Primer Problems...


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mcdonl
March 6, 2010, 01:55 PM
Hi all, I think it is a primer problem but I am not sure.

I brought my Charter Arms, Bulldog .357 to the range today with 50 .38's and 50 .357's I loaded

The .38's were using LSWC 158g bullets, 4.2g universal and the .357's were same bullet with 4.6g universal. All rounds were accurate but I had 2 out of the batch that did not fire on the first strike. It took two strikes before they would fire. The other 98 were fine, and I shot 200 9mm with the same primers and no misfires of any kind there...

The primers are Federal Small Pistol Magnum.

IS 2 out of 300 acceptable? Seems like a bad ratio to me, but these were my first 300 pistol rounds I ever loaded :)

PS - I was able to shoot 300 rounds today when 2 months ago I couldn't afford ammo!!

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The Bushmaster
March 6, 2010, 02:02 PM
You didn't seat the primers all the way. Don't be afraid to SEAT them DAMNED primers. Put a little pressure on them when seating them...

The first hammer blow seated the primer and the second hammer blow set it off...

Two out of 300 rounds? NO...Not exceptable...I've been reloading for over 24 years and have not had a primer fail to go off...

mcdonl
March 6, 2010, 02:04 PM
Thanks Bushmaster. I try to feel each one to make sure it is flush but I am sure I could have missed a couple.

454PB
March 6, 2010, 02:05 PM
No, 100% ignition is required.

Are you sure that the primers are fully seated? If you run your finger over the seated primer, it should be just slightly below the case head.

In general, magnum primers have a thicker cup, and require a bit more force to ignite.

For the load recipe you're using, magnum primers are not needed. I'd try a standard primer, and I bet you'll get 100% ignition.

bds
March 6, 2010, 02:33 PM
I try to feel each one to make sure it is flush but I am sure I could have missed a couple.

You cannot go by feeling them to be flush because primer pockets vary - You should go by seating pressure (seat them until primer no longer go further in the pocket). This is the reason why I hand prime all of my cases - I can "feel" whether the primer is at the bottom of the pocket or not.

Are you sure that the primers are fully seated? If you run your finger over the seated primer, it should be just slightly below the case head.

+1. I find that most of my primers go just a bit below the case head. When the primers are flush/above the case head, it's because there's crud in the primer pocket keeping the primer to seat deeper. Many blame failure to ignite primers on the primer, but often it is seating depth and/or fouling in the pocket.

PS - I was able to shoot 300 rounds today when 2 months ago I couldn't afford ammo!!

Yup, the joy of reloading! :D I shot 600 rounds at the range yesterday and my reloading cost was about $30.

mcdonl
March 6, 2010, 02:41 PM
454PB, all I could get for a while was SP Magnums so I used them. I will continue to use them for the .38's and .357's but use the regular SP I have for the 9mm. Times are tough ya know?

ReloaderFred
March 6, 2010, 03:19 PM
Ideally, primers should be seated .004" below flush, but realistically that's not always possible. Just seating flush isn't the proper way to seat primers.

When you properly seat the primer, the anvil is pushed into the primer cup by the bottom of the primer pocket, against the priming compound. Then the indentation caused by the firing pin striking the cup mashes the priming compound between the properly seated anvil and the cup, detonating the primer.

If the primer isn't fully seated, the first blow from the firing pin fully seats the primer the rest of the way and the second blow mashes the priming compound between the anvil and cup, like it was intended to do.

Just do as The Bushmaster says and seat those primers all the way.

Hope this helps.

Fred

Walkalong
March 6, 2010, 04:07 PM
Do like Dragline said and "Get mad with them d*** primers", and seat em good and hard.

Eggs, primers, what's the difference. :D

lykoris
March 6, 2010, 06:40 PM
CONGRATS ON SHOOTING YOUR FIRST RELOADS :)

2 primers out of 300 isn't a big deal and I'm sure you'll have no problem with your 2nd batch of reloads. As others have said don't be afraid to apply strong consistent force when seating them and you'll be fine.

mcdonl
March 6, 2010, 08:45 PM
One thing I have learned on my own reloading is the book can't describe how much force to use.

I learned the same lesson crimping.

Thanks!

The Bushmaster
March 7, 2010, 11:20 AM
"Dragline"?? Who's "dragline"??

Walkalong
March 7, 2010, 02:16 PM
A character in Cool Hand Luke. You missed a classic Bushmaster. Awesome film.

The Bushmaster
March 7, 2010, 02:48 PM
Don't particularly care for the lead actor...

jfh
March 7, 2010, 02:54 PM
Well, yeah, but the character he played in Cool Hand Luke was an important one. IMO. Like Walkalong says....

The Bushmaster
March 7, 2010, 07:36 PM
In answer to your statement "You missed a classic......." No...I didn't...:evil:

Starter52
March 7, 2010, 07:42 PM
I've read that some Charter Arms revolvers have a light hammer strike. My .44 Bulldog will not ignite CCI primers when shot double action, and in single action will not ignite about 1 out of 5. I switched over to Winchester primers and the problem went away.

billybob44
March 7, 2010, 09:57 PM
One thing I have learned on my own reloading is the book can't describe how much force to use.

I learned the same lesson crimping.

Thanks!
Most on this Forum just loves the heck out of hand held primer tools. I use the "Built in" priming systems on my Dillon 550, and RCBS RockChucker, with a close to a two foot lever, and have always had the power to seat the primers. Been loading since the mid '70's with those tools, and the very-very few primers that I have had not go, would not go no matter how many times you hit them-in other words-dead primer. Look at post #7 ReloaderFred has the proper info on how a primer goes off. And YES, with my two foot levers, on my press, I can feel when the primer is seated=NOT crushed..

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