get it.

TheJeepGuy
March 6, 2010, 05:06 PM
see: http://www.bullseyepistol.com/training.htm

Arkansas Paul
March 6, 2010, 05:30 PM
Thanks JeepGuy. That's very helpful. I wouldn't have thought of half that stuff.

ol' scratch
March 6, 2010, 06:48 PM
Do what I did. Sell the piece of crap and buy a Rock Island 1911. That inproved my accuracy dramatically. If you don't like the .45, get a CZ75-also very accurate.

Sorry to be insulting. I owned a Sigma and I couldn't hit anything with it. I started shooting the CZ and the 1911 and hit my mark.

Edit--I read in an earlier post that you don't have the funds. My Rock Island cost me $380 new. I have seen them as low as $310 at gun shows (also as high as $500). I sold my Sigma with the mags for a little more than I paid for it and bought the Rock for an additional $40.

mokin
March 6, 2010, 08:30 PM
I've seen that happen with a friend's Sigma. I bet it is just the really long trigger pull. I can see where it would be easy to get too much "pull" on the trigger. He was ready to sell it after his first box of ammo because he shot low and to the left. I shot a magazine and did much better (I'm much more accustomed to DAO triggers). I suggested he practice with his double action 22 revolver for a while. It really improved his accuracy with the Sigma.

possum
March 7, 2010, 03:35 AM
Do what I did. Sell the piece of crap and buy a Rock Island 1911. That inproved my accuracy dramatically. If you don't like the .45, get a CZ75-also very accurate.

Sorry to be insulting. I owned a Sigma and I couldn't hit anything with it. I started shooting the CZ and the 1911 and hit my mark.

Edit--I read in an earlier post that you don't have the funds. My Rock Island cost me $380 new. I have seen them as low as $310 at gun shows (also as high as $500). I sold my Sigma with the mags for a little more than I paid for it and bought the Rock for an additional $40.

this does not solve the issue of bad technique. simply selling the gun in question makes no sense at all. The sigma's are plenty accurate enough, the same with other handguns, they are not race guns and they aren't meant to be however, they are plenty capable of accuracy when the proper use of technique is applied.

i can't shoot this gun good so i am gonna sell it, buy something else, put adjustable sights on it, and a laser too of course becasue that always seems to make people shoot better heck i might as well just have someone else shoot it for me.

rskent
March 7, 2010, 07:24 AM
Dry Fire, Dry Fire, Dry Fire, Try to do it in front of a blank wall to force yourself (himself) to look at the front sight. After a few million pulls I bet that Sigma will shoot a bit straighter.
Steve

KevinR
March 7, 2010, 08:43 AM
That front sight is a mother to do anything with. It looks like it plugs into a hole and the tit sticking through inside gets melted to hold it in place. I think any and all corrections are designed to be done with the rear sight. Let us know what you end up doing please.

roaddog28
March 7, 2010, 12:46 PM
this does not solve the issue of bad technique. simply selling the gun in question makes no sense at all. The sigma's are plenty accurate enough, the same with other handguns, they are not race guns and they aren't meant to be however, they are plenty capable of accuracy when the proper use of technique is applied.

i can't shoot this gun good so i am gonna sell it, buy something else, put adjustable sights on it, and a laser too of course becasue that always seems to make people shoot better heck i might as well just have someone else shoot it for me.

possum is right. Most accurately errors are shooter errors. I bought a SW40VE about six weeks ago. I took the Sigma out to the range along with my Ruger Service Six 4 inch revolver. I shoot double action only revolvers and can hit at 10 to 15 yrds in the black consistantly with the Ruger. I started shooting the Sigma. It took me at least 4 mags of rounds before I started hitting the paper around the black. As I got used to the trigger more and more my accurately got better. I had trouble with the Sigma at first and I am used to shooting double action only which is the type of action the Sigma is. Double action only guns take awhile to master the long and heavier trigger. But with practice you can shoot the Sigma more than accurately enough for any SD situation. The Sigma is not a target shooter. The Sigma is a combat pistol much like a Glock or other pistols. I feel the Sigma is safer because of the longer trigger. Practice, and give the Sigma a chance. If you feel the your Sigma has accurately problems find a person that is used to shooting double action only revolvers. I bet that person will not have problems with accurately after they put a few mags through the Sigma.




Good luck,
roaddog28

BossHogg
March 7, 2010, 03:11 PM
I think just about everyone shoots the Sigma low left at first. It's just getting use to the trigger,no big thang. It's a great SD,or truck gun,goes bang every time. Fun,fun,fun in the sun.

Arkansas Paul
March 7, 2010, 03:20 PM
Oh, I have no problems with it other than that. I'm actually glad that the general concensus is that it's me. If it's the case, and I suspect that it is, I won't have to spend a hundred bucks on adjustable sights, and I'll have an excuse to go to the range even more. (Like I needed one)

ol' scratch
March 13, 2010, 01:51 AM
this does not solve the issue of bad technique. simply selling the gun in question makes no sense at all. The sigma's are plenty accurate enough, the same with other handguns, they are not race guns and they aren't meant to be however, they are plenty capable of accuracy when the proper use of technique is applied.

i can't shoot this gun good so i am gonna sell it, buy something else, put adjustable sights on it, and a laser too of course becasue that always seems to make people shoot better heck i might as well just have someone else shoot it for me.

I didn't mention adjustable sights or a laser. I have a bone stock 'Government' model 1911 that is less refined than the Sigma was. I have fired many pistols and revolvers. The Sigma was the only pistol I couldn't get to shoot well. Probably because the darn thing has a 9 pound trigger. Also, my 1911 is much easier to work on, the trigger breaks at 4.5 pounds, I hit what I am aiming at and not just at 25 feet but 25, 35 and even 50 YARDS. If I want after market parts, I can install them myself and I have more options. My bone stock 1911 out shot my bone stock Sigma. I still go by my original post. The Rock Island 1911 is a better value than the Sigma.

You mention the Sigma is accurate 'enough'. That 1911 without any modification is MORE than accurate enough.

I suppose you could mess with it and put adjustable sights on it (as per the original poster's remarks), but you are still left with a SIGMA. It just seemed like a poor expenditure of hard earned cash. Keep in mind that I spent almost the same on my Rock Island as I did on the Sigma.

dalegann
April 12, 2010, 10:04 AM
Hey Paul,
The consensus I get here is that you or the gun suck!

Cornhusker77
April 12, 2010, 10:42 AM
When I first got my SW9VE, i shot low and left.
Right after I got it, I used it to qualify for my CCW.
The instructor had us warming up, doing a little bullseye shooting, just kind of messing around before the actual qualifying.
I was shooting low and left, and I told the instructor my sights were off.
He walked up to the target, cut a slit in it and put a playing card in the slit.
Then he said "Let me see your gun"
I handed it to him, he racked one in, looked down the sights, pulled the trigger and split the card.
He unloaded the gun, handed it to me and said "there's nothing wrong with those sights."
After that, I shot better :)
I kept the playing card, it's in my gun cabinet and it reminds me every day that my Sigma shoots straighter than I do.:D
Oh, and the trigger does get better.

doc540
April 12, 2010, 12:38 PM
Should the trigger be a little rough or crunchy, you can call Sigma, and they'll email a shipping label on their dime.

Don't tell them it's "stiff", just "rough".

They'll smooth it up, make a dramatic improvement in the way it shoots, and ship it back within 2 weeks, again on their dime.

We've owned three, had all three done, and they shoot dependably and accurately.

dwhite
April 12, 2010, 07:08 PM
Ditto the low and left with the Sigma. Took me a couple hundred rounds to really figure out the trigger but it (I) now hit where I point it. Mine seems to be regulated for 180 grain bullets also. Give it some time.

Sigma was my first pistol. I've always shot DA revolvers so the trigger was familiar. Also, now that I've mastered the Sigma, I can shoot my buddy's XDm 9mm better than my buddy can. Master that Sigma trigger and you'll shoot everything better.

All the Best,
Dwhite

StevieRayHubcap
August 5, 2013, 10:35 AM
Guys, this 53-year-old has been shooting everything since the age of 5...my first firearm was a birthday present on my 5th birthday, a Remington Boys' Model .22 single-shot bolt action in .22 Long.
My Dad was an Air Policeman, and a crack shot (and still is), who was my primary firearms instructor.
I have fired all manner of pistols for many thousands of rounds; wheelguns, semi-autos, DAO, DA/SA, SA revolvers and DA/SA revolvers.
I know how to aim a pistol.
My Sigma has shot consistently low and left since I took it out of the box 6 years ago. I loathed the excessively long and heavy trigger pull, and naturally assumed that the trigger pull was contributing to my problem--often, by the time the trigger lets off and the round is sent DR, my hand would be quivering slightly, so it is a natural--but has proven to be an ERRONEOUS--assumption.
I recently performed the trigger pull and polishing mod on my Sigma.
WOW, what a difference! Pull seems to be about a half to a third of previous, feels slick as glass, causes no quivers, and I can now do something that was patently impossible before: rapid-fire. Guess what? Gun STILL shoots low and left. I can hammer 25-foot 7-shot groups into a 2.25 area time after time in rapid-fire. STILL low and left. Taking my time and firing slow does nothing to improve target strike area--aim at the center, hit 1" low and 2.5" left. Aim 1" high and 2.5" right, and the bullets punch the center ring EVERY TIME.
It's NOT the shooter, and I've seen SO many of the same complaint that it is naive or presumptive for someone to say "It's you."
It ain't me. The rear sight can be drifted left to improve the windage strike, but the front blade cannot be altered. I like the 3-dot sights, but I wish there were an adjustable (for both windage and elevation) rear sight I could replace the factory rear with. I'm not concerned about it affecting concealability; it's a full-size gun that cannot be easily concealed anyway. It is my home defense pistol and I'd rather know the bullet will go where aimed without employing Kentucky windage.

Arkansas Paul
August 5, 2013, 11:50 AM
This thread was started 3 years ago.
Just an update, the Sigma went down the gun trade trail and I've never been so happy to see a firearm go. I bought a Sig Sauer SP2022 and now when I aim at something, I generally hit it. :)

Lj1941
August 5, 2013, 12:28 PM
My son had the same issues with his Sigma 40. He traded it in and got an M & P 40 and life is good. There is a reason the Sigma is cheap. S & W knew what their product was worth and sold it at a reduced price!:evil:

LeonCarr
August 5, 2013, 12:45 PM
The first and last Sigma I shot was owned by a co-worker and had a 15 pound 3 ounce trigger pull (Verified by Lyman digital trigger pull gauge). He sold it and bought a 1911.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

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